ulsterman. perfect post.

acrossthewater (None) - Posts: 110 - 11/08/2008 16:30:15    71255

Only 2 teams in the country played what can be truly called a blanket defense (02-03 style) this season and they were Fermanagh and Westmeath. Cork played it against Limerick and the first half against Kerry. The other teams who get slated here don't they just work hard .

ringo.starr (Kildare) - Posts: 44 - 11/08/2008 16:30:38    71256

Ulsterman, maybe you should just take the anti-Kerry chip off your shoulder. Stick to posting on your own counties page rather than your own. Appreciate that despite being written off as not being able to cope with the Ulster style earlier in the decade Kerry have a possibility to win more than half the all irelands this decade. Ohhh and stop hanging off the coat-tails of Armagh/Tyrone success as a means to talking up Ulster. I don't know how they would feel but you don't see Waterford hanging off our success as a means to talking up Munster Football. That is the equivalent of what you are doing.

Kingdom Come (None) - Posts: 264 - 11/08/2008 16:43:34    71273

Get use to it, like you say it has only been used in the lastfew years, things get better as will the blanket defence. If you dont like the style of play that is being used today I suggest you find another sport. And if you think it is the end of Armagh then you truely are a fool, they are in their transition phase give it two years and they will be back in a final. I guarantee it.

Armaghgeddon (Armagh) - Posts: 539 - 11/08/2008 16:48:10    71279

Kingdom,

Well I am from Ulster and it is usually 'Ulster' that precedes most of the 'puke football' articles so I think I am fairly entitled to comment OR do you just not like the facts. As for hanging off Tyrone & Armagh I will certainly challenge and take on unfairness wherever and whenever I see it no matter the county so you better get used to it. I am certainly not anti-Kerry, if you look at your own board you will see I have praised players like Darragh O'Se, Tomas O'Se and Paul Galvin consistently. What I do take exception to is an entire province and it's people being stereotyped and abused in a most unfair manner by some partitionist elements in the South. Over the past 6 years, ever since Armagh had the temerity to beat Kerry, ALL we have had is snide, nasty, bitter comments about Ulster and it's football. Most of this is just from those with other agendas. I have RARELY heard ANY praise or positive articles from Kerry people about Ulster football or players and when you consider the province has produced greats like Canavan, O'Neill, Kavanagh, McDonnell, McConville etc I must assume that something else is going on. I am not the only one as you can see on here many others agree with me.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9818 - 11/08/2008 17:01:50    71298

Such a pack of rubbish well said ulsterman. And if ye think tyrone are gonna then ye have another thing comin we're favourites for the minor title this year again and the conveyor belt keeps rollin.

I personally don't care what they say in the south its so obviously just bitterness. I'm obviously biased but some of the matchs ive watched involving ulster teams over the past years may not have always been pretty but they've been action packed and exciting.

C'mon tyrone on saturday hope we can do it and watch thsi space hering rumours on the grapevine of a late last minute comeback

redhanddefender (Tyrone) - Posts: 913 - 11/08/2008 17:05:55    71304

Redhanddef - What have you been hearing lad? I also heard a rumour as well, but the said person is supposed to be on holiday abroad?? Would be great if it does transpire though.

mugsys_barber (Tyrone) - Posts: 2160 - 11/08/2008 17:45:41    71351

Well i'm back from Mayo and raring to go. Had great craic there. I see the same old anti-Ulster football bias still here. " Puke Football " " Blanket Defence " etc. While Galway played nice "OPen Football"..... THEY STILL LOST. Wexford played very nice football against an aging Armagh team who are now short of pace. Good luck to Wexford as its nice to see a new team coming through. But does anyone seriously believe that if Armagh or Tyrone played nice open football in their A.I. victories over Kerry they would have came out on top.? I seriously doubt it. Both won by using a game plan to negate Kerry and it worked. It is clear that it is now time for a change of tactics.... but dont knock teams for coming up with a winning formula to beat Kerry. Now let the KNOCKERS come up with another... I seriously doubt they can.

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 11/08/2008 18:05:25    71369

Ulsterman, you are the man formally known as Antrim Gael I am certain. You have done nothing but come on our page and snipe at Kerry. You flip flop on your position like him. You hang off Tyrone and Armagh. You USE captials when YOU wanted to SAY something out loud. Kerry have always recognised that the players you mentioned were top class. The Irish Independent is not a Kerry paper.

Kingdom Come (None) - Posts: 264 - 11/08/2008 18:08:27    71371

Yes and can you see the general pattern of the posters who agree with you?? Says it all.

Kingdom Come (None) - Posts: 264 - 11/08/2008 18:17:56    71377

From an outside Ulster perspective all we have heard for the last few years is how superior Ulster football is, how tough the ulster championship is, how rubbish Leinster/Munster football is, how defence wins championships etc and only Ulster teams know how to play modern football....and you wonder why people take delight in knocking ye????

Armagh/Tyrone played and won with a defensive style of football when they had Canavan, Mulligan, O'Neill, McGuigan, or McConville, Clarke, Marsden, McDonnell, McEntee etc as scoring forwards....They have continued to try and play the same style of football but now only have 1 or 2 real scoring options which means they won't win anything...There is also the issue of the blatant off the ball fouling, checking, gamesmanship, cynical fouling, diving that goes on with some Ulster teams and the total refusal to accept any critiscism from anyone outside Ulster...

Dubsforsam1 (Dublin) - Posts: 164 - 11/08/2008 18:31:18    71383

i dont think it an ulster bias. people just dont like watching armagh or westmeath play. when they turn over ball, sure there are maybe 2-3 forwards in there half!!! its sad stuff to watch. i like watching tyrone play though, far better than armagh. but kerry are by far and away the best to watch.

highballin (Kerry) - Posts: 5 - 11/08/2008 18:34:38    71386

Absolutely 100% right Ulsterman, in full agreement with your posts today on this subject. There is an element down there that could well be on a parallel with an element up here if you get my meaning.

mugsys_barber (Tyrone) - Posts: 2160 - 11/08/2008 18:36:07    71390

ironic this thread was posted by a galway man, if u's wud of employed the 'blanket defence' or as mugsys barber says 'worked hard' and got good ball to meehen then u's wud of won. there is kno priede in losing by 6 and playing 'the correct way' its about time the rest of ireland realised that kerry will happily beat us' by 6r7 points in a free flowing game if u let them.. good luck tyrone i realy hope u's win i dont care if its 'puke' (hard) football

speedy12 (Fermanagh) - Posts: 592 - 11/08/2008 18:37:08    71394

"I personally don't care what they say in the south its so obviously just bitterness. I'm obviously biased but some of the matchs ive watched involving ulster teams over the past years may not have always been pretty but they've been action packed and exciting."

i think this is the point here, the ulster games are not good to watch. nobody wants to watch 10 players swarm a forward and get the ball back, its just ugly. they want to see open, high scoring matchs with great point taking and kick passing. sure armagh never can score more than 10-13 points!!

highballin (Kerry) - Posts: 5 - 11/08/2008 18:51:19    71402

If you think you have seen the end of sweepers and new defensive systems you have another think coming.
Thats how it will be from now on. It is just surprising that these tactic werent introduced earlier... its all down to creeping professionalism which is all about not losing as opposed to winning.
Look at Galway last Saturday... glorious losers.
Look at Wexford in Leinster final..... destroyed.
Wexford deserve great credit for getting reorganised defensively in a very short time. Galway should have known better than going head to head with Kerry in end to end football. I was watching Matthew Clancy after the match.... congratulating Dara O Se and delighted with Kerry's great victory !!!!!!!! How could you beat Kerry with an attitude like that.

I have nothing against Kerry nor Kilkenny they have both won enough long ago. It would normally be great to see teams going for 3 in a row but not these two and both simultaneously... Think the other 31 should unite behind the underdogs, even Dublin. I remember well the time Kerry were going for 5 in a row and sure people had almost lost interest in football.

BIG SACKS (Tyrone) - Posts: 1681 - 11/08/2008 20:08:37    71438

Ulsterman

Very strong opinion there and not one I agree with. You could just as easily turn the argument around and say that Ulster folk have no time for people down south - and just the same as your argument may be valid in some isolated cases then the argument the other way is also true in some isolated cases - I have experienced it. This is pretty normal in any society eg some Londoners do not like Lancastrians etc - I wouldn't get hung up on it. I do not for one moment think there is this big concerted anti-Ulster thing going on down here - it is anathema to everything the GAA stands for. Remember those who shout loudest will always be heard and empty vessels make most noise.

I think there has been lots of interaction between Ulster clubs and those in every other province for many years now. Indeed there was a great reaction to Down's win in 1991 and every other win since in my experience. People are entitled to their opinion about styles of play. I have written here on more than one occasion that I felt this 'puke' tag was lazy and inaccurate. A lot of people didn't like Clare's hurling style - it didn't mean there was a huge anti-Clare sentiment going around.

Generalising as you have done is not true or clever. Your overuse of the word 'partition' (a word I have not heard in many. many years) may say more about your mindset than your perception of the mindset down south. Lets keep it to football and hurling and leave the 'victim' and persecuted feelings out of it. I look forward to Saturday and meeting a few Tyrone fans and having the craic - win, lose or draw. I will do so as I would do with any other county's fans - without prejudice. pre-conceptions or stereotyping - just enjoying a chat about the football and a pint - this is what its about.

JayoCluxton (Dublin) - Posts: 2688 - 11/08/2008 22:09:44    71494

The "blanket defence" and "puke football" are just the despairing cries of the so-called "purists" who hate to think that there's a better tactic than lumping an aimless 50-yard high ball in the general direction of a 18 stone, 6 foot 4 full forward.
The fact is that long kick-passes are extremely difficult to execute accurately when under pressure, and that is why most teams decide to eliminate the risk, by utilising the safer hand-pass as much as possible. For all the criticism Armagh get, they only really employ the hand-passing game in their own half , where it would be foolish to risk losing the ball (which if you watch is pretty much what Kerry, Dublin and everyone else do as well). Once they get to in or around half-way they send ong ball in to the 2 man full forward line. The only difference from how Kerry do this is that Kerry keep their 6 forwards as forwards. Armagh didn't (when they developed this tactic) have 6 forwards of the highest standard, they had 2; so surely it makes sense to give these two as much space as possible to work in. Then bringing the players back to defend makes sense, if you've only two players as scoring forwards, surely its only sensible to bring the rest back to both win ball, and to prevent the other team from scoring.
The only problem I'd have with the way Armagh, Tyrone, etc play is the late hits to prevent players moving forward for a return pass, but that's as much referees' faults for not clamping down on the late hits. Can you really blame a team for doing something if they know they're going to get away with it?

But as for the posters claiming that the complaints about Northern football is due to Southern partitionist you really eed to drop the victim mentality. The only partitionists around are the 51% who live in the 6 counties and mostly don't want anything to do with our sports.
As I said at the start, it's the old farts who can't accept that there's any way to play successful football other than their blinkered "traditional" style that give out about it. Every club has people like this, the sort that reckon hand-passing should be banned in training, they're the ones that you should be giving out about, not accusing Southern people of being partitionist

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 11/08/2008 22:33:11    71509

I think Armaghgeddon is right, we havent seen the end of Armagh. They will be back in a final in two years.
Armagh. Tommy Murphy Cup winners, 2010.

The Gael (Down) - Posts: 115 - 12/08/2008 00:26:05    71569

I love the blanket defense. It's here to stay. I don't know what that Galway lad is goin on with. Maybe if your team could defend you would have won. So you pleased the neutrals with your positivity brilliant but personally prefer the northern model of winning at all costs myself

iarmhiman (Westmeath) - Posts: 140 - 12/08/2008 01:53:58    71586