Thurlesblues its hilarious to see you preach about the great game of hurling and football when youve obviously never held a hurley or as much as kicked a ball in ure life!!! Real GAA stars are a lot more humble than that..... Anyone with 2289 posts on the message board needs to have a chat with himself he's certainly not out 'playing the beautiful game' evry night anyway!!!!!

deisebhoy (Waterford) - Posts: 416 - 20/04/2011 17:33:54    915854

A young kid in Kilkenny will get trained the same skills as a kid in Belfast. However, the kid in Belfact won't be constantly playing competitions, cups, round robin leagues etc. When I was playing under-age back in the dark ages at under 12/14 level, we played:
School competition 5-aside between 5th and 6th classes ground hurling only at lunch times;
Under 12/14 school competition against other schools; both a league and cup competitions;
Street league competition with club based on various local streets within the club being grouped together. Again it was 7 a-side rather than full teams.
Numerous round robin competitions with us hosting and going up to Anderstown, Belfast every year, hosting or going down to Blackrock, Cork every year, and hosting or going up to St Vincent's in Dublin.
Then you had the feile.

I can't remember having the same for gaelic; all I can remember was the school competition. So as a kid we were immersed in playing competitive hurling. This meant that you were forever honing the basic skills in competitive matches. Kids in dual counties probably aren't seeing as much hulring as we did and hence whilst they may have the basic skills, they don't get to hone them as much. Look at Eddie Keher. One of KK's greatest ever hurlers. His family were from roscommon, not exactly a hurling hotbed.

And if you look at the progress Dublin are making, you only have to step back and look at what has been done under-age. That is where the work needs to be done and the rewards come afterwards. Look at Dublin minor level the last 5 years. They have usually been KK's biggest challenge in leinster. My worry is that people like Paudie Butler are no longer being kept on and this will impact hurling development in weaker counties.

Hurling is one part nature, a lot of nurture.

Puddersthecat (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1692 - 21/04/2011 10:39:41    916109

I'm noticing the same now at underage here. As we've 2 clubs hurling in Westmeath, at the start of the season you can see the Westmeath clubs are already much further on than we are because they're been playing all through the "off-season" with their schools whereas there's no hurling in our schools (indoor doesn't count). Our boys play soccer & some play rugby in the off season.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 21/04/2011 10:56:11    916123

Puddersthecat
County: Kilkenny
Posts: 1469
. My worry is that people like Paudie Butler are no longer being kept on and this will impact hurling development in weaker counties.

Is Paudie not being kept on, if this is true it's a discrace, he is doing a fantastic job.

Hurling is one part nature, a lot of nurture. For hurling to be strong in an area I would say it is all nurture. Individual hurlers will have been gifted with individual ability which will be be allowed to flourish though proper nuture to become great players. This individual talent is available in every parish and county, the problem is it only get's the opportunity to flourish in certain areas. The main reason for this is (1) it takes hard work and (2) county boards in general are footbal dominated and don't encourage it.

onlyhurling (Galway) - Posts: 800 - 21/04/2011 11:26:06    916150

onlyhurling, gone:

[url=]http://www.anfearrua.ie/db.asp?a=topicdisplay&tid=1013582&xpos=35

[url=]http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/building-on-solid-foundations-2607465.html

[url=]http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/hurling-minnows-oppose-radical-league-change-2598159.html


Now the last bit hinted at a new role but the position of Director of Hulring has gone. Thanks Christy. It appears from rumours that the Gaelic Football groupies wanted a similar football position so the hurling position was jettisoned. Such a pity as the man did mighty work.

Puddersthecat (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1692 - 21/04/2011 11:52:03    916173

Is Paudie not being kept on, if this is true it's a discrace, he is doing a fantastic job.

As far as I know Paudie resigned??

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 21/04/2011 12:21:17    916192

HAG_AND_CHEESE
County: Tipperary

Is Paudie not being kept on, if this is true it's a discrace, he is doing a fantastic job.

As far as I know Paudie resigned??


I think the 5 year term just ran out, and the position isn't being continued. As far as I can remember, the position was advertised at the time with a salary of 100K, plus expenses. I'd imagine that's now considered to be bit too rich for the GAA's blood. Its a pity, because I think its a job that needs to be continued, although not at that type of salary.
From all reports, Paudie Butler did a fantastic job, on the road constantly, and the work he did quietly was beginning to bear fruit. I've been reading about some of his success stories from the last 5 years, and its really encouraging, he was a real evangelist for the sport. Hopefully the GAA will have a rethink, and re-institute the Hurling Coordinator position is some new incarnation.

Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 21/04/2011 13:01:55    916232

well bag of fleas ,i was talking about dublin underage hurling like you commented about underage foootball in tipperary, sorry for getting you so upset pal .

bogstandard (Wexford) - Posts: 799 - 21/04/2011 13:07:10    916238

Good man Bogstandard.... if you actually read the post I made properly you would see that I was pointing out the quick results tipperary got in regards focusing on football won a u21 title in the space of 3 years also not with the player base dublin would have..... the was a lot longer turnaround for dublin to start getting results at underage and senior nearly 5/6 years after the started major developement of hurling the started winning underage matches so players they focused on at a young age came through the ranks.

Also I see you still ignore the point i made about you contradicting yourself on this thread and also the point that you made that dublin were always competitive in leinster and kilkenny were the only one that beat then sure dublin when a hell of a long time before even meeting kilkenny in leinster and it was only after 2008 that they actually would have competed compeditively with the likes of the traditional counties.

But at least you good at the name calling even if your lacking whats needed to formulate a decent arguement.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 21/04/2011 13:15:16    916252

Marlon_JD:

I heard it second hand so it wasn't true so. Yeah paudie butler is a legend in hurling terms done some great work. I remember him training our club team for a while many moons ago excellent trainer even if I lost my lunch prior to the training sessions on many occasions.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 21/04/2011 13:19:40    916260

Marlon_JD,

Where did you read these success stories? Wouldn't mind reading them meself. I found with him here that he didn't really make contact with the clubs themselves. Everything came through the county board & coaching officers i.e. football people.

€100K is huge money in this day & age, though.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 21/04/2011 13:23:38    916270

twelve teams in leinster six in munster ?????

bogstandard (Wexford) - Posts: 799 - 21/04/2011 13:24:38    916273

keeper7
County: Longford

Marlon_JD,

Where did you read these success stories? Wouldn't mind reading them meself. I found with him here that he didn't really make contact with the clubs themselves. Everything came through the county board & coaching officers i.e. football people.
€100K is huge money in this day & age, though.
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The following stories were in the papers recently (I think Pudders already posted one of them), and there were a few bits on different radio stations last week about the job he'd done, the last one I heard was Damian Lawlor (I think) on Radio 1, and they all seemed to give a fairly glowing report on his tenure. It would be interesting to hear people's impression on the ground level though.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/hurling/paudie-butler-the-hurling-evangelist-151684.html
http://www.independent.ie/sport/hurling/building-on-solid-foundations-2607465.html

Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 21/04/2011 13:58:14    916304

bogstandard:

Don't understand what point your making there to be honest but that nothing new there could you be a little cleared!! What that suppose to mean in the context of your arguement!! There were only 3 strong teams in leinster hurling before dublin got into the mix, and before that the were struggling to beat the weaker teams. It was only in 2005 dublin won a lenister minor title after about 5 years developement the won a leinster u21 under 21 in 2007 after about 7 years developement. And only in 2008 did they beat one of the stronger teams in leinster in the championship.

Look at tipp it's mainly made up of players from south tipperary (and at that a few core clubs) a few north tipp players (north tipp dosen't even have 1 senior football club). Johnny evan took over as minor and u21 football manager in late 2007 and had won a munster u21 title in 2010 after less than 3 years at the helm and a pick of a limited amount of footballers in relation to strong counties like cork and kerry. Also taken over as manager of the seniors he's managed to get 2 promotions in a row in the league, quick results in relation to what dublin have done in hurling over a 7/8 year time frame.

Come here if you going to debate this at least put an arguement together rather than giving a one line comment without explaining what it means.... there a good lad!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 21/04/2011 14:00:34    916308

patrique
County: Antrim
Posts: 12306

Didn't they move Antrim to Leinster a couple of years ago. Even if the hurling doesn't improve the weather might get a bit better with a move like that.

Nick (Wexford) - Posts: 1100 - 21/04/2011 14:13:42    916322

your the one arguing i am only merely asking questions of you hag,cool the jets son .
when did the work start in dublin on hurling

bogstandard (Wexford) - Posts: 799 - 21/04/2011 14:17:32    916328

Thanks for that, Marlon. Will have a look/listen tonight. He's a top class coach, no doubt, but that was my "on the ground" impression.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 21/04/2011 14:46:44    916359

Marlon_JD
County: Tipperary
Posts: 96


I think the 5 year term just ran out, and the position isn't being continued. As far as I can remember, the position was advertised at the time with a salary of 100K, plus expenses. I'd imagine that's now considered to be bit too rich for the GAA's blood. Its a pity, because I think its a job that needs to be continued, although not at that type of salary.

Compared to the money the suits in croke park are on it's actually not, considering all they do is generate more officialdom advocate volunteerism

dhorse (Laois) - Posts: 11374 - 21/04/2011 14:47:27    916360

dhorse
County: Laois
Posts: 7846

Compared to the money the suits in croke park are on it's actually not, considering all they do is generate more officialdom advocate volunteerism

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Yeah, definitely, I'm surprised the hypocrisy isn't pointed out more, it should be. Its very hard to listen to someone who reportedly earns 5 times the industrial wage lecture on payments to managers and a volunteer amateur ethos.

Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 21/04/2011 15:03:50    916369

bogstandard:

You seem to think you annoying me you not I'm actually entertained with your lack of knowledge and lack of reasoning in trying to discuss this.

twelve teams in leinster six in munster ?????

Right I thought this was a discussion about the weaker v stronger counties in ireland and also the developement dublin have put into where they are now as a side topic.

The question you asked well what context is it in. If your talking geographically yes then aye the are 12 counties in leinster and yes 6 counties in munster think we learned that in primary.

How ever there are not 12 counties in the leinster senior hurling championship there are 9 teams (including antrim and galway) and there are 5 teams in the munster senior hurling championship also there are 6 teams in the u21 leinster championship and also 6 teams in the munster u21 football championship so I trying to make out the point you were might be making (?) in its harder to win in leinster than it is in munster because of the amout of teams well there are the same number of teams in both at u21 level...... wonce again you drop a clanger back to the drawing board with ya, you knows nothing amigo!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 21/04/2011 15:04:52    916370