RuanNua??? Where do you get your facts from?? A teacher does not get 50eur for supervising the yard. Teachers sign up for a scheme called S and S. As part of this scheme a teacher commits to a cetain level of supervision per week. They also sign up to keep two of their free periods a week free to cover for a collegue. So in total we may cover up to 35hrs of class a year and also about 35 hrs of supervision. That is 70 hours. We get a payment of 700eur in jan of which your looking at 150 going back in tax,. We get another payment of 700 in june. Once agin getting taxed at 150. We are talking at most 1100eur for 70hrs work. Do the maths that aint your 50eur.. Get your facts right please. We also do not get thousands for our degree level. I get roughly 130eur a month for that extra. You also said that " your tax pays for schools and our wages" get a life we prob get taxed the most out of all workers. I can tell you now that every time i get a payslip I lose quarter of it to tax at least so do not get on your high horse. As a profession we were made several promises by our shabby government. We have been stabbed in the back and been made scapegoats. A very limited amount of teachers give grinds. I could name on one hand the amount of teachers do it in my school. We have a staff of 62 and 4 give grinds. All this teacher bashing is getting old at this stage.

topman500 (Monaghan) - Posts: 294 - 15/11/2009 12:08:50    484101

14/11/2009 15:59:34
Duffy89
County: Wexford
Posts: 1981

Did you think for a second that I had to do something at half 4 in the morning not that that's any of your business ??????
___________

I dunno, you were probably finished on redtube and decided to check back on HS before you went asleep.

nocky (Wexford) - Posts: 2059 - 15/11/2009 12:16:24    484105

topman500, how much do you earn annually and how many days in the year do you work?. I wont ask you to do the maths I'll do that part myself.

BartleDoo (Monaghan) - Posts: 389 - 15/11/2009 12:39:05    484117

TOPMAN

The numbers I quoted are from an article in one of todays newspapers. I have no direct evidence of the exact structure as I am not a teacher
€5,177 for an honours degree it is less for HNDs etc. Why should teachers receive a bonus for having the level of education needed to do the job in the first place.

I don't understand how the 35 hours for covering for staff works. Does this 35 hours happen after 4.00pm or is it during the 9-4pm period ? Why should teachers be paid for doing work during the period that they are at work?- How can it be extra work - Does the teacher teach two classrooms at the same time or is it during a "free period" - Does the free periods come out of wages ?

. The paper Im reading quotes 50.34 for yard duty - apologies if this is incorrect

Also apologies for the 70 hours so it works out at 6 hoursx160 days + 70 hours (or 35 if the covering for other staff is during normal hours.
this compares to 8 hours x 210 days in the private sector which is double what a teacher works. In fact if you include pension benefit if a teacher worked those hours they would be on €140k a year plus €50k of pension benefit


Dont get your point on tax. IF a teacher pays 30% of his wages back in tax where does the other 70% come from. ie I still maintain that the private sector taxpayer is paying for this service. Last month I paid 52% of my gross wage in tax so I do feel I am entitled to have my children educated and feel strongly that teachers should make their point on their own time.

though teachers do suffer versus some other public servants in that they do not receive any rent allowance unlike the Gaurds and prison officers €4k per annum.
Maybe have a seperate strike day for this

ruanua (Donegal) - Posts: 4966 - 15/11/2009 13:06:27    484132

Ruanua, you are on a good old wage yourself and not a word about it !! You probably get a mileage allowance too but not a word about that !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 15/11/2009 17:34:50    484271

O.K. I take your point on board ruanua. But the fact is our wages are getting seriously cut. At the minute it does not affect me as it is only my second year in a job and i am earning for the first time in my life but i do feel genuine pity for those teachers who are married to eachother and have planned mortgages on the pay increase we were promised for 2009. I am actually against the strikes and in fact I am not even part of a trade union because I would rather speak for myself. My major gripe is with the fact this is a total public sector strike and yet still it is us the teachers who are recieving all the bad press. I work from 8-6 every day accept the weekeends and my weekend is spent with prep and correcting. I give up all my lunchtimes in order to ensure my students get plenty of coaching time in GAA, Basketball and Soccer. I also give up 1hr and a half a day after school to train and coach teams at various levels. I know of numerous teachers who do the same. Who are grateful for the chance to interact with the youth and help them in ways other than just academically. I also ensure that any games I may have as part of school activities run during lunch times or during my scheduled free periods. I am not permanent in my school so I do not get paid for holidays be it mid term or summer. If its figures that people are looking I believe I earn 24k before tax and i am def not complaining. It is a massive wage for someone just coming out of spending 4 years as a broke student. I can guarantee you all that the majority of teachers share my view on strikes. We far from want to disrupt the plans of our students however it is important to let our government know that we are not here to be walked all over while fatcats in the banks who caused all this are still earning an absurd amount.

topman500 (Monaghan) - Posts: 294 - 15/11/2009 17:53:42    484287

15/11/2009 17:34:50
Cavan_Slasher
County: Cavan
Posts: 3214

484271 Ruanua, you are on a good old wage yourself and not a word about it !! You probably get a mileage allowance too but not a word about that !!
_______________
Slasher - Not sure what impact my wage has on the public finances- other than the fact that I pay more than 50k per annum in tax
I work for a privately owned Irish company so am only ever paid what the owners feels im worth whch is 15% less than two years ago. Relative to what say a Public Servant would receive with same level of responsibility I am not well paid. Relative to what the average wage is the yes I am well paid and on my standard wage I pay tax at the highest marginal rate
Last week I worked 50 hours which was a handy week though the week before I worked 75 incl two 4.30 am journey starts and getting home from the airport at 12.30 on Friday night. I dont get overtime for this its what I need to do.
I dont receive a mileage allowance as My employer provides me with a good standard car which I do need in the job I do. For this I pay €750 per month in BIK tax.

As Stated on a previous thread I have also recomended
1. Removal of childrens allowance for higher earners
2. Reduction in tax bands by 6.5%
3. Increase in tax on highest band

These measures would cost me €15k per annum and I think they would be fair. However that is'nt going to raise €4bn. so public sector pay and social welfare have to be cut - The 7% reduction being proposed is not even a reduction as the cost of living index that so worried the unions when it was going up is down 6.5%.

Topman

No specifc problem with teachers though this is the title of the thread. I have a problem with any public sector employee who wants to disrupt services because they cant understand reality.
I agree the banking system is a mess but we are where we are. Paying someone min wage to run a bank unfortunately wont cure the problem.
€24k out of college is'nt bad. In my proffession the post degree wage is currently €12k and its every man for himself after that. It was £4.5k when I was 21 which is over 13 years ago, though it does improve with postgrad qualifcactions. Though I will concede that my point was made at permanant teachers who receive pay for a 10-12 week summer break which you are not one of.

ruanua (Donegal) - Posts: 4966 - 15/11/2009 19:14:33    484342

Ruanua, well fair play to you for getting that job and the free car !! Where did you see the mention of a 7% reduction in the Public Sector ? I have not seen mention of that. Nobody minds doing a longer day if the rewards are good and believe me i have often worked extra days for nothing while trying to get a young person settled in a particular place and i have also done a lot of fundraising to help childrens organisations also in my own time and for free. My main gripe with the whole economic problem is that some sectors are escaping scot free. I am aware of some self employed people, even a dentist, who gets education grants for his children because he can adjust his own tax form to suit himself, the P.A.Y.E. sector cannot and many qualify for nothing. I have put all my 5 children through university with the help of the local credit union. I was lucky to be able to do this and have no complaints except with the likes of the case i mentioned. Also if i was on the dole or never worked at all i would get a free house, reduced electricity, free education or university for my kids and i could spend the whole day in the bookies or pub. Also if i was ultra rich i could avail of all the tax-free breaks and again escape just like Bono or his likes. All i want is a level playing field for everyone. I know many lads who lost their jobs in the Private sector and i am genuinely sorry for them as they are mates, but they used to laugh at me because i earned a lot less than them and i was also encouraged to leave what i am doing and go and work with one of them. Thank God i did not !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 15/11/2009 20:08:23    484387

Slasher - the 7% was in one of todays papers though I would guess that might be 5% for <50k and 10% for>50k, But thats just a guess. Reading the papers today the spindoctors are really against the public sector - more so than is justified. Im with you on the PAYE sector. I did my leaving in 1990 and my father was earning about 15k as a public sector worker. at the time UNI grants came from VEC and were means tested whereas RTC grants were ESF funded. I did'nt qualify for a UNI grant and there were also fees at that time so I went to an RTC even though I was offered a UNI place. Did two years and ended up doing home study after that.
Several years later I was working in an accountancy office (in cavan town) where one of my jobs was filling in VEC grant forms for sons of Publcians/ Large Farmers/Pharmacists etc.

By the way I earn less than the head of one the unions relevant to this thread - at XMAS He drinks in a pub (owned by a brother of the owner of that Hotel you stay in ). It will be his round this stephens day !!!

ruanua (Donegal) - Posts: 4966 - 15/11/2009 20:49:29    484426

Ruanua, do you remember big Denis the night porter in that hotel ? A decent fellow indeed, very helpful gentleman !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 15/11/2009 21:03:36    484440

Slasher

Worked with him for seven summers - Me him and Michael the head waiter used to play golf on a Sunday morning. Free golf was the only Perk!!. He left about 10 years ago I think. Wont say why but you might be able to guess.

ruanua (Donegal) - Posts: 4966 - 15/11/2009 22:01:41    484511

Patrique - boohoo for the poor teachers so. You're just like every other union official.
Not alone do you want to do nothing yourself, you want every one else to do nothing as well.

RAM85 (Westmeath) - Posts: 978 - 16/11/2009 15:11:30    485090

if they have it so good why didnt ye all go into teaching so? i for 1 would HATE the job , trying to educate 30 brats & dealintg with naggy parents. no thanks

mac21 (Leitrim) - Posts: 677 - 16/11/2009 15:52:38    485153

Ruanua, i will ask the barman about him so. big Paddy from the island. Might call on him in April when i go up. You would have been there when the T.J.'s went up every April from 1991 !! I was with them and still am, a mad bunch but great craic !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 16/11/2009 15:56:14    485162

I am aware of some self employed people, even a dentist, who gets education grants for his children because he can adjust his own tax form to suit himself

Slasher,

You've brought this gripe up before; are you complaining that you don't have the opportunity to commit fraud and feel you should be compensated for it? Filing false tax returns is a serious offence, not a perk of a job.

Maybe you should contact Revenue and hand over all the evidence that you have of this.

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 16/11/2009 16:04:11    485176

rua

On another thread you asked about my profession/salary. I'm an Assistant Manager in Big 4 firm, and figures stated are current going rate across Deloitte, PwC, EY and KPMG.

black&white (Sligo) - Posts: 1628 - 16/11/2009 16:06:07    485178

Cavan_Slasher
County: Cavan
Posts: 3221

483488 BartleDoo, sorry but your original post refrers to a child who appears to be yours !!

DNA test required

dhorse (Laois) - Posts: 11374 - 16/11/2009 18:56:22    485373

Black & White, you are not so naive to believe that all the self assessed are honest in their tax affairs and that they cannot fiddle their books by the use of a good accountant. The dentist who is getting education grants for his children is well connected with a big noise in the income tax office and will not be put under any pressure by them at all imo. I often saw them golfing together !! many people would say "fair play to him" !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 16/11/2009 19:55:13    485455

thanks be ta god, a lie on at last

mondred (Wexford) - Posts: 872 - 16/11/2009 22:31:50    485669

16/11/2009 15:11:30
RAM85
County: Westmeath
Posts: 737

485090
Patrique - boohoo for the poor teachers so. You're just like every other union official.
Not alone do you want to do nothing yourself, you want every one else to do nothing as well.


I work about an 8 hour day, and would put in an average of two hours unpaid voluntary every day and more at weekends.

Mind you I earn 17,000 Euros a year for this.

But I am a Civil Servant. All of my union work, 100% of my time at work, is voluntary.

I had a chance to be General Secrtetary there but that pays about 50,000 euros a year but means a 16 hour day, at least, and maybe all weekend.

Of course things might be different in the North. Perhaps in the south you have had things that easy that you put all your trust in the bosses, and now don't know what to do. And you wouldn't want to upset the bosses would you?

I think the Re4public needs a recession to give people a sociology lesson.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 16/11/2009 22:47:19    485701