We (an AMATEUR association) have a stadium larger than TWO PROFESSIONAL organizations (who had to use our facilities.) Don't make me laugh Joseff

dammon (Meath) - Posts: 1291 - 18/06/2010 16:00:31    681165

Classic stadium I would be a fan off croker over most stadiums

castlemaine (Kerry) - Posts: 546 - 18/06/2010 16:05:43    681173

definitely should seat the hill. Its an awful lump of a yoke at the minute

whiterbannnas (Mayo) - Posts: 2441 - 18/06/2010 16:09:31    681179

Something about Croke park gets me going, Its one of those things that just excite me wildly

Orlaith (Derry) - Posts: 4282 - 18/06/2010 16:12:44    681191

Why dod people continue to entertain Joseff, we have stoped listening to him a long time ago on the louth page,

Louth Gael (Louth) - Posts: 1227 - 18/06/2010 16:18:20    681201

As someone who had been in Old Trafford and the Nou Camp this year, Croker is a step ahead of either of them. The seats, and alleyways between seats are so much wider in Croker its untrue. Watching a match at Croker is much more comfortable. The corporate facilities (ie boxes and premium) are a joy and is a model which many stadiums across the world have since adopted. As opoosed to the 2 stadiums mentioned above, You have a decent view no matter where you sit at Croke Park.

Which parts of the stadium need an upgrade?

jafallon (Galway) - Posts: 489 - 18/06/2010 16:19:46    681204

Croke Park is fine. Fair enough the hill is a bit of an eyesore but the atmosphere it generates when the Dubs are playing makes up for it. The obvious next step is the re-construct the hill into a stand and thus making Croke Park one of the world's best stadiums.

men_of_49 (Meath) - Posts: 2022 - 18/06/2010 16:25:39    681210

joseff
County: Louth
Posts: 562

680971 I think from recent visits to Croke Park and other staduims around the world, it's fair to say Croke Park can't compete with these modern stadiums (Wembley, Nou Camp)

You gotta love this. You write this, but you've clearly never been to the Nou Camp. Its very delapidated and its not great on vacilities, it was built around the 50s and has had little work done to it since. Its still a great stadium though, visually stunning from the inside.
Croke parks vacilities are average but its by no means out-dated.
I'll admit that the hill is a kip and brings down the rest of the stadium, I know there is a space restriction here but in any other country they would have made a better job of finishing the stadium, smacks of the ''sure it'll be grand'' attitude that prevails in this country

Lebowski (Meath) - Posts: 363 - 18/06/2010 16:37:18    681226

There are a number of issues there which I intend to respond to, please forgive me if i leave anything out.

-A few have asked for what needs to be upgraded. I outlined a number of areas in my second post on this thread and don't intend to repeat them.
-Thats the typical line we get "amateur organistation" blah blah blah. The GAA is professional in all but name at the minute. The sooner the old stagers accepot that the better.
-For the two professional organisations that used Croke Park, the atmosphere at Soccer games were terrible, while rugby wasnt far behind.
-I agree with Whiterbannas, clearly he is an academic like myself. Plato,Aristotle etc would be proud.
-In relation to LouthGaels imput, hes on here with a negative attitude against me, because I am a superior poster and he can't take that.

Yours In Sport,
Joseff

joseff (Louth) - Posts: 964 - 18/06/2010 16:39:26    681232

Joseff

You probably have a point about the hill alright but thats about it. whatever the hill stands for shouldnt matter at this stage, we should just move on with the times as safery is No1 priority...all-seater stadiums are obviously the way to go. we all like the hill but the Dubs are probably the only county who would be seriously put out if they got rid of it, the rest of us would get over it fairly quickly id say.

Joseff, you mentioned certain parts been a little run-down, the bottom line is every stadium begins a very slow deterioration from the day it begins to be used..through our bad weather and general wear and tear so thats not a big surprise...you make it sound like the place is falling down..far from it..i think its a pleasure to watch a match there, have a pint or something to eat..it generally feels good to be in the stadium and I certainly havent noticed anything majorly wrong apart from the hill...and im sure a make-over will be done to the stadium when its needed but that is not now.

To compare to the Nou Camp, Old Trafford etc is unfair but its well able to compete with them in any case....comparing stadiums where Messi and C Ronaldo play for €150,000 per week to a stadium of an amateur organisation isnt very fair. Croker is better than most (if not all) of them anyway...and ive been to a good few.

To sum up, on a world stage...Croker is up there with the best, a very very good stadium....for an amateur organisation, it's an absolutely extraordinary stadium and I would find it very difficult to start a thread that criticises the great place!

JGiles (Limerick) - Posts: 88 - 18/06/2010 16:48:29    681251

Joseff

You probably have a point about the hill alright but thats about it. whatever the hill stands for shouldnt matter at this stage, we should just move on with the times as safery is No1 priority...all-seater stadiums are obviously the way to go. we all like the hill but the Dubs are probably the only county who would be seriously put out if they got rid of it, the rest of us would get over it fairly quickly id say.

Joseff, you mentioned certain parts been a little run-down, the bottom line is every stadium begins a very slow deterioration from the day it begins to be used..through our bad weather and general wear and tear so thats not a big surprise...you make it sound like the place is falling down..far from it..i think its a pleasure to watch a match there, have a pint or something to eat..it generally feels good to be in the stadium and I certainly havent noticed anything majorly wrong apart from the hill...and im sure a make-over will be done to the stadium when its needed but that is not now.

To compare to the Nou Camp, Old Trafford etc is unfair but its well able to compete with them in any case....comparing stadiums where Messi and C Ronaldo play for €150,000 per week to a stadium of an amateur organisation isnt very fair. Croker is better than most (if not all) of them anyway...and ive been to a good few.

To sum up, on a world stage...Croker is up there with the best, a very very good stadium....for an amateur organisation, it's an absolutely extraordinary stadium and I would find it very difficult to start a thread that criticises the great place!

_____________________________________________________________________

May i just say that i don't appreciate seeing the origional title of the thread has been changed. If it was ok first, why wasn't it considered good enough now?

Back to the issue, you make a few good points and am glad to see you debated the topic, unlike certain posters who just took the oppertunity to snipe at me.

-On the point of vantage points in the staduim (mentiond by another poster aswell) i don't think its fair to say, no matter where you are you have a good view of the game. I've sat in many different areas of Croke Park, most are perfect it has to be said. However, in many areas such as family areas its almost impossible to see the whole pitch.
-Your on about having a pint or something to eat there, thats another issue. The que for either food or drink there is akin to the passport office with people waiting 3 days to get a passport. Also the price of food in particular leaves a lot to be desired.
-A make over is already required am afraid mate.

Another poster mentioned that the staduim is comfortable. I beg to differ here. The seats (compared to Wembley) are very tight together. Any indivual over 6ft tall or any way big will struggle to enjoy the match in comfort.

Yours In Sport,
Joseff

joseff (Louth) - Posts: 964 - 18/06/2010 17:08:11    681269

Fair play Joseff you are a past master at winding people up. The Hill is not unsafe. If it were The Gardai would close it. Secondly the pitch has not been constantly criticised over the lasy six years. The previous pitch was an excellent pitch and was recognised as being so. The present pitch was laid after the U2 concerts last year and is developing very well. I too would love to see a complete bowl. I don't believe it was feasible to build one because of the houses and the railway line that are at the back of The Hill.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6197 - 18/06/2010 17:11:39    681272

The Hill End looks atrocious in comparison with the rest of it.

However, I think Croke Park is an impressive stadium. 82,500 is a great capacity. You criticised the way Croke Park has slowly been developed but this could be a positive as if you compare it with the disastrous demolition and rebuilding job done to Lansdowne Road/Aviva Stadium (which didn't really increase capacity) it doesn't seem too bad at all.

Joseff, have you been to any stadiums mentioned in this thread other than Croke Park?

Leviathan (Louth) - Posts: 257 - 18/06/2010 17:17:03    681275

I find it unbelievable that anyone with an iota of sense could be so critical of Croke Park but there we are. To briefly humour some of the points made I reply with the following; 1) What makes Hill 16 unsafe, it was built to a very high standard with plenty of access and egress points installed in what is effectively 3 seperate terraces, much more than existed on the old Hill 16 or Nally Stand, its barrier system is excellent and I have stood at recent All-Ireland finals on the Hill when it is at full capacity and it has always felt and been safe and with a good degree of comfort in movement so explain your theory on that. 2) The only seats that have been really effected by weathering are the ones in the Cusack as they have been there the longest (initially installed on the lower deck in 1994) and tend to get the most weather, I understand that the Cusack seats are due to be replaced after this years Championship. 3) The roof of the Cusack has no major translucent panels and the last time I sat there, which was last week, I didn't notice too much grime anywhere, however I further understand that maintainence work to the roof of all three stands is to be carried out in conjunction with the installation of the walkway which is to be installed along the roof for visitors to walk along. The age old argument about a 3/4 finished stadium is old hat now, the Hill is constrained by the railway line behind it and the houses on Clonliffe Road, eventually I feel that the issue of the railway line will be resolved just as the issue with the canal and railway was resolved at the Canal End and that houses will, in time, be bought by the GAA to develop the Hill further in line with the other stands and allow for the other plan of a total roof over the stadium, however in the meantime I have no problem with the present Hill and find it a fine vantage point that has good facilities within its concourse. Anyone who thinks Croke Park looks dated, grimy or any other such adjective has I would suggest led a very sheltered life.

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3772 - 18/06/2010 17:20:13    681280

Joseff, you're a WUM!

Orlaith, there's such a thing as sharing too much...

And what is a Bowel stadium..? I'm not an architect so am intrigued by the concept. If the Hill end was completed would it then be a Bowl? As Hill 16 is now the open end of a Bowel what would this be called scientifically??? Does this explain why the Dubs supporters are at home there?

Since you're such an academic wum Joseff, maybe you'd like to explain?

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 2521 - 18/06/2010 17:51:00    681317

I would agree with Joseff as Croke Park has got very old and it should be demolished and rebuilt and i would rename it the Ballygowan Stadium as it would be similar to the Aviva stadium.In my opinion a new stadium should be be built in a wealthy and prosperous county like Monaghan.

2faced (Louth) - Posts: 405 - 18/06/2010 18:20:48    681336

Joseff ... in one word... rubbish! Sorry but your views are based on what? You have identified nothing in particular that is wrong with Croker.

Without a doubt it is one of the best stadiums in the world, recognised as such and I fail to see why you have brought up this post at all... mischief! ?

carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1895 - 18/06/2010 18:44:47    681348

although way behind the Amsterdam ArenA and the Allianz Arena its quite a good stadium compared to the likes of the nou camp. i was in the san siro only two weeks ago and its a dump. it wont be too long until weeds start growing in it.

the only criticism i would have with croke park is its not steep enough and thus can lack atmosphere at times. the top tier is fine but because of the bottom tier its too far away from the pitch. if you compare the san siro and croke park in the way in which they are made, san siro is easily better. its a monster. it towers over you. you're nearly on the pitch. if the bottom tier in croke park was built steep like the san siro, it would be an amazing sight and would have far better atmosphere

32_4_1 (Meath) - Posts: 4209 - 18/06/2010 19:03:08    681355

I think croke park is a great stadium, never had a bad seat or view of the game since it has been done up, the only thing I would change is the hill end, I wouldnt make it two tiers but join it in with the lower tiers of the hogan and cusack and have it all seater so that the stadium would look better, at the moment it looks unfinished.

bryanadams (Kildare) - Posts: 733 - 18/06/2010 19:47:45    681375

I find it unbelievable that anyone with an iota of sense could be so critical of Croke Park but there we are. To briefly humour some of the points made I reply with the following; 1) What makes Hill 16 unsafe, it was built to a very high standard with plenty of access and egress points installed in what is effectively 3 seperate terraces, much more than existed on the old Hill 16 or Nally Stand, its barrier system is excellent and I have stood at recent All-Ireland finals on the Hill when it is at full capacity and it has always felt and been safe and with a good degree of comfort in movement so explain your theory on that. 2) The only seats that have been really effected by weathering are the ones in the Cusack as they have been there the longest (initially installed on the lower deck in 1994) and tend to get the most weather, I understand that the Cusack seats are due to be replaced after this years Championship. 3) The roof of the Cusack has no major translucent panels and the last time I sat there, which was last week, I didn't notice too much grime anywhere, however I further understand that maintainence work to the roof of all three stands is to be carried out in conjunction with the installation of the walkway which is to be installed along the roof for visitors to walk along. The age old argument about a 3/4 finished stadium is old hat now, the Hill is constrained by the railway line behind it and the houses on Clonliffe Road, eventually I feel that the issue of the railway line will be resolved just as the issue with the canal and railway was resolved at the Canal End and that houses will, in time, be bought by the GAA to develop the Hill further in line with the other stands and allow for the other plan of a total roof over the stadium, however in the meantime I have no problem with the present Hill and find it a fine vantage point that has good facilities within its concourse. Anyone who thinks Croke Park looks dated, grimy or any other such adjective has I would suggest led a very sheltered life.
_________________________________________________________________________

Theres a hape of comments addressed to me there, so i picked the one that showed the most intellect.
On that, you appear to have a fantastic knowledge of whats happening, so I get the impression you may be an inside man my friend.
However, you haven't adressed many of the other issues I raised in previous posts (which i won't repeat)

In response to leviathian, I have been in many staduims around the world. As you know I am an experienced tourist both within and outside this country. I have frequently visited staiums in the UK, such as Casement Park and Omagh.

2faced makes a well made point, but I have to question, whats your point 2faced?

There were other comments in there, but I haven't time to remember (care about) them.

Yours In Sport,
Joseff

joseff (Louth) - Posts: 964 - 19/06/2010 14:14:04    681601