As an Antrim Gael who originally supported the redevelopment of Casement Park I now believe the proposed £70 million spend should be shelved as it is:
1. A total political and not a sporting decision; the redevelopments of Windsor Park and Ravenhill have played the major decision on Casement Park getting ALL of this money.
2. It is a waste of resources and will be a white elepehant. Casement should have received maybe a £20 million upgrade and North Antrim had a similar hurling facility/ground built with the rest divided on improving other GAA grounds within Ulster. ONE stadium sitting empty most of the year isn't worth a 70 MILLION POUNDS spend.
3. The stadium in it's current proposal is too big for the surrounding area.
4. It is dividing too many Antrim and Ulster GAA people and creating a lot of bad feeling within West Belfast especially the Gaels there. Thoughts?

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9816 - 30/03/2014 17:41:24    1567121

You are absolutely spot on with that post Ulsterman.All the money should have gone to developing a stadium that is central to all of Ulster and where the Ulster championship final could be played and be accessible to people from the whole province.Time to reallocate all this money to a Healy park upgrade in Omagh :)

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 30/03/2014 18:04:35    1567153

I hate to say I told you so Ulsterman, but... ;)

TheGateKeeper (Tyrone) - Posts: 2843 - 30/03/2014 18:55:51    1567205

Have to agree with that. The old ground certainly needed an upgrade and the new proposed one looks impressive, but will it be used enough to justify spending so much money? Not a chance!

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5244 - 30/03/2014 19:10:47    1567218

Several matters have really soured this entire episode. The way residents seem to have been airbrushed out the development altogether isn't right as is they way the Casement Social Club has been treated. People are looking at what's happening to those living around Croke Park and are very concerned about their quality of life. Furthermore legal letters flying about and being sent by the County board to former county players about alleged outstanding Social Club bills just alienates people and leaves a bitter taste. All this in the week that a famous Falls Road club McDermotts has folded due to falling numbers. There seems to be very little goodwill whatsoever regarding this redevelopment just a lot of very angry, betrayed people.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9816 - 30/03/2014 20:38:51    1567307

I don't support this development for the simple reason that Cavan will be seeing a lot of Ulster semi-finals and finals in the coming years and it's such a trek for us to go to Belfast ;)

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 30/03/2014 20:52:32    1567326

Ned_Stormcrow
County: Cavan
Posts: 229

1567326 I don't support this development for the simple reason that Cavan will be seeing a lot of Ulster semi-finals and finals in the coming years and it's such a trek for us to go to Belfast ;)


Semi finals maybe. Finals not so sure. decent hard working but limited team.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6178 - 30/03/2014 21:08:55    1567351

I support it beacuse we need a decent 21 century stadium in the second city and if Cavan got to the final you would travel...

Would you not travel to Croke Park or are you just a complete stringy git

Today myself , wife and kids travelled the long jouney to Tuam - its an embarrasment, Galway won the game, no complaints, ref was poor - he should have sent more Armagh men off - but what annoyed me was i brought my wife and kids to this dump when Salthill is fine and ok,
Fact - i can p>>s up aginst a wall but not my daughter or wife, we need facilities which the 21Century expects, i want to sit in a half decent stand, not something which should have been pulled down 40yrs ago..., i saw an elderly gentleman going over on his ankle, fall over on the crumbling paving area, the terracing is a disaster waiting to happen, - crumbling,

So yes I support all decent groung improvements wether it is in Cork, Louth or anywhere.......

cuchulainn35 (Armagh) - Posts: 1688 - 30/03/2014 21:30:09    1567375

Greengrass
County: Louth
Posts: 3007


Semi finals maybe. Finals not so sure. decent hard working but limited team.

Yes! That's exactly what people said about Donegal in 2011. And then..............

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 30/03/2014 21:41:22    1567393

Cuchulainn, of course I'd travel, I'd go to the moon if Cavan ever played there, hopefully it wont come to that though because I think the sky is the limit for us, but obviously the closer the better, Croke Park is little over an hour for us anyway.

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 30/03/2014 21:44:13    1567396

Almost everyone would support having a new state of the art stadium as the home of the GAA in Ulster, as long as there was a proper debate over its location and full consultation with all the residents and other interested parties. There was a strong case for putting the development somewhere central in the province, either on the outskirts of Dungannon, which has all the commercial infrastructure needed, or possibly on a green field site in a place with good road connections like Ballygawley. Casement Park, which is surrounded by existing housing, was an unusual choice which could only work if a huge effort was made to sell the project to the local community. Instead, information was released on a very restricted basis, the people living nearby felt alienated and the dealings with the Casement social club were mishandled to a ludicrous degree. There is so much bad feeling about that the Ulster Council might be best to put the whole scheme on hold for six months, make a fresh start with the residents and see if some form of agreement can be reached. If not, there is little point in trying to force the plans through in the face of growing opposition.

MourneRising (Down) - Posts: 238 - 30/03/2014 21:55:17    1567407

Yeah Andytown and west Belfast doesn't need all this investment. A waste of time. Urban decay and drinking clubs, now yer talking

srb (Antrim) - Posts: 344 - 31/03/2014 09:41:36    1567451

We all knew this was a decision based purely on political expediency rather than on pure sporting and cultural demands, the shinners would have called in more than a few favours with their new friends in the NIO for being good law abiding citizens of the UK, to ensure that the 'heartlands' is well catered for, nevermind the concerns of the local folk nor the grassroots of the wider Ulster GAA community.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 31/03/2014 09:52:06    1567459

Investment srb?? After the initial build, which more than likely will be fellas from the country, can you tell us what economic benefits will come to West Belfast exactly? If there are 4 big matches a year that's some part time bar work for a few hours for a few kids and probably an outside catering firm with maybe a few local cafes and bars getting a wee bit more trade for 4 days a year. There will be few permanent jobs at the new stadium; it will be like one of those lovely big granite headstones in Milltown Cemetary from the 19th century. Impressive to look at but nobody comes near them for most of the time.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9816 - 31/03/2014 14:06:20    1567752

Ulsterman
County: Antrim
Posts: 6757

1567121
As an Antrim Gael who originally supported the redevelopment of Casement Park I now believe the proposed £70 million spend should be shelved as it is:
1. A total political and not a sporting decision; the redevelopments of Windsor Park and Ravenhill have played the major decision on Casement Park getting ALL of this money.
2. It is a waste of resources and will be a white elepehant. Casement should have received maybe a £20 million upgrade and North Antrim had a similar hurling facility/ground built with the rest divided on improving other GAA grounds within Ulster. ONE stadium sitting empty most of the year isn't worth a 70 MILLION POUNDS spend.
3. The stadium in it's current proposal is too big for the surrounding area.
4. It is dividing too many Antrim and Ulster GAA people and creating a lot of bad feeling within West Belfast especially the Gaels there. Thoughts?


Are you for real?? What made the penny finally drop with you?

I argued last year about Casement being a political deal rather than a sporting nescessity, that Casement had to get that much money as Ravenhill and Windsor Park were getting upgraded ( Rugby world cup bid ).
I said a more central GAA stadium with ample parking and equal journey times for the 9 counties who use such a venue would be better and more sensible.

I agree that Casement needs to be fixed up, and the overall facilities need to be upgraded. If you said Antrim GAA deserves a good quality County ground, I would say yes they do and I would back such a project.

But the argument that Belfast City needs a GAA stadium just doesn't wash with me, especially with a bunch of local politicians clammering to get a photo op and brag at next election that they made this happen. When in truth the descision to Inject £70 Million was taken most likely after a Rugby Lobby group pushed for support for a Rugby World Cup bid.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 31/03/2014 14:13:53    1567762

brendtheredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 9107

1567459
We all knew this was a decision based purely on political expediency rather than on pure sporting and cultural demands, the shinners would have called in more than a few favours with their new friends in the NIO for being good law abiding citizens of the UK, to ensure that the 'heartlands' is well catered for, nevermind the concerns of the local folk nor the grassroots of the wider Ulster GAA community.

One of the main reasons I had a beef with Casement getting a £70 million stg makeover, was that it is a provincial stadium rather than a National or International venue.
The majority of folks who attend it, will come from the 9 counties of Ulster. Yet it was being located in the extreme east of the province!!!.

A bit more thought should be put into it what we need from such a stadium, and what travelling supporters need and want. A location central to the 9 counties would have been my preferred choice of location for a top class stadium. Making it logistically viable for those who use it the most.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 31/03/2014 14:23:55    1567775

Yes, investment. have you chose to ignore the various studies that tell you the economic benefits of such stadia throughout the world? Here's one on Cardiff's Millennium Stadium http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/29064.php#.Uzlvko77BaQ How many times per year is that full?

srb (Antrim) - Posts: 344 - 31/03/2014 14:41:06    1567801

Dungannon, Ballygawley, you say? Is there public transport to these places? Would you get 30 to 40K people to travel there for a concert? (G Brooks and that Carter fella aside)

Belfast is the right location, Casement is the wrong site, its just too small, there are plenty of other grey sites in Belfast that should have been looked at, but alas this is a pet project for some high ranking Ulster council officials and some politicking by the West Belfast Councillors.

Hasty and ill thought out decision not helped by some dubious feasibility report carried out by the Ulster Council,which won't see the light of day.

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 31/03/2014 14:42:39    1567804

bricktop
County: Down
Posts: 855

1567804
Dungannon, Ballygawley, you say? Is there public transport to these places? Would you get 30 to 40K people to travel there for a concert? (G Brooks and that Carter fella aside)

Omagh was more to my thinking, a mere stone throw from Ballygawley i suppose. Specifically along the new A5 dual carriageway would be preferred, with exclusive exit from the A5 to the stadium.
Easy access from Belfast, Armagh, Monaghan, Enniskillen, Letterkenny, Derry, Dungannon, Cavan etc. Yes there is public transport to this particular spot, Including Dublin/Derry and Dublin/Letterkenny buses passing every 40 mins.

Wow.......We could have a Provincial stadium that would actually cater for a Provincial crowd!!
WARNING: Sadly It may not suit the jet hopping global crowds flying in for every big GAA game or One Direction concert, as additional bus trip would be needed. But it will be a GAA fans wet dream.

Why the facination about holding concerts in a GAA provincial stadium? Belfast has managed for years without stadium concerts, but now they will have Windsor park and Ravenhill for bigger concerts, and for anything bigger than that see Croke Park.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 31/03/2014 15:17:15    1567852

srb
County: Antrim
Posts: 303

1567801
Yes, investment. have you chose to ignore the various studies that tell you the economic benefits of such stadia throughout the world? Here's one on Cardiff's Millennium Stadium http://www.wru.co.uk/eng/news/29064.php#.Uzlvko77BaQ How many times per year is that full?

The Millenium Stadium is Wales "National stadium", and hosts many International Rugby games and International Soccer games each year. Also as the National Stadium, It is first choice for large Concerts that are being held in Wales. That won't apply here.

An Ulster Provincial GAA stadium will host mostly low - medium attendance GAA games throughout the year, until the Provincial championship SF or Final in June or July. It will lose big concerts to Croke Park, and will be forced to compete with a host of other outdoor venues for Concerts in it's capacity range.

It is my opinion that a Provincial GAA stadium should be there to benefit the GAA supporters in the whole province, rather than worrying about it's economic benefit to Belfast or its ability to host concerts which are secondary concerns IMO.

Is it a facility for Gaelic Games, or a fundraising Investment?

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 31/03/2014 15:31:08    1567877