Lads,
I have got to partially defend ball (hyphen) boy on this one to an extent!!

A TV question came up some time ago where the question was asked "Name the Mountain range between Wexford and Carlow?" or something to that effect. The mot wasnt sure and then guessed wrongly to which I was surprised she didnt know it was the Blackstairs Mountains of course!

I then questioned her to what extant they have to study geography and history etc in order to be well versed enough to teach the subject and be very well au fait with it and was shocked to hear that they did little or no actual "expertise" in the subjects at all except Gaeilge which for the Corca Dhuibhne múinteoir as a native speaker is no bother!
She said most of the training is on all sorts of high falutin stuff like 'the history of education'!!!!!!!!!, child development, the syllabus of learning, methods of instruction, etc and nothing much at all about the actual subjects!!!
I asked her this question: Did you have to study mathematics at all? The reply came: "No! Sure its only Primary school stuff, ya should know it well!"
I agree fully that you should know mathematics well as its only kids stuff and hence I agree with ballboy that none of what the primary teachers actually teach is difficult at all!!.....anyone can teach it!!
The mot always says she will bring me into the class as a 'guest speaker' for history lessons cos she has no interest in history at all whereas I love it!
Ask a primary teacher to name the seven signitories of the proclamation and most couldnt tell you all 7 names and that is a crime!!.....its all OK not knowing history things with the small kids but in the senior classes its not on!!.......(probably why the mot says the male teachers get the senior classes because they are more passionate about history/geography etc than the women are!).

P.S. If the Corca Dhuibhne múinteoir is lucky enough to become my wife some day its the best job in the world for a wife to have as:
good wage, stress free, home early, kids can be in the school with her, job security etc!!
What better job could a man wish for his wife to have eh!!!

PS ball (hyphen) boy is also correct about lesson plans, they only exist in the early days when they are being assessed for the H-Dip!!

That said manys the edition of the edition of the Sunday Game has been spoiled by the production of half the classes copy books and a red pen for me to help correct while she did the essays for 2nd class and I ended up with a stray fleck of glitter on the side of my neck in work the next morning being pointed out to me!!

......and by the way, those little packs of 'haribo' sweets or whatever the mot buys for the kids as a treat on a friday if they have been good all week are expensive!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Snufalufagus (Dublin) - Posts: 8100 - 10/08/2011 17:16:52    1008492

cheers snuffy. its daylight robbery in all fairness. a leaving cert student could teach any level of student provided they were a decent student themselves. and on the subject items as snuff alluded to them spend their time in st pats doing anything and everything possible to give them an ego such as the philosopsy of various learning styles on the mental development of early adolecents - its a complete con job. ill put it like this i cannot spell well in fact im terrible at it, but absolutely nooone could tell me that i wouldnt be able to teach english at any level in school and that would be my worst subject- do i need to be able to spell?

;lads this teaching craic is a complete joke if iut wasnt so serious it would be funny. as i have said while giving the odd guest lecture during my PhD - degrees could be two years long but first we have to address the 14 years of damage done at school and actually teach these children how to think for themselves.

if teaching was such a hard job we would not hear the joibes about june july and august all year long now would we? they are fooling no one folks and the sooner we get this sorted out the better, laugh at me all you want but i will not stand by and watch you laugh at me at my expense.

teaching is the easiest, most brain dead, effortless job in the entire world, that i can assure you!

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 10/08/2011 17:38:40    1008518

Snufalufagus
County: Dublin
Posts: 2711

1008492 Lads,
I have got to partially defend ball (hyphen) boy on this one to an extent!!

A TV question came up some time ago where the question was asked "Name the Mountain range between Wexford and Carlow?" or something to that effect. The mot wasnt sure and then guessed wrongly to which I was surprised she didnt know it was the Blackstairs Mountains of course!

I then questioned her to what extant they have to study geography and history etc in order to be well versed enough to teach the subject and be very well au fait with it and was shocked to hear that they did little or no actual "expertise" in the subjects at all except Gaeilge which for the Corca Dhuibhne múinteoir as a native speaker is no bother!
She said most of the training is on all sorts of high falutin stuff like 'the history of education'!!!!!!!!!, child development, the syllabus of learning, methods of instruction, etc and nothing much at all about the actual subjects!!!
I asked her this question: Did you have to study mathematics at all? The reply came: "No! Sure its only Primary school stuff, ya should know it well!"
I agree fully that you should know mathematics well as its only kids stuff and hence I agree with ballboy that none of what the primary teachers actually teach is difficult at all!!.....anyone can teach it!!
The mot always says she will bring me into the class as a 'guest speaker' for history lessons cos she has no interest in history at all whereas I love it!
Ask a primary teacher to name the seven signitories of the proclamation and most couldnt tell you all 7 names and that is a crime!!.....its all OK not knowing history things with the small kids but in the senior classes its not on!!.......(probably why the mot says the male teachers get the senior classes because they are more passionate about history/geography etc than the women are!).

P.S. If the Corca Dhuibhne múinteoir is lucky enough to become my wife some day its the best job in the world for a wife to have as:
good wage, stress free, home early, kids can be in the school with her, job security etc!!
What better job could a man wish for his wife to have eh!!!

PS ball (hyphen) boy is also correct about lesson plans, they only exist in the early days when they are being assessed for the H-Dip!!

That said manys the edition of the edition of the Sunday Game has been spoiled by the production of half the classes copy books and a red pen for me to help correct while she did the essays for 2nd class and I ended up with a stray fleck of glitter on the side of my neck in work the next morning being pointed out to me!!

......and by the way, those little packs of 'haribo' sweets or whatever the mot buys for the kids as a treat on a friday if they have been good all week are expensive!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Like your alleged mot already said to you, if it's so good and so easy why are you not doing it ?

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6183 - 10/08/2011 18:35:48    1008579

Greengrass,

What do you mean my "alleged mot"?.........sounds to me like someone is a little bit jealous!!

As for "Why dont I become a teacher"?.....whats that supposed to mean too?.......just because im havin a pop at how easy teaching is 'subjects wise' and 'holidays wise' like everyone does and like all teachers are used to?!

..........I simply wouldnt have the patience for teaching and listening to kids day in day out, it would drive me crazy!!!.......is that good enough a reason for you?

Let me ask you a question: 'Why are you not a priest?'...............stuipid question isnt it?!!!!.....like yours is!!

Usually you get into a particular profession because its what you enjoy and are good at!.........not because the holidays are good!......cop on lad!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Snufalufagus (Dublin) - Posts: 8100 - 10/08/2011 19:08:22    1008601

liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 4152

1007889 frankbhoy77
County: Antrim
Posts: 683

1005672 Ah well i might as well enjoy the rest of my holidays while i still have them, before i go back to my 20 hours (wherever that figure came from)

----------------

this is whats wrong- the above cant even tell the difference between two countries and the fact that they even have two education systms- you would make a great teacher alright. the above shows i am perfectly right we need to get tough on these teachers who are living it up at our expense


Can i just ask what the hell you are on about here???? Are you making a rather lazy assumption that because i am from antrim that i teach in antrim???? Tut tut.

frankbhoy77 (Antrim) - Posts: 1300 - 11/08/2011 08:10:57    1008779

I have certain sympathies with both sides to this argument.

Teachers do have handy hours & I'd say if you were to break their salaries down to earnings per hour it would be quite a ridiculous figure. In saying that though the patience required for the job must be torturous. I know that when I tried to give my younger brother physics and maths grinds for his Leaving Cert we nearly came to blows. If teaching was just about educating the kids in a patient & caring manner then it would be no problem but they also have to deal with troublesome pupils day in day out aswell which would be quite stressful I'd imagine.

What gets my goat about some teachers is the gloating about their holidays and the whinging when they actually have to do some work!
Two examples:
1. I live with a teacher in Dublin who has spent the entire summer swanning around South America. He is due back next week some time and is looking forward to Donegal's semi with Dublin on the 28th. The only "problem" is he's due back to school on Monday the 29th & is whinging about how hungover he'll likely be following Donegal's inevitable win ;-)

2. Talking to a teacher one night in town she was lamenting the fact that flight prices go up so much during mid-term break so it's impossible for her to get a cheap getaway!

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9907 - 11/08/2011 09:57:48    1008834

Snufalufagus
County: Dublin
Posts: 2714

1008601 Greengrass,

What do you mean my "alleged mot"?.........sounds to me like someone is a little bit jealous!!

Jealous?? Don't think so. No offence Snuf, but I am very happy with my lot in life thanks very much.


As for "Why dont I become a teacher"?.....whats that supposed to mean too?.......just because im havin a pop at how easy teaching is 'subjects wise' and 'holidays wise' like everyone does and like all teachers are used to?!

Precisely why I asked the question. You were having a pop. I only asked you a question and you threw your wee hissy fit. If you can't take it don't give it.

..........I simply wouldnt have the patience for teaching and listening to kids day in day out, it would drive me crazy!!!.......is that good enough a reason for you?

A stress free job you said ??? Yet it would drive you crazy ??? "Anyone can teach it", you said, yet you admit you couldn't do it ??? Snuf ???

Let me ask you a question: 'Why are you not a priest?'...............stuipid question isnt it?!!!!.....like yours is!!

You Snufalufagus ask a stupid question? Never.

Usually you get into a particular profession because its what you enjoy and are good at!.........

Correct. Go to the top of the class.

not because the holidays are good!......

Oh dear, back to the bench

cop on lad!

Ooooooohh, hhhiiisssyyy !!! Miaow !!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

May you live your life in serenity and peace and may life bestow its wisdom upon you each and every time you post on Hoganstand in the future.

Mise le meas,

Greengrass ........ Ordinary fella.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6183 - 11/08/2011 10:55:56    1008880

lads i think we can all agree that teaching is a part-time job, if they want to be treated like full time workers then they should do exactly that and work full time. listening to teachers of welfare cases complain when they dont know how good they have it really makes me annoyed

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 11/08/2011 11:13:44    1008891

Armchair generals as usual talking ill informed p**h about teachers. How many of them would have the nerve or guts to stand up in front of 25 - 30 hormonal, hate the world, disrespectful cheeky kids (not all of course) who see it as their job to 'break' teachers and make their lives a misery? Children seek out every teacher's weakness and play on it for the entire year and I know teachers who are physically and emotionally drained by it. They get long holidays but to hold the disciplne and attention of a classroom of children is one of the hardest jobs anyone can do.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9829 - 11/08/2011 12:46:36    1008961

Snuf - yes there are teachers who defy belief out there, im not disputing that - just like there are builders or nurses who are useless and do nothing.. Im sure there are plenty of people running around with PhD's who havent a clue either.

My woman works in the north (as a primary teacher) and i can tell you for a fact that she is flat out every evening - her boss has them constantly changing schemes and requiring to see their plans and notes etc so the sweeping statements being made by yourself and balls are in fact 'sweeping' and untrue.

I still work on sites in dublin where men do absolutely nothin except smoke and lean on shovels and stuff - ye can point fingers at one profession if ye like but realistically everyone has to look at themselves at the moment and ask how hard we are actually working ourselves.

Ballboy - dont let yourself get annoyed - use your phantom PhD to become a teacher! Problem solved :-)

Brolly (Monaghan) - Posts: 4472 - 11/08/2011 13:06:06    1008980

Brolly
County: Monaghan
Posts: 2324

1008980
Snuf - yes there are teachers who defy belief out there, im not disputing that - just like there are builders or nurses who are useless and do nothing.. Im sure there are plenty of people running around with PhD's who havent a clue either.

Ah now !! Leave liathroidboy alone, its not fair !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 11/08/2011 13:37:18    1009010

Ulsterman
County: Antrim
Posts: 3975

1008961 Armchair generals as usual talking ill informed p**h about teachers. How many of them would have the nerve or guts to stand up in front of 25 - 30 hormonal, hate the world, disrespectful cheeky kids (not all of course) who see it as their job to 'break' teachers and make their lives a misery? Children seek out every teacher's weakness and play on it for the entire year and I know teachers who are physically and emotionally drained by it. They get long holidays but to hold the disciplne and attention of a classroom of children is one of the hardest jobs anyone can do.


----------------------------------------------

armchair general- now that perfectly sums you up ulsterman- brilliant! guts to stand up in front of a few kids- oh dear god what has the world come to- spoend a day reading from a book to kids, and im usung the word day very loosely more like a couple of hours, and its supposed to be hard/ difficult on the poor part timer- give it a rest will ye. this drain on the part of teachers, the only drain is the drain they are on society ripping us off for years. i also love your 'entire year' that is a complete laugh- teachers work part time for 6 months of the year and they are off for the rest of the year- bless the poor darlings. teaching is the easiest job ever, its like all easy jobs they try to make them out to be difficult as a coverup, its a bit like a housewife- you have to hear the same nonsense from them poor darlings. its easy dicipline kids in fact its probably the easiest thing in the world to do, to keep their attention is also easy you have to make things interesting but that requires effort on the part of the teachers and we all know these people are just out to milk the system- they are the lowest of the low in my opinion. its time to get real, teachers will have to start working for their pay or else they will be paid for just teh hours they work. agre disagree i couldnt care less the change is coming, the race to the bottom starts here and i for one am absolutely delighted :)

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 12/08/2011 11:12:54    1009528

liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 4170

1008135 Brolly
County: Monaghan
Posts: 2321

oh cry me a river- the poor darlings. walking around putting a gold star on the copybooks of a few kids for getting their spelling write- sound seriously hard to me. and i have kids and i totally understand that teahers do nothing as with all this planning they are supposed to do and that their unions keep crying out that tghey are spending all hours of the day planning lessons and individual learning plans etc. my simple solution was to ask to see them? then you soon realise that its a complete an utter joke and i have no problem telling them. i have said to numerous teachers of my kids that they should be fired for incompetence, they usually dont be so smug when they are not dealing with council house vermon and have PhD educated people asking the question. i urge all parents to ask to see this plans that take so much time to draw up- ill let ye in on a little secret folks they dont exixt but we are paying for them and i would like answers. as i have said if we are to clean up society we must start with the worst offenders first ie those on welfare and underworkered overpaid civil servants- that are the cause of 90% of all our problems - but their cummupance is coming solwly but surely

And that folks is why ballboy has such a gripe against teachers! Not even the most incompetent teacher on the planet would ever give you a gold star for spelling. Incidentally, Did they have a cryptic code breaker to mark your thesis for your PhD? otherwise I cannot fathom for the life of me how they deciphered it.
As for standing up to kids, I see the police in Britain armed with batons and pepper spray had trouble enough and yet teachers are supposed to put up with gangsters like that every day. I tell you what, you give it a go

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 12/08/2011 12:50:59    1009620

omaghredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 3134

1009620 liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 4170

1008135 Brolly
County: Monaghan
Posts: 2321

oh cry me a river- the poor darlings. walking around putting a gold star on the copybooks of a few kids for getting their spelling write- sound seriously hard to me. and i have kids and i totally understand that teahers do nothing as with all this planning they are supposed to do and that their unions keep crying out that tghey are spending all hours of the day planning lessons and individual learning plans etc. my simple solution was to ask to see them? then you soon realise that its a complete an utter joke and i have no problem telling them. i have said to numerous teachers of my kids that they should be fired for incompetence, they usually dont be so smug when they are not dealing with council house vermon and have PhD educated people asking the question. i urge all parents to ask to see this plans that take so much time to draw up- ill let ye in on a little secret folks they dont exixt but we are paying for them and i would like answers. as i have said if we are to clean up society we must start with the worst offenders first ie those on welfare and underworkered overpaid civil servants- that are the cause of 90% of all our problems - but their cummupance is coming solwly but surely

And that folks is why ballboy has such a gripe against teachers! Not even the most incompetent teacher on the planet would ever give you a gold star for spelling. Incidentally, Did they have a cryptic code breaker to mark your thesis for your PhD? otherwise I cannot fathom for the life of me how they deciphered it.
As for standing up to kids, I see the police in Britain armed with batons and pepper spray had trouble enough and yet teachers are supposed to put up with gangsters like that every day. I tell you what, you give it a go

--------------------------------------------

my only gripe with teachers is that they are lazy and useless- besides that i have no problem with them. dicipline a few kids, if you cant dicipline a few 6 year old that is more a reflection of how useless you are rather than anything got to dowith the kids. anyways the time for debating how useless teachers are is over, society has accepted that, the question now is what are we going to do about it. to be hoenst teaching is so easy and largely irrelavant to society that i think it should be part of community service as anyone could do this simple task. why pay someone when you could just get another idiot to do it for free?

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 12/08/2011 13:00:38    1009630

Whats the PHD in ballboy?

and if Irish teachers (or any for that matter) are incompetent then why are your qualifactions so important? surely due to the standard of teachers and teaching then your qualifactions are worth no more than toilet roll. remember that degrees and master degrees are taught under a strict syllabus just like the leaving and junior certs are.

Therefore a person with a pHD in ireland who gained this through the irish system of education is not a person of any stature due to inadequate teaching standards. So why would any teacher be afraid to be challenged by you and your pHD knowing that its worthless?

TylerDurden (Mayo) - Posts: 155 - 12/08/2011 21:22:45    1010147

you cant do your degree and master by reasearch - so your argument is totally wrong, and a phd is soely by research bar a few philosophy and methodology courses that are not examined- so its safe to say you are completely wrong. degrees spend 90% of their time correcting the wrongs done by 14 years of incompetent teachers. we all know this is the reality- I think the discussion has moved past the fact that they are underworked and overpaid the question now is what to do with them to correct this

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 15/08/2011 14:37:45    1011402

"they are underworked and overpaid the question now is what to do with them to correct this"
-------------------------------------------------------------------

'Marry them'!!!

Thats the thought going through my mind anyway!!!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Snufalufagus (Dublin) - Posts: 8100 - 15/08/2011 15:21:06    1011460

Can you actually get a PhD in fishing ?

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 15/08/2011 16:13:42    1011514

you cant do your degree and master by reasearch - so your argument is totally wrong, and a phd is soely by research bar a few philosophy and methodology courses that are not examined- so its safe to say you are completely wrong. degrees spend 90% of their time correcting the wrongs done by 14 years of incompetent teachers. we all know this is the reality- I think the discussion has moved past the fact that they are underworked and overpaid the question now is what to do with them to correct this

Say what?

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 15/08/2011 18:03:39    1011629

you cant do your degree and master by reasearch ---What? who said that you could?

- so your argument is totally wrong, and a phd is soely by research bar a few philosophy and methodology courses that are not examined- so its safe to say you are completely wrong. degrees spend 90% of their time correcting the wrongs done by 14 years of incompetent teachers. we all know this is the reality- I think the discussion has moved past the fact that they are underworked and overpaid the question now is what to do with them to correct this


Right.. if you did have a pHD you would actually be able to actually read and interpret something correctly. re-read what I posted and try again.

Maybe your teachers just gave up on you---they heard you say one thing and said 'there's a lost cause if i ever seen one'. I know I've read some of your posts and thought that.

TylerDurden (Mayo) - Posts: 155 - 15/08/2011 19:03:27    1011678