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Viking there are many different options other than this ludicrous system. It is more biased against Leinster teams. Fighting for a third place finish and avoiding relegation at the same time. At one stage that was a worry for Wexford. The Munster championship is now hyped out of proportion. It was always competitive and some of the games were mediocre this year. There were huge defeats for three of the 5 teams. Ironically Waterford were not one of these and our tents are folded for the year. That's fine but when I look at team from a lower championship qualifying that is just not right. The same applies to Clare and Wexford. What if in this great system the game between Limerick and Clare had a bearing on qualification for third place. Limerick through this game as nothing at stake for them. It is a flawed system that does not need to be. The qualifiers was closer to being fairer if not totally perfect.
Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 3083 - 04/06/2025 02:26:38 2614719 Link 0 |
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When are you planning for lower tier counties to get experience playing higher tier ones if there is no League?
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 09:27:47 2614737 Link 0 |
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There were too many lopsided games in the qualifiers though. We beat Laois by 20 points in 21. Agree that the Joe Mac finalists shouldn't be in a preliminary QF, but that was agreed because so many Leinster counties got excluded from playing in their own Championship when the Round Robin came in. Personally I think the ideal format for real cut to the games was what we had in the late 90s, second chance for the Provincial finalists only, with Galway and Antrim or sometimes Down, usually the winners of Ulster and Connacht, playing the beaten finalists in a QF. But then the complaint was there wasn't enough games for everyone. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 09:36:13 2614741 Link 0 |
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With the movement between championship divisions Viking. How much do the current structures really benefit them? With what I've described the Joe mcdonagh winners get quality games in the all Ireland round robin the year they win it, then also the following year in the province Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3688 - 04/06/2025 10:44:28 2614755 Link 0 |
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One of the better proposals. To me it is backwards. The top teams play in the All- Ireland series. Yes there should be promotion and relegation but not up and down yearly. Then if the provinces want to use standings in the All-Ireland competition for their final or semi finals on a knockout bases fine.
Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 3083 - 04/06/2025 14:18:28 2614854 Link 0 |
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So if your system was in for this year if Laois lose to Kildare then Laois, Westmeath and Carlow would have had no competitive game against a tier 1 County at all? That's really pulling the ladder up altogether. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 14:39:37 2614862 Link 0 |
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So if your system was in for this year if Laois lose to Kildare then Laois, Westmeath and Carlow would have had no competitive game against a tier 1 County at all? That's really pulling the ladder up altogether. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 14:39:48 2614863 Link 0 |
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I agree the Joe Mac counties shouldn't be in the AI series. The other 6 counties are the top teams this year so should be in it. And are in it.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 14:41:22 2614864 Link 0 |
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I'm just shooting the breeze Viking, not suggesting I have all the answers. Are they really playing top opposition in the league? Would championship pace not be of more benefit in the long run? I did suggest the league could be played as pre season in Jan/Feb. Maybe to away with finals and just promote/relegate based on the table. That's inter county games from Jan-Feb, April - May then June-July but the calender is even tighter and shafts the clubs a bit. But here we are in Wexford out of the championship and the club groups won't start for another month, and the serious stuff could still be in October Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3688 - 04/06/2025 14:48:23 2614868 Link 0 |
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I agree the Joe Mac counties shouldn't be in the AI series. The other 6 counties are the top teams this year so should be in it. And are in it.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 14:50:13 2614869 Link 0 |
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I like the idea of Munster v Leinster matches in the round-robin, but I just can't see that system washing if the top two Leinster counties are to go through anyway, no matter where they finish. Just suppose Munster hurling really is so superior to Leinster hurling that every Munster county beats every Leinster county, and the table finishes like this: 1 - Limerick 2 - Cork 3 - Clare 4 - Tipperary 5 - Waterford 6 - Kilkenny 7 - Galway 8 - Wexford 9 - Dublin 10 - Offaly Waterford would have beaten both Kilkenny and Galway, but they (Waterford) would go out, and Kilkenny & Galway would both go through. It'd do nothing to quell the current complaints about "stronger" Munster counties going out, and "weaker" Leinster ones going through. Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2902 - 04/06/2025 14:58:19 2614874 Link 0 |
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Me too. Its a forum and Im stuck in a really boring wiring job. Think we should just get our collective #### together and be better on the pitch tbh Doyler. In the short term hopefully the dozen or so 21/22/23 year olds on the panel are practicing like mad in their free time, not just static striking but moving the whole time they are at a wall , doing their gym work every week so as not losing gains, eating well but not too clean etc etc. Hopefully the 4 or 5 lads that age who were injured are now fit again and doing the same, O'Hagan, Kehoe, Whelan, Dundon etc. And the other few lads who came out of u20 last year like Wickham and Parker, and lads from this year's u20s like Rowley, Byrne, and Roche. And then lads around 24 like Murphy, James Byrne, Mcguckin, Kelly, Clancy, the same. Hopefully 10 or 12 of them turn into really good Senior hurlers in 2 years time. And put more of an effort in at u20, put more money into team preparation, as Kilkenny did this year. Long term we should be looking at county winter hurling for all ages from u11-u17, as happens in Clare and Limerick, not just u12s which is what we have here. And better expenses for development squad coaches to encourage the best to apply. Again, if that costs more money, we should pay that money. We have spent enough on infrastructure the last good few years, thanks to Derek Kent and Michael Martin and their Boards we have some of the best facilities in Ireland. With no debt. Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 04/06/2025 16:02:17 2614896 Link 0 |
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The road we are heading down and pointed to by yere man Dempsey is the chasing pack are going to lose players. If for instant the same counties for every year do not play in the National competition and not hurling after May players are going to opt out. It is fine to say they need to do better but I am sure Wexford and Waterford are working their butts off doing this. The system has to be fair to begin with and the best 10 or 11 teams must be in the All-Ireland series. Not the case it jumps from the 6 to 11 with the 11 team the easy passage. It is not about giving anyone an easy passage you still must win. It is a fake provincial system to begin with. The three qualifiers from Leinster would be different if Galway were in their own province. This whole system for our national competition is a mess.
Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 3083 - 05/06/2025 00:41:58 2614978 Link 0 |
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Why must the best 10 or 11 teams be in the All Ireland series? That never happened before. There used to be 3 or 4 counties in the AI series, depending on year. That was expanded to 6 in 1997. Then 8 to accommodate the Joe Mac finalists when Leinster was shrunk so many hurling counties in Leinster couldnt participate in their own championship. Now you want to expand it to 10 or 11? Sure let's get a heap of Liam McCarthy trophies made, 32 or 34 or 36, and give them to everyone.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16110 - 05/06/2025 11:35:37 2615033 Link 0 |
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Completely disagree with you Canuck. Waterford are guaranteed 4 championship games every year with the current system, can you point to any time in the past when your hurlers had this opportunity? Your now parroting Peter Queally, who wants to change the system just because Waterford are struggling to get out of Munster. It's up to Waterford, and Waterford only to ensure your hurling summer is extended. I do agree that there should be at least 2 weeks between games, and this would extend the RR into June. However, having 10 or 11 teams in an AI series would be a complete disaster. Where's the jeopardy? Where's the excitement if every hurling county is progressing? How many meaningless games would there be? Who would attend all these games? Come on lad, get a grip
bloodandbandage (Cork) - Posts: 396 - 05/06/2025 11:49:09 2615035 Link 0 |