Right now lets see..

Right now let's see...

Cowen is on more money than Obama... His comrades are some of the highest paid politicians in the world…. there's the first salary cut right there!

During the boom our TD's were having votes to raise their wages in the Dail

If there are further wage cuts to be made they should set the example and go back to their Pre-Celtic tiger wages

They talk about cutting people on 8 euro an hour... while the sons of b*t*hes that got us into this mess are some of the highest paid politicians in the feckin world!!

I can only hope that the IMF and ECB/EU plant our politician's feet firmly back into the ground and finally address this outrageous issue…

Sure we also have doctors working in our hospitals that are on 3 times the wage of a doctor found in a similar position in Germany…!!

There is huge money to be saved from making the cuts where they belong… There are many at the top in this country being grossly over paid compared to other EU countries… It's time to reign in such practices.

As I said… make the cuts where they belong!! And finally burst a few bubbles… targeting the lowest paid is disgusting!!

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 22/11/2010 10:59:50    820521

Could not agree more.
If these cuts come in the cost of living needs to be addressed too. Took the two daughters to the doctor the other day, both had flu. Charged €60 for five minutes. Its not just public sector need reining in, the private sector need to rein in the cost of living for the cuts to be sustainable.

Kilanerinfooty (Wexford) - Posts: 200 - 22/11/2010 12:00:53    820569

The Private sector is the one being hit on this one, they cutting min wage, trying to get rid of interst relief on pensions, which will save 3 billion,
I so sick of it, The people in the private sector on Min wage have no union to stand up for them , alot of private sector workers are being forced to work overtime for no pay because if they give out they could lose their jobs. I pay 120 euros into my pension a month I get a tiny amout of tax relief, my pension istn fully funded and will never be, i certainly wont get 2-3 salary, I have a relation in the Navy who was giving out at the weekedn that he pays in €16 euros a week, and he will only get 28,000PA if he retired now , that more than my yearly wage. The Private sector for the last 3 years have taken pay cuts , lost their jobs and now they want to take away pension tax relief from us ,because it will save 3 billion. I say only a tiny percentage of Private sector workers have pensions, most are not fully funded, However Bertie Ahern is on a full pension, All public sector workers get a defined benifit pension , No pay cuts for the public sector since this crisis happen, they ant be fired.Their is no accounabilty in ANY department, massive wastage of money (FAS, HSC,)IF a Gaurd retires or a teacher then they get thier pension plus they can take a job in the private sector while drawing their pension. And they will never be reform in the sector , how can they when asked for reform they refused to give up the 30 mins to cash their cheque despite being paid by Direct Debit.

The unions have alot to answer for as well as the banks, and politian, They pushed through Benchmarking and we the tax payer got nothing for our money, Just infated salaries for all public sector workes, secured pensions for them, yet no accountabilty , and if anything they work slower now than they ever did.
My sister is a nurse in UK, she head sister in charged of ICU, she earned €40K a year, a bloody ordinary staff nurse here just a couple years out of college get that her.
I hope the IMF does half all wages and make the state pensions defined contriubtion not benifit.

yummymummy (Cork) - Posts: 21 - 22/11/2010 12:27:34    820597

yummymummy
My point wasn't that the public sector houldn't be cut, it should, mostly in the form of redundancies imo. I know about private sector pain. I am a self employed tradesman. I am already pinned to the wall. My point is that we have all took pain, yet the cost of essential services has not been pushed down to share the burden. I do realise the public sector has it cushy, mainly office and admin staff, please don't bash guards, nurses, teachers, firemen etc. as MOST do work to the best of their ability in my experience.

Kilanerinfooty (Wexford) - Posts: 200 - 22/11/2010 13:09:18    820632

Your bang on the money there Jimbo no pun intended of course

nacellabeaga (Offaly) - Posts: 700 - 22/11/2010 13:10:59    820635

i cut wages today in my company- the IMF is a great excuse to do this, but i do agree wages are way to high and its the joe soaps wages im on about- porters in hospitals getting €800 a week- get real its a 300 a week job- thank god there are goinmg to be cuts until the lazy irish people start sweating everyday to keep their jobs

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 22/11/2010 15:49:12    820816

Recent ersi survey:

"Workers in the private sector earned an average of €678 weekly, compared to €792 for those in the public sector and €809 for those in commercial semi-state organisations."

I agree there should be redundances in the public sector before pay cuts you to figure out an accurate head count before getting wages sorted.... Why pay 2 people less to do the same job when you can leave 1 person on the same wage to do the job.... they public sector is littered with this and it takes from the area's within the public sector that actually need it!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 16:05:43    820840

liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 545

820816 i cut wages today in my company- the IMF is a great excuse to do this, but i do agree wages are way to high and its the joe soaps wages im on about- porters in hospitals getting €800 a week- get real its a 300 a week job- thank god there are goinmg to be cuts until the lazy irish people start sweating everyday to keep their jobs
--------------------
Your paper round not as lucrative these days liathroidboy?

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 22/11/2010 16:09:15    820844

22/11/2010 16:09:15
brendtheredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 2841

820844 liathroidboy
County: Mayo
Posts: 545

820816 i cut wages today in my company- the IMF is a great excuse to do this,
__________
Do you run a chicken Ranch in Merrion Square ?

Omar.d (Cavan) - Posts: 1141 - 22/11/2010 16:20:30    820854

HAG_AND_CHEESE
County: Tipperary
Posts: 3817

820840 Recent ersi survey:

"Workers in the private sector earned an average of €678 weekly, compared to €792 for those in the public sector and €809 for those in commercial semi-state organisations."


Its a pity the public sector doesn't have hundreds of thousands of minimum wage positions to bring that average down.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12484 - 22/11/2010 16:33:56    820876

no im actually doing very well- profits are down like everywhere so as i like to maximise my return i squeeze as much as i can out of my staff to maintain my margin of takehome - i should not suffer why should i when i can get more for less out of people i would be foolish to do so. a few sleepless night and my staff will all have a new motivation- the carrot never works all it does is breeds a sense of entitlement- constantly remind people where the door is and that they are nothing but a number is the best motivation you need- that and investigating their background as you have more leeway with some with a big mortgage than say some with no ties. those also with young children are easily squeezed- survival of the fittest for the minnions i say

liathroidboy (Mayo) - Posts: 4921 - 22/11/2010 16:43:07    820885

Its a pity the public sector doesn't have hundreds of thousands of minimum wage positions to bring that average down.

Yet they benchedmarked themselves against wages of people who made millions in the .com boom in the early 00's if they bench..... maybe they should be more on minimum wages and what about the level upon levels of high paid managers..... exec's and top managers would account for a some of the average in the private sector which in fairness they own the companies they can take what they want. Also there been hundreds of thousands of redundancies in the private sector which may effect the average wage you'd think that would lower it but if could also push up the average!!! But what am i talking about the public sector dosen't know much about redundancies YET!!!

I'd like to see an ERSI surey on a comparison of jobs describtion and spec and see a wage comparison then... it was higher for public sector on average before the recession god knows what it looks like now.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 17:00:20    820902

Hag,

Many people in the Private Sector are very poorly educated unlike those in the Public Sector who at least have Leaving Certs (many have much higher) !! Do you think we should " un-educate " ourselves too ?

Now i am not running down these people but many are ordinary factory workers with little education but do you think they should earn the same as someone with a degree or even a diploma ?

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 22/11/2010 17:56:17    820954

Many people in the Private Sector are very poorly educated

And many aren't..... the private sector takes just as many college graduates as the public sector.... granted much of the manual work dose not require college degrees but a lot of it dose.... your generalising again!! Also dose civil servants for example require a college degree and of the older generation the in the public sector how many of these have a college eduation.

On a further point as you say there are an eduacted workforce in the public sector well why are they put doing jobs with no multitasking and levels upon levels of managers an eduacted workforce should lead to less employees and a flatter structure!!!

Also you are constantly on about comparing average industrial wage to public sector wage we'll here's a article from jobs.ie telling different from 2006 and i think i could safely say there hasn't been much improvement in the industrial wage in the mean time

http://irishjobs.ie/ForumWW/WWIndividualArticle.aspx?ParentID=67&CID=164&ForumTypeID=2333

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 18:13:13    820973

Slasher:

also there a lot of the average industrail wage that is proped up by overtime where so there a lot of those earning to do with extra hours!! Outside of frontline services medical security etc. do the other area's work much more than 39 hours a week??

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 18:30:57    820993

Hag,

I have a nephew who is a garda and he showed me his wage slip and it is nowhere near that figure even before tax. It was not that high even before their cuts and levies. I don't know how they work out those figures but they must divide all the wages they pay by the amount of people in the entire job to get an average. Do they count overtime ? Some areas get overtime and in other areas they do not. After 5 years in the job his take home pay was just over 440 euro and he has a wife, child and mortgage !!

Maybe you could explain how they come up with these figures !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 22/11/2010 18:33:24    820997

hag,

Also the Public sector require a minimum of a leaving cert but try and get in now without some kind of degree and you will find it very hard !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 22/11/2010 18:35:12    821001

Cavan_Slasher:

I've have a masters shortly and I can't get a job in the private sector...

Also what about the older heads in the public sector is there degree's left right and center there aswell!!!

Slasher In fairness even in the boom times you'd find it hard to get a any job without a leavving cert...... I very very small amout would!! Massive generalisation yet again!!

I don't know how they work out those figures but they must divide all the wages they pay by the amount of people in the entire job to get an average. Do they count overtime ?

Yes that is the way they do it and that is the way they do it for the average industrial wage too!! Did you happen to get a glance at deductions and how would it look when the pension was taken into it??? Something that the private sector fund themselves....

But 440 is low but it gose to proove that there are sectors within the public sector that are wasting the money be it too highly paid or employed where they are not needed if the dead weight was gotten ride of funds could be used better.... this includes managers but also many of the lower paid staff also!! How's the reform in the public sector going because in fairnes you don't hear much about it!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 18:49:01    821015

Also slasher you mentioned the Gardai there overtime within the gardai is something like 80 million a year.... there was a case a few years ago where a manager in the department of social protection managed to get something like 195,000 euro on overtime

And sure what about the 5 mayo gardai who claimed €325,111 in a year looking after the corrib gas field!!! One lad claimed something like 80,000!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 19:00:30    821020

Here a brake down of garda wages!!! Granted many do deserve it.

But the starting wage in the gardai is more or less the same as a college graduate right??

"Starting Salary
Gardaí begin on a pay scale around €26,000 but this can quickly progress both with service and through promotion up the ranks. Also, Garda pay is boosted by weekly allowances for uniform, mileage, night and Sunday shifts and most members of the force will have the potential to earn significant sums through good overtime pay. One garda in Dublin earned €45,000 in overtime alone in 2005. Ambitious recruits with their eyes on the top job can look forward to a salary in the region of €230,000 as Garda Commissioner - though this remuneration is bound to have risen significantly by the time they reach the post.

€26,000 - €230,000"

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 22/11/2010 19:07:10    821026