seany16
County: Dublin
Posts: 1219

1518936 The key point in all aspects of this discussion is the fact that Dublin, or the DCB, have managed to get their house in order. This debate or comments from the Kildare CB simply wouldn't materialize had Dublin not won 2/3 of the last All Irelands. Its simply an excuse from counties like Kildare to attempt to place their shortcoming upon factors apparently outside their control. Yet within that partially paraphrased statement we see no acceptance of responsibility for the financial predicament that Kildare find themselves in. Kildare, a county with a potentially large support-base have no ground of their own worth talking about and that fact has hurt them over the years in terms of their development. The common opinion that Kildare focussed upon trying to achieve success without concentrating on their grass roots did not materialize from no-where!

Dublin who have a larger support-base have also no home ground worth talking about.

What common opinion is this? The one that you hold? Or the one that Dubs hold? And again I'll repeat for those like yourself who are probably not aware but Kildare are the current Leinster minor and U21 Champions. Not bad for a crowd that have thrown the eye off the ball when it comes to the grass roots.

Dublin have their house in order with a good bit of help from the GAA. Going back 15 years they were getting twice as much in capital grants than any other county. Thats a fact. It cannot be denied that Dublin have gotten serious money from the GAA in recent years. I'm not saying it should not be done but at least show a bit of equality and spread the wealth. The games need development everywhere and not only in Dublin.

sedico (Kildare) - Posts: 1682 - 28/11/2013 21:34:42    1518980

sedico, with all due respect.....

If Dublin get twice the capitol grants of other counties and have a support base/membership 4 times the size of everyone else, then surely the Dubs are still getting short changed?

On the Parnell Park jibe....Parnell is a lovely little ground with cover on 3 sides of the ground. Go to most county grounds and you only have one side covered!

So...no....Parnell isn't Croke Park, but its well developed for its limited size.

Like people on here live in a bubble....the expenses Dublin incur in promoting GAA and the fan base they attract surely merits the deals that they are negotiating. This nonsense about money is ridiculous. If you have a brain, you understand that Dublin are good for the GAA.....and a decent Dublin generate revenue and interest that just wouldn't be there if Dublin were back in the doldrums.

Dublins sponsorship is relative to the sponsorship in the past......its always been bigger......didn't always equate to success.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 28/11/2013 21:47:45    1518987

Id Dublin are able to raise money for themselves in whatever way they want, then so be it. If they can haggle to get more money from sponsorship than others, then fair play to them, all the power to them for being able to do it. Of course being capable of winning the AI in both codes helps, but they fact is they're a huge draw.

I would point out to those giving out about Dublin getting the huge sponsorship deal, well there wasn't a word there 10 years ago about Dublin's sponsorship deals when they weren't successful in either code, including underage.

And I would also point out that the likes of Kildare, who are in massive debt, would have being better off in copying Dublin's plan of putting their earnings into underage development than pouring massive amounts of their earnings into into massive backroom teams and management wages for the senior team. Or Cork, who manage their finances well and have never being in debt, despite being one of the top sides in both codes through all age groups. Or Kilkenny, with half their population base to raise money, who have financed a new stand, a new training centre, fully kitted development squads, expenses for coaches training schools outside Kilkenny that have Kilkenny players in said schools, and improved their club grounds, and have not gone into debt doing so.

Perhaps counties should start looking at how they spend their own money than moan about Dublin managing to attract a nice deal. At least with Dublin there's a good chance that money will be gone into underage development. If other counties did the same, they might just be successful enough to get a good deal themselves.

dblackandamber (Kilkenny) - Posts: 92 - 28/11/2013 21:58:13    1518991

County: Dublin
Posts: 492

1518987 sedico, with all due respect.....

If Dublin get twice the capitol grants of other counties and have a support base/membership 4 times the size of everyone else, then surely the Dubs are still getting short changed?

On the Parnell Park jibe....Parnell is a lovely little ground with cover on 3 sides of the ground. Go to most county grounds and you only have one side covered!

So...no....Parnell isn't Croke Park, but its well developed for its limited size.

Like people on here live in a bubble....the expenses Dublin incur in promoting GAA and the fan base they attract surely merits the deals that they are negotiating. This nonsense about money is ridiculous. If you have a brain, you understand that Dublin are good for the GAA.....and a decent Dublin generate revenue and interest that just wouldn't be there if Dublin were back in the doldrums.

Dublins sponsorship is relative to the sponsorship in the past......its always been bigger......didn't always equate to success.


Why do you take it as a jibe? It wasn't a jibe - I was merely pointing out that with your support base and ability to attract such sponsorship ye're county ground is not relative to that. Just because I said something critical about Dublin doesn't mean I meant it as a jibe.

And again I never said Dublin were not good for the GAA but then again every other county is good for it too. Its not all about Dublin. I should also mention that what Kathleen O'Neill said is a load of bunkem. Dublins sponsorship is Dublins business.

I don't think I'm wrong in saying that Dublins development over the past several years has received significant funding from Croke Park. Maybe someone could enlighten me as to how many GDA's Dublin have? I heard a figure in the high teens.

sedico (Kildare) - Posts: 1682 - 29/11/2013 09:37:12    1519008

Great article. Just about sums it all up....

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/football/2013/1129/489884-roche-dublins-appeal-helps-gaa-financially/

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 4281 - 29/11/2013 09:59:02    1519016

This nonsense about money is ridiculous. If you have a brain, you understand that Dublin are good for the GAA.....and a decent Dublin generate revenue and interest that just wouldn't be there if Dublin were back in the doldrums.

Well, they are and they arent. They are good for the gaa as an organisation because they earn a quick buck off them. They are bad for the actual sport because of the advantages they are being given. We are headed for an La Liga situation, where 1 team goes miles ahead of the others because they keep getting way more resources. Which takes away from the competitiveness, which in turn leads to neutrals losing interest. So in terms of promoting our games further afield, it is actually the total wrong way to go. We should be striving for the EPL model, not the roundly criticised La Liga model. That is what people dont realise here. Saying dublin are good for the gaa doesnt tell the full story and is actually misleading, they may be, but if that effort went into making things more even, what that would give you is fierce competition in more games, with smaller teams taking more big scalps. So dublin might be good for the gaa financially, but the opposite would be great for the gaa in all aspects.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 29/11/2013 09:59:03    1519017

Holy moly, you would think the Dubs were winning All Irelands every year with the sponsorship deals we have.

Money doesnt guarantee success. Our record over the past 20 years will show that.

Time for the begrudgers to move on and hope their own county boards get their act together and their own house in order, instead of whinging about someone else doing well financially.

Between splitting our sponsorship money and the previous idea of splitting our county in 2... I dunno...
Where was all this talk about Kilkenny hurling team or the great Kerry football team being split in 2.
It didnt happen.
But Dublin win 2 All irelands in 3 years and some counties start getting hysterical.. Get a grip.
Jealousy is a terrible thing.

Counties would be better served concentrating on themselves rather than us.

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 4281 - 29/11/2013 10:28:54    1519034

Fionn
County: Dublin
Posts: 527

1519034 Holy moly, you would think the Dubs were winning All Irelands every year with the sponsorship deals we have.

Money doesnt guarantee success. Our record over the past 20 years will show that.

Time for the begrudgers to move on and hope their own county boards get their act together and their own house in order, instead of whinging about someone else doing well financially.

Between splitting our sponsorship money and the previous idea of splitting our county in 2... I dunno...
Where was all this talk about Kilkenny hurling team or the great Kerry football team being split in 2.
It didnt happen.
But Dublin win 2 All irelands in 3 years and some counties start getting hysterical.. Get a grip.
Jealousy is a terrible thing.

Counties would be better served concentrating on themselves rather than us.


I don't believe anyone is begrudging of Dublins financial success - fair play to them for having the business sense to attract it. And of course people are jealous of Dublin. No more than we were all jealous of Donegal last year.

Honestly some of you are uber sensitive when it comes to Dublin.

Are we not entitled to show concern about the possibility that Dublin could become some sort of 'superpower'.

sedico (Kildare) - Posts: 1682 - 29/11/2013 10:52:52    1519039

Sedico
Are we not entitled to show concern about the possibility that Dublin could become some sort of 'superpower'.


Nobody in Dublin thinks Dublin are going to become a super power. Far from it.
We may win a couple more All Irelands in the next few years please God, but a SUPERPOWER. I dont think so.
Bit of an over reaction I feel. Honestly...
We are not being over sensitive at all. Other counties are just over reacting and delfecting from their own poor financial CB's state.
Sort their own messes out first.

Fionn (Dublin) - Posts: 4281 - 29/11/2013 11:04:37    1519043

I agree with this but for it to be classed as a success then the Gaa should be the ones brokering deals. As has been said The DUblin CB did a brilliant job in getting such an ammount but it does call into quiestion what hope the lesser teams have.
Donegal is one of the bigger counties in Ireland and yet it had to rely on handouts from local business men to give the team all they required last 2 years. This is becuase in order to compete with the likes of dublin.
Bare in mind that Dublin are already head and shoulders above the rest (except maybe tyrone) in terms of facilities. All our tyrones were generally senf funded via their supporters fund AFAIK.

dstuction (Donegal) - Posts: 1209 - 29/11/2013 11:14:34    1519047

sedico
County: Kildare
Posts: 1539

Dublin who have a larger support-base have also no home ground worth talking about.

What common opinion is this? The one that you hold? Or the one that Dubs hold? And again I'll repeat for those like yourself who are probably not aware but Kildare are the current Leinster minor and U21 Champions. Not bad for a crowd that have thrown the eye off the ball when it comes to the grass roots.

Dublin have their house in order with a good bit of help from the GAA. Going back 15 years they were getting twice as much in capital grants than any other county. Thats a fact. It cannot be denied that Dublin have gotten serious money from the GAA in recent years. I'm not saying it should not be done but at least show a bit of equality and spread the wealth. The games need development everywhere and not only in Dublin.

Unfortunately for yourself your points re your recent underage success support what im saying. Its true that Kildare have achieved recent success in Leinster. Current Minor and U21 titles is a sign of good work at underage and a sign that structures are in place! Perhaps that is a positive that can be taken from the McGeeney era. However i don't think the same could be said of Kildare football over the past 20 years and in terms of a force in Leinster they have failed miserbly and Minor and Senior level. That fact points to a problem with structures and indeed there is a train of thought that Kildare among many other counties neglected their underage structures and concentrated on short term fixes of one that in fairness nearly worked for them. The same train of thought is evident among Dublin folk in terms of how we neglected our underage structures. Our house is in order and we are seeing results. If Kildare continue to produce good underage sides they stand a very good chance on making a breakthrough!

Re Parnell Park; the ground is actually in good nick and serves the purpose of what we require at that level. Newbridge is one of the worst grounds in Ireland. Not many will dissagree there im afraid.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1663 - 29/11/2013 11:31:58    1519051

Why should Dublin or any county share their sponsorship? If Kildare hadn't persisted with a sub standard management setup for so long and thrown any amount of money at the same setup they might have cash or actually won something

Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 2388 - 29/11/2013 12:47:15    1519083

sedico uses the term superpower.
well if you were to take a superpower in gaa it would be kilkenny in hurling,they have dominated the sport for over a decade.
I didnt hear calls for anything to be changed regarding them,did we?
People talk about dublin having the potential to do it,thats just it potential where as kilkenny have been doing it yet nobody whinged about them.
In football I believe you will never have one team dominate its way too devloped in every county.there are so many teams at the top and a few just below them that if get a couple of good players coming through can go places and get on a roll.
Superclub is brandished alot towards dublin clubs also.yet take the dublin championship theres no domination of the compeition.
six differant clubs in the last ten years have won the competition.
Ballymun kickhams are a clear example of what hard work gets you and developing players.nothing to do with money.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/11/2013 14:06:03    1519108

dstuction

how are we ahead of everybody in facilites?
we have one of the smallest home grounds.
no centre of excellence like most others.
no training bas as our hurlers train in bray which technicaly is wicklow.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/11/2013 14:08:19    1519110

As many posters point out. Its irrelivent whether people think Dublin are a super power! They arent.

All posters who are banging on about that never address the Kilkenny issue in the hurling. Utter dominance in hurling. Nothing done to stop this. Their funding only spent on one code. But completely ignored the other. Others had to catch up.

For the good of the game.....When have Mayo offered Leitrim some cash? For the good of the game like?

Why do Cork and Kerry have the Munster Football draw rigged??? For the good of the game like?

Why do Kilkenny not get penalised for promoting one code? For the good of the game like?

Lets hear some other non-Dublin things that could be for "the good of the game"

So Dublin begrudgers.......catch up.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 29/11/2013 20:30:33    1519211

It suits some posters to portray Dublin as this magical county full of sparkling clubhouses and pitches with thousands of kids outside quequing to get in and money flying around everywhere. truth is most are like every club in Ireland fundraising like mad to get funds to run their clubs, there is a lot of hands being held out looking for money when the DCB have some.
So maybe posters who are moaning especially Kildare should look at where they spent their money.

AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 29/11/2013 22:00:52    1519244

if dublin seek it, get it, its their sponsorship, if you share it, some become dependent and lazy

cuchulainn35 (Armagh) - Posts: 1688 - 30/11/2013 12:07:18    1519274

I would take whatever the Kildare secretary said with a pinch of salt. Dublin have a big sponsorship deal at the mo and fair play to them. they deserve it. investing a lot in underage and in BOTH Codes. 30 other counties are not doing that. Jealousy is an awful thing. Kildare are in financial trouble.

db9 (Meath) - Posts: 283 - 30/11/2013 15:18:48    1519299

Why on earth should one county who get a good deal subsidise one that can't? Doesn't make sense to me, what next? I'll be honest I wouldn't like to see money from tayto park been given to another county. Look kettle and co got excellent deal for Dublin, and fair play to them, why should they now hand a portion of that revenue over to Kildare or whoever? Each county should get their own deals. Let's be honest this talk of super powers is absurd Dublin have appeared in less all Ireland finals than Kerry, cork, Meath Tyrone and even Mayo over last 30 years Little perspective here, yes they are going through a purple patch as of late, but sure Tyrone, Kerry cork and Meath have gone through the same over last few decades.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 30/11/2013 16:45:17    1519313

Fair play to them I say. I don't think they have to share it out at all but I'd like to see a spending cap on county teams put in place and then any excess should be allocated to infrastructure and development. Judging by some of these comments here that may have prevented certain financial difficulties in some counties discussed before my less than insightful post.

Eager_to_hurl (Carlow) - Posts: 81 - 30/11/2013 17:17:33    1519321