HoganStand GAA Football and Hurling

National Forum

Aidan O'Shea Diving

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post

You need to Login to Post

The best way to sort out diving is not by cards, it is by name and shame. No man of the match nominations No all star nominations. This would be an unfortunate legacy to be remembered for if you dived in a game the year a player was on an all ireland winning side. Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3854 - 12/07/2016 17:35:47 1882010 Link
Replying To browncows: "daytona11 (Kildare)- how can you tackle a player if you cannot put a hand on him. Guys put hands all over the place on your back, on your neck on your chest and it happens in every tackle. This diving has only recently come into the game and more so with introduction of the black card. It was a very obvious dive even in real time and should have been obvious to a half decent ref" Daytona 11 the rule book is quite clear on this issue the only contact you are allowed is shoulder to shoulder In the tackle you can only contact the ball and then only with the open hand You are not allowed to smash him in the arm the guts "as in a softener" come over his back lie on top of him when he falls to the ground wrap your arms around him These are all fouls But the referees today will not call them The whole idea of the defensive game today is to slow the attacking player down so 4 or 5 defenders can swarm all over the attacker The swarming tackles is what has to be addressed or else go to the Aussie Rules rule Got to let the ball go before you're tackled cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 569 - 12/07/2016 18:35:57 1882045 Link
Replying To cluichethar: "Daytona 11 the rule book is quite clear on this issue the only contact you are allowed is shoulder to shoulder In the tackle you can only contact the ball and then only with the open hand You are not allowed to smash him in the arm the guts "as in a softener" come over his back lie on top of him when he falls to the ground wrap your arms around him These are all fouls But the referees today will not call them The whole idea of the defensive game today is to slow the attacking player down so 4 or 5 defenders can swarm all over the attacker The swarming tackles is what has to be addressed or else go to the Aussie Rules rule Got to let the ball go before you're tackled" So bodies may not come into contact as players are competing for the ball??? neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 12/07/2016 19:19:24 1882055 Link
Replying To cluichethar: "Daytona 11 the rule book is quite clear on this issue the only contact you are allowed is shoulder to shoulder In the tackle you can only contact the ball and then only with the open hand You are not allowed to smash him in the arm the guts "as in a softener" come over his back lie on top of him when he falls to the ground wrap your arms around him These are all fouls But the referees today will not call them The whole idea of the defensive game today is to slow the attacking player down so 4 or 5 defenders can swarm all over the attacker The swarming tackles is what has to be addressed or else go to the Aussie Rules rule Got to let the ball go before you're tackled" So, no bodily y contact allowed as players compete for the ball??? Are you serious? There would never be any continuity in the game if that was the case. At the throw-in, players are always jostling for possession. Are you saying the ref should be blowing them up for frees. Now a days most subs are welcome new on to the pitch by jolting from the player he will be playing on - more frees. If you happen to touch a players body as you knock the ball cleanly away from him, should you have a free given against you? neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 12/07/2016 19:39:34 1882066 Link
Replying To neverright: "So, no bodily y contact allowed as players compete for the ball??? Are you serious? There would never be any continuity in the game if that was the case. At the throw-in, players are always jostling for possession. Are you saying the ref should be blowing them up for frees. Now a days most subs are welcome new on to the pitch by jolting from the player he will be playing on - more frees. If you happen to touch a players body as you knock the ball cleanly away from him, should you have a free given against you?" Nothing about coming together Daytona was talking about tackling another player You are not supposed to lay a hand on the opponent you are to play the ball Don't go criticizing me I didn't make the rules Just look at the rule governing the tackle its quite clear cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 569 - 12/07/2016 19:54:44 1882074 Link
Replying To Keepthefaith51: "Very harsh. He felt contact and went down. For the last number of years he has received awful treatment. How many times have we seen Aido mauled to the floor and gets no protection. The use of the word 'cheat' has been used out of context here. As regards your feelings re Mayos chances this year, we will have to wait and see. I certainly wouldn't write us off. That's all I'm saying" Sorry if you keep saying it enough won't make the rest of us believe it. AOS gets no worse abuse from defenfers than any other inter county forward - it's actually getting very annoying. He made a mistake and not for the first time - I hope he learns from it and moves on. Also I've watched him for a number of years including u21 and due to his physicality he takes the ball into the tackle a lot thinking he can get through and when there's a defensive system in front with 2 or more players he will inevitably hit traffic. If he lays the ball of sooner then he won't "get fouled" as you call it. I've noticed other counties do the same over the years incl Donegal, Tyrone, Galway, Cork and they shift heavy tackles and turn the ball over and I don't see them complaining about their players treatment. IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 12/07/2016 20:04:47 1882079 Link
This is where the GAA is at unfortunately. The win at all costs means just that. A sure everyone else is doing it mentality now exists to diving & feigning injury and not to do it would be seen as weak and against the principles of doing whatever it takes to win. This can be seen in Mayo posters contributions here however I have no doubt fans of every other county would be saying the same if it was their player in this situation. Now the referees will be roundly turned on as fans/pundits demand they do not be tricked by players diving despite this being an impossible task. Pundits/fans and bad managers will demand 'consistency' from refs however this means referees will be forced to ref to the exact letter of the law. The 'spirit of the game' unwritten rules of sportsmanship are dead. Physicality will slowly be eroded as it is impossible to define in writing the fair physical tackle that we all know and love to the rulebook. Defenders will no longer be able to tackle (as per even current rule as previous poster noted) and tactically it would minimise risk to hand pass as much as possible. More defenders will be seen as solution to not be able to tackle. A sorry spectacle is left with all the blame falling at the feet of referees, the one person who is powerless to do anything to change things. bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4668 - 12/07/2016 20:12:45 1882087 Link
I posted this about 5 times and the admin refused to let it through..... AOS gets no rough treatment from referees. Saturday a big decision (a penalty) went his way because he dived. Lets call a zebra a zebra.... he dived. But it wasnt the first time in the game he dived. AOS has been running into contact years and flinging himself to the ground. It works most of the time for him. Most refs buy it and award a free. The days a ref didnt buy it, he got rough treatment....because they didnt award frees when he flung himself to the ground. Referees should be aware of this tactic by AOS by now. Hes doing it long enough. Do I blame O'Shea, not really, I frown on it because its not something I wanna see a lad his size do because he doesnt have to do it. I blame referees. If they didnt award him frees for doing it, he would stop. JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 12/07/2016 20:26:20 1882096 Link
Replying To JayP: "I posted this about 5 times and the admin refused to let it through..... AOS gets no rough treatment from referees. Saturday a big decision (a penalty) went his way because he dived. Lets call a zebra a zebra.... he dived. But it wasnt the first time in the game he dived. AOS has been running into contact years and flinging himself to the ground. It works most of the time for him. Most refs buy it and award a free. The days a ref didnt buy it, he got rough treatment....because they didnt award frees when he flung himself to the ground. Referees should be aware of this tactic by AOS by now. Hes doing it long enough. Do I blame O'Shea, not really, I frown on it because its not something I wanna see a lad his size do because he doesnt have to do it. I blame referees. If they didnt award him frees for doing it, he would stop." Quite the authority on our Aidan there I see Jay P. All black and white and not a grey area in sight. Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 12/07/2016 21:31:57 1882146 Link
Replying To Dubfan Abroad: "Ah sure none of it matters a jot. Mayo will capitulate at some point, they don't have an All-Ireland win in them anyway. O'Shea can do all the diving he wants, and the rest of the team can do parallel bars or hurdles or long jumps or boxing or whatever Olympic sport the wish. They still will not ever win the All Ireland Gaelic Football Final." Look it, every player in gaa cheats by doing one thing or another. I remember Connolly throwing a thump into lee keegan in last years semi final. Is that not cheating? Far worse than diving. The only difference was Connolly was punished and O'shea wasn't mayoaresavage (Mayo) - Posts: 313 - 12/07/2016 22:10:01 1882189 Link
Replying To TheMaster: "link link The same guys who were on here defending these guys are slating o'shea now. I think you will understand if I politely ignore every word." The AOS dive was embarrassing and his size probably made it look worse. But ye he is not alone in trying to gain an advantage for his team. Although you could of dug out better clips. AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 12/07/2016 22:19:38 1882198 Link
Replying To Dubfan Abroad: "Ah sure none of it matters a jot. Mayo will capitulate at some point, they don't have an All-Ireland win in them anyway. O'Shea can do all the diving he wants, and the rest of the team can do parallel bars or hurdles or long jumps or boxing or whatever Olympic sport the wish. They still will not ever win the All Ireland Gaelic Football Final." Quite the philosopher I see Dubfan. As my old granny used to say "sure it will be all the same to us when we're dead and gone". Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 12/07/2016 22:21:59 1882201 Link
Mayo and kerry have led the way in the dark arts over the last number of years especially when it comes to simulation. They have by far the highest instances and examples of it. The outcry over McCanns dive compared to O'Sheas is something to behold.If I remember rightly Harte said young McCann made a mistake and that he will learn from it whereas Rochford and Mayo are practically praising O'Shea for his dive. And of course O'Donoughue's dive hardly even registeted.. salvador (Roscommon) - Posts: 439 - 12/07/2016 22:23:26 1882203 Link
Replying To salvador: "Mayo and kerry have led the way in the dark arts over the last number of years especially when it comes to simulation. They have by far the highest instances and examples of it. The outcry over McCanns dive compared to O'Sheas is something to behold.If I remember rightly Harte said young McCann made a mistake and that he will learn from it whereas Rochford and Mayo are practically praising O'Shea for his dive. And of course O'Donoughue's dive hardly even registeted.." It's a bit harsh judging Mayo and Kerry against, say the likes of Roscommon, as we rarely get a chance to see Roscommon on telly. They might have been simulating away like mad things over the years and we'd know nothing about it. Only saying like. Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 12/07/2016 22:47:56 1882226 Link
Replying To Llaw_Gyffes: "It's a bit harsh judging Mayo and Kerry against, say the likes of Roscommon, as we rarely get a chance to see Roscommon on telly. They might have been simulating away like mad things over the years and we'd know nothing about it. Only saying like." No. I am judging Mayo/kerry against the likes of Tyrone,Dublin and Donegal. Rochford praised O'Shea for diving poor Aiden gets awful abuse etc. Harte reprimanded McCann publicly ie. young lad needs to learn..we dont condone diving.. Big difference. salvador (Roscommon) - Posts: 439 - 12/07/2016 23:36:41 1882264 Link
Replying To salvador: "No. I am judging Mayo/kerry against the likes of Tyrone,Dublin and Donegal. Rochford praised O'Shea for diving poor Aiden gets awful abuse etc. Harte reprimanded McCann publicly ie. young lad needs to learn..we dont condone diving.. Big difference." Jesus are you trying to say those 2 incidents were similar? Night and day. TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8507 - 13/07/2016 08:58:07 1882313 Link
Replying To mayoaresavage: "Look it, every player in gaa cheats by doing one thing or another. I remember Connolly throwing a thump into lee keegan in last years semi final. Is that not cheating? Far worse than diving. The only difference was Connolly was punished and O'shea wasn't" Seriously?!?! That is laughable! How in God's name can that be considered 'cheating'?? Ridiculous comment The definition of cheating: 'act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage.' Please tell me what advantage was gained by Connolly/Dublin? The only team that gained an advantage from that iincident was Mayo. CroiGorm (Dublin) - Posts: 1547 - 13/07/2016 09:20:23 1882322 Link
Jesus are you trying to say those 2 incidents were similar? Night and day. TheFlaker (Mayo) You are correct in that they are not similar. The McCann dive was carried out by a very in-experienced player and had no effect on the result. The O'Shea dive with a few minutes to go decided the result - indeed a huge difference! browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2342 - 13/07/2016 11:23:49 1882412 Link
Replying To browncows: "Jesus are you trying to say those 2 incidents were similar? Night and day. TheFlaker (Mayo) You are correct in that they are not similar. The McCann dive was carried out by a very in-experienced player and had no effect on the result. The O'Shea dive with a few minutes to go decided the result - indeed a huge difference!" That is like saying cheating is ok as long as the result is never in doubt? That does not make any sense. Also I don't remember being this much backlash from James O D diving in the munster final last year...probably down to cuteness was it? yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11768 - 13/07/2016 11:34:19 1882419 Link
yew_tree (Mayo)- If you read my post correctly I did not say that cheating was ok on either occasions- I was just making a comment regarding the post from your fellow county man. Now you can take whatever opinion you like as that is your choice. You could also say (like the Ref) that it was a penalty. browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2342 - 13/07/2016 11:43:30 1882427 Link