I have been making the same point exactly that essmac referred to about partitionism playing a big part in this BUT for whatever reason the HS MODS have completely censored my posts and I don't know why because a lot of this is important in the debate. Master talks about the 'common perception' that Tyrone are more cynical than others BUT when confronted with stats and facts about Tyrone committing the least number of fouls in the quarter finals he changes the goalposts again and says "Aye but Tyrone's fouls are MORE cynical". Seriously you couldn't make some of this stuff up. Tyrone, Armagh and to a lesser degree Donegal suit the 'common perception' that Ulster teams are rougher, nastier and dirtier than the rest because this covers and provides a smokesscreen for a large, deep partitionist mindset that exists in the South and I know it does because I have family there. The HS MODS seem to think this is irrelevant but how can it be when many Ulster posters are saying the same thing? If we are in the 'common perception' theme then that it is also the case that many Ulster Gaels now have a 'common perception' that there are TWO different Associations in operation with TWO different sets of rules and standards being applied to the detriment of Ulster sides. The massive silence from the Dublin/Kerry game with it's many 'incidents' (far worse than anything that has gone on in Ulster games) as opposed to the hysterical campaigns after Tyrone games proves that beyond doubt.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9829 - 12/09/2013 14:05:59    1480740

Its 5 years since Tyrone puke football brought SAM North, so whats the hassle?....Its over for them!.....Let the baby have his bottle as the old saying goes!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Snufalufagus (Dublin) - Posts: 8100 - 12/09/2013 14:17:11    1480753

Skillful_Bill, no it is actually the truth. You lads keep labelling it as a perception because you are trying to discredit it. Tell me, how do you 'perceive' a team that keep diving? Are people only imagining them diving while grabbing an opponents arm? What is being perceived there?
Again it isnt an issue I have. You want to do it that way then that is up to you. My issue is where you are doing it, and then trying to absolve yourselves of deserved criticism afterwards. Maybe you 'perceive' that you can have it both ways...

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/09/2013 14:29:46    1480777

TheMaster, Firstly I do believe it was you that introduced the term 'common perception' into the arguments. I was pointing out to you that this common perception is based on the media's williness to highlight Tyrone's transgressions over and above their williness to point out the incidents involving other teams.

You on the other hand are now claiming Tyrone lads are defending their team by claiming it is only perception.

''you lads keep labelling it as a perception because you are trying to discredit it.''

Now forgive me if I am wrong here but my understanding now of your post that Tyrone are 'commonly percieved' as being cynical should have in fact read 'it is a fact that Tyrone are the most cynical team in Ireland'

Which brings me back to my point I don't often agree with Ulsterman but having seen the media circus this year and their ability to create perceptions within the GAA public surrounding Tyrone and Ulster teams in general it is truely sad to read some of your posts in relation to the 'Truths' which people like you now hold.

I have been following my county for over 40 years, I have played the game at a fairly high level and am an active club coach and I am completely shocked how GAA people can buy into this media distortion. Anyone who see's enough games at club and county level will clearly see this for what it is.

In regards to the rest of your post I found it incoherant and utterly confusing.

Skillful_Bill (Tyrone) - Posts: 102 - 12/09/2013 15:38:28    1480851

Skillful_Bill
TheMaster, Firstly I do believe it was you that introduced the term 'common perception' into the arguments.

I 'do believe' it was brend that introduced the term... I mocked his use of it because it was a cop out... This pie in the sky idea that the media make everyone who doesnt happen to have a vested interest in tyrone perceive things that arent actually there is a joke, and actally a little insulting. It is yourselves that view tyrone through rose-tinted glasses, and then label an objective assessment of them as biased. Maybe it is your own media who are fooling you into perceiving tyrone incorrectly? Why cant that be the case?

Also, making a point about spelling works a lot better when you actually know how to spell the word... Perceived...

Skillful Bill? Is that an ironic name? Like big john who stands 4 foot tall?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/09/2013 16:19:06    1480890

TheMaster you are lucky you are even in an all Ireland final and have a ref to thank for it and you know it.You are a liar when it comes to Tyrone football and your dislike of all things Tyrone might cause you to go get some help because its getting a bit weird in all fairness now.Many neutral posters on here have said that Tyrone have come in for unfair criticism this year so to me thats "the common perception" that I'm seeing.Not the lies being propagated by you and the sensationalist pundits who have an axe to grind against Tyrone.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 12/09/2013 16:33:45    1480906

Superglue
County: Kerry
Posts: 773

1480700
Tyrone posters have gone into overdrive since this match. Are ye that starved for attention?
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I suppose we are.I see you must be too since you've come to join us.You could talk about cynical tactics from Kerry point of view.How you played 13 men in your own half against Cavan and executed a rugby tackle in that game also and how your fellas were swinging of the jerseys of the Dublin players in the last few minutes of your all Ireland semi.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 12/09/2013 16:37:39    1480911

seanie_boy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 2850

1480911
Superglue
County: Kerry
Posts: 773

1480700
Tyrone posters have gone into overdrive since this match. Are ye that starved for attention?
------------------------------------------
I suppose we are.I see you must be too since you've come to join us.You could talk about cynical tactics from Kerry point of view.How you played 13 men in your own half against Cavan and executed a rugby tackle in that game also and how your fellas were swinging of the jerseys of the Dublin players in the last few minutes of your all Ireland semi.

I would but prefer not to take the joy out of everything

Superglue (Kerry) - Posts: 1283 - 12/09/2013 17:05:00    1480938

I love this recent quote that has become popular on here about "taking the joy out of everything". This after the joy was well and truly sucked out of every Ulster success of the last 10 years on here. Every single one was criticised in a variety of ways. An outrageous double standard.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12453 - 12/09/2013 17:16:51    1480957

Dublin and Kerry are so far ahead of everyone else which is the cause of all the jealousy and bitterness directed at the mighty Dubs and the mighty Kerrymen on this site.

Condorman (Dublin) - Posts: 983 - 12/09/2013 17:32:01    1480974

seanie_boy
TheMaster you are lucky you are even in an all Ireland final and have a ref to thank for it and you know it.You are a liar when it comes to Tyrone football and your dislike of all things Tyrone might cause you to go get some help because its getting a bit weird in all fairness now.Many neutral posters on here have said that Tyrone have come in for unfair criticism this year so to me thats "the common perception" that I'm seeing.Not the lies being propagated by you and the sensationalist pundits who have an axe to grind against Tyrone.

Lucky to be in an AI final? Te ref to thank? Was it him kicking all those scores in the 2nd half and running away with the game? Some boot on him doesnt he eh? Funny, I just remember him disallowing a good goal. The irony of you making that point considering sean cavanagh's exploits in the 2 previous games seems to be lost on you... Mayo played sh*te, kicking a load of wides that on every other day they have nailed, and they still ran out comfortable winners. I wouldnt be reminding anyone of that game if I were you. anyway, dont make this about something it isnt about.
As regards lying, what lie is that? Take off the rose tinted glasses, tyrone are the most cynical side around. Im not trying to be critical about that, it has its pros and cons, but it is true. This nonsense about the media fooling the entire country and brainwashing them for 10 years is actually as insulting as it is far fetched. Is everyone in the country a fool or what? Maybe it is your own media that is doing the same to you. Why cant that be the case?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/09/2013 17:42:45    1480981

Look, if I am wrong then you explain to me why tyrone lads blatently dive when they get into scoring distance in every game they play. If you can offer a more reasonable explanation for this then fair enough. Let's hear it.

You're making claims with basically no proof whatsoever. Could you list some of these dives that occurred in Tyrone games this year? Never heard anyone else on this board or in the media or wherever else whinging about Tyrone diving this year. If we try to dive in scoring positions we obviously don't do it very well - Niall Morgan kept missing long-range frees from about 50 metres out against Donegal (the main reason we lost that match), and Darren McCurry missed a few of them from long-distance as well against yourselves this year. Just think you're talking nonsense on this occasion. The most blatant dive I can remember this year was in the Tyrone-Mayo match this year, and it wasn't a Tyrone man diving. Maybe you'll provide a list of Tyrone dives this year in your next post - I doubt it though.

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 12/09/2013 17:46:11    1480984

Don't be expecting TheMugster to back up any of his claims on this site. The media campaign in the run up to last years all ireland which branded Mayo the most cynical team in Ireland was equally wrong. Wasn't it Master or was that somehow different?

Skillful_Bill (Tyrone) - Posts: 102 - 12/09/2013 18:12:48    1481008

MichaelO
County: Tyrone
Posts: 497

1480984
Look, if I am wrong then you explain to me why tyrone lads blatently dive when they get into scoring distance in every game they play. If you can offer a more reasonable explanation for this then fair enough. Let's hear it.

You're making claims with basically no proof whatsoever. Could you list some of these dives that occurred in Tyrone games this year
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I've a lot of sympathy for Tyrone's plight. Their cynism and style of play has really been put under the microscope, not to the levels that Micky and Tyrone fans would lead you to believe but no doubt that a certain Derryman's comments have brought more attention to it, unjustly in my view.

However, on the matter of diving, and I did bring this up on another thread, I was disappointed to see Cavanagh go down easily a couple of times against Monaghan, probably not as obvious as previous years when Tyrone employed the arm clamping tactic. This really infuriated me seeing McMahon being booked for it in 2011 and then O'Neill doing the same thing and winning a scoreable free. Not only that but he shouted at the referee almost as though trying to get the Dublin player booked when in fact O'Neill himself should have been. That's cheating in my book and is beneath a player of SON's calibre. So no doubt Tyrone systematically employed this tactic (clamping) in the past but I didn't see a lot of evidence of it this year.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4748 - 12/09/2013 18:53:37    1481037

have to laugh at the direction of this thread mayo and tyrone people slagging each other re cynical fouling whilst the saviours of gaelic football kerry and dublin reign supreme. there isnt an ulster bias its the old being sold down the river mindset that persists in the north, get over it. the same myopism applies in mexicoland re the north. harte is right to refer to the hysteria re both games driven by the media. kerry dublin game was no better than the mayo tyrone game. were being fed all summer by the media about the quality of dublin and mayo and the beautiful game. both teams lack any real quality especially up front and both full backlines are rubbish but they are a breath of fresh air apparently. well neither team would have been a patch on the tyrone kerry teams of the last 10 years or the galway team and meath teams of the previous 10. the kerry tyrone 05 final galway kildare 98 and meath cork 87 games not to mention down derry 94 would wipe the floor with the dublin kerry game. but the need to sell tickets create monsters and heros drives on a diminishing product. dublin will beat mayo next week (mayo in a final come on) and we will be told its the greatest advert for gaelic games and a godsend to promoting our product. Hysteria plus.

weebox (Tyrone) - Posts: 272 - 12/09/2013 19:21:34    1481058

Skillful_Bill, why are you talking about media campaigns? Im talking about what happens on the field during games. This media stuff you and a few more keep harping on about is of no concern to me.
As regards mayo. There was no media campaign against mayo. It was one guy trying to influence a game to suit the team he wanted to win. However mayo were cynical in their play. Were they the only offenders? No. Were they the worst offenders? No. Are tyrone the only offenders? No. Are they the worst offenders? Yes. It is as simple as that. You can keep talking about media all you like. It makes no difference, Im talking about what I see on the field and that is the point you need to address. This crap about 'teams are as bad as each other' is actually garbage. Some teams are worse than others. Tyrone happen to be the most team that utilise it.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/09/2013 19:56:50    1481083

Some of the posts on this thread are exactly why this forum is on it's knees with regards to quality of post.

GetOverTheBar (Tyrone) - Posts: 1388 - 13/09/2013 08:02:47    1481183

TheMaster you need to wise up since the biggest offender this year is your very own Aidan O' Shea for a wreckless foul,followed by feigning injury in an attempt to get another man in trouble.Give me the open rugby tackle any day over this type of stuff.He wasn't the only one either with Dillon getting the galway player sent off for same oul nonsense,hitting the deck like a bag of spuds.Mayo are more than well drilled in all this stuff and are most likely the worst offenders in the country for feigning injury and play acting.All very distasteful stuff too,like I said at least the rugby tackle is the manly thing to do.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 13/09/2013 09:01:14    1481200

Breffni39
County: Cavan
Posts: 8737

1480957
I love this recent quote that has become popular on here about "taking the joy out of everything". This after the joy was well and truly sucked out of every Ulster success of the last 10 years on here. Every single one was criticised in a variety of ways. An outrageous double standard.

And the opposite never happened

Superglue (Kerry) - Posts: 1283 - 13/09/2013 09:03:32    1481202

GetOverTheBar
County: Tyrone
Posts: 743

1481183
Some of the posts on this thread are exactly why this forum is on it's knees with regards to quality of post.
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You are probably right,but to paraphrase a great Corkman,"they had gone down in the mire to destroy us and our nation,and down after them we had to go". You have to stand up for your own,nobody else will.You know how it is.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 13/09/2013 09:06:10    1481206