I will post this again as the MOD decided my initial response to MadJoe was not worthy (maybe there from donegal). Basically madjoe you are wrong. Sean cavanagh did what he did y-day to stop the opposition, mcgee did what he did today to also stop his opposition. You cannot use emotion (fustration with mcgee and desperation with cavanagh) to excuse that or differentiate between the two. The difference if any is Cavanagh did what he did to keep a numerical advantage for his team, mcgee did what he did to hurt a man by stamping on the back of a player! Donegal or no other county in ireland has any right to judge cavanagh for what he did, we are all guilty of these tactics. In the games today I saw examples of this by all four counties with the worst example just happening to come from a donegal player.

fermanagh4sam (Fermanagh) - Posts: 48 - 04/08/2013 18:58:06    1452593

Thank god for the traditionalists, the saviours of our beautiful game,galway , dublin , mayo and kerry. Ulster teams have done nothing but bring the beautiful game into the gutter

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 04/08/2013 19:01:15    1452599

Does that include taking illegal steroids thegatekeeper?
After all, win at all costs eh?

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 04/08/2013 19:05:32    1452606

Don't judge an entire province by one teams antics.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 04/08/2013 19:11:29    1452610

And so we are Tommy John immensely proud of this great team getting to the semis

Not get yer Monaghan bunting down and out with the Tyrone bunting we are on the march again!

omaghjoe (Tyrone) - Posts: 1191 - 04/08/2013 19:13:51    1452613

mlcollins - Does Declan O'Sullivan pulling down a young cavan defender coming out with the ball by the ankels constitute the 'beautiful game'?? Your hypocrisy an all other counties for that matter who preech the beautiful game STINKS!!

fermanagh4sam (Fermanagh) - Posts: 48 - 04/08/2013 19:22:34    1452631

joe ws a bit harsh in fairness though i think these cynical tackles are starting to happen too early in every game with almost all the top counties

psychomick (Meath) - Posts: 42 - 04/08/2013 19:24:07    1452632

Has to be said that Mayo were at it today too (when the game was competitive anyway).
Problem is that the Mayo posters here will lazily dismiss what I say as anti Mayo bias from a Galwayman (the same way many of the Tyrone posters here lazily dismiss my criticism of their county as anti Ulster bias from a Southerner)

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 04/08/2013 19:31:40    1452646

Is there genuinely one poster here who would honestly claim they are from a club or county who wouldn't have done what Cavanagh did yesterday? Come on I want one person to say they are....

Anyone?

Come on there must be, ye're all so happy to put the boot into Tyrone...

doublehop (Kildare) - Posts: 4172 - 04/08/2013 19:52:03    1452662

There will of course be isolated instances but i should have qualified my post in that CERTAIN ulster teams adopt a pervasive cynical systemic approach to matches namely tyrone and armagh, re: remaining ulster teams with the one exception that is DOWN who i should not have included in my original sweeping statement the rest play a negative brand of football.

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 04/08/2013 19:53:24    1452664

joncarter
County: Galway
Posts: 724

1452610
Don't judge an entire province by one teams antics.
---------------
Well said. As can be seen in the clip I have posted a few times now there are plenty at it. Including Galway with the first one and clearly "better" than Cavanaghs effort.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 04/08/2013 20:04:14    1452675

fermanagh4sam
County: Fermanagh
Posts: 23

1452593
I will post this again as the MOD decided my initial response to MadJoe was not worthy (maybe there from donegal). Basically madjoe you are wrong. Sean cavanagh did what he did y-day to stop the opposition, mcgee did what he did today to also stop his opposition. You cannot use emotion (fustration with mcgee and desperation with cavanagh) to excuse that or differentiate between the two. The difference if any is Cavanagh did what he did to keep a numerical advantage for his team, mcgee did what he did to hurt a man by stamping on the back of a player! Donegal or no other county in ireland has any right to judge cavanagh for what he did, we are all guilty of these tactics. In the games today I saw examples of this by all four counties with the worst example just happening to come from a donegal player.

---

I'm assuming this is in response to me. What McGee did today was not to stop the opposition, the ball was gone, in fact Donegal had the ball, the Mayo man was on the ground and he petulantly stamped on him. There is no tactical play there whatsoever, so it is not comparable to what Cavanagh did as Cavanagh was being tactical, not lashing out.

I haven't once stated it's only Cavanagh and Tyrone who employ cynical tackling and stopping third man runners, in fact I've defended Cavanagh. And I was not excusing what McGee did either, some people on here really read what they want to read, I said he was rightly sent off for kicking out, it's dangerous play and the correct decision came from it.

The argument about what Cavanagh did is teams go out targeting players, or are told on the training pitch - this is what you have to do to win the game. I was stating that there is no comparison with McGee's sending off because that was a moment of petulance, not a pre-meditated tactic.

JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1432 - 04/08/2013 20:05:42    1452677

Well doublehop my personal gripe is with the general way Tyrone use it as a tactic as opposed to an isolated incident.
The "you would have done the same thing" argument doesn't impress me.
That doesn't make it right.
You could say the same thing about soccer players who dive, cyclists who take peds and poor people who steal.
Wrong is wrong. Are you suggesting we all applaud Cavanagh for cheating?

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 04/08/2013 20:17:26    1452692

mlcollins; your name is quite appropriate because your hero also sold out the Northern province to sectarian Unionism and signed the treaty that partitioned Ireland so it's no wonder you take his moniker. If you think players like Oisin McConville, Ronan Clarke, Stevie McDonnell, Diarmuid Marsen, Peter Canavan, Stephen O'Neill, Brian McGuigan, Sean Cavanagh, Michael Murphy, Karl Lacey, Colm McFadden etc are negative, cynical footballers with NO talent the problem is yours and you know nothing about football. Then again Kerry have never been gracious or humble in defeat so I suppose yours is the Kerry way. Ulster will always be here in the GAA and in your face so get used to it pal.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9819 - 04/08/2013 20:25:47    1452697

Joe is right. That sort of behaviour has no place in football. As well as being sent off the player, in addition to missing a game or two, should also be suspended from the next All-Ireland championship game against that opposition. You wouldn't get a Tyrone fella dragging down a Dublin player for example, if it could mean missing out on an All-Ireland final the following year. It would make players think for sure.

ipswichgaillimh (UK) - Posts: 3 - 04/08/2013 20:34:33    1452702

There will of course be isolated instances but i should have qualified my post in that CERTAIN ulster teams adopt a pervasive cynical systemic approach to matches namely tyrone and armagh, re: remaining ulster teams with the one exception that is DOWN who i should not have included in my original sweeping statement the rest play a negative brand of football.

You do realise Kerry play a blanket defence? That Declan O'Sullivan feigned injury and was told to get up today? That Crowley and O'Sullivan (again) would be black carded under the new rules?

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 04/08/2013 20:40:59    1452712

mlcollins - I like the way you tryed to justify these tactics when being pulled up on them by your own county. Regards all Ulster counties being "negitive" if you look at the stats u'll see that ulster championship games produced consistently higher scorelines than most if not all other provincial championships. What do you all want? One uniform brand of football and tactics? Look at it this way, would the world like to see every team play football like barcleona, no cause that woud be boring and those special moments of skill and class would no longer be special. Was Inter Milans tactics under 'the special one' criticised when stopping barcleona? No. All teams have different individual systems with different tactics and there in lies the beauty in all of it as each other try to figure it all out and overcome it to win. Also, what is the definiton of this "beautiful game"? there is none as it's interpretation depends on the value's held by the man asking the question. My idea of the "beautiful game" may be and is likely to be different to others but that's what is good about our sport, thats what creates the dramas and those unforgetable magic moments. Those who preech the "beaufiful game" are complete "rutards" get over yourselves as your "dream" is never going to reslised and thank god to..

fermanagh4sam (Fermanagh) - Posts: 48 - 04/08/2013 20:41:04    1452713

I must head down to Carlow to watch this beautiful expansive game they play in Carlow the Bosco. Unfortunately I haven't had the privilege of seeing Carlow on TV too much. I suppose you hardly even need referees down there given how sporting you are down there

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 04/08/2013 20:41:35    1452714

Before we give Joe Brolly too much credit we need to be clear on a few things.

1. What he said last night was correct.
2. The black card can't come soon enough because these things are ruining the game.
3. Yes, we would all want our players to do what Sean Kavanagh did, but that does not make it okay. It is ugly, frustrating and the game is suffering. Apologists don't erase the problem!

So yes, I agree with Joe BUT

1. He never had a problem with this in the 00's he actually adored that Tyrone team and only made very slight referense to how cynical they were. If even!
2. Donegal are very cynical in my opinion, and he adores them, just like he adored that Tyrone team. Do you think he'd mention it in relation to them? Well, he hasn't!
3. I think I remember him almost applauding actions like this on occasion as part of the wonderful modern game! And suddenly he hates it with a passion!

Either get consistent, or be quiet!

Treaty_Exile (Limerick) - Posts: 386 - 04/08/2013 20:43:50    1452716

Joe Brolly gets paid for sensationalism and that's what he did last night. He attracts audiences and promotes RTE. Anybody listening to Newstalk last night rushed to there TV screens to watch Joe's rant and fair play to him for doing his job. In the same sense Sean Cavanagh did his job. I believe Joe feel is totally wrong, and also the Black card is wrong. Yellow cards were introduced to GAA to to impede players who fouled and give the advantage to the opposition. if teams like Monaghan can't take advantage of player on a yellow, then that is their problem, due to lack of experience, naiive play or whatever. The yellow card is one foul away from a red. If Monaghan can't isolate Sean and take the advantage of him being on a yellow then that is a weakness on their part part and not the sport.

Lurcher (Meath) - Posts: 1 - 04/08/2013 20:45:00    1452718