Samin, is that the J.McEntee who came on as a sub when Armagh won the Junior Crown in 1926?

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 05/01/2009 12:44:15    173045

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 413

172460 Borderboy, from the ulster rainbow coalition i presume?
Berbatov is a player with a massive diving ability, i thought tyrone could do with another one...

Haha! You know as little about soccer as you do about football!

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12452 - 05/01/2009 12:53:36    173058

patrique
County: Antrim
Posts: 1534

173045 Samin, is that the J.McEntee who came on as a sub when Armagh won the Junior Crown in 1926?

No you know the one im talking about, but now you mention it he would probably be as usefull as McGourty. At least he wouldnt be getting in the way. Nah im only messing McGourty is a good player but he is not as good as you think he is, more importantly he is not as good as he thinks he is. Were you in Armagh yesterday?

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 05/01/2009 13:56:26    173123

You at the game yesterday Patrique?

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 05/01/2009 15:46:29    173236

TheMaster, I put your refusal to use the shift key when typing proper names of other people down to a lack of breeding (obviously not Master McGrath pedigree). Meanwhile, I note that you manage to cap up twice in your own handle!
I have no problem with people taking an interest in other sports or even befriending people in competing codes. Mickey Harte is perfectly entitled to share information and techniques with other managers, be they Alex Ferguson in English soccer or Brian Cody in Hurling. However, I draw the line at a presumption that we are all so familiar with English soccer on this GAA board that references to it are part of some universal lexicon. That attitude is a symptom of an intoxication that prompts people to suggest that buying 'berbatov' is an option for the Tyrone manager.
Finally, before accusing me of 'ignorance,' you might be best to learn some manners, some English and some keyboard skills.

Borderboy (Monaghan) - Posts: 277 - 05/01/2009 17:03:14    173336

Samin, I am actually serious about Kevin McGourty, although at times I feel I have to convince myself. In a few Sigerson's though he was brilliant. A serious player. What I am saying is I didn't realise how good he could be.

I know he has "attitude" problems, but still.

Mention of McEntee reminds me why I always think/thought that Armagh were a better side than Tyrone. They had better individual talent, bar Canavan. Marsden was a great player, if he had stayed around I think they would have won in 2004 or 05. Mind you, he was always injured.

But throw in McGeeney, McGrane, two McEntee's, McDonnell, Clarke, Oisin and Marsden and certainly Armagh had better individuals than Tyrone.

However I am also always saying that Tyrone do not conform to normal judgement, they are purely and simply a TEAM. All for one, and one for all.

And there was a J.McEntee in 1926. History counts.

And I was not in Armagh yesterday. when it comes to the McKenna Cup I support Queen's.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 05/01/2009 17:28:29    173363

bocerty
County: Tyrone
Posts: 255

172935 dellboy i see your showing your ignorance again - a word of advice if you dont know what your talking about its sometimes best to say nothing. Tyrone did indeed win a special all ireland hurling title the word special was in no way meant to be derogatory.


I picked it up wrong because i class these poeple like our selves humans but my mistake this time i took it the wrong way.

Dellboypolecat (Tyrone) - Posts: 15069 - 05/01/2009 17:48:32    173382

so now its the capital letters that are at fault... ur arguement Is so comprehensive anD complete, how could i possIbly have fallen at the ultimate Of gaa hurdles ->capital leTters...
So i shouldnt assume u know anything about soccer? But when push came to shove you actually did know who and what i was talking about, as did every other poster on the thread... So why pretend they dont?
And whats wrong with comparing the two? Looking at one and trying to improve the other? Thats how progress is made here in the real world... Take a look at the way mickey harte goes about mind games, very 'aleX ferGuson-like', surely a coincidence right?
On sporting terms they are very similar, they probably have as much in common as football and oz rules... The only conclusion i can come to is that ur dislike is non sporting related? 'English-man's game' i suppose, or maybe you just werent picked on the school team, either way it doesnt matter to me, im posting about gaa matters, and all the things that go along with it (including its similarity to soCCer)

you know i wasnt saying tyrone should buy players but merely looking at what the buying of a player is: an improvement

Ulster Coalition exibit A: Breffni

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 05/01/2009 18:07:58    173396

clearvision
County: Tyrone
Posts: 133

172897 Quite a good initial post actually. It does point out that as long as London includes NI as part of its realm, it wouldnt offer such awards to the most successful sportsmen in the country. Accepting such an award is a different matter all together.


Then on a more serious note, a bit of craic has turned Patrique somehow on to Antrims camogiers again. Again. Again. Again.

Can you blame the man for getting turnred on when you put camogie and craic together

dhorse (Laois) - Posts: 11374 - 05/01/2009 18:11:46    173398

However I am also always saying that Tyrone do not conform to normal judgement, they are purely and simply a TEAM. All for one, and one for all.

It's funny how people only seem to have taken this line in 08. In 05 people talked about our individual brilliance - O'Neill, Mulligan, Canavan, Cavanagh, Brian McGuigan, Dooher, McGinley, Jordan...I think you get the point. Eight all-stars in 05. Tyrone played a bit differently this year because of our lack of scoring power in comparison with 05, but that was due to loss of form in the case of Mulligan, and retirement in the case of O'Neill and Canavan. It was due to circumstances.

A couple of games in which defenders scored heavily led to all this talk about a system (360 degree football as the Sunday Tribune called it); that's all. Nobody in 1997/1998 etc, when the team under Harte really began, said "jeez, these guys have some system here!" Great piece of management nonetheless - i.e. to get the defenders scoring when we lacked a bit up front this year.

But if you compare the two line-ups of Tyrone and Kerry during the last twenty minutes of the all-ireland final, after Harte made a number of substitutes and Tyrone resembled the 03/05 line-up, and when Tyrone really came into their own, I think man-for-man we had as good as players as Kerry did. Also, I saw the 08 final recently, and it was fairly conventional. Davy Harte was the only Tyrone defender who scored. Why then did Kerry get beaten? I suppose it's been well-documented, and there's a number of different viewpoints. McConnell's leg. O'Shea's decisions on the line. Lack of discipline. Sean Cavanagh. Whatever. In general, the defenders concentrated on defence, unlike with the Wexford game. The "system" thing is somewhat exaggerated in my opinion, especially in the light of this year's final. Just my opinion.

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 05/01/2009 18:37:33    173423

patrique
County: Antrim
Posts: 1542

172648 Kevin McGourty is only challenged by Declkan O'Sullivan at centre half forward. He reminds me of McDonald, wonderful perception and distribution. He can however contest and win high ball at mid-field, unlike any other centre half forward I can think off. Mind you, there is a bit of a dearth in this position at the moment.

CJ has more natural footballing ability than any Tyrone forward. whether he has the team ethic, work rate, high tempo, tackle back and fill in at full back qualities, I am not sure. CJ did manage to score 4-6 in an Ulster football final, and 4-5 the following week in an Ulster hurling final so he has qualities not associated with Tyrone forwards.

Ciaran can win ball and distribute it and score.

Melissa is a fine camogie player.

Mind you they got it all from the da, who got it all from me when we were kids, so it is not a great surprise.

_________________________________________________

How come if Antrim have two such great players how come tyrone are capable to win all-irelands and anglo-celts with average players...

HokeyPokey (Tyrone) - Posts: 1744 - 05/01/2009 22:59:20    173588

Stands to reason Hokey, surprised you have to ask. Tyrone have the "system" devised by one Dessie Ryan according to The Tribune.

And 15 superstars do not necessarily make a good side, I did say any team does need workers, or water carriers.

And most of Antrim's better players do not play for the county as a rule. Elementary my dear Hokey.

And I take an earlier point that in 2005 Tyrone did have some star individuals in Canavan, O'Neill and Mulligan up front. I have never been convinced about Brian Mcguigan. This year until the Wexford game I kept saying but they have no scoring forwards bar cavanagh, and they need him to bolster mid-field. That was true, but the 360 degree football worked. McCullough was outstanding at Right Half Back against Wexford.

And to tell the truth, Antrim's defence is God awful. A talent like Sean Kelly is wasted.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 05/01/2009 23:14:02    173598

How come if Antrim have two such great players how come tyrone are capable to win all-irelands and anglo-celts with average players...

Because we have good team spirit etc i imagine - as if we're the only county who has a good work ethic.

MichaelO (Tyrone) - Posts: 820 - 05/01/2009 23:57:46    173628

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 418

173396
_________________

So now the presumption has gone beyond your obvious fixation on English soccer to include a general paranoia about anything that differs from your view of Ulster and the world. Again, I should reiterate that the word 'berbatov' (lower case 'b') meant absolutely nothing to me until you 'helpfully' explained that it is a 'player with a massive diving ability'. I used the wonders of Google to find out that Berbatov (upper case 'B') is a soccer player from eastern Europe and so on. I am more than willing to learn, but I thoroughly dislike the presumption that we all know about English soccer.
As for your juvenile assumption that my disinclination to follow English soccer is 'non sporting related' and symptomatic of an anti-English disposition, I should point out that I have a very healthy interest in Rugby Union and ice hockey. On the latter, I strongly support the Toronto Maple Leafs, having lived in Toronto for a considerable period. If you are such an ardent advocate of Manchester United, could I ask how long did you live in Manchester?
On school teams, I am proud of my role as a sub on our MacRory Cup team back in the day. I even got to line out against some 'greats' of English soccer. One that springs to mind is Martin O'Neill, a more than promising footballer before he opted for an overhyped game that seems to specialise in 'scoreless draws'.
While I don't presume to talk for every other poster on this thread, if you think that "buying" players is an "improvement," then you are obviously at odds with most people in the GAA.
Finally,now that you've found the shift on your keyboard, you could try to locate the 'apostrophe' key which might differentiate between "can't" as in "I cannot," and 'cant,' as in the 'insincere use of pious words'. Then again, I suspect you can't tell the difference anyway.

Borderboy (Monaghan) - Posts: 277 - 06/01/2009 02:19:14    173664

However I am also always saying that Tyrone do not conform to normal judgement, they are purely and simply a TEAM. All for one, and one for all.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

About time someone noticed, a TEAM. Football andd hurling are team sports. Individuals win little in these games. Its the best team who wins the titles.
The sooner alot of people realise this the sooner they'll start to compete.

clearvision (Tyrone) - Posts: 138 - 06/01/2009 09:06:41    173683

Well Patrique.

So McGourty could be up there with the best? Potential is a different story all together. My football manager used to say i was going to be the next Mark Grimley, my boxing coach used to say i was the next Ali, a few men in the golf club used to beg me to come to tournaments and play properly, said i could be really good. Where did it all go wrong? Potential, potential eh?

On the Queens subject. Armagh v Queens at Lurgan 2.00 on Sunday. One thing players not playing for their county to represent their uni's we will have Aidan O'Rourke gone this week too as he is Queens manager, bit of a strange scenario.

I agree with you about the Armagh thing, i also believe that if Marsden had of been there we would have had another in 04 or 05. I also always thought we were as good if not better than Tyrone from 2000 to 2006, no doubting though after last year Tyrone have the trophies. End off. But hey new year and new championship, roll on end of May to we get a crack at them.

For the record Antrim showed up pretty well yesterday, i know both teams were missing alot of players and its only January, first meeting and all that, but i thought Antrim showed alot of spirit and fight, they seemed like they were really determined to impress their new manager. Hopefully the novelty does not wear off, i fancy them to win their division 4.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 06/01/2009 09:14:52    173690

thats lovely borderboy, but you have assumed that all gaa fans know what google is, etc etc... We can all take a fesescious approach but whats the point? And the same goes with that rubbish about apostrophes, these arent english essays... Why not actually contribute to the subject of the thread?
No i dont follow man utd, nor have i lived there, but i have the capability to respect the talent of a team which has no relevence to me or my county. They play to an excellent style of their sport and would have a similarity to kerry in football... Wimbledon had a style similar to what we see some teams play over here nowadays. They done well for a while but were found out and are now languishing in the lower leagues...
Now I actually want to post on the topic of this thread so if you dont mind... --->

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 06/01/2009 10:26:54    173732

Ulster Coalition exibit A: Breffni

The Master -

You're not as clever as you think you are. You think you have a whole province worked out from you little perch in Mayo.

I have not made any comment on this thread other than to laugh at your assertion that Dimitar Berbatov "has great diving ability". This is simply incorrect. How you view this as some sort of Ulster thing says more about you than it does about me.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12452 - 06/01/2009 10:49:51    173746

No breffni, im actually smarter...
You just waded into the conversation, why not first take a look at what was initially said? That comment was a flippant response to another flippant response, in my view the only way to deal with them... If you want the full picture (and i doubt you do) why not have a look back and see what it was all about...However I do know ur comment was just an excuse to have a shot, because i have argued against ur views in the past... I mean, for god sake, are u actually telling me you rate how players are diving in the english premier league? research maybe?
And for the record Berbatov does go down easily...

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 06/01/2009 13:18:25    173891

The Master -

How does my comment about Berbatov relate to me being from Ulster?

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12452 - 06/01/2009 15:06:35    174008