http://hoganstand.com/Dublin/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=203674

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 16:35:04    1507849

arock, how can he have summerised it perfectly when he ommitted the very subject the debate is about? A 7 million handout. They didnt raise that, it was given to them out of the taxpayers money. Now the 500,000 he keeps harping on about as regards mayo, we did earn that, that was our money. Strange how he is making, as you say, a perfect summary of how spending your own earned money is perfectly ok in one breath, yet has posted about 15 times about how bad it is when the team concerned is mayo and not dublin. You are justifying spending for dublin because it is their own money, yet criminalising mayo for doing the same thing jimbo... Care to explain that? Not that it is relevant anyway, because the subject up for discussion here is a 7 million euro handout that nobody else got, not money raised, but I would like to hear you explain why you display total double standards as regards a county spending money it raised, as well as you opinion on getting handouts until you are good enough to compete. It is fair to assume that, if the counties involved were swapped, your opinion would swap also, or at least your form suggests that anyway.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 31/10/2013 16:40:36    1507852

What difficulties it poses, we'll have to overcome in time, but let's just see where this goes first.

As I said, already in the pipeline.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 31/10/2013 16:42:45    1507854

"You'll never have an equal world, because life just isn't equal, that's it. But I'd much prefer to face the challenge of having to equalise things because we're getting more money than if we were getting less.

"We are in a recession and we're here now discussing a county getting more money than some people thought they would - as far as I'm concerned that's good news for us.

"What difficulties it poses, we'll have to overcome in time, but let's just see where this goes first."
__________

There you go...

That's pretty much the stance I and others have put forward to you themaster

Your ideas of "fairness" are completely naive and unrealistic.

themaster... you really should be addressing the GAA from here on in...

You're obviously a very "motivated" person.

I see no logic in you continually raising such again on this site where nothing constructive will come from your time and effort.

IMO

I honestly think many posters have had enough of your views at this stage.

It's been quite a number of months with the same message.

It's grown quite tiresome.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 16:51:15    1507861

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 9314

1507854
What difficulties it poses, we'll have to overcome in time, but let's just see where this goes first.

As I said, already in the pipeline.

____________

What's in the pipeline?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 16:53:24    1507865

Master the people from Dublin will meet in say a pub a grand hall to discuss why we are against your proposal , you can meet with your cohorts in a telephone box and get back to us .
Your backed by yourself , not suprising .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 31/10/2013 16:56:11    1507866

jimbodub
County: Dublin
Posts: 11302

1507865
TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 9314

1507854
What difficulties it poses, we'll have to overcome in time, but let's just see where this goes first.

As I said, already in the pipeline.

____________

What's in the pipeline?

....

According to the article... the possibility of additional funding to other counties to level the playing field.

Yet... things will never be ultimately fair... that's the way of life.

Haha... it's as if he's been reading my posts... :)

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 17:03:10    1507869

Again, TheMaster.......

That is delusional on your part. You brush the Kerry and Kilkenny approach under the carpet. It's their business? Well they are harming the development of hurling and football in their counties by ignoring one code. Which hurts the the development and promotion of Gaelic Games going forward. You can't just dismiss that because it suits you.

You said I assume the rest of the country were probably ok with Dublin getting taxpayers money!? Any problem with clubs getting money from the national lottery!? Any problem with the GAA getting taxpayers money for the development of Croke Park!? Surely the IRFU and FAI wouldn't approve of this.

The way you make it out is that Dublin, the Senior County Panels got all this money.

This money was pumped into the communities around the city to develop Gaelic games and participation levels in Dublin. Now you say "taxpayers" money. People in Dublin pay their fair share of taxes and I as taxpayer I am delighted to see money pumped into sports in urban areas as it helps people from falling through the cracks and involves youth in becoming positive participants in society. I have no problem with monies been invested in Cork, Limerick, Donegal etc if it helps society. I have no problem with this. In fact the GAA were shrewd in doing this in Dublin as they know what side their breads buttered on and see the revenue Dublin GAA as vital going forward. Any taxpayers money that went into a development of games in Dublin allowed the GAA redirect finances they might have been pumping into Dublin somewhere else.

The Government pay money into many hundreds of social projects each year, Dublin with the demographics will always get money.

In fact if you look at population diversity, new communities etc. the Dublin County Board, the GAA and the Government will need to direct future funds into inclusive development plans for ethnic minorities. Don't be surprised if the Government give Dublin a "handout" for this. Or else we could just exclude these people, not involve the GAA and end up with riots and marginilisation.

As the Cavan poster pointed out.....Dublin are hardly a dominant force, they haven't had a 10-15 year run of winning every year or second year. You cannot say dividing Dublin is for the good of the game especially since you have no idea how this would affect finances in the game and interest. A diluted Dublin with weak support is of no use to the GAA. Bums on seats TheMaster, and the masses in Dublin don't want a split, so it won't happen.

You keep mentioning for the good of the games etc.......

You would address the imbalances out west or down in Munster if you really wanted development!

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 31/10/2013 17:14:29    1507876

I just hope that the GAA performs a mean test before handing out additional funding to certain counties

Some CB's have run themselves into the ground...

The GAA have already stated in the past that they wouldn't be bailing out toxic CB's... who have spent way above their means.

It wouldn't be fair to reward such toxic practices. I mean there's plenty of CB's being run very well... I personally think they deserve the rewards.

Hopefully the GAA will be true to their word.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 17:22:49    1507881

According to the article... the possibility of additional funding to other counties to level the playing field.

Where does it say that?


Jimbo, when are you going to address the 7 million handout and the knock-on effects of that on inter county football? Just skip to that part will you?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 31/10/2013 19:20:33    1507922

I've already done that several times themaster

Not my problem if you choose to ignore it.

Its all there as clear as day...

"It may well change our thinking on how we finance counties across the board, you know, to equalise things.

"You'll never have an equal world, because life just isn't equal, that's it. But I'd much prefer to face the challenge of having to equalise things because we're getting more money than if we were getting less.


So the GAA will look at how they "finance counties" across the board to equalise things

What does that mean to you?

How do you finance counties to make them more equal with Dublin?

I would stagger a guess... perhaps by making more funding available "across the board"

You'll never have an equal world, because life just isn't equal, that's it.

Almost word for word from what I've been trying to tell you... someone always sits on top.

And that's straight out of the mouth of the GAA... haha

I don't think they quite agree with your own bewildering notions of fairness.

In fact you've been at this for months... with little or no support whatsoever

You have preached about the GAA being almost founded on fairness...

They don't agree with you. :)

Told you...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 20:08:03    1507949

JayP
County: Dublin
Posts: 448

1507876 Again, TheMaster.......

That is delusional on your part. You brush the Kerry and Kilkenny approach under the carpet. It's their business? Well they are harming the development of hurling and football in their counties by ignoring one code. Which hurts the the development and promotion of Gaelic Games going forward. You can't just dismiss that because it suits you.

You said I assume the rest of the country were probably ok with Dublin getting taxpayers money!? Any problem with clubs getting money from the national lottery!? Any problem with the GAA getting taxpayers money for the development of Croke Park!? Surely the IRFU and FAI wouldn't approve of this.

The way you make it out is that Dublin, the Senior County Panels got all this money.

This money was pumped into the communities around the city to develop Gaelic games and participation levels in Dublin. Now you say "taxpayers" money. People in Dublin pay their fair share of taxes and I as taxpayer I am delighted to see money pumped into sports in urban areas as it helps people from falling through the cracks and involves youth in becoming positive participants in society. I have no problem with monies been invested in Cork, Limerick, Donegal etc if it helps society. I have no problem with this. In fact the GAA were shrewd in doing this in Dublin as they know what side their breads buttered on and see the revenue Dublin GAA as vital going forward. Any taxpayers money that went into a development of games in Dublin allowed the GAA redirect finances they might have been pumping into Dublin somewhere else.

The Government pay money into many hundreds of social projects each year, Dublin with the demographics will always get money.

In fact if you look at population diversity, new communities etc. the Dublin County Board, the GAA and the Government will need to direct future funds into inclusive development plans for ethnic minorities. Don't be surprised if the Government give Dublin a "handout" for this. Or else we could just exclude these people, not involve the GAA and end up with riots and marginalisation.

As the Cavan poster pointed out.....Dublin are hardly a dominant force, they haven't had a 10-15 year run of winning every year or second year. You cannot say dividing Dublin is for the good of the game especially since you have no idea how this would affect finances in the game and interest. A diluted Dublin with weak support is of no use to the GAA. Bums on seats TheMaster, and the masses in Dublin don't want a split, so it won't happen.

You keep mentioning for the good of the games etc.......

You would address the imbalances out west or down in Munster if you really wanted development!

Superb post.

Really shows up themasters rather ill informed, lazy and down right sloppy point of view.

But sure nothing new there...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 20:10:50    1507951

The Master,

Look do everyone a favour and separate out the various articles. First you implying that in 2004 Dublin got a freebie of 7m - they didn't it was spread over many years it was only part of what the Govt gave to the GAA. Even last year the Irish Sports Council (they have a very easy to follow website to track the funding) gave the GAA 2.9 million. According to the DCB's own accounts roughly 1 million went to DCB to distribute on the strict criteria of projects stipulated by the ISC. This is very important to the arguments what exactly is that money being spent on? You've been told you won't listen.

The Article by the President of the GAA is refering to the AIG deal for the DCB. That money has/will be given to the DCB to distribute evenly across, Hurling, Football, Camogie, Ladies Football and Handball, throw in schools and colleges. There is barely enough funds in that to power the fuel in the mowers in Dublin to cut the grass never mind lavish it on a single code adult county team.

This money is peanuts when distributed on Dublin GAA, if you build something it has to be maintained and that costs money. The 7m (over 7 years) might buy kit for kids in clubs in severely disadvantage areas, or subsidise their memberships. It might pay for Go-Games promotion in the capitol, it pays for gear and coaching in disadvantaged schools. It pays for infrastructure like joint ventures with the Dublin City Council on building and providing pitches, for grants to college going players. To colleges to promote the games, it goes on and on. This is nothing to do with the clubs nor is it anything to do with the Inter-county teams. Ultimately it is about bringing kids to sport and ultimately bums on seats to make it at self sustaining.
But of the 7m million spread over 7 years or so, it was only a third of the overall grant to the GAA. That is something NOT in the articles. So go to the ISC and see how much Camogie, Ladies Football, GAA, Basketball, Soccer, Rugby etc get its all proportional as it the distribution within the GAA proportional to size.

It is unfair to present only the bits that reinforce an argument, most of us working in the GAA on the ground no the sheer scale of the financial problems in Dublin GAA.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4954 - 31/10/2013 20:16:38    1507952

Again.. another superb effort arock.

Only further highlights the baseless / spin / sensationalist input of themasters own efforts.

:)

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 20:24:57    1507958

Grrat piece arock , but will go on deaf ears with The Munster (ha festive )

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 31/10/2013 20:36:19    1507961

And by the way arock...

How is any of that

"Profit before People"

The title to this thread....

It's just a pity that the Government didn't pump more money into the GAA when everything was rosey

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 31/10/2013 20:36:57    1507962

Lot of energy been wasted lads repling to a Wum.
It doesn't really matter what good and valid evidence is put forward, the Master is like someone in the opposition in politics , he will just go the other way in the argument.
I do think ADMIN have to look at the amount of time he spends ruining threads by going on about Dublin, its stopping people posting .
Personally I think ill give it a miss for a while .
Adiós boys till O Byrne Cup time.

AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 31/10/2013 21:43:29    1507981

An awful lot of spin going on here. Jimbo keeps referring to the 7 million hadnout as if it was normal funding. It isnt, it was a 'special case' (a phrase direct from the statement) so obviously this was quite different. You go on by saying other counties might need to be brought up also. But we both know you are only giving that lip service. Where is the money going to come from for a start? Surely, every other county would need about 20 million to catch up? Where is taht money coming from jimbo? Obviously that isnt a reasonable answer, and you know this. The only functional one, the one that could be put in place today is the seperating of dublin. So I ask again, when do you get to the 'special case' 7 million handout?

Arock, what difference does it make if it was spread over 1 year or 10 years? It is still a handout is it not? How the payments were made is really beside the point. If you rob a bank in the morning and take 7 million, and your only defence is 'well I only took the money in installments', Im pretty sure you still go to jail.

JayP maybe kilkenny and kerry need a handout to be competitive in these sports? - like dublin. Im sure 7 million might go some ways as to making them better, arent you? That is the crux of the issue. The rest have to make do, dublin get bailed out when they arent good enough. not really fair is it?

Everything else you lads osted on the subject has no bearing at all. 7 million special case - discuss.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 01/11/2013 09:43:15    1508001

TheMaster...

Read my post again. You have, like usual, ignored all my valid reasoning. You are like a child with a ball who wont let anybody else play with it.

Social issues are ignored by you!

Was that honestly the best you could come back with. The Administrator on this really needs to ban you for a while. You have no logic whatsoever and clearly have no knowledge of the GAA and funding issues in sport.

You hate Dublin ..... ok.

We caused Ebola, the Asian Tsunami and killed the dinosaurs. And we got funding from the government to do it.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 01/11/2013 09:59:11    1508003

Take it up with the GAA themaster

It's pointless and illogical to continue your crusade on Hoganstand.

The GAA have released a statement on the issue.

A statement which has not only backed up my own stance but the stance taken by many other posters while responding to you on this topic,

That's that for now... let's see what the GAA come up with.

All the best

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 01/11/2013 10:25:14    1508009