Greenandred
He could be an excellent Gaelic footballer
I'm not suggesting the individual is or isnt
Its ormonds assumption that because he played "pro sport"
Means you can have the skills to play Gaelic football despite not playing for 15 years is ludicrous

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 16/05/2014 20:31:09    1588749

16/05/2014 16:07:54 Soma
Ormo Harlequins were always at bottom in that season barely winning a game. No 1 game would have had any bit as much pressure as a one off final such as the parker pen, secondary competition to heineken cup or not
Good grief! Had harlequins won either of there last 2 games they would have finished 9th. They lost them both and finished 12th, relegated by 2 points. It was one of the tightest relegation battles ever in English rugby. No offence to you but you don't have a clue what you are talking about. Just leave it so. So my name is Ormond not ormo. Really thought people here would have intelligence to read and be capable of typing 6 letters of my first name. isn't an ormo on this site.
Harlequins were always going down and while they were close to survival through a few ok performances their performances over the entire season had them going down. No 1 game can be compared pressure wise to a game where its win or bust in a final. relegation from a league cannot be put to one game while a final is just one game. Not comparable..

16/05/2014 16:16:35 updwell
Janesboro I think you'll find half of those skills you listed out are performed by 1 maybe 2 players on a rugby team while the other half are pushing, shoving and lifting, you can't seriously call those 'skills' Those skills are not performed by just 1/2 players. Actually watch rugby and you would see that. The lifting ability of some of those players in many situations is a skill like 1 man lifts from Mike Ross etc of 2nd rows in lineouts/kickoffs which is serious skill to do especially when they've to keep an eye on the ball and lift an 18+ stone guy and have to move in such a way not to get tackled, hit etc.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 17/05/2014 21:39:14    1589098

16/05/2014 17:15:42 hill16no1man
15 years later you think he will still have the exact same skills come on man?
yeah he had the skills 15 years ago to play county underage
hes now 32 when you leave a sport for that long its bound to take time
sure look at tadhg kennelly he was playing the odd game when home from australia
and was playing a sport far closer to gaa then rugby and it took him from january to august to get himself right
you keep saying pro athlete but that was in rugby I dont get your over use of the word pro
that just because somebody gets paid means they can do anything better
well he obviously wasnt up to the fitness of mayo squad when this was his comments
"I thought my heart was going to explode during training with the running involved and how the rules have changed since I last played!" He is at the end of his rugby season while Gaelic players like the Mayo squad he has joined are at an entirely different juncture in their season so will have totally different training plans in terms of fitness etc. Pro athlete who lives and breathe and has nothing but sport on his mind makes a huge difference. Its May when he joined the county squad. For past decade plus he would be on holidays at this stage not in heavy or intensive training..

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 17/05/2014 21:42:08    1589103

16/05/2014 17:17:03 hill16no1man
ormond he said running was an issue already but saying he was in bits basically from the runningHis body would be wrecked from entire season and the mayo lads he is training with are hitting their peak training period now ahead of the championship...
16/05/2014 18:04:44 GreenandRed
He'd have done the hard condition Connacht last July, August and September in their pre and early season. He'd be saying he's knackered if it was this August and back into another rugby preseason the real murder weeks. He's hit the Mayo training at a time where coaches are ramping up the fitness. I daresay many of the experienced intercounty players are finding it very tough.
For Gavin it's different conditining to the rugby, different skills using different muscle groups, less heavy collisions more pace so of course it takes time to adapt.
Very valid point that he hasn't played at a top level in 15 years but it shouldn't stop him trying. Playing 6 Nations Rugby is possibly comparable to the pressure of a Championship game.
Sure it might annoy someone in the squad that might lose their place but in the unlikely event that Gavin can make the grade it improves our options.
Give him his chance to prove the doubters wrong. 6 nations is easily comparable to pressures of championship..

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 17/05/2014 21:44:28    1589107

16/05/2014 19:40:40 hill16no1man
Janeaboro Half of them skills could be filed under one thing
Kicking a ball Haha
Rugby guys love their terms and fancy names for simply kicking the ball No terms and fancy names. Just different styles of one action.

16/05/2014 20:31:09 hill16no1man
Greenandred He could be an excellent Gaelic footballer
I'm not suggesting the individual is or isnt
Its ormonds assumption that because he played "pro sport"
Means you can have the skills to play Gaelic football despite not playing for 15 years is ludicrous No his pro sport experience combined with his natural football ability. He has played gaelic football afaik. Was mentioned in a newspaper article that he had. Skills are not so unique in gaelic that a player of duffys calibre who was playing a footballing position in a footballing sport and had decent experience underage etc couldn't pick up..

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 17/05/2014 21:57:45    1589113

15 years out of top class football is a very big gap. Tha game has seriously changed in that time.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 8004 - 18/05/2014 18:23:30    1589412

Tomás O'Se made a very valid point today; Regardless of whether he makes the starting 15 for Mayo or not he will bring the professional approach to Mayo and the players will feed off that. He said that is what happened when Kennelly joined the Kerry set up in 2009.

Horsebox77 (Kerry) - Posts: 5491 - 18/05/2014 18:36:25    1589428

Horsebox77
County: Kerry
Posts: 1772

1589428
Tomás O'Se made a very valid point today; Regardless of whether he makes the starting 15 for Mayo or not he will bring the professional approach to Mayo and the players will feed off that. He said that is what happened when Kennelly joined the Kerry set up in 2009.

be a bad sign if mayo need connaught rugby experiance
sure connaught are one of the worst sides in the rabo league

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/05/2014 18:40:04    1589434

18/05/2014 18:36:25 Horsebox77
Tomás O'Se made a very valid point today; Regardless of whether he makes the starting 15 for Mayo or not he will bring the professional approach to Mayo and the players will feed off that. He said that is what happened when Kennelly joined the Kerry set up in 2009. +1.
18/05/2014 18:40:04 hill16no1man
be a bad sign if mayo need connaught rugby experiance
sure connaught are one of the worst sides in the rabo league don't be so arrogant hill. He will bring professional experience and knowledge and has experience with Harlequins and Ireland as well as Connacht.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/05/2014 20:28:49    1589544

Kennelly was playing a sport not too dissimilar to GAA. A sport with not dissimilar defensive and attacking patterns and with an athletic element to it. A fast moving...fast scoring game.

And he wasn't 15 years removed from the sport.

Why not hire any former Pro in from any sport to get a "professional" approach.

If they weren't looking to play him....he wouldn't be near the panel.

Personally I cant see him in the squad in July.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 18/05/2014 20:46:50    1589571

16/05/2014 16:16:35 updwell
Janesboro I think you'll find half of those skills you listed out are performed by 1 maybe 2 players on a rugby team while the other half are pushing, shoving and lifting, you can't seriously call those 'skills'

ok lets have a look at the skillsets involved -
Scrummaging- skills here involve hookin the ball (can be rare control of the ball by the no 8, the pick and drive, the hit, the timing of the shove, the bind, props knowing when to lower /higher their opponent, good body technique, knowing when to bore an opponent/turn a scrum, even winning penalties - there are plenty of examples where a smaller prop has beaten a bigger guy though having strong technique rather than being able to push/shove

Rucking - skills here involve using your correct body position which involved a lot of flexibility, the act of poaching a ball on the deck the skill of protecting a ball on the deck - if you just simply charge in to push and shove you can easily lose your feet and be penalised for going over the top (in defence) or sealing off (in attack)

Catching/fielding be it in lineout/restart of open play - if it is such a wonderful skill in football then its a great skill tooo in rugby

Tackling - correct tackle technique is one of rugbys most important skills - look at 1995 RWC final where big Lomu was caught by super tackling by the relatively small (pardon the pun james small and joost vd westhuizen ) who got low and had great technique. Not much mushing and shoving involved here

Lifting - done by all in pack, lift at restarts and lineouts, in a lineout you have a moving jumper moving jumper back forward, quite often they can catch and offload from lineout in one go offloading in one go its even harder from a restart as the jumper may have to move move

then there is offloading in the tackle

there are plenty of skills in rugby as there are in hurlign and football

janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 19/05/2014 10:16:18    1589766

16/05/2014 19:40:40 hill16no1man
Janeaboro Half of them skills could be filed under one thing
Kicking a ball Haha
Rugby guys love their terms and fancy names for simply kicking the ball No terms and fancy names. Just different styles of one action.

hear hear ormond - hence they are different skills

all sports have fancy terms so does gaa -paralellogram = box , sliotar - ball, puck the sliotar = hit a ball, solo =run with the ball, double=hit the ball -its just terminology

janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 19/05/2014 10:19:42    1589772

Ormo
Harlequins were always going down and while they were close to survival through a few ok performances their performances over the entire season had them going down. No 1 game can be compared pressure wise to a game where its win or bust in a final. relegation from a league cannot be put to one game while a final is just one game. Not comparable..
Ormo I am mindful of George Carlins famous advice when I discuss things with you here, but clearly you don't have a clue what you are talking about and are just bluffing it now, trying to defend your assertion that my perfectly valid point was 'ridiculous'. Quins played Leeds in the second last game of the season, and were 2 points behind them in the table. Had they won that game they knew they were staying up, but they lost it and the final game of the season by 1 point and were relegated. Not only did their entire league season come down to 1 game, it came down to a missed kick by Jeremy Staunton in the final minutes of their final game, a missed kick described by his manager as "the most expensive in British rugby." You clearly have no idea what you are talking about, I have no idea why you persist.
I agree with you JayP, it is very strange to bring a lad in simply because he has previously been paid to play another sport. It smacks of desperation from Horan, and suggests that things are not great in the Mayo camp. If Jason Byrne retired from Bohs at the end of this season I really doubt Jim Gavin would consider calling him straight into the Dubs set-up, regardless of how good a minor he was. That annual €650k spend on the Mayo senior team seems hard to justify if a lad having experience with a poor, inconsistent Connacht outfit is thought to be able to bring a more professional approach.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 19/05/2014 11:49:00    1589866

19/05/2014 11:49:00 Soma
Ormo I am mindful of George Carlins famous advice when I discuss things with you here, but clearly you don't have a clue what you are talking about and are just bluffing it now, trying to defend your assertion that my perfectly valid point was 'ridiculous'. Quins played Leeds in the second last game of the season, and were 2 points behind them in the table. Had they won that game they knew they were staying up, but they lost it and the final game of the season by 1 point and were relegated. Not only did their entire league season come down to 1 game, it came down to a missed kick by Jeremy Staunton in the final minutes of their final game, a missed kick described by his manager as "the most expensive in British rugby." You clearly have no idea what you are talking about, I have no idea why you persist.
I agree with you JayP, it is very strange to bring a lad in simply because he has previously been paid to play another sport. It smacks of desperation from Horan, and suggests that things are not great in the Mayo camp. If Jason Byrne retired from Bohs at the end of this season I really doubt Jim Gavin would consider calling him straight into the Dubs set-up, regardless of how good a minor he was. That annual €650k spend on the Mayo senior team seems hard to justify if a lad having experience with a poor, inconsistent Connacht outfit is thought to be able to bring a more professional approach Can you stop trolling with the ormo stuff. ITS ORMOND.
Not very strange to bring in someone like Duffy. He is in because of his footballing ability as much as more than his other experiences. Certainly doesn't smack of desperation. He was a pro athlete who lived and breathed and solely concentrated on his sport for over a decade an that can bring benefits regardless of how his team did over years.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 19/05/2014 12:02:16    1589879

When Big Davy Tweed (ex Ireland and ulster international)lined out at Full back for the Antrim senior football team it wasn't a big success.

kerryrowz (Kerry) - Posts: 833 - 19/05/2014 12:24:32    1589898

Big Davy trained 14 months a year. January, February and March, March, March.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 8004 - 19/05/2014 13:23:45    1589976

GreenandRed
County: Mayo
Posts: 789

1589976
Big Davy trained 14 months a year. January, February and March, March, March.

BRILLIANT!!!!!

janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 19/05/2014 14:09:39    1590064

GreenandRed
County: Mayo

Big Davy trained 14 months a year. January, February and March, March, March.

Thats class!

On this guys chances of making the Mayo panel tho, does anyone know what position he is hoping to play? 15 years is a hell of a gap and it will take him time to get used to it. However if he is a corner back I cant see it being impossible to play at a high level. Center forward would be near impossible IMO.

white.n.blue (Monaghan) - Posts: 249 - 19/05/2014 14:52:36    1590124

Well he may get a run who knows....our star midfilder (and most improved player) from the league Jason Gibbons apparently broke his ankle in a club game at the weekend which if true is terrible news for Jason, his club and Mayo team and fans.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11583 - 19/05/2014 14:59:51    1590136

Not a million years ago, a certain David Beggy played for Meath, rugby background and only took up playing GAA during the summer as there was no rugby. Never played underage for club or county that I know of. This guy has a GAA background so why not bring him in and see what he can add if anything. Only thing is, is that he's 32 not twenty something, will have taken a lot of abuse in 10yrs pro rugby. Does anyone out west know if he's going to be playin' club football?

moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 486 - 19/05/2014 16:34:35    1590234