IF THE GAA goes ahead with its planned revamp of the Allianz hurling leagues they will "end up killing hurling in the smaller counties", according to Casey O'Brien, who managed Wicklow to a Division 3A title and a historic Christy Ring Cup final appearance at Croke Park this year.
"It will help make the strong counties even stronger and give the weaker counties nothing to play for," O'Brien said.
"We hear all this talk from Croke Park about promoting hurling -- but what it has really become is an elitist game at the top level, and this is only going to increase that. This is the kind of thing that will end up killing hurling in the smaller counties.
"You work your way up the ladder and get so far and for what? To get kicked back down it again? If this goes ahead, I'll have to reconsider my position because I don't think I can face that again.
"In Wicklow, we will definitely lose players as well because this is a real kick in the teeth to them. We got a number of key players back on the strength of our two-year programme and winning promotion. If that's taken away, the players -- like me -- will just lose that drive again."
"This isn't just about us," O'Brien said. "John Meyler has done a brilliant job in Kerry and so has Kevin Ryan in Carlow and there's other counties, like Louth, where Paddy Kelly has done brilliant work."

Article: http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/league-revamp-will-kill-hurling-in-smaller-counties-2827344.html

I have to say, I agree with him. The winners of the revamp are the elite at the top and other sports codes!

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9040 - 21/07/2011 20:24:57    991549

On the back of news on the league revamp and lower league counties dissatisfaction, should lower league counties withdraw from the league in protest and run their own competition in the spring? Possibly drastic but if the GAA don't care about these counties they have to make a stand.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9040 - 22/07/2011 10:04:14    991706

I've always hated the current league structure. It's done no good fopr hurling in Clare, Limerick, Wexford or now Offaly. I guess part of the reason I hate it, is 'cause I can see Cork visiting the lower tier in the near future. That'd set Cork hurling back even further.

For all of that, the GAA's concern should be 'hurling' not 'Cork hurling.' The two often have similar needs, but not always.

Doesn't the new set up still allow for promtion of teams like Kerry and Wicklow? It'll still allow them to work their way up Offaly's level, whilst giving Offaly more meaningful games. I'm more than willing to change my mind, but at the moment I don't really see a major downside to the re-vamp. It does mess up Wiclow hurlings promotional chances for one year. But that should only be one year, and again the GAA have to concern themselves with 'hurling' nor 'Wicklow hurling.'

As I say, my mind isn't closed on this issue. I'm happy to take the Cork goggles off, and listen to the other side.

Culchie (Cork) - Posts: 799 - 22/07/2011 10:31:07    991736

The league was fine the way it was imo. The only change that they maybe could've made would be to have made it 2 up 2 down.

Teams weren't good enough for Division 1 hurling so instead of getting the work done to make sure they return to the top flight its easier to just complain about it for long enough. The GAA will eventually cave in.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13833 - 22/07/2011 11:43:52    991822

No-one will listen to Wicklow or Kerry you may be certain.

hurlingdub (Dublin) - Posts: 6978 - 22/07/2011 12:02:21    991837

Well time the smaller countie stopped their whenging, no matter what we do, ye dont seem to develope, what more can be done? The back door was wrong too, what the hell can be done. I believe the weaker counties are just lazy and expect the likes of us to help ye along.

bbilly (Galway) - Posts: 414 - 22/07/2011 12:33:33    991874

bbilly
County: Galway
Posts: 217

So you're saying Galway should be sent back to Connacht then?

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13833 - 22/07/2011 12:41:49    991898

This year's 8 team division 1, will become next year's division 1A & 1B with 6 teams in each group. The GAA have tried this format before. It basically stops the likes of Antrim/Limerick/Clare/Wexford/Offaly from yo-yoing between division 1 & 2.

But the weaker counties say that with division 1 split, then division 2 is effectively the third tier. It is a fair point. Limerick were relegated to division 2 on merit in 2010 - we lost 7 out of 7 & deserved it. So called weaker counties playing in division 2 now need to get promoted again into a smaller division of 6 teams with less games & less margin for error.

I see where they are coming from. Personally I like the 1A/1B system, but at least when it's division 1 & 2 and there's 8 teams in the top flight, it gives everyone something to play for in every game.

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6510 - 22/07/2011 12:45:40    991908

Whilst I see where they are coming from, I dont think anybody would deny that Clare, Wexford, Offaly, Limerick and Antrim need help first. So yes you could say it's elitist but I dont see the Wicklow senior hurlers being managed by Liam Sheedy or Donal O'Grady or another high-profile manager, like their football counterparts.
The GAA need to look after the real hurling counties first where hurling is bread and butter, and get us back up competing with the likes of KK and Tipp. This new league format is one step towards that.
I'd love to see the average victories for Wexford, Clare, Limerick and Offaly over Kildare, Laois, and Down over the last 4 years - it'd be 20+ points. How is that serving hurling in these counties? These counties will be only too happy to have a more realistic competition in the league rather than togging out for a turkey shoot.
In every new format, there will be winners and losers. The losers are as per this article, the winners are Wexford, Offlaly, Limerick, Clare and Antrim and Carlow (who will be up in the top league after this year).
Carlow are to be commended for the time and resources they have devoted to hurling, and they will be hurling division 1 the following year as they will be the best team in division 2. Also in fairness to their county board, they have a very good and high-profile manager to boot. But to say hurling in counties like Wexford and Offaly and Clare - where huge resources are spent on the game and who will be competing for AI in the next few years - to assist Wicklow and Kerry is just nonsense. I feel sorry for die-hard hurling people in these counties but it's up to them to get their own house in order and get level pegging off their own county board before the rest should suffer as a result.
So yes it is a slightly elitist game but until the "weaker" counties start to devote the same resources to the small ball as the big, the GAA wont want to know about them.

Pinkie (Wexford) - Posts: 4100 - 22/07/2011 13:10:03    991946

I think that the best way hurling can improve in any county is to look and improve at underage level... Hurling is that type of a game!

Putting teams like Limerick, Clare, Wexford, Offaly and the likes into Division 2 (current system) hasn't worked. They might be bottom of the top level but for the sake of the game everything should be done to keep them competitive. Clare's last 3 league games this year were against Carlow, Down and Kerry and they ran up big scores! And then they are expected to be prepared for a Munster clash with the All-Ireland champions? This years Championship has been so dull, the current league structure is a factor I reckon!

Weaker counties - if you use Dublin as a template to get more competitive then you'll find yourself mixing it with the best. It takes time and hard work - nothing good comes easy.

The mentality by some is to bring teams down to help out - which is very typical of the Irish mentality.

I'd be one for push yourself and get up to the next level - As Rocky said - "If you know what your worth then go a get what your worth and stop pointing the finger"

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1479 - 22/07/2011 13:26:49    991975

MesAmis
It has nothing to do with us, im talking bout the smaller counties

bbilly (Galway) - Posts: 414 - 22/07/2011 13:49:38    992014

bbilly
County: Galway
Posts: 218

992014
MesAmis
It has nothing to do with us, im talking bout the smaller counties

Really?

We gave Galway a chance to develop in Leinster and they haven't really come on at all. So, like you said, I think its time we stopped helping them and made them stand on their own two feet.

I don't know what else we can do for Galway.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13833 - 22/07/2011 14:00:09    992024

bbilly

"Smaller counties?" When did Galway last win an senior All Ireland Blouse?

LohansRedHelmet (Clare) - Posts: 2697 - 22/07/2011 14:21:40    992049

MesAmis - you could open a chain of fast foods with the amount of chips you seem to have on them shoulders!!

Ironically, times have never been so good for Dublin hurling and you seem so disgruntled. You must have been some dose when the likes of Westmeath were beating you in the Championship..

Cheer up - If Galway got a hold of you now you'd know all about improvement..

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1479 - 22/07/2011 14:24:14    992055

LohansRedHelmet

Galway 4-25 Clare 0-20

Its weaker counties like ye wer tryin to help. Nobody wanted to see a drubbing like that. It just shows the difference in class between the top 3 and the likes of Clare, Antrim etc. Hurling needs to be improved in these counties.

bbilly (Galway) - Posts: 414 - 22/07/2011 15:01:57    992114

There are some things the weaker counties can do, some have said as much here, to get up at least competing you need to have all those boring things like strctures in place. I wouldn't start with making changes at Inter-county level but way down at U8's. That makes it a 12 year project because thats how long it will take. You need to get level pegging with your own county board, you need to accomodate duel players and structure leagues to facillitate both codes. If the standard at senior club level is not good enough amalgamate the senior level leagues with an adjacent weaker county same further down. Much is made of Dublins progress etc but compare the resources and structures in place for boys/men with the girls in Dublin and its a different story. There are huge numbers of girls now playing camogie and they compete at national level very well up to 14 and 16 and then it all comes apart. The most important problem facing camogie is the standard of the club scene it is just not producing quality adult county teams. The structures now coming into place where they are emulating the Hurling structures and recruiting mentors from hurling in large numbers, spreading the game into the southside schools has been a big development which will have the effect. But this mirrors the problems that weaker counties face. It is wrong to say they don't need any help, they need more than advice, they need to have administrative changes, archaic regulations amended and redrawn, they need dedicated commitee's, they need co-operation, they need tournaments and competition and they need sign up by all the clubs. They need people sent into schools, they need nurseries, they need teams to amalgamate to ensure a level of hurling is available right across the county. It isn't easy, but if they do all that change will come, but its not next year.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4957 - 22/07/2011 15:14:14    992136

bbilly
County: Galway
Posts: 220

I see yer whole team fell off a motorbike, bye bye Dublin.

Ha ha we'll see, we can hopefully cope with Keeney's loss, the same can certainly not be said of Galway with that anemic bench never mind the teams brittle resolve.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4957 - 22/07/2011 15:19:23    992152

evveryone, please don't let a WUM destroy every hurling thread by responding to them.

onlyhurling (Galway) - Posts: 800 - 22/07/2011 15:30:23    992168

D'you know what onlyhurling I was about to type a few choice words then I realised who posted that mindless comment and remembered I have a policy of not responding to them, because they're quite frankly boring and irrelevant as far as I'm concerned, and not indicative of the people of Galway such as your good self!

Kenjg80 (Dublin) - Posts: 228 - 22/07/2011 15:54:47    992204

Ban
County: Westmeath
Posts: 31

992055
MesAmis - you could open a chain of fast foods with the amount of chips you seem to have on them shoulders!!

Ironically, times have never been so good for Dublin hurling and you seem so disgruntled. You must have been some dose when the likes of Westmeath were beating you in the Championship..

Cheer up - If Galway got a hold of you now you'd know all about improvement..

Not disgruntled at all my man. Been watching the Dubs hurl for years and am delighted with the current situation. I remember when Westmeath beat us below in Portlaoise in the swamp.

Westmeath were shamefully treated by the GAA and the Leinster council just at the time when they were making a nice bit of progress. Would Clare, Limerick, Wexford or Offaly be left out of their provincial championship for a time?

You seem to think it was fine the way Westmeath were treated but I don't.

MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13833 - 22/07/2011 15:58:20    992207