Cavan_Slasher

I have not read the agreement on meal breaks and cannot find any articles on it. Have you a link ?
If you are right then the protest should be called off !!

The entire agreement was distributed to all the union membership when the argeement was entered into, and copies of it have been doing the rounds amongst non-cabin crew Aer Lingus staff as well since the dispute reared it's head. A former colleague now works for for Aer Lingus and was able to show it to us. If you know anyone working in Aer Lingus they should be able to get you a copy, whether they are cabin crew or not.

The bit around the meal breaks was pointed out to us. It's two paragraphs in a pretty large document. The gist of it was that under previous arangements, if staff hadn't een granted the meal break after 4 hours they could down tools and take it, but now they need agreement from their supervisor to ensure that there are enough cabin crew available to passengers at all times. There's provision for complaints to be made against supervisors who don't allow breaks to be taken at reasonable times.

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 25/01/2011 16:45:36    853542

Of course they'll tallk. All disputes are resolved by talking. What I read here is typical of all internet forums. People who are not involved in the dispute spouting as if they were fully appraised of the facts. The simple fact of the matter is that most people only know what they have read in the papers or on the net. Neither of these sources are in the slightest bit reliable or trustworthy. This thread is just another example of people who know very little about an issue clearly demonstrating that particular fact. What is also apparent is that the pathetic Thatcherite, Reaganite right spouting the rhetoric of their failed ideology are out in force. Given what you wrote on the "I Shed a Tear " thread ballboy, I'm surprised you have the neck to appear on these pages again. Come to think of it , for a man who is running a hugely successful and diversified business empire you seem to have an awful lot of free time on your hands. Maybe your underpaid minions are doing it for you.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6180 - 25/01/2011 16:53:26    853545

B & W,

I believe you are right. Most places only give a meal break after 5 hours. I have a nephew in the Garda and he told me that (45mins per 8 hour shift) !!
If that is their only gripe and if provisions are made to cover the meal break then they should get back to work but i find it hard to imagine why a union would sanction industrial action over something they had already signed up to. Maybe there is more to it !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 25/01/2011 17:07:42    853559

Cavan, there is always more to it. We just don't know it unless we are involved in it. News agencies will only tell you what they want you to know.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6180 - 25/01/2011 17:32:24    853584

Question is what aer lingus wants to implement any different to what other airlines implement across the industry??

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 25/01/2011 18:39:13    853684

final warning are being given to these lazy overpaid dinner ladies/ cleaners- this is a great day :)

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 26/01/2011 10:26:42    853973

fair play to micheal o leary for assisting another irish air line in distress and making complet rubbish of the unions areguments of saying its costing 40k a trip - michael take a bow sir you truly are one of the shining lights in this country- his stance on communists is 'dont even acknowledge they exist' this man has done more for the irish economy and the irish people than any politician ever has- he sshould be given the freedom of evert town and city and county in ireland- a true example to us all!!

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 27/01/2011 09:36:02    854692

I dont agree with too much liathroidboy says on these forums but I agree 100% with him on this one. Its nearly as bad as the passport office shower holding the country to ransom last year. WHY WERE THEY NOT FIRED ON THE SPOT instead of all these delays though. Aer Lingus management need to wise up or be walked on by the once powerful but still intimadating unions and their "screw the worker" officials.

georgelee (Louth) - Posts: 523 - 27/01/2011 12:09:30    854793

i hear that management have moved strategy into complete union busting- they fell its the only way to fully secure the future of the organisation and i must say i am 100% delighted with this development! i sincerely hope that the government follows suit and we can save the country from the evil grip of these communists who never created a job bar their own in their lives. Fir play Air Lingus- the bank will be calling these people looking for the mortage to be paid this week - will IMPACT pay it for their members???? Dismissal procedures are in full operation and air lingus are following all protocols and i cant wait until individual take them to court as there is a chance they could lose everything and i would be delighted for them- will IMPACT pay their legal costs when the lose? will IMPACT find them another job? will IMPACT give them a job? I really hpe this is the begining of the end of unions in this country- they ruined it and now want to ensure it remains ruined and there are disgusted that their cosy relationship with the government is now over!

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 27/01/2011 12:26:37    854809

Amidst all your twisted gloating liathroidboy and your gloating is very similar to your twisted gloating in relation to the poor unfortunate family who were faced with the prospects of the bailiff calling, you mentioned the banks. Perhaps you might examine the role of the banks in relation to the ruination of the country. That my friend, is the principal reason this country is on skid row. Unions represent people who work. You exemplify yourself why they are needed. They are needed more than ever to protect people from individuals such as you. If your posts are to be believed and that is a mighty big if, you look upon people as mere chattel who exist to increase through their labours your already colossal fortune. Unions are not always right. Some have been irresponsible in their behaviour in the recent past. What they did however pales into insignificance in comparison to what our captains of industry, our paragons of the financial secteor and our politicians did. So long as there are people like you who advocate unfettered capitalism and the exploitation of people and their work then unions will be a vital component of an equitable society. Having said all that I still believe you are a WUM and a bluffer.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6180 - 27/01/2011 16:43:28    855061

greengrass,

and did you hear liathroidboy's friend Bertie Aherne dissing the woman today live on radio ? A working woman tackled him outside the Dail when he was posing and he stated that she was only after publicity on the radio with her complaints about being taxed to the hilt and paying the U.S.C.. AND he was the one who spent the last 2 days giving interviews !! Yes liathroidboy's hero and bankers friend was a disgrace and he after overseeing the ruination of the country !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 27/01/2011 18:25:21    855170

if there was never a banking problrm we would still be debt to the tune of 20 billion a year - the 3 major spends are health, civil service pay and finally welfare (in no particular order) the unions are 100% to blame for ruining each of these areas- we have a minimum wage in this country therefore absolutely noone is being exploited whatsoever. if there is a problem at work there are laws that cover every aspect of employment therefore there is absolutely no need for unions. these communists have given people a sense of entitlement that their ability in generating money simply does not match.

Bertie was 100% right people got massive wages for the past 10 years and were severly undertaxed- so she doesnt have a leg to stand on- pay your way in life or die off as i couldnt care less about people who dont pay their way and i absolutely despise people on welfare.

As i say more people should emigrate as they are not all they are cracked up to be and they certainly are not the best and brightest people available- when the turnaround comes these positions will not be filled this time round by returning irish- these position will be filled by people with a good work ethic and no sense of entiotlement i.e. German and US employees. Cause even those who are educated in this country think they are something special and in reality they are dwarfed by many other nationalities. The irish joe soap has got ahead of himself and the day of entitlement s gone and im glad- us wealth creators have seen sense to the lazy irish they are worth the minimum wage and nothing more

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 27/01/2011 18:48:52    855202

I'm in not way agreeing with ballboy here, but i don't see the reason for unions in modern business, unions were initially set up to have good and safe working conditions and make sure they have a fair wage..... There is legislation not that ensures this and I can not see in any way how their aer lingus human or working right have been impacted in the changes.....

These rosters and hours as far as i know are industry standard (I could be wrong) so what the blazes is wrond with the they get a fair wage and have a job. If it dosen't suit their lifestyle quit..... Before I was made redundant in my last I was offering to take pay cuts and work longer hours. Maybe they have a bit of Hinesight on the dole queue, simple fact is aer lingus came from being government owner and making a loss which was funded by the government, they are not in a very compeditive market and need to make these cuts to remain compeditive if they don't over the long term no onw will have jobs. It wouldn;t be the first national air line to go under and they don't have the backing of the government money anymore either.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 27/01/2011 18:54:40    855209

herehere HAG well said- the law protects and uions are now for the greedy. there is nothing a union can do that the law cannot- perhaps it would be a good thing if air lingus went bust and a new greenfield unionfree airline was set up- i wonder would any airlingus employees get a job in the new one? why would that be? lazy, entitled and overpaid- no way to run a business but a definate way to ruin one. very few private comapanies have unions and all would get rid of them given the choice- they are simply bad for business and when you consider business is the nly way out of this recession is businnes and it hard to that with unions trying to strangle the economy even more- the deficit is 100% their fault that is unquestionable

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 27/01/2011 19:25:13    855238

Guess what liathroidboy ?? Aer Lingus is now preparing to have discussions with the Impact trade union to end the dispute !!

Well what about that ?? Should have done it earlier !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 27/01/2011 19:28:32    855240

Hag & Cheese,

I agree with you but its too simplistic !! But i believe that had these workers no union they would probably be trampled all over by Aer Lingus !! I don't know the ins and outs of the dispute either but can someone tell me why this company has had so many disputes over the years ? I mean they have had more than many other big companies put together !! Something smells very fishy with Aer Lingus management !! Impact is involved with many other companies that rarely have a dispute !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 27/01/2011 19:34:07    855245

Soory typo:

"they are now in a very compeditive market and need to make these cuts to remain compeditive if they don't over the long term no onw will have jobs."

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 27/01/2011 19:36:27    855252

ICTU should call a NATIONAL STRIKE if these workers are sacked. This is a litmus test for employees and the trade unions.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9818 - 27/01/2011 19:37:40    855255

27/01/2011 19:34:07
Cavan_Slasher
County: Cavan
Posts: 7058

855245 Hag & Cheese,

I agree with you but its too simplistic !! But i believe that had these workers no union they would probably be trampled all over by Aer Lingus !! I don't know the ins and outs of the dispute either but can someone tell me why this company has had so many disputes over the years ? I mean they have had more than many other big companies put together !! Something smells very fishy with Aer Lingus management !! Impact is involved with many other companies that rarely have a dispute !!

_____________________________
€104k average wage for 700 hours work= €150 an hour that is hardly being trampled
Why so many disputes ? - simple
The unions know they can hold the company to ransom because a strike causes disruption
The company is 90% union controlled
The board includes a union leader

Though its disapointing that they are letting IBEC handle the dispute - IBEC are no better than the unions just the other side of the table
Negotiation is for the weak.

Omar.d (Cavan) - Posts: 1141 - 27/01/2011 19:43:35    855263

few last point on unions.... in private sector companies they cover a small number of people so they have a collective voice in the vast majority of the time for a minority in the company thus causing segregation with union and not union within the company that is not healty. Also Irish employee can be a member of a union but irish employers have the right not to recognise this union. Also the way unions are run is a joke they try an collective bargain for everyone that was fine in manual work in the industrial times as everyone had similar jobs. well jobs spec's have diversified now and the wants and needs of workers are different yet they are all bundled in together.

Simple fact is if you think you are being treated unfairly or not getting what your worth treaten to leave and if you are worth it the employer will do all that they can to make you stay.... it's an employers market now simple as, we can no longer name our price.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 27/01/2011 19:44:08    855265