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Football Format Changes Discussion

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How about this:
- Revert to 2-tier, 'leagues of 16'
- 2 'mixed quality' groups of 8 in each tier
- 7 game round robin
- Tier 1 'top 6s' & Tier 2 'top 2s' (12+4) to 'Sam 16'
- Tier 1 'top 4s' (8) get double chance (like Rd 2A now); and
'Other 8 teams' to KO (like Rd 2B now)
- 'Sam 16' play Tier 1 league the next year (4 up, 4 down)
- Others to 'Tailteann 16' (T1 7/8, T2 3/4, double chance)

- Option 1: League is '8v8' inter-group (4 home, 4 away)
- Option 2: Tier 2 group winners & Tailteann Finalists go or
stay up (variable 2-4 up, 2-4 down)

While the prior 'Proposal B, Team 6 issue' was flawed, could we accept a possible 'Team 13' version above instead? - difference being 'Team 6' would always stay up and miss the Sam Playoffs, while 'Team 13' would always go down and play in the Tailteann Playoffs (reprieved from going down if a TC Finalist under Option 2).

omahant (USA) - Posts: 3434 - 27/05/2026 15:26:15    2676058

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Again its all about Kerry. When will you all stop fixating on them. There are 4 provincial championships. Why diminish 3 because you dont like one county? That seems petty to me. You are diminishing your own counties achievements in doing so. Imagine Rossies got a week or so to celebrate the achievement (WM too or other 2) and 2 weeks to prepare. No Tyrone to bring everyone back down to earth. Forget about Kerry. No matter what format is applied that will remain the case. Or do you want to diminish Roscommons achievement."
Was just making an observation.
Certainly not diminishing our great Connacht Final win.

Seanfan (Roscommon) - Posts: 599 - 27/05/2026 17:02:02    2676110

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "There would be a reason. They would be already qualified for the quarter final through winning the provincial championship.
The other 12 teams would be battling it out to join them.
If you lose your first game you are not automatically out. You need to win your last game of course but the team that beat you have to win their other game also. In a 3 team group I dont think head to head result would be agreeable at all. If you prefer 4 groups of 4 so be it. I just dont think 3 matches to lose 1 team is efficient. I also think that the preliminary qf round puts pressure on the schedule and players physically.
That said, the current system is mad that way. You could, in theory , have to play extra time and pens in every single round."
Groups of 4 are not great either and splitting the field into 4 is also not great. It's why the 4 by 4 doesn't work very well and why it hasn't stuck.

It's why what I'd actually prefer is 2 groups of 8 or 2 groups of 6. You could have 3 going from those groups into a last 6 which is an high qualifying standard and you could have the bottom teams playing to maintain their place in the top tier.

We have a tiered championship in football but don't use it to get more games in by using it to decide relegation.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4689 - 28/05/2026 06:55:23    2676201

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Replying To Seanfan:  "Was just making an observation.
Certainly not diminishing our great Connacht Final win."
Yea I know but it was your first and only observation. Everyone is fixated with Kerry and they love it.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 498 - 28/05/2026 15:53:27    2676313

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Groups of 4 are not great either and splitting the field into 4 is also not great. It's why the 4 by 4 doesn't work very well and why it hasn't stuck.

It's why what I'd actually prefer is 2 groups of 8 or 2 groups of 6. You could have 3 going from those groups into a last 6 which is an high qualifying standard and you could have the bottom teams playing to maintain their place in the top tier.

We have a tiered championship in football but don't use it to get more games in by using it to decide relegation."
Im not sure what you mean by splitting the field into 4? If you mean seedings I think its necessary to ensure balance.
The 4 groups of 4 worked okay. People just dont really know what to do and when you invite them to tinker with it tinker they will. If it had been left alone I think it would have bedded in and became normal in a few years. We are back to square one now with another seriously flawed system that will be tinkered with again. It should be given to Jim Gavins committee to sort. They have proven themselves to be competent.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 498 - 28/05/2026 15:58:56    2676315

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Im not sure what you mean by splitting the field into 4? If you mean seedings I think its necessary to ensure balance.
The 4 groups of 4 worked okay. People just dont really know what to do and when you invite them to tinker with it tinker they will. If it had been left alone I think it would have bedded in and became normal in a few years. We are back to square one now with another seriously flawed system that will be tinkered with again. It should be given to Jim Gavins committee to sort. They have proven themselves to be competent."
Splitting the field into 4 is that there are 4 groups. It keeps top teams apart too much.

4 groups of 4 could be ok if 2 progressed and bottom of each group was relegated.

Groups of 4 with 2 through and 2 out aren't great in the GAA because there are few draws and it's regularly the case that the teams are decided before the final round of fixtures. That's why the Super 8s weren't great (and because there weren't other tiers). It's why3 teams went through from the group stage when the 4 groups of 4 system was brought in but that was low stakes with 3 from 4 progressing.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4689 - 28/05/2026 16:24:42    2676326

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Im not sure what you mean by splitting the field into 4? If you mean seedings I think its necessary to ensure balance.
The 4 groups of 4 worked okay. People just dont really know what to do and when you invite them to tinker with it tinker they will. If it had been left alone I think it would have bedded in and became normal in a few years. We are back to square one now with another seriously flawed system that will be tinkered with again. It should be given to Jim Gavins committee to sort. They have proven themselves to be competent."
Good idea.

Seanfan (Roscommon) - Posts: 599 - 28/05/2026 16:48:03    2676336

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Splitting the field into 4 is that there are 4 groups. It keeps top teams apart too much.

4 groups of 4 could be ok if 2 progressed and bottom of each group was relegated.

Groups of 4 with 2 through and 2 out aren't great in the GAA because there are few draws and it's regularly the case that the teams are decided before the final round of fixtures. That's why the Super 8s weren't great (and because there weren't other tiers). It's why3 teams went through from the group stage when the 4 groups of 4 system was brought in but that was low stakes with 3 from 4 progressing."
Relegated where? Are you seriously advocating 4 teams be relegated from the Sam Maguire each year while, simultaneously, arguing that there should be no seeding as that keeps the best teams apart? So, if Kerry, Armagh, Galway and Dublin ( just picking 4 big teams randomly) were drawn together under your system one of them would play TC the following year? Really?.
As i said previously im in favour of 4 groups of 4 seeded properly with the top 2 coming out. However this is the GAA and, for some reason, every game has to have meaning in the GAA or the pundits, media, armchair and keyboard warriors have a fit and demand change.
Taking that into consideration the 3 our of each group was a reasonable compromise and should have been allowed to develop over 5 years minimum.
What we have now is ridiculous

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 498 - 28/05/2026 20:20:40    2676363

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Relegated where? Are you seriously advocating 4 teams be relegated from the Sam Maguire each year while, simultaneously, arguing that there should be no seeding as that keeps the best teams apart? So, if Kerry, Armagh, Galway and Dublin ( just picking 4 big teams randomly) were drawn together under your system one of them would play TC the following year? Really?.
As i said previously im in favour of 4 groups of 4 seeded properly with the top 2 coming out. However this is the GAA and, for some reason, every game has to have meaning in the GAA or the pundits, media, armchair and keyboard warriors have a fit and demand change.
Taking that into consideration the 3 our of each group was a reasonable compromise and should have been allowed to develop over 5 years minimum.
What we have now is ridiculous"
What I'm saying is that there should be 2 groups of 8 with relegation.

4 groups of 4 is bad because teams are kept apart too much when seeding, but I'm not against seeding I'm against there being 4 groups.

In terms of relegation, I'd have 12 teams staying in Sam plus the Tailteann winner plus any non qualified Provincial champions plus however many from the league needed to make up 16. In the unlikely event of 4 Provincial winners being outside those 13 qualified at the start then there needs to be a playoff to lose 1 team.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4689 - 29/05/2026 12:08:18    2676411

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "Relegated where? Are you seriously advocating 4 teams be relegated from the Sam Maguire each year while, simultaneously, arguing that there should be no seeding as that keeps the best teams apart? So, if Kerry, Armagh, Galway and Dublin ( just picking 4 big teams randomly) were drawn together under your system one of them would play TC the following year? Really?.
As i said previously im in favour of 4 groups of 4 seeded properly with the top 2 coming out. However this is the GAA and, for some reason, every game has to have meaning in the GAA or the pundits, media, armchair and keyboard warriors have a fit and demand change.
Taking that into consideration the 3 our of each group was a reasonable compromise and should have been allowed to develop over 5 years minimum.
What we have now is ridiculous"
The previous system was low stakes 3 from 4 going through is silly and it was bad for scheduling.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4689 - 29/05/2026 12:09:47    2676412

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Replying To Whammo86:  "The previous system was low stakes 3 from 4 going through is silly and it was bad for scheduling."
So do we want teams playing football into the summer or dont we? That really is the question.
The provincial system is going to remain and, most likely, remain in its current position in the calender. Its over by mid May. I dont know a better system that keeps as many teams as possible playing football through June than the group system. So we need to decide, do we want high stakes knockout football or do we want as many teams as possible playing football through June followed by high stakes knockout football.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 498 - 29/05/2026 13:37:17    2676437

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "So do we want teams playing football into the summer or dont we? That really is the question.
The provincial system is going to remain and, most likely, remain in its current position in the calender. Its over by mid May. I dont know a better system that keeps as many teams as possible playing football through June than the group system. So we need to decide, do we want high stakes knockout football or do we want as many teams as possible playing football through June followed by high stakes knockout football."
I've addressed this already, we want meaningful games, high stakes games.

You can have that with 2 groups of 8 with 3 from each going through where there is a high bar to progress.

With there being relegation decided by that championship it means that there's still something to play for, for weaker teams.

Having a tiered championship where there's relegation allows for more games and there being an intense competition. That's what gets people excited. Having a format where a team could progress by getting 1 point in 3 games doesn't have intensity.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4689 - 30/05/2026 07:00:01    2676527

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Go back to old qualifier system. Allow the early fallers play simultaneously to the provincial. Ridiculous that teams like Mayo Derry Louth Donegal etc have been idle for weeks while the provincial finalists have had a game every fortnight for last 6-8 weeks accumulating injuries. Leaves some teams at an advantage and some at a disadvantage.

Chops (Westmeath) - Posts: 898 - 30/05/2026 11:51:03    2676541

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Replying To Chops:  "Go back to old qualifier system. Allow the early fallers play simultaneously to the provincial. Ridiculous that teams like Mayo Derry Louth Donegal etc have been idle for weeks while the provincial finalists have had a game every fortnight for last 6-8 weeks accumulating injuries. Leaves some teams at an advantage and some at a disadvantage."
We voted that out by 90% back in 2022.
We came up with a new system so teams would get more games and into later in the season.
We voted that out after 2 years by about 92%.
We're 2 weeks into a new AI system and nobody likes it or its anomalies.

What next?

PS hurling was tricking around with systems for 10 or 15 years until the football quarter finals round Robin came in. Then they jumped into their current system as a response.

Tadhg's suggestion of a Jim Gavin type committee has merit as we dont need media and presidential knee jerks driving new systems every couple of years.

Seanfan (Roscommon) - Posts: 599 - 30/05/2026 12:33:01    2676551

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Replying To Chops:  "Go back to old qualifier system. Allow the early fallers play simultaneously to the provincial. Ridiculous that teams like Mayo Derry Louth Donegal etc have been idle for weeks while the provincial finalists have had a game every fortnight for last 6-8 weeks accumulating injuries. Leaves some teams at an advantage and some at a disadvantage."
How do they have a game every fortnight in Munster? Kerry played a tailteann cup failure in Clare, and then Cork,who played a couple of strong football counties to make it to a final! If Kerry were not in league final, at least that gave them some match time.

Expertinall (UK) - Posts: 122 - 30/05/2026 12:56:46    2676556

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Replying To Seanfan:  "We voted that out by 90% back in 2022.
We came up with a new system so teams would get more games and into later in the season.
We voted that out after 2 years by about 92%.
We're 2 weeks into a new AI system and nobody likes it or its anomalies.

What next?

PS hurling was tricking around with systems for 10 or 15 years until the football quarter finals round Robin came in. Then they jumped into their current system as a response.

Tadhg's suggestion of a Jim Gavin type committee has merit as we dont need media and presidential knee jerks driving new systems every couple of years."
It's the skewed, unbalanced provincial systems that start everything off on the wrong foot! Balance that, and end with 16 teams, almost any format works thereafter. Grasp the nettle and reallocate counties fairly into four groups, all with similar teams based on league final placings.
I'm off now to put my tin hat on : )

Expertinall (UK) - Posts: 122 - 30/05/2026 13:04:37    2676558

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