well the two "anti-nordie" muppets have hijacked another thread and the more responses they get the more kicks they seem to get out of it all. i dont any genuine gael on here will fail to recognise that alot of clubs and members suffered alot during these dark days that are thankfully behind us all now. threads are being twisted to provoke and i dont think you patrique are helping matters in all honesty.

on the point of the thread, irrespective of who didnt or didnt raise the matter, he deserves full recognition as a founding member as much as any of the others irrespective of job, religion or poliitical beliefs. end of.

Rahilly_Man (Tyrone) - Posts: 361 - 11/11/2009 23:23:38    481747

paddyogall County: Mayo Posts: 2008 480682 Most of the people on here wouldnt have any respect for him because of his ties to the British security forces especially the Nordies which is a shame. About time people other then Cusack are getting the recognition that they deserve. Paddy, I somewhat mistakenly held the opinion that you were an intellectual who liked to wind up folk much like my dear friend Patrique. I know Patrique personally so I am aware of his nuances and need to play devils advocate, however you now appear to be just a wind up merchant full stop. What's worse is that you have a sidekick in Toma007. As well as this, you fail to explain why you have no issue with your fellow "countrymen" by this I mean Irishmen ( I think) having no respect for McCarthy because of his British ties. I personally have no issue with any memorial to this man as he his a founder of the organisation I belong to and dedicate a lot of my time to. I have no love of those things British, however I agree with the point that occurrences in the recent past cannot be equated to those of the 1880's. I also agree with Patrique that not everyone can be lumped together. I know some policemen who served in the RUC and are and were fine outstanding men of principle and dedication to doing their jobs correctly. Likewise, I know policemen who were also members of loyalist paramilitaries and quite a few who were most sympathetic to them. The same can be said of numerous UDR members who I know personally. In respect of British soldiers, they, to an extent were "victims" and I use the term very loosely of circumstances. I am quite sure that they did not set out as bigots but were brainwashed by a combination of government policy and IRA activity. The facts remain however, that membership of the GAA highlighted and indeed earmarked people for special attention from the security forces of whatever ilk, and therefore in all likelihood loyalist paramilitaries. Throughout the "troubles" numerous people paid the ultimate sacrifice. Sean Brown, Sean Fox, Gerry Devlin, Martin McShane, to name a few God bless them. I would suggest that you read a book by a friend of mine, Des Fahy. He is a barrister and his book " How the GAA survived the troubles" is an excellent read and may help you have a more balanced view on the "North" and maybe an insight into why we struggle at times to reconcile with those responsible for so much pain in our community. Equally I understand that the Unionist people of this island as well as security force personnel have the same struggle. Your crass ill informed viewpoints smack of an uneducated throglodyte that I am pretty sure you are not, so take a while and view the whole picture and maybe you might see the error of your ways

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 11/11/2009 23:31:36    481759

The opening post on this thread was extremely good, the first reply was controversial and devisive and set the tone for what followed. I would ask contributors from both sides to read back the opening posts and having read them I'd defy anyone to disagree.

corkcelt (Cork) - Posts: 4388 - 11/11/2009 23:34:47    481766

Excellent Post Omaghredhand.

As for books, Joe Barrett's book about how football helped to heal the civil war divide in Kerry in the late 1920s and early 1930s was also a great read, and an inspiration to all.

Kerry3in arow mentioned the Irish Civil war, as I did in the past, but a few people here claim to be the ONLY people ever in history to have suffered and have no interest in that shameful, and sad blight upon Irish history. At times I feel a few people would like to revisit that episode in the North.

I would suggest some of them are too young to really have suffered and are fantasising.

The commemoration of this man has absolutely nothing to do with the recent history of the six counties, and therefore a few early posts were out of order.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 12/11/2009 00:44:47    481806

I find the contents of this topic seriously dis-heartening. Being from Monaghan and having spent alot of time in both Omagh and England, I find sectarian insults like Nordies and Free-staters shocking, especially from a group of people who claim an end to the 'troubles and sectarianism'. There is a story on the main page of this website of a Unionist MP claiming that 'the GAA is still a dark house to' the protestant majority. How are we supposed to prove these people wrong and do this great organisation some justice especially in the North and to all Northern Irish people, if we cant stop bickering among ourselves on past events? It was great to see such a post at the beginning of this topic, and like Douglas Hyde (Gaelic League), people like this should be given the credit they deserve. And perhaps these acknowledgements may begin to bridge the difference in the cultural divide between Catholic and Protestants, those in the security forces, etc. Over our bloody history there have been many injustices, genocides (Cromwell), and some could call it ethnic cleansing (Nothern Ireland), along with the Civil War etc. But what is this forum for, history or sport? Any olive branch offered or bridge built should be reinforced with another one, and something doesn't work out then we learn from it, but should go down the route where we become as sectarian as our fore-fathers, aren't we all better educated than that??? A great saying, 'we are all standing on the shoulder of giants', but we all need to look at history and learn from it, not use it for revenge or any kind of justification!!!

Monaghan in exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 189 - 12/11/2009 02:24:59    481840

Its very hard to understand the bitterness of ulster posters on here........thankgod for patrique and his views....Politics should have no place in sport but yet you boys drag it into every thread on here......redhand you have plenty sidekicks on here,...Must dash good riddance

tomaoo7 (Dublin) - Posts: 5896 - 12/11/2009 09:23:58    481881

Tomatoe it was you and your side kick who dragged this thread down.

Yop (Wexford) - Posts: 362 - 12/11/2009 09:56:44    481907

Very simplistic nonsensse being posted on this thread by judgemental people who live a long way from the people whom they excoriate. Nothing is ever as simple as it looks particularly if like Tom and Paddy you live in the warm embrace of the capital. Less of the self righteous judgementalism boys.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6182 - 12/11/2009 10:26:18    481921

Agreed Yop.

Toma, maybe that's the point, you don't understand why some Ulster folk are bitter, whilst others are not. First of all it is down to human nature. Some people live and let live, some don't and harbour grudges and all have their reasons for doing so. This does not mean that they should be lambasted at evry opportunity by yourself and Mr OGall. Like I said in my previous post, take time and educate yourself on the issues you comment on and it may balance your outlook. As for having sidekicks, I would seriously doubt it. I have agreed with and disagreed with most of the posters on here which is my right as it is theirs, however, I take each thread/topic on its own merits and take my stance on that basis. You should consider doing the same instead of extolling anti-northern rhetoric hot on the heels of your chum everytime he posts.

omaghredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 3656 - 12/11/2009 10:37:50    481935

Patrique - Tyrone posters do not claim to be the most oppressed people ever that seems to be a personal view of yourself. As for Poster who claim that GAA supporters that llive in the North of Ireland whinge alot perhaps they should read the following article: Arson attacks drive up Tyrone insurance costs 12 November 2009 Tyrone clubs are counting the cost of last year's terrorist attacks on the Fr. Rock's and Edendork clubhouses. The overall insurance bill has jumped from EUR106,000 in 2008 to a whopping EUR230,000 this year. In some cases, the figures for individual club premiums are up 140 per cent. Other factors in the huge increase included extensive flooding at grounds such as Beragh Red Knights and Carrickmore. Last year, the Fr Rock's club in Cookstown suffered extensive fire damage, while Edendork's clubhouse was burnt to the ground in sectarian attacks by the Orange Volunteers terrorist group. Both clubs have received insurance payouts, but Cookstown are still awaiting a certificate from the Chief Constable confirming they were victims of a terrorist attack. Speaking to the Irish Daily Star, Fr Rock's chairman and Tyrone PRO Damien Harvey admitted that it has been a frustrating wait for the cert. "Some clubs have been very harshly hit. If we can get the NIO to say it was a terrorist act, then the premium will come down again next year," he said. "They (the other clubs) are not going to hold it against us, but in the interests of the GAA in Tyrone, it is important that does come through."

TyroneUltra (Tyrone) - Posts: 307 - 12/11/2009 11:46:30    481992

omaghredhand County: Tyrone Posts: 815 481759 paddyogall County: Mayo Posts: 2008 480682 Most of the people on here wouldnt have any respect for him because of his ties to the British security forces especially the Nordies which is a shame. About time people other then Cusack are getting the recognition that they deserve. Paddy, I somewhat mistakenly held the opinion that you were an intellectual who liked to wind up folk much like my dear friend Patrique. I know Patrique personally so I am aware of his nuances and need to play devils advocate, however you now appear to be just a wind up merchant full stop. What's worse is that you have a sidekick in Toma007. As well as this, you fail to explain why you have no issue with your fellow "countrymen" by this I mean Irishmen ( I think) having no respect for McCarthy because of his British ties. I personally have no issue with any memorial to this man as he his a founder of the organisation I belong to and dedicate a lot of my time to. I have no love of those things British, however I agree with the point that occurrences in the recent past cannot be equated to those of the 1880's. I also agree with Patrique that not everyone can be lumped together. I know some policemen who served in the RUC and are and were fine outstanding men of principle and dedication to doing their jobs correctly. Likewise, I know policemen who were also members of loyalist paramilitaries and quite a few who were most sympathetic to them. The same can be said of numerous UDR members who I know personally. In respect of British soldiers, they, to an extent were "victims" and I use the term very loosely of circumstances. I am quite sure that they did not set out as bigots but were brainwashed by a combination of government policy and IRA activity. The facts remain however, that membership of the GAA highlighted and indeed earmarked people for special attention from the security forces of whatever ilk, and therefore in all likelihood loyalist paramilitaries. Throughout the "troubles" numerous people paid the ultimate sacrifice. Sean Brown, Sean Fox, Gerry Devlin, Martin McShane, to name a few God bless them. I would suggest that you read a book by a friend of mine, Des Fahy. He is a barrister and his book " How the GAA survived the troubles" is an excellent read and may help you have a more balanced view on the "North" and maybe an insight into why we struggle at times to reconcile with those responsible for so much pain in our community. Equally I understand that the Unionist people of this island as well as security force personnel have the same struggle. Your crass ill informed viewpoints smack of an uneducated throglodyte that I am pretty sure you are not, so take a while and view the whole picture and maybe you might see the error of your ways Good post. Would you agree that Militant nationalists were sometimes blatantly wrong in what the did, just as the groups you mentioned above

dhorse (Laois) - Posts: 11374 - 12/11/2009 14:01:56    482116

dHorse, give us an example.

wise_guy (Tyrone) - Posts: 1584 - 12/11/2009 16:19:09    482243

wise_guy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 692

482243 dHorse, give us an example.

jean mc conville, frizzels, the list is fairly long in my opinion. But i was thought yes might be your answer.

dhorse (Laois) - Posts: 11374 - 12/11/2009 16:34:42    482260

And dhores, I'm sure you know exactly all the ins and outs in each of these instances!!

wise_guy (Tyrone) - Posts: 1584 - 12/11/2009 16:55:47    482281

A huge number of posts on various subjects seem to end up in an argument or discussion about the troubles in the North in some form or another. This is of course a very relevant and emotive subject, but if people want to discuss it why not simply start a direct thread i.e. Was the Provo campaign justified. Then we could all jump in and give our penny's worth in as much as the administrator would allow us. But at present there are some very interesting threads being destroyed by this constant messing where the same posters jump in with the same comments draw the same fire from their opponents and its ground hog day all over again.

corkcelt (Cork) - Posts: 4388 - 12/11/2009 17:14:22    482302

dhorse I don't know why you would care about the goings on in the north truth be told most of the people in the south of Ireland couldn't have cared less what was happening the people in the north for the last 30 odd years, and as for patrique the more I read your post the more I see you are nothing but a rubbish talker all you want to do is wind people up and try and find some one who will back you up, you always have to try and be sensationalist----

fiannablue (Tyrone) - Posts: 326 - 12/11/2009 17:19:17    482305

wise_guy County: Tyrone Posts: 694 482281 And dhorse, I'm sure you know exactly all the ins and outs in each of these instances!! Murder is Murder.

AD (UK) - Posts: 29 - 12/11/2009 17:24:24    482309

wise_guy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 694

482243
dHorse, give us an example.


If you read my post take a look at the attack at lamh Dearg pitch in Hannahstown.

Or you could go to extremes and ban all of Tyrone from the GAA, along with all security forces.

Why Tyrone? Young footballer from elsewhere killed outside a club this year.

Now, could some of you be realistic.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 12/11/2009 17:25:27    482312

AD, that's true in a sense... but when a foreign force arrives in a country and murder people at will then there will be a reaction. For every action there is reaction.
But to call the defensive side of conflict terrorists isn't accurate either...

So was it wrong of the Polish, British (who requested American involvment), and the Russian's and French to resist the Nazi waft of plunder and pillage? Where they terrorists because they killed Nazi soldiers and bombed strategical targets and inadvertently killed innocent German people who where not directly involved with the war? Those French murdering terrorists!!

And tell me AD, dhorse, paddy etc, which side are the terrorists (or are wrong) in Afghanistan and Iraq or even Gaza?? Or when the American's invaded Vietnam, well those Vietnamese should have been grateful that the USA arrived with napalm to save them from themselves, not to mention the carpet bombing of Cambodia, well tricky dickie nicky was just trying to liberate the Cambodians!

wise_guy (Tyrone) - Posts: 1584 - 12/11/2009 19:37:14    482432

12/11/2009 16:19:09
wise_guy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 695

482243 dHorse, give us an example.
_______________

Paul Maxwell and for that matter the other three also

ruanua (Donegal) - Posts: 4966 - 12/11/2009 20:12:16    482463