hill16no1man
County: Dublin
Posts: 5814

1477166
amazing how harte is blinkered himself.
he talks about johnny coopers tackle now yes he fouled him but was clearly going for the ball while in the mean time anthony maher strikes stephen cluxton in the face off the ball and only recieves a yellow card wheres hartes consitency as a strike to the face is a straight red card,seems he is the same as the guys he is giving out about and only sees what he wants himself
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Your missing the point,Mickey is on your side! He is simply pointing out how Tyrone and Cavanagh were criticized for fouling earlier in the year but when it came to this game with plenty dirty fouling,no defending and a bad referee to boot..........it seems nobody noticed any of it! That is mostly because they didn't want to off course.You are right to voice your opinion on something you see as wrong in a game but how come our so called experts,bar a muted and contrived protestation from Brolly,were willing to deny any of the unsavoury stuff just so the undoubtedly good aspects of the game would be come the only narrative of it? It is complete hypocrisy of the highest order.I had no dog in that race but I can still say with conviction that Cluxton should never have had a penalty awarded against him.Does that mean I'm bemoaning the whole game? Off course not,I'm pointing out a poor piece of refereeing.Its consistent and fair post match analysis that has been missing from the RTE panel that has left a sour taste for many this year and thats not just Mickey Harte's opinion.Just ask Paul Grimley or Kevin Walsh or Colm Cooper to start with.Disgraceful personal attacks and biased match assessments are not good enough,with pundits barely able to contain their own glee in the victory of one team over another,it smacks of begrudgery and hostility and simply is not on.If they can't control themselves and at least try to be impartial then they should not be on the show.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 07/09/2013 21:24:12    1477341

If teams decide to attack first and foremost then there is always going to be space to be exploited by both forward lines. Both teams went out with attacking game plans and so there was more space to be exploited. Its very easy to defend well when you have 12 men parked inside the half off the field you are defending. Even the best defensive systems wouldn't have prevented alot of the scores in Sundays game.

It was a great game and instead of complaining about the game getting so much praise perhaps Mickey should be happy that Gaelic Football has been getting so much positive coverage as he was continually complaining about negativity in the GAA media towards Gaelic Football.

Although there is obviously no right or wrong way to play any sport and every teams should do whatever they can in order to win, I think if you asked football fans would they prefer if teams played with positivity like both Kerry and Dublin did on Sunday or negatively like numerous other counties I think we know the answer most would give.

Personally I would have it as one of the 5 best games I have seen along with Mayo Dublin in 06 the 2005 and 2008 All ireland finals and Tyrone Armagh Semi final in 2005, the Mayo Dublin game last years was top class aswell.


Excellent post on the topic above.

Yeah it's mighty to drop 13 men behind the ball..

Some posters talking about the art of defending? Are you having a laugh... seriously!

It was a fantastic game of open attacking football.. It was hugely entertaining.

It also had plenty of niggle and bite but that's Gaelic football...

This is what people want from a Dublin v Kerry game as they sit at home...

That's what they got... and bloody hell... it was a classic encounter between the two most successful Footballing GAA counties in the history of the game and will be spoken about for a long time.

I'm sure that will continue to annoy some...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/09/2013 21:48:50    1477351

seanie_boy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 2841

1477341


hill16no1man
County: Dublin
Posts: 5814

1477166
amazing how harte is blinkered himself.
he talks about johnny coopers tackle now yes he fouled him but was clearly going for the ball while in the mean time anthony maher strikes stephen cluxton in the face off the ball and only recieves a yellow card wheres hartes consitency as a strike to the face is a straight red card,seems he is the same as the guys he is giving out about and only sees what he wants himself
-------------------------------------------------------------
Your missing the point,Mickey is on your side! He is simply pointing out how Tyrone and Cavanagh were criticized for fouling earlier in the year but when it came to this game with plenty dirty fouling,no defending and a bad referee to boot..........it seems nobody noticed any of it! That is mostly because they didn't want to off course.You are right to voice your opinion on something you see as wrong in a game but how come our so called experts,bar a muted and contrived protestation from Brolly,were willing to deny any of the unsavoury stuff just so the undoubtedly good aspects of the game would be come the only narrative of it? It is complete hypocrisy of the highest order.I had no dog in that race but I can still say with conviction that Cluxton should never have had a penalty awarded against him.Does that mean I'm bemoaning the whole game? Off course not,I'm pointing out a poor piece of refereeing.Its consistent and fair post match analysis that has been missing from the RTE panel that has left a sour taste for many this year and thats not just Mickey Harte's opinion.Just ask Paul Grimley or Kevin Walsh or Colm Cooper to start with.Disgraceful personal attacks and biased match assessments are not good enough,with pundits barely able to contain their own glee in the victory of one team over another,it smacks of begrudgery and hostility and simply is not on.If they can't control themselves and at least try to be impartial then they should not be on the show.

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Like I said before, if you have a game like that Tyrone Monaghan match where you had two fist fights at half time, a rugby tackle on a player in on goal by a player who did the same thing the previous week and you have dour football. What's going to generate most discussion from that game? Not the dour football obviously.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4748 - 07/09/2013 21:53:54    1477352

What are you trying to say Jimbo? That there is no skill in great defending?With that way of thinking how could you be expected to have a balanced view on any game never mind this one! Perhaps you would prefer to ditch the goal keeper completely and have 14 boys shooting end to end and no doubt you will get your basketball scores in a fine free flowing game.How anybody who loves or knows football could simply dismiss a huge part of its skill set in this off hand matter is beyond me.You don't think that a great block is a good display in a game of football, or the ability to read a game and intercept a pass inside to a goal bound forward,or the ability to dispossess a man from the ball while running at speed? If you don't view these as great skills man then you don't like football.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 08/09/2013 08:22:07    1477357

To be perfectly honest there is some truth i what he says. When Tyrone go on the field we probably do focus on the negative aspects of their play and fail to give them credit for their strengths. I loved last weeks game, as a neutral I could fully enjoy it. However looking back two of Dunlins players, both already on yellows, should have gone in the gooch inncident.

hootervillian (Meath) - Posts: 309 - 08/09/2013 10:13:35    1477383

1. Like a lot of us have been saying there was a bias in RTE this year against Tyrone. Tyrone were subjected to standards of investigation by RTE that other teams were not.
2. Tyrone should move to a more attacking style. It will increase the amount we score and perhaps reduce criticisms also. For example Joe Mc Mahon is usually named in the forwards but plays in defence which makes the defence look on top but then the ball is kicked up to 1 or 2 forwards who are heavily outnumbered and can't do much.

tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 08/09/2013 11:30:34    1477402

tyroneed
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Agreed & agreed.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 08/09/2013 17:08:58    1477598

Joxer
Like I said before, if you have a game like that Tyrone Monaghan match where you had two fist fights at half time, a rugby tackle on a player in on goal by a player who did the same thing the previous week and you have dour football. What's going to generate most discussion from that game? Not the dour football obviously.
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Catch yourself on Joxer,the criticism of Cavanagh and Tyrone rose to heights never before seen about an incident in a game of football and it was totally over the top and unwarranted given that these types of pull downs have happened many times before and even happened in another game on the same weekend and there was hardly a peep about it.Outside of the pull down the game was decent enough game and the incident at half time was oul handbags stuff that happens the whole time also.There were incidents in the Dublin V Kerry game involving Johnny Cooper,Rory O' Carroll and Mc Mahon that would have been seized upon and highlighted as dirty and cynical and on it would go if they had been Tyrone players.Certainly on this years commentary which has been undoubtedly anti-Tyrone.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 08/09/2013 17:37:15    1477621

It was Brolly who questioned Tyrone not RTE.

Superglue (Kerry) - Posts: 1283 - 08/09/2013 18:11:17    1477660

And Brolly works for?

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 08/09/2013 18:23:48    1477674

So my opinions are a direct line of opinions of my employer? Jesus grow up lad will you

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 08/09/2013 19:04:22    1477722

I greatly admire Mickey Harte and Tyrone. I like him as a man and I have huge admiration for the way in which Tyrone CLG and he himself have overcome massive personal and practical obstacles. We all know what they them tragedies are.

I don't see why that stops me criticising them as a team or Mickey for his comments on games. I think his opinion on last week was beneath him to be quite honest. He is still one of handful of CLG people I think of as heroes.

hurlingdub (Dublin) - Posts: 6978 - 08/09/2013 19:30:48    1477742

It was Brolly who questioned Tyrone not RTE.

What about the caption during the Mayo-Tyrone match that said Cavanagh had committed 4 fouls. Never saw that kinda thing before, seemed so petty.

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 08/09/2013 20:46:31    1477812

A few tips for all the Tyrone posters

1. Get yourselves organised into your own support group to talk through your feelings of paranoia.
2. Stop watching RTE on match days and stick to the BBC NI - you'll find its far more to your liking with its pro-Ulster views.

jimski (Kildare) - Posts: 381 - 08/09/2013 21:01:14    1477830

Big problem is the total inconsistency and frequent incompetnece of officials at matches and what follows from that

(including frequently a failure to be proactive in pointing out fouls by umpires which is particularly bad; instructions, re championship mateches in particular, should go out publicly making it absolutely clear umprires must draw all fouls they see to Refs or they won't be alloqwed to officiate in any role again)

This problem really is critical because media move into the vacuum that is left by bad officiating and bad silent inactive administration. Media often then make publicity seeking statements aimed at creating self perpetuating bandwagons to serve the purpose of hyping up debates focused of disputes thus pushing the games creating scapegoats and unbalanced emotional reactions serving hyperactive ill-considered self seeking contributions where evidence is ignored(that is what media does all over the place so we can't be surprised I suppose)this allows them in effect dominate the administration of the games whilst the administration keeps their heads firmly in the sand behaving like the 3 monkeys hearing seeing and speaking no evil or simply reacting to media generated pressure to excuse their failures.

The root of the problem is the state of the administration and officiating in GAA versus the supreme efforts of players and management in preparing for and playing games. That contrast between players and administration could kill GAA by disillusionment in the longer term.

We need people who care to take back GAA from being media driven to being driven by participants and ordinary people not a circus but a national treasure.

cjx (Tyrone) - Posts: 270 - 08/09/2013 21:28:03    1477846

No need for that jimski. Some of best posters here are Tyrone. Bren and the rest. Everyone has a right to their say.

hurlingdub (Dublin) - Posts: 6978 - 08/09/2013 21:31:23    1477849

hurlingdub
County: Dublin
Posts: 5068

1477742 I greatly admire Mickey Harte and Tyrone. I like him as a man and I have huge admiration for the way in which Tyrone CLG and he himself have overcome massive personal and practical obstacles. We all know what they them tragedies are.

I don't see why that stops me criticising them as a team or Mickey for his comments on games. I think his opinion on last week was beneath him to be quite honest. He is still one of handful of CLG people I think of as heroes.


Having just read his article, I am baffled as to why you think his comments are beneath him? The focus of his article was more aimed at pundits and Journalists who whine and criticise the defensive game plan deployed by many sides.

Kerry v Dublin was superb to watch, but was hardly flawless by any means. Generally any very high scoring game, with teams close or level with 5 or 10 minutes to go will be edge of the seat type stuff.

Mickey Harte is probably sick of Tyrone and other sides getting slagged off for cynical fouling, while in this Instance Dublin and Kerry basically escaped such criticism despite their game featuring it's fair share. Harte is a superb tactician, and is more plausible than some of the pundits RTE have on.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 08/09/2013 21:31:54    1477851

Everybody knows harte was having a go at the panelist and rightly so after what brolly said about cannavan he was out of order that day. He is wrong about the game though it was a good one so what if there was mistakes made they are made in every game. People compare it to '05 and '08 finals but there was mistakes made in those games also. Was ocinneide's goal in '05 a great move or bad defending was kinda like walsh's goal last day the goal by cannavan was bad defending no sign of our fullback as galvin was last man back. they say it was a great goal but imo it was awfull defending. In saying that tyrone played their best game ever that day. The '08 final was a goood game but not great (not because kerry lost) the hightlight being the point by dooher. the points scored by cavannagh that day were excellent but was that bad defending ? some of it.Dublin scored points just as good last week. Also the two goals in last years final by donegal (the best team ever according to brolly) now that was bad defending. And somebody said spillane stopped brolly from saying something about the cynical fouling after the game well give me a break that didnt stop him before.

chicago09 (Kerry) - Posts: 694 - 08/09/2013 21:57:05    1477886

jimski
County: Kildare
Posts: 99

1477830
A few tips for all the Tyrone posters

1. Get yourselves organised into your own support group to talk through your feelings of paranoia.
2. Stop watching RTE on match days and stick to the BBC NI - you'll find its far more to your liking with its pro-Ulster views.
3. Treat your County manager with the due respect he deserves for the valiant efforts he has made in bringing your team up a level.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 09/09/2013 09:59:05    1477935

chicago09
County: Kerry
Posts: 405

1477886
And somebody said spillane stopped brolly from saying something about the cynical fouling after the game well give me a break that didnt stop him before.

You are 100% correct, I can't see Pat Spillane or anybody else shutting Joe up after the game if he really felt the need to rant.

It was a cracking game to watch, no doubt about it. I also enjoy certain defensive tactical type games, Where scores may not be as high, but it is still fascinating to watch.

Granted there are some defensive games that would put you to sleep, but most are fine so long as the team deploying them have an attack plan/options.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3026 - 09/09/2013 18:07:24    1478642