|
Replying To alalalalalum: "we shall see if it is or not" How will it work? Who will pay for it? There's no worldwide audience. There's not even a majority of this country's tiny population that would say Football was their favourite sport.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 17875 - 10/11/2025 10:23:29
2643808
Link
0
|
|
Replying To PoolSturgeon: "Plaudits at least for bringing the thread back on topic. These kind of discussions seem to always descend into the usual childish stuff: "hurling good; football bad" or "football good, hurling bad". So tiresome." It is an interesting idea but would probably only work if arranged around the provincial structure.
Each province could select from non McCarthy cup teams or players who are not selected by McCarthy cup teams. It would need co-ordination with the lower tier fixtures and would probably mean that the provinces could only enter championship, not league. But it could offer every player the potential chance of playing in the MacCarthy cup and every supporter the opportunity to shout on a team in the competition.
Instead of the Joe McDonagh teams entering the MacCarthy cup at the qualifier stage, the provincial sides could join at that point. An open draw among the provincial sides and the two winners progress to playing third in Munster and Leinster.
slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6627 - 10/11/2025 17:47:42
2643888
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Claretandblue: "Utter nonsense, no Louth player would get within shouting distance of a Westmeath senior county team and we are average at the moment." I can't agree with you that no Louth player would get near the Westmeath team right now.Louth senior champions have beaten our third tier winners a few times in Leinster and Ringtown,Brownstown and St Brigid's have all produced county players in the last decade.
jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 1851 - 11/11/2025 08:57:18
2643927
Link
0
|
|
Who from St. Brigid's has hurled for Westmeath in last ten years?
Claretandblue (Westmeath) - Posts: 2508 - 11/11/2025 10:05:10
2643944
Link
0
|
|
Pointless targeting the smaller hurling counties with the intention of creating more competition at the top level. The likes of Mayo, Tyrone etc have their hurling areas but they are football counties. Mayo are a strong football county but even then look how long it is since they won an All Ireland, if the GAA pumped money into the county to create more hurling clubs and targeted kids and schools it would face huge resistance from the top football brass. The last thing they need is young kids and more areas of the counties getting a bigger interest in hurling at the expense of football. Anything that takes players away from football or they consider a threat will be fought. We already see how hurling and the players are treated in certain counties when they pose zero threat.
The counties the GAA need to target are counties where hurling already has a strong culture in certain areas and who lets face it are too small to compete at a high level in football so have less to lose. Counties where fans no matter of a football or hurling background will take to the team when there's signs of success because as counties they have been starved of it in both codes.
The likes of Westmeath, Carlow and Laois are the counties the GAA needs to target and help bring to the next level if they are serious about ever creating more tier 1 teams. There is less competition in hurling than football so if you can create a couple of strong counties they are already close to the top table. There are about 9 counties at most who can ever really realistically dream about winning an All Ireland. I don't mean at the moment but in general. It's crazy to think Galway are the most northern county to win an All Ireland in hurling. In Football you have around 15 counties who you feel if they got their **** together can build teams to win All Irelands. Maybe even closer to 20 if some counties had strong teams and a bit of luck. Obviously again I don't mean at any one time.
I spend alot of time in Westmeath in hurling country, and these counties are so passionate about hurling, it is their sport. There's something there to build on. It's not going to be an overnight project. Throwing big money at the top outside managers is also a waste when the talent isn't there to compete. This money and the help of the GAA on top of it should be used to put the proper structures in place for future generations. Grow the game under age, in the schools and build for the future. It'll take a couple of generations maybe more but it's the only way. Success breeds success, so the better counties get the more kids will want to get involved. A long term project.
But honestly I don't think the GAA care about this. They have their tier 1hurling teams that bring in the money and with Football being huge in the rest of the country that's enough for them.
Galwegian_Entity (Galway) - Posts: 10 - 12/11/2025 10:34:10
2644125
Link
0
|
|
Won't quote the whole thing, but think that's a very good and sensible post by Galwegian_Entity above.
Counties like Mayo and Tyrone where football is clear number one have little or no interest in developing new hurling areas, because of how it would take from football in those areas. Could say the same even of "lesser" football counties like Fermanagh or Sligo or Leitrim. They'd value reaching (and even losing) a provincial football final far more than they'd value winning a Nickey Rackard or Lory Meagher Cup.
But the likes of Westmeath, Laois and Carlow is where there could be progress made with hurling, and where there'd be a significant will within the county to do it. I'd add Kerry, Down and Antrim to the list. And possibly even Kildare and Meath, even though they'll surely always be "football number one" counties as well.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3312 - 12/11/2025 13:34:54
2644163
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Pikeman96: "Won't quote the whole thing, but think that's a very good and sensible post by Galwegian_Entity above.
Counties like Mayo and Tyrone where football is clear number one have little or no interest in developing new hurling areas, because of how it would take from football in those areas. Could say the same even of "lesser" football counties like Fermanagh or Sligo or Leitrim. They'd value reaching (and even losing) a provincial football final far more than they'd value winning a Nickey Rackard or Lory Meagher Cup.
But the likes of Westmeath, Laois and Carlow is where there could be progress made with hurling, and where there'd be a significant will within the county to do it. I'd add Kerry, Down and Antrim to the list. And possibly even Kildare and Meath, even though they'll surely always be "football number one" counties as well." Kildare and Meath have the growing populations to do very well at the top at both codes
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 17875 - 12/11/2025 15:00:10
2644174
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Claretandblue: "Who from St. Brigid's has hurled for Westmeath in last ten years?" Paddy Carroll played league and Championship with the county in the last ten years and Conor Slevin played warm Up matches if not league.
Happy?
jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 1851 - 13/11/2025 08:58:05
2644234
Link
0
|
|
Conor Slevin? Ah stop. Why not name Eamon Gallagher while at it. Paddy Carroll hasn't featured on a Westmeath squad in last ten years. We've had Noel Conaty, Ciaran O' Brien, Aaron McHugh and Conor Bracken since.
Claretandblue (Westmeath) - Posts: 2508 - 13/11/2025 09:26:24
2644239
Link
0
|
|
bad.monkey. This is an excellent point you bring up and it could also be looked at for football - to a point.
Some very good points made already. The county boards in non hurling counties definitely want to focus on Football - and its hard to blame them. ITs a wase of time trying to force the County Boards. So the GAA (currently Willie Maher) need to strip it down and build it back up again - properly. There are some amazing pockets of hurling in most "non hurling" counties. And these clubs need more help form Croke Park.
You can also look at weaker football counties and say their funding/training is miles off the top tier counties. For example Leitrim, Fermanagh Waterford, etc Football teams would have nowhere near the S&C, dieticians, coaches etc to top tier counties. The weaker hurling counties have fewer resources again!
So my thoughts are as follows;
1. Create a center of excellence (and I mean excellence) in each province - this can be used for S&C, diet, performance coaches, etc. This can be used for both football and hurling counties that want to avail of it. This will help even things up a bit from the very well funded counties. The stronger counties in each code wont want to us it. Croke Park & Provincial councils build and run them. The counties using them will pay to run them.
2. Take hurling away from the county boards for the most part and create a new Connaught, Leinster & Ulster hurling boards for the weaker counties - Kerry will have to be looked at separately due to logistics. They will have to work with County boards for fixtures etc as most hurlers will likely play football also.
3. The new board identifies clubs in each county that should be playing hurling.
4. Club league & championships are played across the province.
5. Counties will have to amalgamate to from county teams - plenty of discussion needed here but for example Mayo, Roscommon, Sligo & Leitrim. Leinster could have two.
6. Initially this will be funded by Croke Park but each county board has to contribute a fixed amount also. If successful they will become close to self sufficient after a few years.
These are just initial thoughts. But Something radical needs to be done to support both codes at the lower levels. Otherwise the void will only increase - both ways!
Seeking_silver (Limerick) - Posts: 412 - 13/11/2025 11:17:45
2644258
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Claretandblue: "Conor Slevin? Ah stop. Why not name Eamon Gallagher while at it. Paddy Carroll hasn't featured on a Westmeath squad in last ten years. We've had Noel Conaty, Ciaran O' Brien, Aaron McHugh and Conor Bracken since." The censors have been at work so i Will politely inform you that indeed you are incorrect.Paddy Carroll has a division 2a National Hurling league medal in 2019 when he played a number of matches.
jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 1851 - 13/11/2025 14:13:34
2644300
Link
0
|
|
I think there's a fair bit of wishful thinking about this (and I know this is very convenient for a Galway man to say) but there is no hope of , for example leitrim, fermanagh and someother counties ever becoming competitive and while there should be investment in hurling there, it's not the place where the most focus should be imo.
As above, Antrim, laois, carlow, Westmeath, Kildare, meath, Down, kerry have reasonably big pockets of hurling heartlands and with the game becoming more and more developed (for want of a better word) in the Liam Maac, there should be a huge focus on making sure they stay at least as competitive as they are now (and hopeefully more competitive).
I know it has been said ad nauseum here but the Joe Mcdonagh is a fantastic competition and I'd love to see some outside the box thinking to try to promote it more. I admit it's foolish to ask for outside the box thinking and then not offer any ideas! I would just love to see those games marketed better, and made into more of an event. To their credit I think Connacht rugby and some league of ireland teams have done that very well over the years to get some more casual fans in.
But talk of Cavan, leitrim etc is pipe dream stuff imo. There's hurling clubs in those counties and they should alwasy be supported (as they are) but the reality is in those counties they might have the odd spike (donegal beating kerry this year for exemple) but I think you'd be throwing good money after bad in trying to have them somehow competitive with top teams etc.
The merging thing is an interesting idea for those counties in fairness but incredibly tough to execute. (Apart from the mad man who suggested carlow and Laois join up, removing two counties who already do themselves proud). Three was talk of a joined up Ulster team a few years ago. But hard to know if the interest would be tehre. Is a Down hurler really goign to play as hard for 'Ulster' as he does for Ballycran or Down. or would down even be involved? where do you start? Is a donegal man going to have the same passion paying for Ulster as he does playing for Setanta or for Donegal?
Overdahill (Galway) - Posts: 82 - 13/11/2025 14:47:43
2644305
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Overdahill: "I think there's a fair bit of wishful thinking about this (and I know this is very convenient for a Galway man to say) but there is no hope of , for example leitrim, fermanagh and someother counties ever becoming competitive and while there should be investment in hurling there, it's not the place where the most focus should be imo.
As above, Antrim, laois, carlow, Westmeath, Kildare, meath, Down, kerry have reasonably big pockets of hurling heartlands and with the game becoming more and more developed (for want of a better word) in the Liam Maac, there should be a huge focus on making sure they stay at least as competitive as they are now (and hopeefully more competitive).
I know it has been said ad nauseum here but the Joe Mcdonagh is a fantastic competition and I'd love to see some outside the box thinking to try to promote it more. I admit it's foolish to ask for outside the box thinking and then not offer any ideas! I would just love to see those games marketed better, and made into more of an event. To their credit I think Connacht rugby and some league of ireland teams have done that very well over the years to get some more casual fans in.
But talk of Cavan, leitrim etc is pipe dream stuff imo. There's hurling clubs in those counties and they should alwasy be supported (as they are) but the reality is in those counties they might have the odd spike (donegal beating kerry this year for exemple) but I think you'd be throwing good money after bad in trying to have them somehow competitive with top teams etc.
The merging thing is an interesting idea for those counties in fairness but incredibly tough to execute. (Apart from the mad man who suggested carlow and Laois join up, removing two counties who already do themselves proud). Three was talk of a joined up Ulster team a few years ago. But hard to know if the interest would be tehre. Is a Down hurler really goign to play as hard for 'Ulster' as he does for Ballycran or Down. or would down even be involved? where do you start? Is a donegal man going to have the same passion paying for Ulster as he does playing for Setanta or for Donegal?" In terms of promotion ideas perhaps season tickets should include entry to McDonagh, Ring, Rackard and Meagher games too. So a football fan buys a season ticket but if their county is McDonagh level or below entry to those games is included.
A rights package for a game a weekend. TG4 the obvious choice but GAA+ and Clubber are now available as extra broadcasting options. They need to be visible to some degree.
Greater social media coverage. (Entire GAA needs to look at this too). Story telling, engagement etc.
More double headers with the footballers. Bring the games to the people if the people wont bring themselves to the games.
Not rush them and have their finals later in the season (like the Tailteann Cup)
trimmer (Meath) - Posts: 569 - 14/11/2025 10:43:56
2644414
Link
1
|
|
There are some good ideas above.
A combined Connacht or Ulster team would be much like having a divisional or district team in a county championship. So on whether (for example) a Donegal hurler would make the same effort for Ulster as he would for Setanta or Donegal - does David Clifford make the same effort for East Kerry as he does for Fossa or the Kerry county team?
Running the McDonagh Cup until a little later in the year, and doubling up the final with something like an All-Ireland senior semi-final, would make sense too. But of course that would involve having to break the link between the McDonagh and McCarthy Cups, so it mightn't be plain sailing all the way to get one over the line.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3312 - 14/11/2025 14:30:05
2644450
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Pikeman96: "There are some good ideas above.
A combined Connacht or Ulster team would be much like having a divisional or district team in a county championship. So on whether (for example) a Donegal hurler would make the same effort for Ulster as he would for Setanta or Donegal - does David Clifford make the same effort for East Kerry as he does for Fossa or the Kerry county team?
Running the McDonagh Cup until a little later in the year, and doubling up the final with something like an All-Ireland senior semi-final, would make sense too. But of course that would involve having to break the link between the McDonagh and McCarthy Cups, so it mightn't be plain sailing all the way to get one over the line." The link between the mcdonagh cup and Mccarthy cup is a joke, two complete mismatches. So pushing the mcdonagh cup forward would be a much better idea.
Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 2640 - 14/11/2025 17:08:25
2644470
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Overdahill: "I think there's a fair bit of wishful thinking about this (and I know this is very convenient for a Galway man to say) but there is no hope of , for example leitrim, fermanagh and someother counties ever becoming competitive and while there should be investment in hurling there, it's not the place where the most focus should be imo.
As above, Antrim, laois, carlow, Westmeath, Kildare, meath, Down, kerry have reasonably big pockets of hurling heartlands and with the game becoming more and more developed (for want of a better word) in the Liam Maac, there should be a huge focus on making sure they stay at least as competitive as they are now (and hopeefully more competitive).
I know it has been said ad nauseum here but the Joe Mcdonagh is a fantastic competition and I'd love to see some outside the box thinking to try to promote it more. I admit it's foolish to ask for outside the box thinking and then not offer any ideas! I would just love to see those games marketed better, and made into more of an event. To their credit I think Connacht rugby and some league of ireland teams have done that very well over the years to get some more casual fans in.
But talk of Cavan, leitrim etc is pipe dream stuff imo. There's hurling clubs in those counties and they should alwasy be supported (as they are) but the reality is in those counties they might have the odd spike (donegal beating kerry this year for exemple) but I think you'd be throwing good money after bad in trying to have them somehow competitive with top teams etc.
The merging thing is an interesting idea for those counties in fairness but incredibly tough to execute. (Apart from the mad man who suggested carlow and Laois join up, removing two counties who already do themselves proud). Three was talk of a joined up Ulster team a few years ago. But hard to know if the interest would be tehre. Is a Down hurler really goign to play as hard for 'Ulster' as he does for Ballycran or Down. or would down even be involved? where do you start? Is a donegal man going to have the same passion paying for Ulster as he does playing for Setanta or for Donegal?" And the reality of an Ulster team it will mostly be made up of Antrim players with a sprinkle from Down & Derry.
The odd outstanding player from Donegal & Armagh might make it but hard to see many from Tyrone (the great late Damien Casey comes to mind), Fermanagh, Monaghan or Cavan on it.
Past hurler (None) - Posts: 1019 - 14/11/2025 19:41:03
2644485
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Seeking_silver: "bad.monkey. This is an excellent point you bring up and it could also be looked at for football - to a point.
Some very good points made already. The county boards in non hurling counties definitely want to focus on Football - and its hard to blame them. ITs a wase of time trying to force the County Boards. So the GAA (currently Willie Maher) need to strip it down and build it back up again - properly. There are some amazing pockets of hurling in most "non hurling" counties. And these clubs need more help form Croke Park.
You can also look at weaker football counties and say their funding/training is miles off the top tier counties. For example Leitrim, Fermanagh Waterford, etc Football teams would have nowhere near the S&C, dieticians, coaches etc to top tier counties. The weaker hurling counties have fewer resources again!
So my thoughts are as follows;
1. Create a center of excellence (and I mean excellence) in each province - this can be used for S&C, diet, performance coaches, etc. This can be used for both football and hurling counties that want to avail of it. This will help even things up a bit from the very well funded counties. The stronger counties in each code wont want to us it. Croke Park & Provincial councils build and run them. The counties using them will pay to run them.
2. Take hurling away from the county boards for the most part and create a new Connaught, Leinster & Ulster hurling boards for the weaker counties - Kerry will have to be looked at separately due to logistics. They will have to work with County boards for fixtures etc as most hurlers will likely play football also.
3. The new board identifies clubs in each county that should be playing hurling.
4. Club league & championships are played across the province.
5. Counties will have to amalgamate to from county teams - plenty of discussion needed here but for example Mayo, Roscommon, Sligo & Leitrim. Leinster could have two.
6. Initially this will be funded by Croke Park but each county board has to contribute a fixed amount also. If successful they will become close to self sufficient after a few years.
These are just initial thoughts. But Something radical needs to be done to support both codes at the lower levels. Otherwise the void will only increase - both ways!" Kerry has loads of good quality hurlers that would hold their own at Liam McCarthy level Fionan Mackessy, Shane Conway and Podge Boyle to name but 3, they were beating Kildare and Offaly in the championship not so long ago.
The problem in Kerry is a lot of the talented hurlers are also very good footballers and in Kerry football pulls you in with the brights lights and recognition players get even at senior club level.
Past hurler (None) - Posts: 1019 - 14/11/2025 19:47:36
2644486
Link
0
|
|
Donal Og talks and talks about a Team Ulster. When London and New York are facilitated, should allowing counties to merge be a big deal?
Ulster - 8 counties without Antrim.
Connacht - 4 counties without Galway.
Leinster - Meath, Wicklow, Longford and Louth.
Would have to apply across league and championship. 16 counties represented by 3 provincial amalgamations. Just saying.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9322 - 15/11/2025 20:07:08
2644626
Link
0
|
|
Replying To legendzxix: "Donal Og talks and talks about a Team Ulster. When London and New York are facilitated, should allowing counties to merge be a big deal?
Ulster - 8 counties without Antrim.
Connacht - 4 counties without Galway.
Leinster - Meath, Wicklow, Longford and Louth.
Would have to apply across league and championship. 16 counties represented by 3 provincial amalgamations. Just saying." The 8 Ulster counties without Antrim would be a good bit stronger than the other amalgamations. Down were in the Joe Mcdonagh this year. Derry, Donegal and Tyrone were all in the Christy Ring.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 17875 - 15/11/2025 21:10:17
2644637
Link
0
|
|
Replying To Viking66: "The 8 Ulster counties without Antrim would be a good bit stronger than the other amalgamations. Down were in the Joe Mcdonagh this year. Derry, Donegal and Tyrone were all in the Christy Ring." They would be stronger than other provincial amalgamations. If so, so be it. Possibly Down are above amalgamation talk at this time. Terrace talk speaking you'd be looking at the following outside of provincial level:
1. Antrim
2. Laois
3. Carlow
4. Westmeath
5. Down
6. Kerry
7. London
8. West Ulster (7 counties)
9. North Leinster (Wicklow, Meath, Louth and Longford)
10. North Connacht (4 counties)
Again, just saying. Shooting the breeze like, in case anyone unnecessarily combusts! ;-)
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9322 - 15/11/2025 23:19:11
2644657
Link
0
|