And can I add Deise that there are a few snide and unfair comments attributed to yourself towards the creggan management and club so leave off with the Holier than thou bull.

frankbhoy77 (Antrim) - Posts: 1300 - 07/03/2014 14:28:37    1556231

Hopefully Croke Park will come out now and clarify the rule as they way things are left it would appear that the decision was based on a technicality i.e. the 72 hr rule.

I imagine we will get clarification when things have settled down some time before Jan 2015 but I would like to hear it now when it is most relevant.

I do believe that there has been too much muck thrown around on this particular case and would be of the opinion that many clubs in the same position as either of the finalists would have taken the same course of action so folk should maybe think with their heads before climbing onto their Ivory Towers.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 07/03/2014 14:43:56    1556241

I'm really sorry, but I've held my council long enough.

How any blame of this scenario is apportioned to Creggan is beyond me.

The comment "Creggan acted in Good Faith" translation, Creggan sought and received clarification on the rule from GAA Management, and were given the go ahead to play, therefore the club acted in good faith. Not Chancers, not cheats, not trying to take advantage of "gray areas". Clarification sought, clarification received, players played, All Ireland won on the pitch.

And what really irks me, Creggan are not the first club to do this, and we were not even the only club this year to play 16 year olds, but were the club that's being highlighted as being chancers.

Regarding Ballysaggart. Even after all their attempts to change the script, one cannot look at their objection in isolation.

Before the Game - Ballysaggart overly confident on whipping the Northerners
After the game - It ref is blasted, Creggan's physical approach is blasted, Creggan's hurling ability questioned,
During objection - Creggan's integrity questioned, OMG they played 16 year olds, Ballysaggart overly confident on winning objection
After objection - CP let us down; we had 16 years to play

It's all excuses, any balanced view here would see that Ballysaggart didn't take defeat well, and it obviously has to be down to one of the excuses listed above, and not that they were out hurled over the two games from a small club, from the football area of a weaker hurling county.

CSC (None) - Posts: 17 - 07/03/2014 15:32:41    1556267

Ach catch yourself on deisebhoy, as i said before ulsterman was the only contributor to question the attitude of Waterford GAA in general and i think he may have since realised he was being hasty when pointing the finger at Waterford GAA. I think he was wrong as prob like most Antrim gaels we have nothing but respect for Waterford. Justin McCarthy had them up playing friendly matches in Antrim when most others counties didnt and still wont consider it. We've also a waterford man currently in charge of the county team. So there is certainly no bad feeling towards Waterford GAA from Antrim gaels and to be truthful Ballysaggart either, more disappointment at the turn of events.
I think that because Creggan exploited this grey area and Ballysaggart didnt is what is really eating away at them. Im sure you'd have a better idea about the quality of the 'u16s' they could have played.

bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 07/03/2014 15:37:47    1556269

If Creggan sought clarification from the GAA regarding this rule, why has this not been communicated?

The newspapers are now reporting that the CCCC found that the rule was unclear or ambiguous, and that Creggan had acted in good faith by waiting until the next calender year to play the players.

If this is the stance, it's a very different outcome than Creggan having sought and received clarification that what they had done was correct.

Once again I'm going to criticise the CCCC for making a huge mess of this. Still no clarity. Basically they're suggesting that Creggan broke the rules, but because they were unclear and because they didn't know that they were breaking any rules, we'll let them away with it.

ringo (Wexford) - Posts: 384 - 07/03/2014 15:57:31    1556281

Well said C&S

theseasider (Galway) - Posts: 23 - 07/03/2014 16:29:46    1556296

I think by the letter of the law creggan should not have the trophy and ballysagart should have it. But becasue the rule is ambiguous and they followed it as close as they thought they should then they should keep their trophy. I think the GAA should make sure all clubs competitions are in one calender year and then this would not happen or else explain that the club and all ireland are actually thought of as the same cometition. I think the waterford side have every right to question this but Creggan were not wrong really. GAA HQ problem

Fishermantom (Limerick) - Posts: 569 - 07/03/2014 16:45:23    1556301

Ballysaggart played honestly and contested every match last year from their Western and County championship to the All Ireland Series. No one minds losing, when a game is lost fair and square but after the hard slog every player put in all year it must have been gut wrenching to find out that An All Ireland Final was lost because an opposition team "acted in good faith" by playing illegal players. It must be soul destroying especially when Ballysaggart were told they were not allowed to play their sixteen year olds. Soul destroying for the players, their families the management team and all who supported the team throughout the year. So the CCCC should stand up and give a proper explanation and not just come out and say " that by acting in good faith" is the way to win all Ireland's, because to some one like me who follows GAA then what's the point. What's the point following the rules, what's the point giving a 100% at training every night only to be beaten by a team that "acted in good faith". Not right and the rule needs to be clarified sooner rather than later so that another team does not suffer at losing An All Ireland the wrong way.

Deisefairplay (Waterford) - Posts: 2 - 07/03/2014 18:04:52    1556327

Does the statement they acted in good faith clarify they checked the rules prior to playing the game? If so I have complaints given dat the council gave the permission to play 16 year olds.

WildPundit (Tipperary) - Posts: 1709 - 07/03/2014 18:59:15    1556350

So Ballysaggart were told they couldn't play their 16 year olds while Creggan were told they could play theirs??? Come off it!

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 07/03/2014 19:11:14    1556355

CSC why should the comments of one idiot prejudice your view towards a club? Has anyone from your club never made unacceptable comments about referees?

Your post is trying to insinuate that lodging an appeal is equally as low as the comments made about the referee. The guy who said those comments had nothing to do with lodging the appeal and i can assure you he is not a popular man in his home parish at the moment. Yes the comments made by him were shameful but nothing shameful about a club seeking clarification of a rule l

deisebhoy (Waterford) - Posts: 416 - 07/03/2014 20:02:53    1556376

look lads it's all ifs and buts,but at the end of the day and after two games the best team won.well done Creggan...

turfcutter (Antrim) - Posts: 277 - 07/03/2014 20:12:19    1556381

Bumpernut ballysaggart have 2 young lads that would definetly have been playing but more importantly have a new player who recently transferred from a neighbouring club. He would have been a match winning forward but ballysaggart didnt try and play him as they were 'acting in good faith'

So what the gaa are saying is if ballysaggart had played this player as long as they were acting in 'good faith there wouldnt have been an issue. And dont try and tell me its different cos the creggan lads were only 16 because the concept is the same its still a new calendar year. Ballysaggart were the ones who acted in 'good faith' by not playing any new players for the semi or finals but look where that got them'

deisebhoy (Waterford) - Posts: 416 - 07/03/2014 20:18:28    1556383

CSC why should the comments of one idiot prejudice your view towards a club? Has anyone from your club never made unacceptable comments about referees?

Your post is trying to insinuate that lodging an appeal is equally as low as the comments made about the referee. The guy who said those comments had nothing to do with lodging the appeal and i can assure you he is not a popular man in his home parish at the moment. Yes the comments made by him were shameful but nothing shameful about a club seeking clarification of a rule l

deisebhoy (Waterford) - Posts: 416 - 07/03/2014 20:24:03    1556385

maybe i am wrong but i think the law is still much the same as it always was if you are 16 in the year you are under 16,once you go into the next year you are over the age limit,16 in this case and if the rules are correct the two lads are legal to play even if it started in 2013 but then again this is the GAA and most of the people who sit at the top table have no common sense when it comes to sorting out problems or setting out the rules to make it simple for everyone

jackhammer (Louth) - Posts: 83 - 07/03/2014 20:33:22    1556388

well done to Thomas McCann,Danny Dougan,Seamus Dougan and Terry Maguire and to all the Creggan team
for a great result,you have taken us to the top,

killhill (Galway) - Posts: 2 - 07/03/2014 21:33:07    1556412

The players in question are over 16 in 2014. It looks like Creggan did their homework and concluded that the all ireland series which starts and finishes in 2014 is a 2014 competition. The CCCC who run the competition must have a similar view since the black card was enforced for football. It's likely many other clubs operated on the same understanding. Surely Ballysaggart were told that they could not play players in a similar position and Creggan were I'd expect we would have heard a lot more about it.

Brick__Tamland (Tyrone) - Posts: 2 - 07/03/2014 21:36:25    1556413

I'm really looking forward to hearing about the new batch of youngsters breaking into the Ballysaggart first team, the teamsheet should make for interesting reading come championship time. Sounds like their future is bright

skillstar93 (Antrim) - Posts: 41 - 08/03/2014 10:01:46    1556448

CSC
County: All
Posts: 15

1556267 I'm really sorry, but I've held my council long enough.

How any blame of this scenario is apportioned to Creggan is beyond me.

The comment "Creggan acted in Good Faith" translation, Creggan sought and received clarification on the rule from GAAManagement , and were given the go ahead to play, therefore the club acted in good faith. Not Chancers, not cheats, not trying to take advantage of "gray areas". Clarification sought, clarification received, players played, All Ireland won on the pitch.

And what really irks me, Creggan are not the first club to do this, and we were not even the only club this year to play 16 year olds, but were the club that's being highlighted as being chancers.

Regarding Ballysaggart. Even after all their attempts to change the script, one cannot look at their objection in isolation.

Before the Game - Ballysaggart overly confident on whipping the Northerners
After the game - It ref is blasted, Creggan's physical approach is blasted, Creggan's hurling ability questioned,
During objection - Creggan's integrity questioned, OMG they played 16 year olds, Ballysaggart overly confident on winning objection
After objection - CP let us down; we had 16 years to play

It's all excuses, any balanced view here would see that Ballysaggart didn't take defeat well, and it obviously has to be down to one of the excuses listed above, and not that they were out hurled over the two games from a small club, from thefootball area of a weaker hurling county.

CSC what a great post, it nails the whole thing to the wall. Well said. Don't keep your council as long next time!!

thetallgypsy (Antrim) - Posts: 97 - 08/03/2014 15:21:05    1556562

well done Creggan,AI champs from the wee black North,hard for a lot of you lads to accept,best team by far over two games both on and off the field,get over it...

turfcutter (Antrim) - Posts: 277 - 08/03/2014 16:09:41    1556586