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Replying To kevin03: "It as a free out to tyrone. Morgan came in to push o'shea away as he could collect the ball. O'shea went down like he had been punched by tyson." Lads this was a few years back. It's Pascal Mc Connell not Niall Morgan.
seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 10/07/2016 19:54:35
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Replying To seanie_boy: "To Llaw_Gyffes
I don't know about other posters on here but I'd nothing against Aidan O' Shea before yesterday and I still don't today. That's even taking into consideration his prior form in the incident with Pascal Mc Connell where he feigned being struck in the face. The criticism is warranted because he cheated. All cheats should be called out. You are claiming cos he's well known that he's being singled out. I doubt that is the true nature of what's going on. Tiernan McCann wasn't well known last year outside of Tyrone or Ulster but some insiders at RTE and certain people within the national print media made sure he became a household name throughout the whole country. He was vilified to an extent not seen since Sean Cavanagh before him. The witch hunt,cos that's what it amounted to,saw people at RTE calling Croke park to demand punishment. All Tyrone posters condemned what he did on the field cos again he feigned injury and got another guy sent off. We objected to the personal vilification of the player and the Tyrone management. Mayo posters should resist all attempts to demonize Aidan O' Shea also. He did what many others have done and doesn't deserve special sanction for it,just like Mc Cann didn't or Cavanagh or all the others. You must call it for what it was though. He dived and he cheated. Simple as that. Put it in the rules that such behaviour will be sanctioned and then there might be a deterrent for all players to be aware of." What I find hard to stomach is the holier than thou attitude of some of the posters on the Aidan O Shea incident. It's as if their county players are knights in shining armour who would never dream of cheating. Latter day Sir Galahads to a man you might say. Now, not having access to a rule book, I'm not sure of the actual rule that Aidan is accused of breaking on Saturday. Seanie bluntly calls it cheating but I would think that the rule would relate to something like "seeking to gain an unfair advantage". A heinous crime heretofore unknown to the GAA outside such barbarous areas as Donegal and Tyrone. Have any any of you ever witnessed a member of your team seek to gain an unfair advantage? Has any of your players ever moved a free a few metres forward behind the officials back, stood too near a free taker to put him off, having first had a few friendly words in his ear. Seeking to gain an unfair advantage. How about time wasting, a cunning ploy when it's your own team, a dastardly deed when it's the opposition. Seeking to gain an unfair advantage. I don't suppose any of your whiter than white defenders have ever, out of sight of the officials, grabbed hold of the back of an opponents shirt to stop him making a run? How about feigning injury to upset the opposing teams momentum? Ring any bells? Joe was outraged today. Never saw such a thing before. A blight on the GAA. Manna from heaven for Joe, Aidan being such a lovely target, a prelude to another lazy article in one of the Sunday papers. Just out of a thought did any of you see the sly push in the back of the Galway number eight which led directly to a Roscommon point. Did the Roscommon lads who pilloried Aidan O Shea on here come on to apologise on behalf of their countyman and suggest that Galway should have won by a point. I would suggest the "we got away with one there ha ha" approach prevailed. Fair enough but glasshouses and stones springs to mind. Some of the posts were disingenuous, some were mischievous and if I wasn't such an innocent I would think that some might even have an agenda. You know how it goes, throw plenty of s**t at AOS and enough might stick to influence referees down the line. But then that would be seeking an unfair advantage and we all know that's the preserve of Aidan O Shea and his ilk now don't we.
Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 10/07/2016 21:25:11
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Replying To Llaw_Gyffes: "What I find hard to stomach is the holier than thou attitude of some of the posters on the Aidan O Shea incident. It's as if their county players are knights in shining armour who would never dream of cheating. Latter day Sir Galahads to a man you might say. Now, not having access to a rule book, I'm not sure of the actual rule that Aidan is accused of breaking on Saturday. Seanie bluntly calls it cheating but I would think that the rule would relate to something like "seeking to gain an unfair advantage". A heinous crime heretofore unknown to the GAA outside such barbarous areas as Donegal and Tyrone. Have any any of you ever witnessed a member of your team seek to gain an unfair advantage? Has any of your players ever moved a free a few metres forward behind the officials back, stood too near a free taker to put him off, having first had a few friendly words in his ear. Seeking to gain an unfair advantage. How about time wasting, a cunning ploy when it's your own team, a dastardly deed when it's the opposition. Seeking to gain an unfair advantage. I don't suppose any of your whiter than white defenders have ever, out of sight of the officials, grabbed hold of the back of an opponents shirt to stop him making a run? How about feigning injury to upset the opposing teams momentum? Ring any bells? Joe was outraged today. Never saw such a thing before. A blight on the GAA. Manna from heaven for Joe, Aidan being such a lovely target, a prelude to another lazy article in one of the Sunday papers. Just out of a thought did any of you see the sly push in the back of the Galway number eight which led directly to a Roscommon point. Did the Roscommon lads who pilloried Aidan O Shea on here come on to apologise on behalf of their countyman and suggest that Galway should have won by a point. I would suggest the "we got away with one there ha ha" approach prevailed. Fair enough but glasshouses and stones springs to mind. Some of the posts were disingenuous, some were mischievous and if I wasn't such an innocent I would think that some might even have an agenda. You know how it goes, throw plenty of s**t at AOS and enough might stick to influence referees down the line. But then that would be seeking an unfair advantage and we all know that's the preserve of Aidan O Shea and his ilk now don't we." Agree 100% with you here ,
topdownfan (Down) - Posts: 555 - 10/07/2016 21:36:34
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Replying To topdownfan: "Agree 100% with you here ," I'll second that.
See lads.....it's good to talk:)
seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 10/07/2016 21:55:54
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Replying To benched: "Is it really though? A dive to get someone sent off or a dive to win what could be a match winning penalty? One as bad as the other in my eyes" Back to the real reason for this post and not the Down mans agenda - just watched recording of post match analysis and Dessie Dolan said it wasn't a dive but "opportunism" - and it's been in the game forever and a day "time and time before" - there you go a great forward from a non-Ulster county admitting it's been in the game for a while and it's actually part of a forwards game. In fairness it's an Ulsterman Jarlath Burns saying O'Shea was wrong.
IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 10/07/2016 22:00:17
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Replying To topdownfan: "Agree 100% with you here ," As you are so observant, I'm surprised you did see the Galway corner back kick Devonney in the early minutes of the game, an action that had McHale almost manhandling the linesman, and should have brought a red card. Swings and roundabouts.
neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 10/07/2016 23:30:19
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Replying To seanie_boy: "Lads this was a few years back. It's Pascal Mc Connell not Niall Morgan." It was from 2013 how is that pascal?
kevin03 (Tyrone) - Posts: 280 - 10/07/2016 23:51:31
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Replying To kevin03: "It was from 2013 how is that pascal?" Apologies I checked it there again. It was pascal you were right. Didn't think he was still playing in 2013.
kevin03 (Tyrone) - Posts: 280 - 10/07/2016 23:57:58
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Was glad to see Ciaran Whealen say in regards some of the abuse toward's O Se as was with McCann last year is dangerous. Some of the comments I have seen borders on hate. These players have to work and go about their daily lives the next day. I am on record here that what he did was worng and I hate diving. Measures should be brought in to counter it and punishment.
We also had "persons" online abusing and mocking the Mayo minors loosing the Connacht final yesterday because of the O Se incident...what had those young lads got to do with what happened with O Se? Some fierce brave keyboard warriors out there.
yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11768 - 11/07/2016 09:44:16
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Shocking decision from McQuillan to give a penalty. In fairness he is a very poor referee. No doubt the penalty changed the game and the result. Mayo were heading out of the Championship.
aidan64 (Kerry) - Posts: 670 - 11/07/2016 09:53:25
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Replying To yew_tree: "Was glad to see Ciaran Whealen say in regards some of the abuse toward's O Se as was with McCann last year is dangerous. Some of the comments I have seen borders on hate. These players have to work and go about their daily lives the next day. I am on record here that what he did was worng and I hate diving. Measures should be brought in to counter it and punishment.
We also had "persons" online abusing and mocking the Mayo minors loosing the Connacht final yesterday because of the O Se incident...what had those young lads got to do with what happened with O Se? Some fierce brave keyboard warriors out there." I'm with you on this one YT. I can only liken it to the treament our own players got last year and indeed this year too online & beyond. Personal insults are unacceptable no matter what county you're from.
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 11/07/2016 10:07:05
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Replying To aidan64: "Shocking decision from McQuillan to give a penalty. In fairness he is a very poor referee. No doubt the penalty changed the game and the result. Mayo were heading out of the Championship." Were they now? Amazing how the second half seems to have been forgotten about, we would have got the scores needed in my opinion.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8507 - 11/07/2016 10:15:51
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I don't think we can blame O'Shea.
We currently have a win at all costs mantra which is a knock on effect of all the money being pumped in and the professional preparation being done.
Is diving wrong? NO. Not when you win a game.
daytona11 (Kildare) - Posts: 4012 - 11/07/2016 10:24:41
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Replying To daytona11: "I don't think we can blame O'Shea.
We currently have a win at all costs mantra which is a knock on effect of all the money being pumped in and the professional preparation being done.
Is diving wrong? NO. Not when you win a game." It is wrong though. It's wrong in a professional game and it's wrong in an amateur game. That's like saying it's ok to boot a fella in the crown jewels if it means you win a game. Both are against the rules and both can give an unfair advantage to one side.
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 11/07/2016 10:37:54
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Replying To yew_tree: "Was glad to see Ciaran Whealen say in regards some of the abuse toward's O Se as was with McCann last year is dangerous. Some of the comments I have seen borders on hate. These players have to work and go about their daily lives the next day. I am on record here that what he did was worng and I hate diving. Measures should be brought in to counter it and punishment.
We also had "persons" online abusing and mocking the Mayo minors loosing the Connacht final yesterday because of the O Se incident...what had those young lads got to do with what happened with O Se? Some fierce brave keyboard warriors out there." Hold on here Ciaran Whelan was one of the cheerleaders who wanted Tiernan McCann hung drawn and quartered and then was silent when he sat in the SG studio after one of his fellow Dublin players did something similar and couldn't criticise that player - believe it was McMahon but could be wrong. Whilst I'm glad hes now saying this is dangerous he gave no credence to that for McCann and there was a media storm (papers, social and TV) beyond belief. McCann is a very young player and made a bad mistake but the hell he apparently went through was not real.
IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 11/07/2016 10:41:58
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Now, not having access to a rule book, I'm not sure of the actual rule that Aidan is accused of breaking on Saturday.
Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts:218 - 10/07/2016 21:25:11 1880437
He's probably accused of the rule that doesn't allow cheating?
5.4 To attempt to achieve an advantage by feigning a foul or injury. PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS - (i) Caution offender; order off for second cautionable foul. (ii) If play has been stopped for a foul, a free kick from where play was stopped, 83 except as provided under Exceptions of Rule 2.2.
Superglue (Kerry) - Posts: 1283 - 11/07/2016 10:53:21
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Replying To IrishGael3: "Hold on here Ciaran Whelan was one of the cheerleaders who wanted Tiernan McCann hung drawn and quartered and then was silent when he sat in the SG studio after one of his fellow Dublin players did something similar and couldn't criticise that player - believe it was McMahon but could be wrong. Whilst I'm glad hes now saying this is dangerous he gave no credence to that for McCann and there was a media storm (papers, social and TV) beyond belief. McCann is a very young player and made a bad mistake but the hell he apparently went through was not real." I imagine he didnt go to town on him cos he learnt his lesson after the mccann incident. Just a thought!
Jackeen (Dublin) - Posts: 4097 - 11/07/2016 10:59:17
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Replying To Jackeen: "I imagine he didnt go to town on him cos he learnt his lesson after the mccann incident. Just a thought!" Possibly Jackeen and if that's the case then there's a positive - however maybe he should have come out earlier rather than let a kid go through the hell McCann went through - I spoke to a Tyrone fella at the NFL finals and he told me McCann was receiving threats via social media now that isn't on, these guys incl CW who sit in their warm studios and selectively criticise amateur players and lets be frank that's what they do, need to wise up. I have no issue with them calling stuff out and then move on but some of their antics is a way over the top and I emphasise its very selective and personal.
IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 11/07/2016 11:13:41
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My take on this is that ,on a whole, it's a sorry thing to see and the vast majority of us don't want to see it in our games.
But people lose the run of themselves completely over this type of stuff. I heard someone saying that O'Sé should be banned for the rest of the Championship and that would lay down a marker for future 'divers'. Ha!
I often wonder if these type of people have ever played a competitive game in their lives? Gamesmanship goes on all the time in matches up and down the country every weekend at every level. Some of it is just more obvious and high profile than others.
Examples:
1. Player is in a corner approaching a ball on the ground with an opponent approaching from behind. Delays his pick-up, encourages 'contact' before crumpling in a heap on top of the ball. 9 times out of 10 it's a free out for minimal contact and the clever player has bought himself a handy way out of a tricky situation. Diving/Clever?
2. A corner forward is out in front of his man but realises he has limited options if/when he gathers possession. Grabs markers forearm, pulls himself and opponent to the ground. To the referee standing 30-50 metres away it's a clear foul by the corner back. The forward has bought himself a potential point from a scorable free position, Cheating/Clever?
3. Forward is playing in a tight championship match. A diagonal ball is delivered into the box favouring the corner forward but if/when he gathers he will be heading away from goal. Forward feels 'contact;, takes a tumble and wins a penalty. Dive/Clever Play?
Look it's not nice to see but how often have Mayo been accused of being too nice? The fact is that if your club mate 'earned' a penalty in such a way in a tight club championship match he'd be lapped up for being cute as a fox.
Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 10002 - 11/07/2016 11:18:11
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Replying To Lockjaw: "My take on this is that ,on a whole, it's a sorry thing to see and the vast majority of us don't want to see it in our games.
But people lose the run of themselves completely over this type of stuff. I heard someone saying that O'Sé should be banned for the rest of the Championship and that would lay down a marker for future 'divers'. Ha!
I often wonder if these type of people have ever played a competitive game in their lives? Gamesmanship goes on all the time in matches up and down the country every weekend at every level. Some of it is just more obvious and high profile than others.
Examples:
1. Player is in a corner approaching a ball on the ground with an opponent approaching from behind. Delays his pick-up, encourages 'contact' before crumpling in a heap on top of the ball. 9 times out of 10 it's a free out for minimal contact and the clever player has bought himself a handy way out of a tricky situation. Diving/Clever?
2. A corner forward is out in front of his man but realises he has limited options if/when he gathers possession. Grabs markers forearm, pulls himself and opponent to the ground. To the referee standing 30-50 metres away it's a clear foul by the corner back. The forward has bought himself a potential point from a scorable free position, Cheating/Clever?
3. Forward is playing in a tight championship match. A diagonal ball is delivered into the box favouring the corner forward but if/when he gathers he will be heading away from goal. Forward feels 'contact;, takes a tumble and wins a penalty. Dive/Clever Play?
Look it's not nice to see but how often have Mayo been accused of being too nice? The fact is that if your club mate 'earned' a penalty in such a way in a tight club championship match he'd be lapped up for being cute as a fox." 100 per cent Lockjaw. I think a lot of people on here have no idea of even playing senior club championship never mind inter county. It is not nice to see but I don't think O Se was thinking of the implications in that spilt second. He probably wasn't even sure where he was standing, it was just about inside the area.
I remember playing in a senior championship quarter final 3 years ago. We were 2 points down 15 minutes into the second half after being 4 up at half time. I did a Sean Cavanagh style rugby tackle on one of their players as they had an overlap for a goal chance. The guy I fouled was known as a hothead so when we hit the deck I wouldn't let go of him. He lost the plot and struck me on the ground 3 or 4 times. A brawl broke out and when things calmed down I got a yellow for the tackle and he got a straight red. The game was stopped for a few minutes and they lost all momentum. We won by 2 and they ended up with 13 men. Am I sorry for what I did? No. I did what I had to do and we won the championship that year. Players are not thinking about what things might look like in a split second, people need to get a grip.
TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8507 - 11/07/2016 11:52:50
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