there seems to be alot of response to players not being able to commit to gaelic and not play soccer. wat about players that cant make a game because of a family affair? why is there commitment not questioned. wat about players that go on holidays? should their commitment be questioned.

how can you question the commitment of someone who plays for 2 teams, do they not have double the commitment?

graball (Tyrone) - Posts: 3 - 05/01/2009 23:28:17    173614

I have sat and read everything written on this site about Fintona and it simply disgusts me. People in the town know the truth behind what actucally happened and no matter how much crying in papers is done, the truth remains the truth. This "split" happened when the 2007 management team felt they could no longer tolerate the attitudes of a minority and resigned. There is a saying there is no "i" in team. For too long certain players could do what they wanted and start on the senior team that sunday and if they didn't they resorted to school yard behaviour, huffing. The committee had to take a stand and they have. They have the backing of the majority of club members and in a democracy majority rules. We have the numbers to field 2 adult teams this is an achievement as many clubs don't. Finally i would just like to wish all Fintona teams good luck for the 09 season, if we ever needed motivation, this is it.

fin_gael (Tyrone) - Posts: 4 - 06/01/2009 12:02:12    173793

It's good to see the responses of this topic, puts the rest of the bs on this site to the shade on how to have a discussion. i must admit, my mind has been wavered on this topic after reading some of the responses and many people outside fintona such as myself who thought they knew what this was about, simply don't. I agree with some of the arguements of both sides. i do believe no gaa club has the right to impose a ban on anything. what could it lead to? imposing a ban on kids attending the local theatre group because it meddled with scor nights? an exaggeration i know but...
however, knowing some of the soccer lads personally, i would say their egos always went before them, well before their perceived ability and it's a shame that it took this topic so long to bring up the bigger picture that is obviously at work here.
as a neighbouring trillick man i would hope the club sorts the problem out and is able to compete in the future at a level the club and the town could sustain.

milo (Tyrone) - Posts: 238 - 06/01/2009 13:45:35    173918

1.Soggy
2.Stephen Monteith
3.Niall Donnelly
4.Jasy Donnelly
5.Kevy Mc Girr
6.Paul Martin
7.Bernard Cassidy
8.Fergal Mc Cann
9.Sean Connelly
10.Aaron Mc Carney
11.Benny Mc Carney
12.Sean Monteith
13.Aidan Quinn if fit
14.Scott Gray
15.Marky Donnelly

Fintonian (Tyrone) - Posts: 5 - 06/01/2009 15:56:57    174083

Fintonian. Yes that looks like a reasonable team to start with. A number of questions need to be asked though. Will Stevie be back from Australia for the new season? Two of they guys named are likely to be involved in the Tyrone Minor and Under 21 squads. Is their commitment to the club going to be questioned or does this only apply to the guys who play soccer? The guy you have named at full forward is a class footballer; he has two Leinster Minor Gaelic Football medals. I watched him last week turn in a stunning performance for Fintona Swifts. He was told last year that he was no longer welcome, how is your club going to about encouraging him back into the fold? I would prefer Cass in the half forward line, as there is a need for some more size on the half back line? Also there is no room for Herbie??? I still wish the Fintona club success but success would be easier to achieve if we all worked together. Someone will have to start rebuilding the relationships which have been damaged by this ill advised policy?

ednasop (Tyrone) - Posts: 50 - 06/01/2009 18:56:10    174294

Correct me if i am wrong but club policy is based promotion of gaelic games and if certain players do make the county squads are they not promoting gaelic games?! To the best of my knowledge soccer is not a gaelic game.

fin_gael (Tyrone) - Posts: 4 - 06/01/2009 21:18:19    174384

Ednasop. I have been reading the posts on here with some interest and indeed the headlines also carried in the newspapers about the on goings of this club. I would fell you are at the centre of all this havoc, in an area where the elected committee are doing there be to promote gaelic games. Every club has difficulties no more than my own in Donegal with other sports, players picking up injuries playing these , lack of committment etc. I only wish my club had the bravery to do what the Fintona club has done an give the lads that want to play Gaelic Games a proper chance. I have nothing against soccer, but when you play gaelic you train for it together as a team not 7 or 8 on a tuesday and a few more on a thursday. As i have stated in previous posts I wholly congratulate the committee on their decision and when you see posts from current players backing it, it is clear the soccer boys were causing a problem. On that problem from reading various posts you seem to be the centre of attention and I would ask you for the good of your local club and for harmony in 2009 that you stop the sillyness of going to newspapers. Its school yard stuff. We all have to accept decisions we dont like. But as adults we move on and become stronger because of it. This is not about you, the soccer players, this is about the future of the GAA in Fintona. Finally, if the committee is that much of a closed shop, why didnt you all go tgether an oust them at your AGM. Probably because no one wanted their responsibilities and workload I would imagine. Dont knock them. Committees in all clubs work very hard all year in their own time and deserve credit for the way gaelic games has developed.

houserules (Donegal) - Posts: 165 - 06/01/2009 21:42:12    174410

Houserules. Yes but do not forget you started this debate, but I think this is a debate which the club should have had at the AGM in December. We are not allowed to disagree with the clique though. Maybe you are right but I am the only person who is prepared to stand up against the clique who runs the club. I am not a soccer fan I am a committed Gael but I feel that what they are doing is wrong; in fact I believe it is illegal!!! There is much more to this story but I am not at liberty to divulge at present. I do not really disagree with a soccer ban but the equality laws which exist here make this policy potentially illegal. The way this club has gone about this is wrong! This all happened a year ago but we were not allowed to discuss it at meetings during the year. They have thrown the baby out with the bath water. All I want to see is the 15 best players taking the field every Sunday. My family have been involved since the foundation of the GAA here. I have been a member all my life and have served in a number of positions on the club committee. The club needs to change otherwise they will be turning their back not just on me but on many other talented and committed Gaelic players and administrators. It is tearing me apart but I had no other option as they would not listen to me. I have been bullied and harassed and I could take no more of it so when they asked me to consider my position I took that as their cue for me to go. I have a great deal more to contribute but there needs to be a sincere apology first. I see that as a long way off so I will have to concentrate my energy on other projects. Hurling and Ladies football are looking favourite!

ednasop (Tyrone) - Posts: 50 - 06/01/2009 23:16:45    174527

its time to let the true gaels get on with the main thing and play football.Once the soccer boys learn to support fintona gaa and not act like children then things might start 2 cool down!!!

bmpms1 (Tyrone) - Posts: 10 - 06/01/2009 23:17:16    174528

To be fair endasop I think you have made matters worse for the club in general. You talk about these 15 boys (which in reality is much smaller) "who are being denied the rite to play gaelic football" - That is so untrue! They were asked to make a commitment and choose not to so, do you think its fair that they should get a spot on the first 15 when they refused to show the same levels of dedication that all the rest are. The were never told they wouldnt get playing - simply they wouldnt start which i think is a fair decision - but too many noses got put out of joint and they decided to boycot the club thinking that we couldnt do without them. Also you forget about the other 50 odd lads at training. You don't seem to think how all this is effecting them and not even the boys Im sure there are alot of the girl footballers who are 100% behind the committee. The committee are trying to do the best for the teams and they don't deserve to be publically harrassed for their dedication.

fin_gael (Tyrone) - Posts: 4 - 07/01/2009 10:40:20    174679

Why GAA is better than soccer 1) The GAA player who played in front of 80,000 at the weekend will be teaching your children, selling you meat or fixing your drains on Monday morning. The soccer player who plays in front of 80,000 will be moaning about playing too many games and will be trying to sell you his personalised brand of leisure wear 2) GAA nicknames are better (The Bull, The Bomber, etc.) Soccer players just add a Y to their surnames 3) Dublin vs Meath is a real derby. What does Utd. Vs City mean to Ronaldo or Sibierski 4) How many soccer players does it take to screw in a light bulb? Answer eleven. One to stick it in and ten to surround and kiss him after he does it 5) Soccer players go to the papers after a game. GAA players go to the pub 6) John Terry would run a mile if he came up against Francie Bellew 7) GAA teams are numbered 1-15. A soccer team reads like the lottery results 8) All soccer players wear shin pads. Some hurlers wear helmets 9) Television runs soccer. Schoolteachers run the GAA 10) The GAA is about where you're from. Soccer is about who you like 11) No segregation at GAA games 12) No soccer team has a nickname quite as lovely as the Fighting Cocks of Carlow 13) Bubble perms never made it to Croke Park 14) A scoreless draw in the GAA would be quite a novelty 15) The GAA may not appreciate its women as much as it should but at least we all know who Cora Stanunton is. The most famous woman in English soccer is Posh Spice 16) Under age players get to be part of the biggest days in hurling and football at half-time in the All-Ireland. 17) Micheal O'Murchearaigh. 18)If a GAA player ever jumped at a spectator like Eric Cantona did the rest of his team would join in. So would the rest of the crowd. 19) Vinnie Jones grabbed Gascoignes testicles. Paudie O'Se decked Joe McNally during the National Anthem. McNally learnt his lesson. Gascoigne just got worse. 20) The GAA season always leaves you wanting more. The soccer season leaves soccer people demanding less. "Fewer games please" 21) Old soccer players get testimonials, Old GAA players just slip down to junior. 22) Rural villages = A Church, A Post-office, a Pub and a GAA pitch. 23) Pints after the match with the lad you knocked seven lumps of ***** out of in the game. 24) Croke park on a Summer's Day.

Pairsaighs

If our Senior team win a Junior league or championship in Tyrone, then of course it is worth celebrating, but if that is all you aim for in the long term, then you have set low standards as I fell for a club like Fintona a junior title is not a major achievement. Maybe you are old enough to remember the team that reached the Intermediate championship final in 2001 and narrowly lost, this included players who have now been sent packing because they also played soccer. These same players also played in 2005 when we were just denied the Intermediate league title. Maybe you're old enough to remember the last time Fintona were playing Senior football, beating the likes of Ardboe and Dromore off the pitch? Wexford might be considered a success going by their standards, I don't know, you would have to ask a Wexford supporter if 2008 was a success despite winning nothing to show for it though they were no worse than fourth best in Ireland in 2008 than 33rd best in Tyrone when you win a junior title. If the rule in place carries on then if our Senior team does not qualify to play senior championship football by say 2012 or 2013 then this can only be seen as a failure.

Also what is bottle calling kettle black? I think you mean the pot, but do you condone members of our club committee giving out abuse to players trying to do their best on the field for our club? I can tell you it has not just been these players who also play soccer who have been on the receiving end and these committee men should not be surprised if they stand up for themselves.

Now maybe you can answer my other questions I posed to you, or maybe you will try to avoid them as well?

DonacaveyLegend (Tyrone) - Posts: 7 - 07/01/2009 12:29:30    174818

fin_gael

There is truth and then there is spin. Both sides on this matter, on the street, in pubs, in newspapers and on the internet are all quoting selective truths to suit themselves and ignore others. You and others in this discussion have said that this ban exists yet our committee says it doesn't! Now who is telling the truth? If it is not the committee then why are they lying and how can our membership back something that they claim doesn't exist? Also you say that many clubs can't field two adult teams but last year in Tyrone only Dregish were not able to field two adult teams for league and championship, so that is simply untrue.

You say that Ednasop is making matters worse? That I don't know but maybe things have to be made worse before they get better. I have never seen my club at such a low point in my life and I think it can get worse still. Your now claim that these soccer players simply would not get a starting place on the starting 15 yet the motion that was supposed to be passed by the committee was that any player that played soccer on a Saturday was not to be considered for selection on a game on Sunday for both the senior and reserve teams. Selection also includes naming your substitutes as well as your starting 15, so what is it? I will agree that there are quite a few soccer lads who had a high opinion of themselves but there are also a few lads who also play Gaelic only who also believe that they should be starting for the senior team by just turning up too and not putting too much effort into training! Also it does not matter what the ladies footballers think if they are not members of the mens club, they are their own separate club who I am sure have plenty to worry about themselves than get dragged into this mess which doesn't affect them. Why not ask the hurling committee too?

As for committee dedication, it does take a lot but in taking on such tasks comes responsibility that has the right to be questioned fairly, and if the committee members don't allow these questions to be asked in a fair manner then what road can be taken for these questions to be asked and answered?

DonacaveyLegend (Tyrone) - Posts: 7 - 07/01/2009 13:00:38    174845

Ednasop, at the end of the day the committee took this decision, an deep down they may regret it, but given the nature of the problem to back down would in turn give the wrong message too. I feel this is a personal grievance you have with the committee and you are now using this excuse to get at them. Look, I dont know anything about your club, but if like most clubs they need everyone possible to help in the running of things, dont you maybe think it is time you decided to bury the hatchet on this issue. Ok you want an apology. We can all want. You be the man here. Accept what has happened even though it is hurting you and move on. See how things go during the year and read out the club at the next AGM if you can get enough support. I must also comment on your best 15. Every club would love to put out their best 15 players but if they are not willing to give the same committment as the rest, I would class them as part of the best 15. Best players,committed players and lazy players are what makes up clubs. Give me 15 committed players any day. Lads that have pride in there jersey and parish, week in week out and not just when it suits them, will go a long way to achieving success. it may take a few years but it will work. it has in our club. We brought in a new manager a number of years ago, he got rid of the bad wood and in 3 years we had gone from Div 3 to Div 1 and have stayed there. Just an example of what committed players can achieve.

houserules (Donegal) - Posts: 165 - 07/01/2009 13:51:47    174895

1. "You and others in this discussion have said that this ban exists yet our committee says it doesn't! Now who is telling the truth? If it is not the committee then why are they lying and how can our membership back something that they claim doesn't exist?"

Have I ever used the word ban - No

2.Your now claim that these soccer players simply would not get a starting place on the starting 15 yet the motion that was supposed to be passed by the committee was that any player that played soccer on a Saturday was not to be considered for selection on a game on Sunday for both the senior and reserve teams. Selection also includes naming your substitutes as well as your starting 15, so what is it?

I believe I said "first 15"

3. Also it does not matter what the ladies footballers think if they are not members of the mens club, they are their own separate club who I am sure have plenty to worry about themselves than get dragged into this mess which doesn't affect them. Why not ask the hurling committee too?

There are ladies footballers on the Fintona Pearses committee, no hurling representatives

4. As for committee dedication, it does take a lot but in taking on such tasks comes responsibility that has the right to be questioned fairly, and if the committee members don't allow these questions to be asked in a fair manner then what road can be taken for these questions to be asked and answered?

It was the former parish priest who ended the debate on the issue at the agm and the person who issued the motion recieved no support from the floor.

fin_gael (Tyrone) - Posts: 4 - 07/01/2009 18:38:25    175247

Fin gael. This debate does not seem to be coming to any rational conclusion, simply more point scoring, and I am accused of being childish! As a former member of the Pearses committee I was in no doubt about what the motion was about. While the statement read by the secretary was innocuous in itself the ratio decideni, behind this were clear. The idea was to ban soccer and to ban any discussion on the subject. You will recall that at least one member dissented and specifically asked that their dissension be recorded in the minutes. Perhaps the only logical solution will be de jure! The reason there are two ladies on the main GAA committee is because it was a proposal from the 2006 AGM. It was decided that there should be representatives from both the Ladies and the Hurling clubs in order that the club could properly organise the use of facilities. Hopefully Cumann Iománaíocht Setanta will take up this option soon. As for the former parish priest. I do not think he or anyone else should be proud of what they did. The basis of any democracy is free speech; they would not even allow a discussion or debate to take place! The meeting was ended prematurely. Also what happened to the club policy on a three year maximum for Cathaoirleach? Is that another policy which they are going to claim does not exist???

ednasop (Tyrone) - Posts: 50 - 07/01/2009 22:13:32    175399

DonacaveyLegend you seem to know alot about meetings and AGMs in fintona club! You also seem to have a long standing gruge with the BIG TWO as you called them. You should put some of your energy into the club instead of running the club down. As for G Mc Carroll did he not stop playing for the Club as he was working in Sligo and now lives there! You must be going on alot of second hand information as there are flaws in alot of the statements you have posted on this site. Personal attacks will not sort rows out. This was a committee decision - not just one for the BIG TWO!

pearsesgeal (Tyrone) - Posts: 3 - 07/01/2009 23:08:56    175446

I personally think it is a real joke the whole matter.
I feel that anyone wanting to play for their club should be allowed and given the right to do so, whether or not they play soccer on a saturday.
I am from a neighbouring club who has people who play soccer on a saturday, and gaelic on a sunday. The whole beauty of gaelic footbal is to enjoy playing the game. If these guys are not been allowed to play for the club I believe they should be given the opportunity to transfer, to a club that will appreciate them.
Gaelic football is an ameteur game and this whole issue seems quite daft. If the club want to stand by and lose 25-30% of their squad so be it, I know our club could do with the numbers.

RedCol (Tyrone) - Posts: 9 - 08/01/2009 12:11:28    175679

Can we get some comments from the players involved in playing soccer to hear their views.

houserules (Donegal) - Posts: 165 - 08/01/2009 12:51:49    175723

Why should a club risk a player picking up an injury the day before a game and maybe an important game at that. Well done to the committee of Fintona Pearses. Take a bow and dont back down.

Can someone please explain to me this comment. If someone wants to play soccer it is of no business to anyone else. We are not under employment or contract to any GAA club as it is an amateur sport. What a player does it up to them. I would be more worried about players going on the drink before a match, then a not fit to play.

At the end of the day, people play different sports, some play golf, some play rubgy some go fishing. Now I would never consider risking death by drowning before a match away fishing, but eac to their own. If the Fintona Pearse have a monopoly on hobbies then that is one club I wouldnt want to be part of.

My own club tried one of these policies for a few players, and as half of the reserve team played soccer and were nowhere near the senior team, so they went on ahead and ENJOYED their saturday with a game of football, then could go out Sat night knowing they were not welcome on Sunday. I see a vicious circle there. It didnt last long, those boys enjoyed their saturday, stopped the booze on sat night and enjoyed their Sunday also.

Everyone is on about a GAA that welcomes everyone, at least everyone who is willing to give up other sports. Its about inclusion, not exclusion.

gottabetrue (Tyrone) - Posts: 300 - 08/01/2009 14:03:25    175791