National Forum

Ban on Turf Cutting

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Urban sprawl has ruined even more of the irish eco-system that turf cutters.

In my opinion Coillte has ruined more bog by far planting non-native coniferious forests and christmas trees for commerical purposes also bord na mona who is responsible for more cut away bog again for commerical purposes.... have ye ever burned briquttes have a guess where they come from yet it is people who are responsible for a tiny fraction of the damage doing what has been done for generations and is part of irish culture.

The green party should be taking action on the commercial damage to this eco-system rather than going after turf cutters!!!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 06/07/2010 20:02:22    698739

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There should be a ban on commercial turf cutting but leave the ordinary man to his ways !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 06/07/2010 20:43:33    698797

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HAG_AND_CHEESE - agree with you 100%. spot on. its time da greens and there buddies get of their moral high horse and look at the facts. id say many of them have never even been to the bog.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11747 - 06/07/2010 20:46:02    698800

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Definately Slasher also I think something needs to be done about coillte... they say their doing good but have you ever walked in a coillte forestry there are only trees and nothing much else, their not real irish bogs or forests..... granted the carbon foot print is improved but the forests don't contain as much wild life as real irish forests.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 06/07/2010 20:57:32    698809

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jimbodub
You are the typical townie talking nonesense about natural habitats
being destroyed, the real damage in the bogs is caused by bord na mona
and the esb. Do you drive a car, do you live in a concrete jungle, if your answer
is yes well you have no right to talk about natural habitats

atta (Meath) - Posts: 710 - 06/07/2010 21:26:26    698838

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Hag & Cheese,


Apart from a few foxes, badgers, squirrels (grey) there is very little. Love forest walks especially above Carlingford, Rostrevor or Newcastle, Co. Down !! Of late there are huge areas of forests cleared and very little re-planting too !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 06/07/2010 21:29:37    698844

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Slasher:

There nothing nicer than a walk in a natural deciduous forest where you actually see something growing on the ground be it flowers or wild garlic but in a coniferious trees are planted in order no light to the ground so all u'll see is pine needles with sparce plants in pathway clearings just looks so artifical to me.

Was in kilarney a while back it was beautiful althought there's a problem with introduced rhododendron killing out native plants again... it's costing them millions to try and clear it..... sometimes the planting they do can do as much harm. Think about 10% of land usage in ireland is forestry of that 10% is natural forestry.... saying that wetlands and bogs i think account for more land than forestry area's in ireland yet it is a tiny minority that are being punished for cutting turf on this land.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 06/07/2010 21:53:16    698903

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atta
County: Meath
Posts: 37

698838
jimbodub
You are the typical townie talking nonesense about natural habitats
being destroyed, the real damage in the bogs is caused by bord na mona
and the esb. Do you drive a car, do you live in a concrete jungle, if your answer
is yes well you have no right to talk about natural habitats
______________________

well said no word of a lie. Im sure the people would stop cutting the turf if they were given some sort of incentive but the government intends to take what are assets off country people. There is no sign of bord na mona stopping cutting turf.

patmcgee (Longford) - Posts: 520 - 06/07/2010 21:59:55    698923

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I'd rather take an educated stance regarding the subject without having to brand people this or that, "Townies" or whatever....

At the end of the day, we have species in this country that are found nowhere else in the world, they mostly exist on bog lands...

I'd rather not have to go down the road of us and them.... I'm of the opinion that there are other options available rather than destroying an eco system that has taken thousands of years to create. Just so a tiny percentage of people in this country can have a free fuel source, because that is what this is all about…. MONEY - this island belongs to us all... and should be enjoyed by all.

There's a fine park here in Dublin, the phoenix park full of magnificent and ancient trees, why aren't we cutting them down to save a few bob during the winter months…. Hey it would be free right?

Maybe we're of different mind sets, I believe in conserving what we have left... in the hope that one day it may have a chance to recover,

I'm not a "townie" by the way… far, far from it. I'm not your "A" typical northside Dub... I have a huge love of nature and the sheer marvellous of it. Through my work I've been fortunate to stand in a few amazing places and filmed wild life, what can I say...? I only want what's best and I believe that future generations will look back with great distain if we were to allow species to be wiped off the map on our watch.

I mean how selfish can you get? It's not just about the here and now…. As a race we are just a speck on our planets time line.

It's only my opinion that I'm giving... so please I'd prefer not to be branded this or that, you know nothing about me whatsoever. I understand and respect that turf cutting has gone on now for hundreds of years, but we've come a long way since those days, we have a better understanding of the natural world, of its strengths and its frailties... There are some tough lessons ahead for us all...

We can still turn on a tap here in Dublin and receive clean water for free… not for much longer.

Can we not just debate the issue without having to resort to name calling lads…? It's an interesting issue…

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 12:30:14    699186

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jimbodub - so a tiny percentage of people in this country can have a free fuel source

wrong - i wouldnt say a tiny percentage - most rural people cut turf for a soucrce of fuel and ive seen increased activity in recent years. and jim turf is not free my friend. bog owners must pay contractors to cut the turf.

as of interst do you think people in cities should be banned from owning 4x4's.

a neighbour of mine had his house flooded this year. it happened two years ago aswell. the council wanted to build a drain to a local river so the house would not be flooded again - surprise surprise the environmental agencies etc, wouldnt allow it.

most people in the country love animals and would never harm them but people must be put before animals

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11747 - 07/07/2010 13:32:51    699300

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bog owners must pay contractors to cut the turf.

Can they cut it themselves?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 13:55:32    699339

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wrong - i wouldnt say a tiny percentage - most rural people cut turf for a soucrce of fuel and ive seen increased activity in recent years

In terms of people living in this country, I would say that I'm correct in saying that it would be a small percentage.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 14:28:04    699401

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Jimbo I see you've ignored the point we've made about bord na mona and coillte.... some facts for you

First one is old dates from about 1994 but it will give you an idea of the distruction coillte has done to bog lands.

"The drive to meet the Government's annual planting target of 30,000ha per year resulted in extensive planting of peatlands. Today 6,400ha of formerly intact raised bogs and 211,000ha of formerly intact blanket bogs have been planted (Ryan and Cross 1984, Anonymous 1994, Farrell & Boyle 1990). Since 1981 forest planting has been supported by EU grants (Douglas 1998)."

Also have a look at the facts on coillte current forest and the lack of native irish trees.

http://www.coillte.ie/coillteforest/forest_facts/forest_facts_by_county/national/

Also the way in small scale it is harvested is by digging up the peat placing it machines which spead it over an area of ground these create bog holes which are a magnet to wildlife over time. went for a walk on the bog and such bog holes where dotted with bog cotton dragonflies even one of irelands carnivious plants the sundew..... I do think the older ways were better but the way bord na mona do it is like open cast mining and in a massive scale.... yet you want the turf cutters on a small individual stopped!!

Right you say you take an eduacted stance on it well maybe first you'll have to educate yourself on the facts and figures and how the turf is cut.

We used to have a pot where there was many 30 to 40 plots for turf on a large area using a tiny fraction of the land coillite bought it and turned the whole bog into a christmas tree farm.... I suppose you think that is better than preserving bog lands.....

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 07/07/2010 16:25:56    699571

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The pheonix park is tiny in fairness you walk it in about 15 mins.... bog near me would take most of the day but now it's just a forest!!! Also bogs were owned by people you pay for a plot and pay the contractor to cut it you just don't walk onto a bog and start cutting away to your hearts content..... I thought you were taking an eduacted stance on it. Have you ever taking a walk on such bogs jimbo if you are an nature lover also take a walk in the coniferious forests in the dublin mountains not the nature trails but amoung the trees you find less wildlife there than in bogs where turf is cut.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 07/07/2010 16:32:20    699580

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HAG_AND_CHEESE
County: Tipperary
Posts: 3031

699571

Sorry HAG I cant breath with all the words you're putting in my mouth.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 17:00:58    699625

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HAG_AND_CHEESE
County: Tipperary
Posts: 3031

Can you not cut turf yourself?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 17:01:59    699626

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The Pheonix Park is Europe's largest park i am told. Hag i agree about the Rhodies as they took over in Dun na Ri Forest Park too !! Lovely to look at when in bloom but take over completely. Is there a shortage of hares about as i rarely see one nowadays ?

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 07/07/2010 17:03:49    699628

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bog near me would take most of the day

PS Walk around the phoenix park in 15 minutes.... Now HAG rocket roller balding doesn't count as walking. I don't see why you're bringing the size of a bog compared to the phoenix park into it…?

I could walk from my house to the river Inny in Westmeath; spend a few hours fishing and walk back home in less than a day...

That's one big bog you have in Tipp.... or would it only take so long because you'd be getting stuck a lot?

Also if you own a plot of bog beside your house... can you not cut that turf for your own personnel use?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 17:10:06    699635

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And lads...

Are fossil fuels really the way forward?

We live in a country that could in all possibility be considered one of the richest sources of renewable energy in the world.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 07/07/2010 17:31:42    699663

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jimbo dub .
i won put as many words in your mouth as hag (who i agree with completly) but i will explain it to you in simple english.. with the help of links to back my points up

1.
board na mona or whatever way u spell it does a style of "strip bog" if you wish. They cut away all the wildlife and leave just bare peat for harvesting
> http://gocproducts.com/ViewofCompostSite.jpg < and > http://www.freewebs.com/oysterperchbay/Cuilnagcon-2003-01.jpg <

2.
now a rural bog is harvested in a less industrial style and leaves much of the natural vegitation and insects and wildlife in general alone. the turf is cut and is then laid out on a "bank" as it is known where im from. it is then turned and stood up and finall brought home. now from then untill the following march/april/
depending on the weather, the bog is not touched . there is no reason to be on the bog and therefore the wild life recovers from the mild activity.
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/43/Peat-bog-Ireland.jpg < and >http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/celtic-roots/bog4.jpg< and >http://image12.webshots.com/12/1/35/40/156113540CEMhYj_ph.jpg<

bitchesandhoes (Sligo) - Posts: 118 - 07/07/2010 17:37:38    699674

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