I am

Tell me about this line from the Cavan GAA Wikipedia entry link. Are they serious?

Current football squad[edit]
Disbanded until the new season starts. If you want to try out, BJ auditions commence on the 20th September 2015 - Imperial Hotel Cavan

realman2 (Kildare) - Posts:296 - 01/03/2016 16:00:21 1829805


anyone can edit wikipedia so never trust it completely.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5520 - 02/03/2016 12:42:21    1830088

And the minority of players play intercounty, yet every club championship is scheduled to facilitate them.

Plenty of other sports have problems with burnout among young players, why would the GAA be any different?

This is completely off topic.......I couldn't really care about other sports and how burnt out they get.....they also have a choice and most get paid a lot of money.
You clearly think burn out is a massive issue....especially with young players. I don't think it's that big an issue and I gave examples......the majority train twice a week and one game. I respect your opinion and that if others but I can't see it. I just feel there are choices for players which I have outlined them in a previous post. They don't have to play and train 7 days a week.....its their choice.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2093 - 02/03/2016 18:01:22    1830205

John McGrath - Tipperary
His schedule from late Dec '14 to April '15

26/12/14 - Played club senior football final
End of January 2015 played 2014 u21 hurling county final
During this period of time he was also training with Tipp u21 footballers & hurlers, UL Fitzgibbon team and Tipp senior hurlers.
He went on to play a few games with Tipp seniors in the league, Lose the u21 all Ireland and win the Fitzgibbon while also playing a few club u21 matches.
The result - persistent hip injuries for the majority of 2015 due to over training and fatigue.

He didnt have to do it you say. What does he leave out, the u21 team who hes played with since u14, the Fitzgibbon team where he was probably on scholarship, the senior team which was more than likely his dream to play with since he was 5 or tell the club where to go??
Player burnout is not a myth, it is very much real.

Joe_Bloggs (Tipperary) - Posts: 186 - 03/03/2016 09:34:04    1830288

This is completely off topic.......I couldn't really care about other sports and how burnt out they get.....they also have a choice and most get paid a lot of money.
You clearly think burn out is a massive issue....especially with young players. I don't think it's that big an issue and I gave examples......the majority train twice a week and one game. I respect your opinion and that if others but I can't see it. I just feel there are choices for players which I have outlined them in a previous post. They don't have to play and train 7 days a week.....its their choice.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts:80 - 02/03/2016

And a mother with 3 kids and a job is on topic?

There's more to burnout than just the number of training sessions or games a player takes part in.

There's a lot of pressure on young people and telling to just give up if they don't like it is completely avoiding the issue.

if_in_doubt (Kildare) - Posts: 3691 - 03/03/2016 10:20:44    1830300

Collie Moran - hip replacement at 29 ! I remember him saying the two people in beds beside him for same procedure were 65 and 85.

There was an excellent piece by Kieran Shannon about him being over played as a young player by a succession of various managers

bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4649 - 03/03/2016 11:43:32    1830330

Guys......John McGrath and Collie Moran are/were elite inter county players. Does the 98% of non elite non intercounty player play in county u21 senior county? No. They train 2/3 times a week and play a game at the weekend. That is not to much. There are people who train a hell of a lot more in other sports which are physically and mentally a lot tougher.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts: 2093 - 03/03/2016 16:21:06    1830491

Guys......John McGrath and Collie Moran are/were elite inter county players. Does the 98% of non elite non intercounty player play in county u21 senior county? No. They train 2/3 times a week and play a game at the weekend. That is not to much. There are people who train a hell of a lot more in other sports which are physically and mentally a lot tougher.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts:82 - 03/03/2016 16:21:06

I no its a small number which are effected but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Its obvious that it is more likely to happen to a 20 year old county player than the average club player.

Joe_Bloggs (Tipperary) - Posts: 186 - 03/03/2016 16:55:54    1830505

Guys......John McGrath and Collie Moran are/were elite inter county players. Does the 98% of non elite non intercounty player play in county u21 senior county? No. They train 2/3 times a week and play a game at the weekend. That is not to much. There are people who train a hell of a lot more in other sports which are physically and mentally a lot tougher.

The_Fridge (Tyrone) - Posts:82 - 03/03/2016 16:21:06   1


Of course it affects the best young players the most!? Not sure what your point is. But im sure any dual club people will know some lads who were playing for 8+ teams at the same time between club & college/school. At a time when their bodies are still growing. Unfortunately the effects only become clear in their mid - late 20s when its too late.

bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4649 - 03/03/2016 18:24:07    1830545

Player burnout is not a myth but it's not so easy to pick a profile and say one size fits all. Depending on a players ability, the better they are, obviously the more teams will want them playing and the more pressure on the player to keep everyone happy.

Coaches should be more responsible with younger players and there needs to be a lot more co-operation between clubs, schools, colleges and inter county setups and monitor and manage exactly what young lads in their care are up to. Unfortunately a lot of coaches can only see/care about their direct needs and have little regard for the long term well being of their players. They will flog the crap out of lads, get the maximum they can from them in order to enhance their own CV and next year or the year after they have a new bunch of lads to flog. They don't care what happens to last year's batch.

We hear about the red zone a lot in professional setups. Players are strictly monitored on training and rest and if they are in a fatigued state or red zone then chances of injury are increased. Unfortunately it's not so easy to monitor our amateur players as they are training with different coaches who don't necessarily see eye to eye never mind co-operate. They don't know exactly how much training a player is doing and they probably don't care as long as they have him exactly when they want him.

Can we implement a system that manages the above better? If there is not a change in mindset of a lot of coaches then unfortunately I doubt it.

Hardtimes (Cavan) - Posts: 1056 - 03/03/2016 20:49:42    1830602

To be honest some managers/Clubs/Counties are smart enough with these things and hopefully getting even smarter.

I know when I was younger I played minor club and senior club but only around 4 of the minors were training with seniors because the rest were smaller ( I presume that was the reason because I wasn't that good)
I got my games with the minors but if trainings clashed Senior took preference.

Even in my current club when championship comes around the senior team splits up to 1st team and then 2nd team. The minors train with whichever team they are with. If they don't yet play senior they train with the second team. No County minor trains with the club seniors until the county are out of their competition. It work well I think in terms of burnout.

I did however notice when I was a bit older and in college it got a bit much at which stage I stopped playing for a few years until I finished college. The reason behind that was that I was playing college ball, u21s and Senior and Managers wanted me to travel home to train during the week and then play possibly multiple games over a weekend.

dstuction (Donegal) - Posts: 1209 - 04/03/2016 09:12:54    1830637

@the_fridge

This topic started because Clondalkindub doesn't like the age changes and decided he wanted to have a go at denying player burnout exists.

There is evidence to suggest player burnout exists towards the elite end and it seems to be particularly problematic around the late teen early 20s ages.

Rules were brought in to deal with this specifically at county level. Sounds pretty sensible to me.

Your solution to player burnout seems to be that should young players aspire to play at an elite level they should just suck it up and do whatever they're being told to do. You also don't think how are sports deal with player burnout is relevant to the GAA.

I disagree with both those points.

I think the GAA needs to make sure playing at an elite level is something enjoyable and worth aspiring to. I think we need to be aware of other sports and how they deal with similar issues to make sure we keep up so that we don't start losing more of our best talent to these other games.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4516 - 04/03/2016 09:42:43    1830648

Thats the thing, people are looking at things simplistically, sure most players only train 2 times a week with one match at weekends etc. Yes the top players excelling at county level have more on their plates but just cos they are a minority doesnt mean it isnt an issue. When you see intercounty players saying they were times they contemplated driving the car into a ditch rather than going training how anyone can say this isnt an issue is beyond me.

At basic club level we have leaving cert students training 2 or 3 times a week with the school with games, then the club minor training and games, club u21, club minor and adult leagues starting now. On top of school, studies, mocks, grinds etc. Then if you happen to be a dual player!

When i got my first job in Dublin i was expected home to train twice a week, leave work at 5, 2.5 hours later pull in for training and either go up the road that night exhausted back to Dublin or leave at 5.30 in the morning to get up for work the next day, and i was no superstar i can tell you.

Now college kids are expected back to train for their clubs. Its an amateur sport, its meant to be a sport and past time but is getting far too serious at every level as far as i can see.

Again people are focussing on physical injuries and completely missing the point.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1488 - 04/03/2016 09:49:14    1830656

The Mayo minor All-Ireland winning side of 2013 would seem to be a good example, as many of them suffer now from injuries such as osteitis pubis, which is often associated with over-training.

Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 07/03/2016 12:08:00    1831709

In my opinion there is also a high % of injuries down to strength and conditioning. It's the same programs for all young player in nearly all counties. Despite everyone having different flexibility and mobility but likewise I'd have to agree on too many games.

Go back to straight knockout for all county games and bring back the club championships to what they were!!

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 07/03/2016 13:20:20    1831795

Good article in Irish Independent today with Roscommons Ultan Harney showing the demands on young talented players now a days even from a county like Roscommon who had short summer last year. Worth a read

Pingcity (Longford) - Posts: 568 - 30/03/2016 08:16:18    1839105

The Mayo minor All-Ireland winning side of 2013 would seem to be a good example, as many of them suffer now from injuries such as osteitis pubis, which is often associated with over-training.

Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts:650 - 07/03/2016 12:08:00 1831709

Are they still pushing cars round the car park up there?

TBH,
There is such a thing as player burnout and its down to two things, rank bad management and rank bad organisational skills within the GAA.

Paid managers and trainers (expenses obviously) need to justify their existence and train the teams like professionals without the rest periods leading to wear and tear, physios say nothing as they're also on the payroll (expenses obviously).

And then you've bad organisational setups within the GAA. Play for 1 intercounty team and thats it. If you're on the senior panel then you're not on the U21 panel and so forth.
The Fitzgibbon and Sigerson need to be for non-intercounty players as well, albeit they're both turning into joke competitions with the 'transfer' policies of some universities being beyond a joke.

Reduce the length of intercounty competitions, a game every week, especially for Minor and U21, with two weeks between senior championship games, tops.

Currently a team can easily go three weeks between games and sometimes more, what do you think managers and trainers are doing with the players in the meantime whilst accruing 'expenses'??

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 30/03/2016 09:40:24    1839124

Top post bricktop. I'd agree with everything said there.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4516 - 30/03/2016 13:36:07    1839232

Travel is a big part of burnout too .

I can only speak for Donegal but a few players in the past number of years were working full time and then had to , in some cases drive 4-5 hours to train .

I'd imagine it's similar in most rural counties , particularly Mayo and Kerry where employment wouldn't be that high .
Travel is a big one IMO.

TheRightStuff (Donegal) - Posts: 1688 - 30/03/2016 14:11:35    1839252