ormondbannerman
County: Clare
Posts: 5709

I don't see it in any way how irish sides apart from maybe one maybe 2 would do ok in englands third tier. Most would be well below that level

Again, I couldn't really debate that with you because I wouldn't know much about it. I'm just going on what people who follow Irish soccer as well as English soccer tell me. It does come as surprise however the amunt of players you here about go from Irish clubs to first and second teer clubs in England. To an outsider that would suggest there is more talent in Irish soccer than you think - although we are obviously only a small soccer nation going on how our national team does and on how our own clubs do in Europe. Would you at least agree with that much????? We might confess to be big supporters of it but we are not much good at it.

There is nowhere near enough money for pro soccer in Ireland. 5000 is not enough of attendance to fund a pro sports team. Connacht rugby get that crowd but subsidised a bit by IRFU and that wouldn't happen in soccer with FAI.

Look i'm a GAA man. I couldn't care less if soccer prospered in this country or not but going on attendances in Scotland's main league (and its a proffessional league) bar the Celtic games the attendances wouldn't be much over 5,000. Obviously when I mentioned 5,000 I was looking at a bigger picture - one in which that sort of interest would lead to merchandise sales and advertising etc. So it would be just the attendances making professional soccer in Ireland viable. Would you not agree that advertising and jersey sales make money for Connacht rugby team????? Look, as far as I'm aware the FAI have little ineterest in its league. There's nothing to worry about, the chances are they will do nothing to promote their league so Irish English soccer fans have nothing to worry about!

While listening figures are not available and not available for a while the figures will be down on all evidence for the new OTB.

Is that your opinion or is it based on anything substantial?

Culann (Dublin) - Posts: 2306 - 12/09/2013 12:55:47    1480667

I've never seen anyone talk so much about something they have no interest or knowledge of and "can't stand the sport". In fact they have so little knowledge of it and can't stand it so much, they can can tell people how it is

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12372 - 12/09/2013 13:08:33    1480684

"I know very little about the topic at hand but at the same time I'm right and we'll have to agree to differ"

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12372 - 12/09/2013 13:11:05    1480687

MB1
County: Tyrone
Posts: 297

1479728
George Best?

Not Irish though.

AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1947 - 12/09/2013 13:19:08    1480693

12/09/2013 12:55:47
Culann
Again, I couldn't really debate that with you because I wouldn't know much about it. I'm just going on what people who follow Irish soccer as well as English soccer tell me. It does come as surprise however the amunt of players you here about go from Irish clubs to first and second teer clubs in England. To an outsider that would suggest there is more talent in Irish soccer than you think - although we are obviously only a small soccer nation going on how our national team does and on how our own clubs do in Europe. Would you at least agree with that much????? We might confess to be big supporters of it but we are not much good at it.Oh there is talent in irish soccer but not to any great extent and not compared to 3rd level of English soccer which is bigger in all means.
Culann
Look i'm a GAA man. I couldn't care less if soccer prospered in this country or not but going on attendances in Scotland's main league (and its a proffessional league) bar the Celtic games the attendances wouldn't be much over 5,000. Obviously when I mentioned 5,000 I was looking at a bigger picture - one in which that sort of interest would lead to merchandise sales and advertising etc. So it would be just the attendances making professional soccer in Ireland viable. Would you not agree that advertising and jersey sales make money for Connacht rugby team????? Look, as far as I'm aware the FAI have little ineterest in its league. There's nothing to worry about, the chances are they will do nothing to promote their league so Irish English soccer fans have nothing to worry about!Scotlands league in soccer has 2 clubs who are 60k crowd pullers and then most other clubs average 10k or so. Hearts averaged 13k between 1998 and 2013. Soccer as a professional sport in Ireland is not viable.
Yes jersey sales and advertising make money for Connacht but they have added advantage of being the pro sports for a city as well as several other counties and have a much bigger support base than any soccer club ever will have.
I think the FAI have plenty of interest in the league. Its their premier competition and they realise the strengths of it

Is that your opinion or is it based on anything substantial?Radio listening figures are only available on yearly basis. google it as its been mentioned with regard to Pat Kenny start new show on Newstalk as well as wrt OTB.
All evidence is from reading across all media forms blogs/forums/twitter/facebook as well as talking to people. Numbers listening are down on OTB since the second captains left

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 12/09/2013 13:44:20    1480711

What about Stephen Roche?? Jesus he won the Tour de France and was world champion!!!

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1994 - 12/09/2013 13:58:34    1480727

AfricanGael
County: UK
Posts: 473

1480693
MB1
County: Tyrone
Posts: 297

1479728
George Best?

Not Irish though.

oh oh

lilypad (Kildare) - Posts: 1363 - 12/09/2013 14:02:17    1480733

Breffni39
County: Cavan
Posts: 8727

1480684 I've never seen anyone talk so much about something they have no interest or knowledge of and "can't stand the sport". In fact they have so little knowledge of it and can't stand it so much, they can can tell people how it is

I wouldn't be interested in the game itself. I wouldn't watch it for example but I am fascinated with how Irish people dismiss it's own people and its own league so much and, also, I am fascinated with how, in my opinion, the English soccer league has such a hold over our people and our media. Its a good point you make but i have to say its strictly a nationalist and patriotic thing. You can see me speaking about this theme regulary on the site whenever the topic arises. Its a thing I'd feel strongly about as you would probably guess and would love to know why all this is. I'd ask a lot of questions on it to try and enderstand it if you know what I mean. Are you happy with that response or would you like to ask me any further questions?

Other relevent things i'd feel strongly abouty would be how Irish people reject the Irish language and how Fleadh Cheoil na hÉireann, by far the biggest annual festival, in Ireland get minimum media coverage.

Culann (Dublin) - Posts: 2306 - 12/09/2013 14:03:56    1480736

Breffni39
County: Cavan
Posts: 8727

1480687 "I know very little about the topic at hand but at the same time I'm right and we'll have to agree to differ"

Every point I have made has been relevent. Feel free to rebute them.

Culann (Dublin) - Posts: 2306 - 12/09/2013 14:05:44    1480739

avonali
County: Dublin
Posts: 62

1480727
What about Stephen Roche?? Jesus he won the Tour de France and was world champion!!!


Same reason I wouldn't have Michelle De Bruin up there!

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8409 - 12/09/2013 14:21:27    1480764

Culann
County: Dublin
Posts: 2213

1480739 Breffni39
County: Cavan
Posts: 8727

1480687 "I know very little about the topic at hand but at the same time I'm right and we'll have to agree to differ"

Every point I have made has been relevent. Feel free to rebute them.

From previous experience I know how pointless it is to attempt to "rebute" your arguments. "we'll have to agree to differ"

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12372 - 12/09/2013 14:32:14    1480780

Attendances of 5k would certainly be enough to sustain a professional soccer league in Ireland. Only 3 scottish league premier sides average over 10k (Hearts, Celtic and Aberdeen), 3 teams are averaging between 3 and 4k so far this season. As Culann said you have to factor in merchandise and sponsorship of a team pulling in those crowds week in week out.

Apparently 100 million euro per year leaves this country to follow the English Premier League. I presume that is made up of Match tickets, Jerseys, Flights, Accommodation etc). It's a very unhealthy obsession in my opinion. If the league of Ireland could get 10% of that our teams would be knocking on the door of the champions league group stages every year.

I thought Second Captains Live was a bit gimmicky but there is potential there. The guests and discussion were good but the setup and format wasn't great hopefully the will iron out the format in time though.

dahayeser (Cork) - Posts: 374 - 12/09/2013 15:08:47    1480820

Clubgaa if you walk into a village in Africa or a slum in South America the alst thing you want to ask is do you know this soccer player or golfer. Getting out alive would be my priority!!

The show is a bit of craic...it was always going to be modern day personalities..well Ronnie Delaney apart.

Liam made sense about Paddy H being no1, 3 majors is some achievement but I guess he is just so annoying to look at and listen to in the last few years that he wouldnt get it!

I for one also wouldnt jump on the Katie taylor bandwagon, she is a great ambassador for the country but really women's boxing is not that up to much.

My no1 would be Sonia.
In my lifetime she is the only athlete , sports person who has put the fear of god into other international competitiors. They used to be beaten mentally if she was stnding on the starting lineup.
A couple of the Olympics went down the pan for her but for half a decade she was a SUPERSTAR of athletics

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2073 - 12/09/2013 15:27:15    1480836

Should read something like this IMO;

George Best
Roy Keane
Christy Ring
Sonia O'Sullivan
Ronnie Delaney
Michael Carruth
Brian O'Driscoll
Peter Canavan
Eamon Coughlan
Rory McElroy

sportsfan14 (USA) - Posts: 281 - 12/09/2013 17:25:29    1480968

Dr Pat O Callaghan. Gold medals in consecutive Olympics. Which, horrendously flawed as they are, remain the flagship global sports event. No other Irish athlete can hold a candle to that.

an tseabhac (Kerry) - Posts: 441 - 12/09/2013 17:33:51    1480975

Rory McElroy????

What!!!!

lilypad (Kildare) - Posts: 1363 - 12/09/2013 17:55:41    1480991

12/09/2013 15:08:47
dahayeser
Attendances of 5k would certainly be enough to sustain a professional soccer league in Ireland. Only 3 scottish league premier sides average over 10k (Hearts, Celtic and Aberdeen), 3 teams are averaging between 3 and 4k so far this season. As Culann said you have to factor in merchandise and sponsorship of a team pulling in those crowds week in week out.
Apparently 100 million euro per year leaves this country to follow the English Premier League. I presume that is made up of Match tickets, Jerseys, Flights, Accommodation etc). It's a very unhealthy obsession in my opinion. If the league of Ireland could get 10% of that our teams would be knocking on the door of the champions league group stages every year.
I thought Second Captains Live was a bit gimmicky but there is potential there. The guests and discussion were good but the setup and format wasn't great hopefully the will iron out the format in time though.Attendances of 5k wouldn't sustain a professional league unless FAI help clubs in big way with funding. TV money, jersey sales, merchandise sales etc so much higher in Scotland for a pro soccer league. Attendances of 5000 would not do enough for clubs here
I don't see it as very unhealthy that people follow irish players, big sides in Europe.
I think the format is fine and if the kinks are worked out the format of the show will be fine and the show will flourish just like the radio show.
12/09/2013 15:27:15
woops
Clubgaa if you walk into a village in Africa or a slum in South America the alst thing you want to ask is do you know this soccer player or golfer. Getting out alive would be my priority!!
The show is a bit of craic...it was always going to be modern day personalities..well Ronnie Delaney apart.
Liam made sense about Paddy H being no1, 3 majors is some achievement but I guess he is just so annoying to look at and listen to in the last few years that he wouldnt get it!
I for one also wouldnt jump on the Katie taylor bandwagon, she is a great ambassador for the country but really women's boxing is not that up to much.
My no1 would be Sonia.
In my lifetime she is the only athlete , sports person who has put the fear of god into other international competitiors. They used to be beaten mentally if she was stnding on the starting lineup.
A couple of the Olympics went down the pan for her but for half a decade she was a SUPERSTAR of athletics I would argue people like Brian O Driscoll, Katie Taylor, Roy Keane, all have put "the fear of god" into other international competitors. Hard to dismiss womens boxing but no matter what she has been worlds best for 7/8 years and virtually unbeaten in that time

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 12/09/2013 18:35:51    1481026

Brian O Driscoll, Katie Taylor, Roy Keane

without question

lilypad (Kildare) - Posts: 1363 - 12/09/2013 21:08:00    1481135

ormondbannerman
County: Clare
Posts: 5725
Scotlands league in soccer has 2 clubs who are 60k crowd pullers and then most other clubs average 10k or so. Hearts averaged 13k between 1998 and 2013. Soccer as a professional sport in Ireland is not viable.

I'd strongly disagree with this for two reasons. The first can be seen here. It is a list of average attendances in a year for Scottish clubs playing in the main league. You will see that half of these teams averaged under 6,000 for the home games for the league - and don't forget this a proffessional league and these players get paid a wage.

http://www.worldfootball.net/attendance/sco-premier-league-2012-2013/1/

Current figures for 2103-2014. Isn't google deadly!

http://espnfc.com/stats/attendance/_/league/sco.1/scottish-premiership?cc=5739


The seocond reason is a population based reason. The Scots support their own league first and foremost and that is why they attract the crowds above. I can only suggest were the Irish to support Irish soccer the very least that would happen would be that these attendances would be matched, which would then have a knock on effect on the quality of the league and who knows where things coulg go from there! Our population sizes are similar enough. I think there is an estimated 4.5 million in the 26 counties and I think the population of the Scotland isjust over 5 million. If you brought the North into it think what you could do then. There is absolutelty no reason we couldn't have a league that is at least as big as the Scottish one but there is no appetite in Ireland for it. We as a nation would just prefer to drole over English soccer.


I think the FAI have plenty of interest in the league. Its their premier competition and they realise the strengths of it

I would not agree with that in the slightest. As I said above with hard work, the right attitude and the the appetite for it is the only way for the FAI to promote their games in Ireland but they either fail or refuse to do it. Sure according to very regular comments in the media it is apparent that Irish soccer clubs have not much respect for the FAI.

Culann (Dublin) - Posts: 2306 - 13/09/2013 08:59:47    1481199

lilypad

Rory McElroy????
What!!!!

My reaction too when I saw this. Its McIlroy...

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 13/09/2013 09:29:26    1481216