breffni, are you pomeroy in disguise as you seem to come on and defend him alot. Nocky's doesn't go on football threads and spout like Plonker does. What is the point in a hurling fan posting on here if we have to put up with the constant wumming. He brings every hurling thread off topic and is let by the admins which clearly means the admins are giving their consent to it.

Point me to one thread where a hurling follower has slagged off football over the last few days and I'll point a load of hurling where he has been on.

Puddersthecat (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1692 - 29/04/2010 15:16:27    633657

It appears that my original post was not allowed through despite I woud argue being no worse than PP's vitriolic posts. You ask for a debate but don't debate any points raised yourself. Have you ever played hurling or tried to ? I suspect the answer to that is no. Lets look at the skills of football and hurling.

Lifting the ball/sliothar: Not that difficult in football, just position your foot near the ball and lift, you can't even be tackled whilst doing this. In hurling you can jab lift or roll lift, the ball being at least a foot or two away from you whilst being tackled.

Tackle: Is there such a thing in football? It generally consists of pulling or dragging, pushing or surrounding a player until he is blown up for overcarrying. In hurling you have frontal blocking, hooking which takes ability and skill.

Catching: Well the football is the size of your head in football and you have two hands to catch it with. In hurling the ball is a lot smaller, travelling quicker and have only one hand to catch it with. Which is easier?

Striking (the ball): I have never yet met any person, man woman or child that cannot kick a football. Alas, this is no longer a pre-requisite as you can handpass/throw the ball the whole way up the pitch. Indeed you can even score by this method. I have met very few people outside of an actual hurler who can strike a sliothar 30metres.

Soloing: Again, quite handy I would have thought any one can do this. I have a 6 year old daughter quite adept at it, yet she can't even balance a sliothar on a hurley whilst standing still never mind running like this.

As well as this we have the new fad of diving in football and feigning injury something that is not seen that often if ever in hurling. The facts are that anyone can kick a football, its an easier game to play, hence the reason so many play it, because they can. Sport mirrors life in my opinion and in life most people take the easiest option when they can. Playing football is the sporting option of the easy option.

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 29/04/2010 15:24:08    633673

Great post omaghredhand!

Puddersthecat (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1692 - 29/04/2010 15:45:16    633723

omaghredhand you sir are a legend!!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 29/04/2010 15:59:09    633743

Pudders - I have not criticised hurling or agreed with PP at any stage. I just personally find it funny that the "hurling snobs" :) have turned the tables and are playing the "poor me" now.

Nocky - I'm not disagreeing with you for the sake of it, I am disagreeing with you as I find some of your posts objectionable. Simple as. There was still no proper cause for that slating of Tyrone football. Was I just supposed to agree with you for the sake of it?

Anyway, I still think some of ye need to man up a bit, and won't say anymore and apologise for going off topic on this thread.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12310 - 29/04/2010 16:29:34    633803

That's surely put the debate to bed! :-) Let's all move on now to constructive discussions please.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 29/04/2010 16:30:01    633806

keeper7:

I'll be quite honest have to say I'm enjoying the debate

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 29/04/2010 16:38:13    633816

Great post omaghredhand. Also in hurling/camogie the skill of a perfect first touch on a ball really is an art form IMO.

Royal_Girl2k9 (Meath) - Posts: 2107 - 29/04/2010 16:59:54    633851

Puddersthecat
County: Kilkenny
Posts: 923

633657 breffni, are you pomeroy in disguise as you seem to come on and defend him alot. Nocky's doesn't go on football threads and spout like P does. What is the point in a hurling fan posting on here if we have to put up with the constant wumming. He brings every hurling thread off topic and is let by the admins which clearly means the admins are giving their consent to it.

Point me to one thread where a hurling follower has slagged off football over the last few days and I'll point a load of hurling where he has been on.
29/04/2010 15:24:08

Breffni is a number of people on this site Dellboy/34_4_1/Ulsterman to name a few. I would take what he says with a pinch of salt. Hurling is a far better sport then bogball in my opinion.

paddyogall (Mayo) - Posts: 5110 - 29/04/2010 17:05:57    633863

My previous post wasn't posted so I'll try again, maybe tone it down a little. If I for example had devoted the time I have spent on Gaelic Football to Hurling there's no doubt I could easily do all the things you mention. Most people could play Hurling to a reasonable level if they trained a few times a week from a young age. To say people don't play it because it's more difficult is ridiculous and burying your head in the sand. It's actually quite amusing the lengths Hurling fans will go to to try to justify why their sport is a distant second to Football in terms of popularity

pplocal (Tyrone) - Posts: 5878 - 29/04/2010 17:12:19    633879

Nocky:

I am actually much more involved with football than hurling Breffni, as Pinkie or many of the other posters on the Wexford site will tell you. Like you said my post was in retaliation to Pomeroy's wind-up post. Your disagreeing with me at every single opportunity is getting pretty tiresome at this stage.

-----------------

You certainly are, and some right barneys we have had (and will have more I'm sure!!), but unlike PomeroyPlonker at least neither of us are against the "other" game, just want to see the two ran better and think they can be ran better together, not looking for the abolition of the other. Sad attitude he has but I dont let him rile me any more! You'd be better off doing the same.

Pinkie (Wexford) - Posts: 4100 - 29/04/2010 17:24:32    633901

Lads, although he's never admitted it, I seriously think Pomeroy must be joking. OK the widup has probably gone on for longer than most of us would carry it, but that's just his sense of humour. Don't take it so seriously. Sure even if he is serious, how could you possibly argue with someone who had such entrenched views on something of which he knows so little. Just take his posts in the jovial spirit in which they were initially intended, or don't respond at all.

Culchie (Cork) - Posts: 799 - 29/04/2010 17:25:09    633903

PomeroyPlunkett
County: Tyrone
Posts: 693

633879 My previous post wasn't posted so I'll try again, maybe tone it down a little. If I for example had devoted the time I have spent on Gaelic Football to Hurling there's no doubt I could easily do all the things you mention. Most people could play Hurling to a reasonable level if they trained a few times a week from a young age. To say people don't play it because it's more difficult is ridiculous and burying your head in the sand. It's actually quite amusing the lengths Hurling fans will go to to try to justify why their sport is a distant second to Football in terms of popularity

Ok, so you now admit that you have to devote time and work to attain the ability to accomplish these skills. In relation to most people being able to hurl to a reasonable level IF they trained a few times a week, this is a most dramatic climb down from your previous assertion that it is about hitting a sliothar as hard as you can or waving your stick in the air. At least we are making progress. Now, surely, the facts are that most people if they dedicate themselves to anything for a couple of nights a week from a young age will achieve a reasonable level. Therefore, by your own admission, it takes time and dedication to be able to play hurling, just as it does football and most likely any other sport. This is the point I suggest H&G, Pudders and the rest of the hurling fraternity are saying. As for the popularity aspect, it does not really bother me which is more popular. I enjoy both but have a preference for hurling. In the heartlands of Kilkenny, Tipp and Clare, Waterford, Limerick and Wexford, hurling is probably more popular. In Galway and Cork there is a mixture although hurling in Cork would appear to be of greater signifigance. In Dublin, hurling is increasing daily. In Antrim, especially around the glens there is nothing but hurling. I accept that the majority of people follow football and there are numerous reasons for this but I thnk that it is time you accepted that hurling was here long before football and will continue to thrive as one of our national sports

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 29/04/2010 17:56:43    633954

re: Culchie

when it comes to pomperoy at this stage my resonpse is YAWN!!!

Post littered with hearsay and wumming.... I would be 99.9999% certain that said poster never played the game of hurling.

"reasonable level if they trained a few times a week from a young age." Laughable really could apply to any sport it's with training you develope these skills and you need to put in a hell of lot more training to develope hurling skills.

I would agree he is joking i wouldn't think any person would would be that out of touch with a rational why of thinking unintensially.... that dosen't just go for posts on hurling but in the general theme of all his posts...... but i suppose we are to blame too we'er giving him what he graves attention. But saying that it's fun to pick his wumming posts to bits. And then he claims he's winning the arguement some lad alright i'm say he'd start a roit in a graveyard!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 29/04/2010 18:08:52    633969

re: omaghredhand

I think we have him on the run..... Get in there, in fairness he was a hard WUM to craic I'll give him that.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 29/04/2010 18:21:55    633992

right pomeroy. i'll give you the benefit of the doubt and answer you seriously.

Nobody says that if you play hurling a few times a week and become obsessed with it as many kids do, then you will become a highly accomplished player. if you're playing at a decent competitive level then there's no reason why any person cannot take to it. i'm sure that some of the best footballers would have made fine hurlers. However, it is pretty obvious that hurling is a very, very, very skillful game to play. i know guys who took up gaelic football when they were 16 or 17 and ended up playing to a high level. the same is true for other sports. john hayes didn't play rugby til he turned 18 or 19.
This can't happen in hurling. i know my club aim to get kids to start hurling when they're 6 or 7. you can't take up hurling in your late teens because there are too many skills to master to ever play competitively at adult level having only taken it up when you're in your late teens.
catching- amid hurls flying. bravery and timing.
sideline - watch joe canning on youtube and tell me whether its a skill or not.
solo - put sliotar in hand only twice. hitting straight off the hurl. soloing through a tackle or two tackles.
speed - ever stop a tennis ball which weighs ten tennis balls travelling at 120 mph?? thought not. check out damien fitzhenry. i've seen goals for both teams in 30 seconds, what other game does this happen in??
games - 9 points at half time and you're still in with a shout in hurling. in football you might as well have a shower.
toughness - i'm not a football man(you might have guessed) but i admire the toughness of it. i still don't think there's anything like getting your finger broken and playing on with adrenaline. happens often in hurling, it has happened to me. i don't like to highlight this side of the game but its a tough, tough game. add to this the fact that there aren't the same number of frees in hurling as football.
other stuff: long range scores - often see a 70 yard score. what a skill!! the block, one of my favourite skills, bravery, timing. the inability to introduce tactics which can kill a game. three man midfield, a man behind the centre back etc are all attempts to reduce players influence and can work but at the end of the day you can't slow a game down while the ball is in play and you can't play a blanket defence or tackle with three men. too fast.
you said you'd answer a proper argument so tell me what isn't true there. i'm not lumping all tyrone in with you. i know there are great GAA men up there. hopefully ye improve the hurling and you can play soccer instead.

hurlinspuds (Cork) - Posts: 1494 - 29/04/2010 18:33:17    634008

re:Hurlingspuds

Mind if i jump in here on this one.
"toughness - i'm not a football man(you might have guessed) but i admire the toughness of it. i still don't think there's anything like getting your finger broken and playing on with adrenaline. happens often in hurling, it has happened to me. i don't like to highlight this side of the game but its a tough, tough game. add to this the fact that there aren't the same number of frees in hurling as football."

Making sure that you don't get hurt is a skill on it's own trying to be sholder to shoulder in challenge so and trying not to get the follow threw on strikes.

I'll outline one skill and expireance.... Remember we were thought how to block someone pulling on the ball on the ground. Basiclly steping on the boss of the hurley and wedge the ball so it dosen't move... I learned that and when out to use it in the next match. steps on the boss as i was told but never tilted the hurley towards the direction the pull was comming from with the effect your man pulled and the boss of his hurley followed up the staft of my hurley till it met my hand taking two finger nails off and nearly a finger.... It's a hard skill to describe but the hurling lads may know it. But i learned then make sure you know those sort of skills properly before using them.

Other skills include protecting yourself when catching bascally shielding your hand with the hurl. I could go on.

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 29/04/2010 20:33:46    634126

one of my favourite skills is doubling on the ball in the air, very difficult but so satisfying. And what can you say about a player who can stick it over the bar from a sideline cut? Amazing. Most skillful and technical game played anywhere on earth.

Suas Sios (None) - Posts: 1558 - 30/04/2010 09:21:41    634298

pomeroyplunkett

if it was easy to play hurling tyrone would be good at it. as thats why more counties play the football
it is easier to play football. for example kerry only beat sligo bye 1 point last year i am not running down sligo
but they never won the sam. that would be like westmeath playing kilkenny in hurling in the championship and the cats
only winning bye a point it wouldn't happen. three years ago a great tryone team let laois beat them.

pomeroyplunkett when was the last time you seen kilkenny, cork. tipp, beaten bye a team that never won the liam mccarthy
if you say it is easy to play hurling. look at last year the cork hurler eoin cadgoan didn't play with the footballers up to the final
yet he walked onto the team . tell me the last time you seen a footballer walk onto a hurling team in a final you couldn't because
hurling is a far more skillfull game and you have to have your touch right and you don't get that over night. all you have to be is fit
for the football.

Birrgreat (Offaly) - Posts: 111 - 30/04/2010 10:25:48    634365

BirrGreat, whilst I agree with the skills point, I think that you are actually strengthening the argument of the football fraternity. You have to be more than fit to play football. There are skills to football, many of them, but the skills of hurling are numerable and more difficult, in my opinion. We seem to having the better of this debate of late and I think that stooping to his level is not the answer. As well as this, your comparisons are not in my opinion correct. Hurling generally has a higher scoring rate due to the fact that it is quickerand because it has a more difficult skillset therefore the gap between top and bottom would appear more vast. In general a division 1 side getting beat in hurling by a division 2 side is a shock whilst if Fermanagh who are now in division 4 beat any of the Ulster teams in the championship in football would be a shock but not earth shattering. This unfortunately is causing a problem for hurling. In the bigger counties such as Tipp, Offaly Cork etc where there is a huge number of clubs, teams normally can play a number of games at their own level. In Tyrone, due to the fact that there are only 5 clubs and 6 teams (Carrickmore have 2) there is a two team hierarchy of Dungannon and Carrickmore, followed by Naomh Colmcille who are a wee bit short of these two but above the reamining 3. Therefore in essence my club who would be in teh bottom 3 really only have 2 competitive games and on occasion put it up to the others. The advent of the Ulster league has been very good as it allows teams to go out side their county and play at least 5 games against clubs of their level and maybe should be considered as a longer term solution to Ulster hurlings woes

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 30/04/2010 10:46:42    634387