KerryKerry wouldn't that be some laugh if Down come to Croker on Sunday all set up to deal with the Cork handpassing/running game and then Cork start hoofing long high balls into Goulding, Sheehan and C.O'Neill. If that was to happen then I would reckon our chances would be much better and Counihan could be deemed as some sort of tactical genius, however I don't feel its in him. I would be of the opinion that a certain amount of hand passing is necessary up to around half way but from here on who ever has the ball needs to look up- if someone inside has made the run then pick them out- if not drill a ball that can be caught at a leap between the 21-13 metre line, leaving Sheehan inside for this purpose alone. Cork have been over complicating things and should keep it nice and simple remembering that they are bigger, stronger and faster they should hold most of the aces. Limit Clarke and Coulter then at the back by deploying Cadogan and Shields to mark them and we should be in a good position.

tj09 (Cork) - Posts: 481 - 13/09/2010 15:44:09    773092

Cork by 10 points. The easiest All ireland we will ever win.

PROC_Hurler (Cork) - Posts: 203 - 13/09/2010 17:05:50    773238

PROC_Hurler
County: Cork
Posts: 152

773238 Cork by 10 points. The easiest All ireland we will ever win.


Agreed. We haven't got a hope, are just making up the numbers, and might as well not turn up. Cork by at least ten.

Gabriel. (Down) - Posts: 412 - 13/09/2010 17:57:54    773341

Fair play Gabriel - (s)he's always posting drivel! Hope it'll be a cracker....and I'd say no amount of stewards or that orange plastic will stop the fans of whoever wins....I think they should let the fans in once the players and management get up on the Hogan....anyway, Rebels abú!!

choctaw (Cork) - Posts: 274 - 13/09/2010 20:33:33    773542

tj09
County: Cork
Posts: 299

773092 KerryKerry wouldn't that be some laugh if Down come to Croker on Sunday all set up to deal with the Cork handpassing/running game and then Cork start hoofing long high balls into Goulding, Sheehan and C.O'Neill. If that was to happen then I would reckon our chances would be much better and Counihan could be deemed as some sort of tactical genius, however I don't feel its in him. I would be of the opinion that a certain amount of hand passing is necessary up to around half way but from here on who ever has the ball needs to look up- if someone inside has made the run then pick them out- if not drill a ball that can be caught at a leap between the 21-13 metre line, leaving Sheehan inside for this purpose alone. Cork have been over complicating things and should keep it nice and simple remembering that they are bigger, stronger and faster they should hold most of the aces. Limit Clarke and Coulter then at the back by deploying Cadogan and Shields to mark them and we should be in a good position.


Any chance you could have a word with Conor, subtle like, so he thinks its his idea??

kerrykerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1779 - 14/09/2010 11:16:41    773870

2:1 for Down amongst the Newstalk panellists last night. The usual story about basis for that opinion.

There seems to be some rules for what you are allowed to consider when judging Down's chances next Sunday:
- Their great free-scoring forwards who demolished Kerry and Kildare
- The positive aspects of the game against Kildare (i.e. above free scoring forwards and midfield domination)
- Their historical record in AI finals i.e. their 'pedigree' and the fact that they are aristocrats of football (thanks Corxxx for that one)
What you are not allowed to consider when judging Down's chances:
- Performance over recent seasons, particularly 2009 and including their last visit to Croke park before this year - a handy beating by Wexford in '08
- Their poor performances earlier this season against Donegal and Tyrone
- The fact that their momentum against Kildare was built on a goal that shouldn't have been given, aided by a point for Kildare that was waved wide
- The fact that they (their defence in particular) faded in the closing stages of the Kildare game and left Kildare get back into the game, needing the crossbar to save them at the very end. They also didn't seem to have any serious impact subs to introduce to stem the tide at this stage of the game.

What you are allowed to consider when judging Cork's chances:
- Their 'choking' performances over recent seasons against Kerry in Croke park
- The narrow margin by which they won they won the semi-final against Dublin
- Their puke football handpassing game
- The fact that they haven't a settled starting XV this year
What you are not allowed to consider when judging Cork's chances:
- Their performances against all opponents other than Kerry in Croke park over the last five seasons
- The fact that they are league champions
- Their performance in the closing stages of their last two matches where they closed out / won the game in the last 20 minutes
- The depth of their squad, especially around midfield, but also at the back
- Solidity at the back - conceded three goals in this year's championship (Down have conceded 6 in the same number of games)

hurling_lad (Cork) - Posts: 69 - 14/09/2010 12:06:53    773934

hurling lad one of the best posts on here in a long long time.

the media pedigree and history count for little especially at 330pm next sunday. i cant see anything other than a cork win. i think they have six better forwards than down and they have a better back three and keeper. down will need to win a lot of break ball and primary midfield possession cant see that happening as corks middle eight are too big and too strong. the down fullbackline are shocking and i expect them to receive a serious pounding on sunday. cork by 4. MCMLX NO

reddoctor (Tyrone) - Posts: 1241 - 14/09/2010 12:25:59    773959

Yes hurling lad i do think you are right in what your saying however this is playing right into our hands. This over confidence or hyping up of the down performances may seep into the down players heads, hopefully they will concentrate on playing their own style and not focus too much on counteracting the Cork game plan. Cork have been stifled by teams who try to stop us, teams that have come out and try to play their own game have generally suited us.

tj09 (Cork) - Posts: 481 - 14/09/2010 12:33:23    773970

Trust me when i say, Down are NOT being over hyped one bit at all. Cork are 4/7, Down are 15/8. Cork are over whelming favourites, and they know they are under massive pressure to perform, especially when their supporters expect them to win comfortably, going by the majority of posts on here. We'll do our talking on the pitch, like we did against Kerry and Kildare. There is no hype over Down up here in the north, we all know how massive the task is ahead of us. Ireland EXPECTS Cork to put in a massive performance and win, for us, well we never even expected to get this far, we're in bonus territory and we're going to enjoy every minute of it.

MourneArmy (Down) - Posts: 1787 - 14/09/2010 13:27:55    774042

question 1

whens was the last time dats cork played well?

ands question 2

I also reads dat...
"Pat Spillane once summing up Cork so well saying that they were a load of chancers lacking in skill but blessed with luck. I feel that the latter statement is so relevant today as the rebels progression has been largely down to luck and not on any kind of outstanding memorable performances."

is tis true?

The_Lug_Coa (Fermanagh) - Posts: 406 - 14/09/2010 17:43:06    774364

Is that not even more impressive that they are able to win without even playing well, can you image what they can do if they get a performance in!! Hope they play well at least then we can have no complaints.

tj09 (Cork) - Posts: 481 - 14/09/2010 18:22:15    774416

I don't know how good McCartan is as a tactician but from form I have only once been impressed with Conor Counihans tactician skills and that's the semi final game against Tyrone last year. Why wouldn't a team focus on counteracting the usual "Cork game plan." As tj09 said " Cork have been stifled by teams who try to stop Cork"...both Kerry and Limerick have done it to Cork, most notably last year's Munster final and AI final. Surely, Conor has learnt from that and has a plan B this time.

Down have a multi-skill type of performance, are capable of different methods of play and are confidence -this can count for something on the day of an All Ireland. However, they don't have the experience, they definitely allowed Kildare back into the game as hurling_lad states and don't have the depth of panel to match Cork to use as subs.

I can't see why Cork can't operate different methods of play as tactically needed and be confident-they certainly have players of talent that have demonstrated these skills in club matches in Cork.

The_Lug_Coa; I am not familiar with Spillane's comments but I wouldn't agree with that at all. Since 2005, only one team has beaten them in the championship and they have been in the business end for more or less a decade-that's not just LUCK. As for no outstanding performances, they were awesome with 14 men against Tyrone last year.

kerrykerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1779 - 14/09/2010 20:31:19    774541

"Pat Spillane once summing up Cork so well said that they were a load of chancers lacking in skill but blessed with luck"

Come Sunday evening will Pat Spillane be correct?

Cavan_gael (Cavan) - Posts: 100 - 14/09/2010 21:59:42    774653

I thought you threw that bait out before. Did no one bite?

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 15/09/2010 08:35:14    774667

Down to win. Cork aint playing well enough.

sponger (Wicklow) - Posts: 3010 - 15/09/2010 11:32:47    774805

I see the RTE poll is very close...

Cork 50.97% (12,402 votes)
Down 49.03% (11,929 votes)
Total Votes: 24,331

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 15/09/2010 21:48:36    775589

Cork v Down All-Ireland Football Final 2010

Preview
Ambrose Rogers(Down) Graham Canty(Cork) are the biggest doubts to start the final in what has been a fascinating season on the GAA All-Ireland hurling and football final circuit and there's one more big day to come when Cork and Down clash in the GAA Football All-Ireland Senior Championship Final in Croke Park on Sunday (3.30).

It will be a first ever All-Ireland final meeting between Cork and Down - indeed they have only met once before in the championship back in 1994 when Down won a semi-final by five points.

Cork are seeking their 7th All-Ireland senior title - and their first since 1990 -while Down are seeking their 6th and their first since 1994. Down have the distinction of having won all five finals they reached in 1960-61-68-91-94.
Cork have appeared in four finals since winning their last one in 1990 but lost in 1993-99-2007-2009.

Paths to the final

Cork
Cork 0-15 Kerry 0-15 (Munster semi-final)
Kerry 1-15 Cork 1-14 (After extra-time) Replay
Cork 1-19 Cavan 0-4 (Qualifier - Round 2)
Cork 0-12 Wexford 0-5 (Qualifier - Round 3)
Cork 0-16 Limerick 1-11 (Qualifier - Round 4) After extra-time
Cork 1-16 Roscommon 0-10 (All-Ireland quarter-final)
Cork 1-15 Dublin 1-14 (All-Ireland semi-final)
Played 7, Won 5, Drew 1, Lost 1.
Average For: 1-14; Average Against: 0-12

Cork Scorers
Daniel Goulding……………..1-34 (0-24 frees, 0-2 '45s')
Donncha O'Connor…………1-16 (0-9 frees, 0-1 penalty)
Paddy Kelly…………………….0-12 (0-6 frees)
Ciaran Sheehan………………..0-9
Pearse O'Neill………………….2-3
Colm O'Neill…………………..0-8 (0-1 free)
Paul Kerrigan…………………..0-6
Paudie Kissane…………………0-3
Aidan Walsh……………………0-3
Derek Kavanagh……………..0-3
Graham Canty…………………0-2
Alan O'Connor………………..0-2
Fintan Goold………………….0-2
Michael Shields………………0-1

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 15/09/2010 21:58:48    775613

Noel O'Leary………………….0-1
John Hayes……………………0-1 (free)
John Miskella…………………0-1

Down
Down 1-15 Donegal 2-10 (Ulster quarter-final) After extra-time
Tyrone 0-14 Down 0-10 (Ulster semi-final)
Down 1-14 Longford 1-11 (Qualifier Round 2)
Down 1-12 Offaly 1-10 (Qualifier Round 3)
Down 3-20 Sligo 0-10 (Qualifier Round 4)
Down 1-16 Kerry 1-10 (All-Ireland quarter-final)
Down 1-16 Kildare 1-14 (All-Ireland semi-final)
Played 7, Won 6, Lost 1.
Average For: 1-16; Average Against: 1-11

Scorers
Martin Clarke……..1-27 (1-0 penalty, 0-14 frees, 0-4 '45')
Mark Poland……….1-18 (0-13 frees)
Benny Coulter…….2-11
Daniel Hughes…….0-14
Ronan Murtagh……1-7
John Clarke…………1-5
Ambrose Rodgers….1-5 (0-1 '45')
Paul McComiskey..0-5 (0-1 free)
Aidan Carr………….1-0
Peter Fitzpatrick…..0-3
Kevin McKernan….0-3
Conor Maginn………0-2
Conor Garvey………0-1
Dan Gordon…………0-1
Declan Rooney……..0-1

Cork in All-Ireland Finals
2009: Kerry 0-16 Cork 1-9
2007: Kerry 3-13 Cork 1-9
1999: Meath 1-11 Cork 1-8
1993: Derry 1-14 Cork 2-8
1990: Cork 0-11 Meath 0-9
1989: Cork 0-17 Mayo 1-11
1988: Meath 0-13 Cork 0-12 (Replay)
1988: Meath 0-12 Cork 1-9 (Draw)
1987: Meath 1-14 Cork 0-11
1973: Cork 3-17 Galway 2-13
1967: Meath 1-9 Cork 0-9
1957: Louth 1-9 Cork 1-7
1956: Galway 2-13 Cork 3-7

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 15/09/2010 21:59:35    775615

1945: Cork 2-7 Cavan 0-7
1911: Cork 6-6 Antrim 1-2
1907: Dublin 0-6 Cork 0-2
1906: Dublin 0-5 Cork 0-4
1899: Dublin 1-10 Cork 0-6
1897: Dublin 2-6 Cork 0-2
1894: Dublin 0-5 Cork 1-2 (Match unfinished)
1894: Dublin 0-6 Cork 1-1 (Draw) Goal equalled five points
1893: Wexford 1-1 Cork 0-1
1891: Dublin 2-1 Cork 1-9 (Goal outweighed any number of points)
1890: Cork 2-4 Wexford 0-1
Played 24; Won 6, Drew 2, Lost 15, Unfinished 1
.
Down in All-Ireland Finals
1960: Down 2-10 Kerry 0-8
1961: Down 3-6 Offaly 2-8
1968: Down 2-12 Kerry 1-13
1991: Down 1-16 Meath 1-14
1994: Down 1-12 Dublin 0-13
Played 5, Won 5.

Previous Championship Meeting
Cork and Down have only met on one occasion in championship history. That was in 1994 when Down won by 1-13 to 0-11 prior to beating Dublin in the final.
The semi-final teams were:
Down: Neil Collins; Michael Magill, Brian Burns, Paul Higgins; Eamon Burns,
Barry Breen, DJ Kane; Gregory McCartan, Conor Deegan; Ross Carr, Greg
Blaney, James McCartan; Mickey Linden, Aidan Farrell, Gary Mason.
Cork: John Kerins; Mark Farr, Mark O'Connor, Niall Cahalane; Brian Corcoran,
Stephen O'Brien, Tony Davis; Shea Fahy, Danny Culloty; Stephen Calnan,
Larry Tompkins, Don Davis; Colin Corkery, Joe Kavanagh, Paul McGrath.

Top Scorers 2010 Championship
Kildare's John Doyle looks certain to top the scoring lists for the 2010 GAA Football All-Ireland Senior Championships. He scored 1-49 (52 points), one point ahead of Bernard Brogan (Dublin) on 3-32 (51 points).
The top scorers from Cork and Down, Daniel Goulding and Martin Clarke have a chance to close the gap next Sunday but are 15 and 22 points respectively behind Doyle.

The top ten are as follows:
1. John Doyle (Kildare)………….1-49 (52)
2. Bernard Brogan (Dublin)…….3-42 (51)
3. Daniel Goulding (Cork)………1-34 (37)
4. Donal Shine (Roscommon)….1-31 (34)
5. Martin Clarke (Down)…………1-27 (30)
- Colm Cooper (Kerry)……………1-27 (30)

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 15/09/2010 21:59:56    775616

7. Cian Ward (Meath)……………..2-23 (29)
8. Padraic Joyce (Galway)……….1-25 (28)
9. Joe Sheridan (Meath)…………..5-11 (26)
10. Bryan Sheehan (Kerry)………2-19 (25)

GAA Football All-Ireland Senior Championship Roll of Honour
Will Cork win their 7th All-Ireland title and join Meath in joint fourth place on the
roll of honour or will Down win their 6th title and join Cork in joint fifth place?
36 - Kerry (1903-04-09-13-14-24-26-29-30-31-32-37-39-40-41-46-53-55-59-
62-69-70-75-78-79-80-81-84-85-86-97-2000-2004-2006-2007-2009)
22 - Dublin (1891-92-97-98-99-1901-02-06-07-08-21-22-23-42-58-63-74-76-
77-83-95)
9 - Galway (1925-34-38-56-64-65-66-98-2001)
7 - Meath (1949-54-67-87-88-96-99)
6 - CORK (1890-1911-45-73-89-90)
5 - DOWN (1960-61-68-91-94)
5 - Cavan (1933-35-47-48-52)
5 - Wexford (1893-1915-16-17-18)
4 - Kildare (1905-19-27-28)
4- Tipperary (1889-95-1900-1920)
3 - Louth (1910-12-57)
3 - Mayo (1936-50-51)
3 - Offaly (1971-72-82)
3- Tyrone (2003-2005-2008)
2 - Limerick (1887-1896)
2 - Roscommon (1943-44)
1 - Armagh (2002)

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 15/09/2010 22:00:17    775617