He has tested positive for drugs - a sample taken during his 1999 Tour win has shown to be positive.

And leaving that aside, next you will be telling me that Flo-Jo was innocent because she was never caught? And, for that matter, Michelle Smith never had a positive test. Ben Johnson took steriods for 7 years before he was caught.

What is more likely, that a man, after beating cancer, can dominate a sport in which virtually every top participant has been caught taking drugs, and in which the riders themselves (including Armstrong) have protested against having random checks, or that he too was a cheat. Are we to believe that Armstrong just likes the company of the Italian doctor Michele Ferrari, a man who has tried to ruin cycling, just in the same way that Barry Bonds, Marion Jones and Dwain Chambers enjoyed hanging out with Trevor Graham at BALCO?

And again, perhaps you could answer my point about why Le Tour organisers would want to demonise him, at a time when, for credibility and advertising revenue, they desperately need a hero.

You are deluded and a sucker for a heart-warming story. Open your eyes, Armstrong is not good for the sport.

Thomas Clarke (Tyrone) - Posts: 1002 - 05/12/2008 14:56:07    157956

Caff01
County: Mayo
Posts: 43

157908 By the way Clarkie, Alberto Contador has never tested positive for drugs! Think you need to get the auld facts straight before printing
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And you would need to read properly before posting.

I didn't say Contador has tested positive, I said he had been tainted. Read it again.

And after you read it, perhaps you would post an explanation of why he and his team weren't in last year's Tour. Oh yes, it was because they were barred for 2 years of drugs scandals. And which team has Lance now joined.........

Thomas Clarke (Tyrone) - Posts: 1002 - 05/12/2008 15:00:16    157968

Loyal2TheRoyal
County: Meath
Posts: 1011

157950 Cycling is easily the hardest sport anywhere in the world.

I would have sympathy for any cyclist who tests positive because I know all of them are at it. Therefore, you are just unlucky if you happen to be one of the ones who gets caught.

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Ah come off it lad, you cant say that. Sport is sport, and if anyone is caught, regardless of what code it is, then they shouldnt be participating in the first place if they cant handle it. There are plenty of decent cyclists out there who dont need EPO...Lance, Contador, Hincapie, Fabian Cancellara , cadel evans, sastra.....you are insulting the endurance these guys have compared to the gutless spinless cheats who take short cuts. I'm surprised you said that actually, as normally you are the face of reason on this site!!!!

Caff01 (Mayo) - Posts: 124 - 05/12/2008 15:05:11    157979

re: samin10

yet a again a two line post throwing abuse at someone "Thomas Clarke" has backed up his opinion with something substancial (something that you don't do too often) and is entitled to his opinion.

You son are the *** nuf outa ya!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 05/12/2008 15:06:49    157982

Wrong Tomas

"Armstrong has continually denied having used performance-enhancing drugs and has described himself as "the most tested athlete in the world".[18] Throughout his career only one test showed indications of the presence of doping products: in 1999, a urine sample showed traces of corticosteroids, but the amount was not in the positive test range. A medical certificate later showed he used an approved cream for saddle sores which contained the substance.[19]"

I wonder why he might be have close ties with a doctor. For a start every team has one, secondly if i was putting my body through what he does after having brain tumors and cancer i might have a wee word with him now and again.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 05/12/2008 15:07:26    157987

You are deluded and a sucker for a heart-warming story. Open your eyes, Armstrong is not good for the sport.
Thomas Clarke , 05/12/2008 at 14:56
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If Lance Armstrong wins the Tour De France next year, it will be one of the great fairytales of sport.

Loyal2TheRoyal (Meath) - Posts: 4522 - 05/12/2008 15:09:13    157990

You are deluded and a sucker for a heart-warming story. Open your eyes, Armstrong is not good for the sport.
Thomas Clarke , 05/12/2008 at 14:56
____________________________________________________________________________

If Lance Armstrong wins the Tour De France next year, it will be one of the great fairytales of sport.

Loyal2TheRoyal (Meath) - Posts: 4522 - 05/12/2008 15:09:53    157993

MR CLARKE.U are talking complete bull. he is a legend. if he was caught for using drugs then why was he allowed to go on and win 7 tour de frances... cycling is a great sport to watch and i wish lance the best for 2009.

AskUreSister (Westmeath) - Posts: 160 - 05/12/2008 15:11:28    157998

Clarkie, again you are wrong.....

Caff01 (Mayo) - Posts: 124 - 05/12/2008 15:12:00    158001

"He has tested positive for drugs - a sample taken during his 1999 Tour win has shown to be positive"

Prove this statement.....! I want you to copy and paste from google or where-ever (believe me you will not find it anywhere) that says a sample he had has tested positive.....go ahead, I will put my caravan on it!!

The sample in 1999 has not been tested. The organisers wanted Armstrong to consent to it being tested, and quite within his rights he denied based on it being over 10 years old, and god knows who could put anything into it over that period of time.

Your arguement about the organisers and the vandetta is weak my friend. After all the drug testing positve tests that have been carried out over the years, the organisers cannot think that a man who has beat cancer could possibly win a Tour, hense they want to crush that fact and say "Hey, this is another man we have caught, who just so happens to have won the last 7 tours". This is a witch hunt...again based on the FACTS that he got tested 5 times more than any other rider during his day. Why do you think he has offered to put his testing results online for everyone to see. I am staing facts here Clarkie...you have not backed up one bit of evidence to prove your weak case!!! Come on, www.google.com awaits you...could be their for a while tho you clown

Caff01 (Mayo) - Posts: 124 - 05/12/2008 15:22:11    158019

Anyone who really believes Lance Armstrong has not used performance enhancing drugs is a mug. Their all at it and this is whats killed cycling. Just ask Stephen Roche.
By the way Horse, Happy Holidays to ya.

mossbags (Galway) - Posts: 1089 - 05/12/2008 15:29:34    158033

Thomas Clarke
County: Tyrone
Posts: 98
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And you would need to read properly before posting.

I didn't say Contador has tested positive, I said he had been tainted. Read it again.

And after you read it, perhaps you would post an explanation of why he and his team weren't in last year's Tour. Oh yes, it was because they were barred for 2 years of drugs scandals. And which team has Lance now joined.........


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Clarkie, are you not listening to me....

Fact....Lance Armstrong has never tested for positive for banned Substances
Fact....Discovery Channel / US Postal (His teams during his reign supreme) never had a rider that tested positive for drugs whilst under the leadership of Armstrong...hamilton and Landis after they left the team did alright, but never when part of his team;

You listed Contadors name in amonst a host of spinless cheats...people only have to put 2 and 2 together here..... Cycling in general is tainted...not just individuals. If thats the case, then the whole of the Kerry Football team is tainted by the AOM scandal.

Jes, stick to the facts lad....STICK TO THE FACTS!

Caff01 (Mayo) - Posts: 124 - 05/12/2008 15:35:59    158042

Thomas Clarke you can make all the spurious allegations you want based on circumstantial evidence. the FACT is that he never failed a drug test although the most tested sportsman in the world.

bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4653 - 05/12/2008 15:40:16    158049

samin10
County: Armagh
Posts: 1801

157987 I wonder why he might be have close ties with a doctor. For a start every team has one, secondly if i was putting my body through what he does after having brain tumors and cancer i might have a wee word with him now and again.
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One who is integrally linked with providing illegal drugs to cyclists? Im sure there are other doctors he could have found.

And Samin, I'll remind you below of what you posted about Aidan O'Mahony, who actually was an innocent victim of a mistake, and who was accused of taking a drug that would actually have impaired his performance. You are happy to believe in Lance, but not O'Mahony. You said:

samin10
County: Armagh
Posts: 1801


I think its even more amazing that everyone seems to know exactly what he had in his system, how much of it and why it was there. I dont think there has been a drugs cheat yet who has stood up and said yes i took it to give me an unfair advantage, thay always have an excuse. I am sure some have been innocent but if we believed every excuse there would be no point in doing the tests in the first place. Think everyone should wait and see before jumping to his defence as well.

Thomas Clarke (Tyrone) - Posts: 1002 - 05/12/2008 15:42:14    158052

samin10, that's more like it!

Hag_and_Cheese (Tipperary) - Posts: 6103 - 05/12/2008 15:43:44    158054

Hag

He posted something with substance? What he posted was wrong.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 05/12/2008 15:45:57    158061

Caff01
County: Mayo
Posts: 48
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I see you're down to the level of name-calling of other poster here, which is a shame, as you are obviously a sports fan, ilke myself, albeit one with a different opinion.

I'm a big cycling fan, I and watch Le Tour every year, with my earliest cycling memory being Laurent Fignon's 1984 tour win. Sometimes I evev let myself be fooled, like when Landis recovered so dramatically to win a couple of years ago, or when someone like Ulrich shows so much talent at a young age, you just believe that he is a freak of nature. Unlike Loyal, I don't believe they are all cheating, but I do believe that the very top cyclists are. On a level playing field, cycling is a fabulous sport, full of honour and men torturing and sacrificing themselves so that their team-mate can win. Unfortunately (and regrettably, because sport is more fun without cynicism), I don't believe that it is a level playing field.

I guess an opinion on Armstrong is something that polarises people. For me, it will always be too improbable and dubious, while you choose to beileve, and each to their own on that.

Thomas Clarke (Tyrone) - Posts: 1002 - 05/12/2008 15:52:31    158071

Thomas

I know what i said and i stand by it. The major difference between the two is one tested positive the other didnt. Has O'Mahony's case been heard yet? All i ever said about O'Mahony was to wait and see the results and reasons of what he had in his sytem. I find it strange that you can defend someone who has tested positive then accuse someone who has continually tested negative.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 05/12/2008 15:53:24    158075

I'm with TC on this one. How anyone can take cycling seriously is beyond me after the litany of drug scandals. Sean Kelly is about the only man I have regard for. You can test all you like but the dopers are usually one step ahead. Look how long it took to catch some athletes - but caught they were. For Armstrong to do what he did is incredible - to do it after his illnesses, to me, is unbelievable. Literally! Surprised at the heat in this debate and it is true that Armstrong has never been caught so innocent til proven guilty and all that. But to me it doesn't stack up .....

JayoCluxton (Dublin) - Posts: 2688 - 05/12/2008 15:58:25    158085

I for one give Armstrong the benefit of the doubt. he was prob the most drug tested athlete in the world during his prime and all results came back negative.
just because he had cancer doesn't mean he could not be world class. it all depends on the sicee(not sure about spelling) of the athlete. lance seemed to use cancer as a means to kick start his career instead of wallowing in self pity which is admirable.
Look we all hear about that he failed this or that test but in fact if had the cycling authorities would have came down on him like a ton of bricks.
i say the cycling authorities are licking their lips to get a chance to test him again

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2073 - 05/12/2008 16:44:46    158130