3inarow08
County: Kerry
Posts: 2441

Fully agree with you on Starting Strength, its a brilliant programme. 6 months of starting strength + good diet and you will have serious overall strength gains. Not sure if its suited for gaelic football, I know its used in many other sports like American Football. But definately better than doing some randam weightmachine programme given by a gym instructor.

Lebowski (Meath) - Posts: 363 - 23/11/2010 14:01:12    821417

3inarow, there are numerous reasons why someone would squat light weights for up to 20 reps. The basic idea behind low weights high reps, is to increase strength endurance. Would this be applicable to a "GAA head"? Do you know what his training age was? Would he be working on technique by any chance?
Do you know anything about his injury history? Maybe he was rehabing an injury.

Con (Louth) - Posts: 511 - 23/11/2010 16:35:11    821532

I would highly recommend for anybody interested in following sound functional training programmes that they look at Power Training by Robert Dos Remedios and Build for Show by Nate Green. Both books are superb.

Tony, just a thought but maybe your lack of fitness was due to you possibly not giving your body enough time to recover.I cant stress enough the importance of recovery between sessions, and this is the area were most GAA boys lack in and think more is better. Also, you are doing close to ten exercises per session and in my opinion this is too much for a single session. 40 mintues for hard work is what should be the requirement of GAA players in the gym, get in and get out. I like to periodise my athletes training, I usually work in 12 week blocks and switch it up every 6 weeks. For example my winter programme would alternate between upper body and lower body workouts. We will use undulating periodisation were you will alternate between set and rep ranges of 4x8, 5x5, 3x12. During the Spring and summer month we would switch to full body workouts and the set and rep ranges would be alternated again.

FitnessGuru (Cavan) - Posts: 20 - 23/11/2010 19:32:10    821736

Con
County: Louth
Posts: 380

3inarow, there are numerous reasons why someone would squat light weights for up to 20 reps. The basic idea behind low weights high reps, is to increase strength endurance. Would this be applicable to a "GAA head"? Do you know what his training age was? Would he be working on technique by any chance?
Do you know anything about his injury history? Maybe he was rehabing an injury.
_____________________________

My lengthy reply wasn't posted last night Con, but here it is in a nutshell. Hopefully this gets posted.

You are believing in the myth that low weight x high reps = increased endurance. Heavy weight, with reduced recovery time in between sets, to failure is the only effective method for increasing muscle/strength endurance. Think about it. And do some research on it.

And the lad had several months training behind him, was not injured or recovering from an injury and was doing these sets as his work sets. Maybe because he wrongly believed that he was increasing his endurance. You're not his trainer by any chance???

3inarow08 (Kerry) - Posts: 2455 - 24/11/2010 16:00:54    822121

Ok 3inarow, you got me on the strength endurance, my mistake, I meant to say muscular endurance which are two very different things.

Con (Louth) - Posts: 511 - 24/11/2010 16:44:00    822155

Where the problem lies in my opinion is that the GAA especially the club scene do not understand the training methods they are implementing. I would have reservations about the average club coach knowing the difference between Strength Training and Power Development. I have seen SAQ Ladders and Hurdles used and I often get the impression that coaches think they must use them because the local rivals etc are using them but does the coach know why he is using them for what purpose and if you asked a coach to justify their use and the goal of the training they probably couldn't tell you in the most part.

I also would like to see the GAA bring in a structured Long Term Player Development pathway similar to the IRFU and we also need to educate coaches in the areas of periodization of training which would be very helpful in the battle to beat player burnout.

sportinguru (Dublin) - Posts: 7 - 24/11/2010 17:16:49    822180

I play(ed) alot of different sports including Football over the years and while i don`t have any qualifications in Sports Science etc.. i intensively research stength and condtioning programmes for all sports i play and consider myself fairly knowlegable.

It is my experience that GAA is behind other sports when it comes to S&C due to many factors. GAA is an old school sport and attitudes in my opinion are slow to change. DMAC commented that players looked over weight cause they worked out too much. this to me is sheer ignorance and typical of many comments i have heard over the years coming from people within the gaa circle. comments like, weights will slow you down and put on weight. yes they will make you look bigger but no there are not going to slow you and make you more injury prone or many other ridicolous comments i have heard over the years. The same training routines persist year in year out and not just in my club but in clubs of players i have questioned - doing long distance runs, poor warmups and pretty much non existent cool downs etc... granted in the last few years, and i pretty much talkin at club level, attitudes have started to change and clubs are trying to evolve a bit and diverse in more S&C orientated training pre season.
but the lack of knowledge amazes me. and this in my opinion is the fault of the gaa, not the ordinary club managertrainer who in their defence are trying. no research is done and if it is, it is not published and made available to those who need it. i remember googling gaa preseason training videos a few years back and on the gaa website was a guy throwing a ball against a wall and trying to catch it. the same video featured a guy shouldering a wall and that is no lie and was on the gaa website. google the same thing for any other sport and thousand of pages of videos come up.
as it is, it guys like us on here trying to come with what we think is the best for gaa players when it comes to S&C and while it is guys players will always be mis informed and train incorrect.
the only thing that pretty much we have established in the last years few years is that interval training is king and `core`is a buzzword flying around most gaa clubs this time of the year.
but i have witness some core exercises and my god, if gaa players ( at club level) have any aspirations to become good athletes ( and i`m not saying footballers - that comes with other training) then it will never happen. i`m been to zumba dance classes which have been harder. it seems some clubs are doing it only cause they think they should be doing it and not because they actually no how.
but as i said S&C | off season training is guys like me giving their two pence ( i think thats the phrase), but here`s mine.
Core is the word, interval is king (but thats for more pre season), but as the topic is aboput s&C then explosivenes and compound lifting should be on everyones lips this winter in the gym. i have never seen a gaa player in the gym snatch,clean and jerk or any variation of this and it is probably conceived as a weightlifting exercise for the olympics. very few put emphasis on squats and if they do they don`t do them right. and please don`t do leg exercises on machines. do you kick a ball sitting down´. all exercises can be done away from machines, at the end of the day you should be the machine

S15 (Mayo) - Posts: 26 - 24/11/2010 17:28:03    822187

Con, no problem.

Sportinguru and S15, great posts. I agree wholeheartedly with everything ye said.

3inarow08 (Kerry) - Posts: 2455 - 24/11/2010 17:54:16    822204

Just to let you know that the GAA is now funding research. Research is taking place looking at fitness norms for kids and adults and also at GAA specific training methods and hydration and nutrition specific to GAA sports. However, as anyone with research experience knows it takes time for this research to get published, but it has started.

Con (Louth) - Posts: 511 - 24/11/2010 19:22:41    822284

In my opinion a rounded S&C programme for a GAA player should look like this;

1.Explosive exercises- clean, snatch, squat jump.
2.Knee Dominant- Squat, Bulgarian Split Squat, Lunges, Stepups
3. Hip Dominant- Deadlift, Good Mornings, Swiss Ball Hip Extension
4. Horizontal & Vertical Pushing and Pulling exercises
5. Rotational Exercises
6. Core Exercises


Both done in Bi Lateral and Uni Lateral. This is just an idea of what an overview of a good programme may look like. Exercise selection, sets and reps will depend what time of the year you are in.

FitnessGuru (Cavan) - Posts: 20 - 24/11/2010 20:49:29    822364