plunkett.
i would imagine he was refering to the mindset of a rogue republican , who clearly was not happy with the leadership , that would be one angle on it.
but that was by no means the thoughts of omagh himself , but u already know that this going on out there , but u decide to slice and dice omagh post, and make out that this was his self belief / intentions ..... u do try it on some times , but gladly people are wise to it.

ta32 (Tyrone) - Posts: 4907 - 15/07/2010 21:53:29    711053

Give us back those poor 6 counties...for I love them with all my heart

gaamad1996 (Wexford) - Posts: 439 - 17/07/2010 11:39:46    712180

A few posts on this thread make me feel queazy to be honest.


There are people on here castigating people from Ardoyne and other working class republican Belfast areas as scum, criminals and hoods, people from places like Galway and rural East Tyrone. While I do admit that some of these lads that were on the street may be engaged in criminality I think it is a joke for anyone from outside Ardoyne to pass comment on it. You sitting in you house in Galway really do have no idea about what it is like to be born and reared in a place like Ardoyne. The violence, fear and intimidation this collection of 20 or so streets have faced on a daily basis for the last 40 years would make the meekest of men angry. I know it isnt all one way and they often give as good as they recieve but believe you me the violence in that part of town is endemic, ingrained and mutual. Thats the way it is and you can say 'they should just let them through,,,, blah blah blah' all you want but why should they let them through. If people from your neighbouring town despised you so much to the point that they attacked your daughters going to primary school not that long ago would you let them through your village even for a minute. If one of the bands that marched through your sleepy little main street in East Tyrone was named after a loyalist who murdered a man coming home from your local pub would you be ok to let them through Mr Pomeroy Plunkett? I know people from your town who wouldnt even consider that for a second.

I'm from Ardboe but have worked, lived and played football in North Belfast in the past. These lads in places like Ardoyne, the New Lodge, Ligoneill, Bawnmore, the Antrim Road and Carrickhill have experienced nothing that you will be able to fathom, ever. Before I went to that part of town I had my prejudices about people from the city. Some of them were right and there is a bad element in North Belfast, like anywhere however there are some fantastic people and to be honest more there than in most places I have been. What i have seen is that sometimes they are not prepared to turn the other cheek, even the gentlemen amongst them, and to be honest i dont blame them.

Dont you dare associated this latest outbreak directly with Ardoyne, especially as you wouldnt do it to their faces.

CheFinny (UK) - Posts: 1358 - 19/07/2010 10:30:10    713889

5 years ago an Orange rally took place in Pomeroy. We ignored them, they done whatever it is that they do and then they packed up and left. We didn't destroy our own village, we didn't riot for 3 nights, there was absolutely no violence. Personally I think that's the right way to do it. If you condone the actions of these thugs and hoods that's up to you

pplocal (Tyrone) - Posts: 5878 - 19/07/2010 18:37:01    715112

Plunkett

I would respectfully suggest you read the man's post again, some important points seem to have been overlooked on your part.

Educate, invest, ban the Orange marches and give these young people hope.

artisan (Down) - Posts: 1794 - 19/07/2010 18:53:15    715138

Everyone on this website would agree that they should be banned from Nationalist areas. However rioting and shooting at the Police isn't going to achieve this. If you look at this rationally and without the hatred of the Orange Order you would see there's a right and a wrong way to go about this. Rioting is going to achieve absolutely nothing. Like it or not the Orange Order is here to stay for the foreseeable future and it's only a matter of time before someone gets killed and that could be the catalyst that drags us right back into violence

pplocal (Tyrone) - Posts: 5878 - 19/07/2010 19:05:30    715158

It's a difficult one which is going to be hard to sort out. There is NO doubt that the Parades Commission is making a serious mistake in allowing EVERY Orange/Loyalist parade to go through Ardoyne and the Crumlin Road. There is a belief in North Belfast that Ardoyne has been traded off for the Garvaghy & Ormeau Roads and no amount of protests or sit downs will change this and that is wrong. This is not just about 5 or 10 mins, Ardoyne is virtually locked down for the entire day by the PSNI while the Unionist marching season lasts from April through to August so it is NOT just ONE day. There is the Tour of the North and Woodvale parades among countless others which affect the daily life for residents in places like Ardoyne, Carrick Hill, New Lodge, Bawnmore, Ligoniel etc. Sinn Fein and the SDLP have condemned the Parades Commission for ignoring their own rules in allowing these marches as those involved break every rule the Parade Commission imposes.
There is a strong Loyalist paramilitary element in many of the Orange Lodges, there are banners commemorating Loyalists who have been involved in killing Catholics (the most famous being UVF man Brian Robinson who was killed by undercover British agents minutes after murdering an innocent Catholic at Ardoyne shops in 1989. NB TO MODS - THIS IS ALL ON PUBLIC RECORD). Catholic houses are routinely attacked at this time of year while the number of assaults and violence shoots right up. Furthermore it is nonsense to say that the Crumlin Road is the only way into Belfast city centre, that is wrong. These marches could go down through Woodvale and the Shankill and on in to the town where they wouldn't pass any Catholic homes but the Loyal Orders insist that they MUST parade past Catholics so people can draw their own conclusions there. Furthermore I am also convinced that we are also seeing the legacy of the Holy Cross dispute of 2001 here. Many young minds were poisoned after they witnessed their sisters and relatives attacked and threatened by Loyalists in that infamous event and community relations in North Belfast were killed stone dead; they have never recovered. We are seeing far more sectarianism in young Catholics now and sinsiter elements taking advantage of this.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9818 - 19/07/2010 19:29:16    715216

Pomeroy someone eluded to the fact that your only a boy and i believe that this has in fact resulted in your opinions.

If the administrators allow me to put this in context for you i will do so below. If after reading it you still decide to call people from Ardoyne scum then so be it you're a lost cause.

An 18-year-old innocent man was murdered by loyalists leaving a pub in Pomeroy in the mid seventies, I am about the same age and remember it clearly.
Would the people of your village be happy for a band commerating his killers to pass through your village annually? Not once in a blue moon but annually?

If the wee girls from St Marys had bottles bricks and blast bombs thrown at them by a baying loyalist mob for a period of a month not even a ten years ago would you be happy to allow them to march through Pomeroy annually? Not once in a blue moon but annually, in fact three or four times annually?

I dont agree with the recent street clashes but i think your claims that they are destroying their area for no purpose or firmly held beliefs is wrong and to be honest offensive.

I know many young lads your age from that area and north Belfast in general and i believe they could do a good job in educating you on manners and decorum.

CheFinny (UK) - Posts: 1358 - 20/07/2010 08:23:20    715485

My original post wasn't posted so I'll try again. Firstly if being in your early to mid 20's means you're a boy then so be it. Secondly do you really think those people rioting have a real just cause and are not just there as an opportunity to attack the Police and take part in some destruction? If you genuinely do then you also are a lost cause

pplocal (Tyrone) - Posts: 5878 - 20/07/2010 14:06:10    716037

An 18-year-old innocent man was murdered by loyalists leaving a pub in Pomeroy in the mid seventies, I am about the same age and remember it clearly.
Would the people of your village be happy for a band commerating his killers to pass through your village annually? Not once in a blue moon but annually?


I see you avoided the question Pomeroy.

There are loads of marches that pass of peacefully like yours in Pomeroy, but when bandsmen start disrespecting the locals, start goading the residents, like they did in Belfast with their five finger salute, in reference to the five men shot in the bookies, then of course there will be trouble. To then have a parade in memory of a Loyalist gunman, well it's asking a bit much.

I believe there is a valid reason for the trouble in Belfast and it seems a lot of people here commented on what they watched on the news, without knowing the background to the situation.

This was Omaghredhand's thread, and I would like to offer him my apologies for provoking him without reason...sorry.

redandblackgaa (Tyrone) - Posts: 251 - 20/07/2010 16:56:32    716460

PomeroyPlunkett
County: Tyrone
Posts: 1072

711037 'If I was an explosives expert in PIRA, and I was now left on the dole or whatever, I could honestly say that I would consider "selling" my expertise as well.'

What did he mean when he said that then Ta?

I tried to post a reply yesterday that was not allowed for some reason, and although I think the thread has run its course, I would like to clarify the above statement for the benefit of PP, as I believe that it is beyond Tomato and Monkey.

Empathy is a concept based on the premise of one's ability to understand the emotions and thoughts of another, quite useful in a debate actually. In this statement I am suggesting, in reply to a point of PP regards ex-PIRA members facilitating the dissidents that this would be a possible reason for such a course of action. Nowhere in any of my posts did I say it was right or justifiable merely that I could understand why such a thing could happen.

I also want to reply regards PP's assertion that because some PIRA members were bigots that the organisation as a whole was sectarian. I think this is the part where admin, may have had an issue yesterday so I will change my example. It is suggested that some Irish people are racist, and undoubtedly some are. Does this mean that the whole Irish race are racist? Is this not a generalisation that you normally give out about?

I also note that he failed to adequately reply to a question about parades in Pomeroy. Maybe he does not have one!!

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 21/07/2010 20:50:38    718625

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-10791364



It now appears that some people travelled 30 miles to be upset by these marchers.

Wonderful.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 28/07/2010 20:39:32    727651

Everything must be taken in context.Maybe he was showing solidarity with his nationalist brothers in Ardoyne who have been under siege from these Orange Bigots for more than 40 years.Maybe he was there just for the craic and a wee bit of rioting?We dont know him or his motives for being there. The Orange men brought the north to near all out civil war when they converged on Drumcree to demand they be permitted to take their triumphalist coat trailing obscenity of a march down the Garvaghy road.The Ruc were content to oblige by beating the people of the Garvaghy road of the streets to appease these not too local Orange brethren.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 28/07/2010 21:17:25    727695

seanie_boy.
i have to agree with you on this one , the local nationalists of these areas there feelings and threats of bigotry are brushed aside .
i am afraid if u allow these parades through loyalist thugs march down catholic areas and taunt locals with their tunes of hate , then u are going to get RESISTANCE , there days of going through catholic areas should be a thing of the past , but ask yourself this , they are elements within authority who would love to keep this conflict going , their big security bugdet would be cut , .... but at what price?

no more sectarian marches ........................ its that simple.

ta32 (Tyrone) - Posts: 4907 - 28/07/2010 21:29:05    727711

patrique.
have u ever thought to yourself were a lot of these orangemen come from to intimidate nationalists in there own areas.
they come from scotland , south africa. etc etc..?

ta32 (Tyrone) - Posts: 4907 - 28/07/2010 21:33:03    727714

Scottish Orangemen,a dirty shower indeed.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 28/07/2010 21:50:49    727752

If I wanted to protest about something happening in Galway City then I would travel the 70 odd kilometres from my home (in County Galway) to the city to do so.

Distance should be of no consequence to protest.

Wests_Awake (Galway) - Posts: 877 - 29/07/2010 13:19:35    728137

seanie_boy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 337

727752 Scottish Orangemen,a dirty shower indeed
------------------
The dirtiest of them all IMO. I remember seeing coachloads of them converging on Portadown during Drumcree, something to tell the grandchildren about I'm sure. They should ban these scum from our shores, we dont need to import bigotry from Englands northernmost outpost, we have enough of our home grown variety thanks!

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 29/07/2010 13:25:56    728153

Here Here,if they would stick to marching in their own areas then there would be no trouble at all.The only problem they would have then is that the whole thing becomes pointless and no fun for them.Their membership is dwindling every year anyway,young people are no longer drawn in from the unionist/protestant community like they were in the recent past.Hope this trend continues.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 29/07/2010 17:50:46    728667

29/07/2010 13:25:56
brendtheredhand
County: Tyrone
Posts: 2582

728153 seanie_boy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 337

727752 Scottish Orangemen,a dirty shower indeed
------------------
The dirtiest of them all IMO. I remember seeing coachloads of them converging on Portadown during Drumcree, something to tell the grandchildren about I'm sure. They should ban these scum from our shores, we dont need to import bigotry from Englands northernmost outpost, we have enough of our home grown variety thanks!

__________________
Is there not an economic benefit - Money spent by tourists is fully incremental to the Norths economy

How many jobs and how much tax revenue is generated by

1. Ferries
2. Staff working on ferries
3. Bus companies
4. Taximen
5. Local hotels/pubs/B&B's
6. Ice cream shops
7. Drum fixers
8. Farmers and others involved in providing good god fearing Ulster frys
9. Shoe shops and Heel Bars for running repairs on marching brogues
10. Bowler hat sales

Not to mention deckchairs/Ice creams/sandwiches/Tea & coffee/Souvenier CD's
I wonder is there a market for all inclusive package deals ?

Omar.d (Cavan) - Posts: 1141 - 29/07/2010 18:05:24    728696