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National Football League 2023

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Replying To omahant:  "Yes, but did Monaghan 'beat' Mayo (or a lesser opponent) - and with their reliance on a Tyrone victory as well - they apparently were "not asking for trouble"."
Armagh can only blame themselves.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8773 - 26/03/2023 17:28:36    2466788

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Replying To omahant:  "This is a prime example of where round robins are incorrectly argued as being "fair" - sure, everyone plays everyone else - but, the 'just not under the same conditions' part gets glossed over.

To my mind, partial round robins where all play an incomplete equally-mixed slate of different fixtures is no less effective and it facilitates a greater number of teams taking part.

As an example, if you split an enlarged 12-team Div 1 into three equally-ranked groups, where all play teams from outside their group instead, they'd play 8 games, in lieu of an 11-game round robin.

In 2024, the UEFA Champions League is going to a new format - 8 matches per team, contributing to a combined 36-team table, with no groups - let's see how it goes, jury is still out."
Your alternative just replaces a system which can potentially be unfair in circumstances where a team has nothing to play for in the last game, with one which is even more unfair.
In your suggested format, you'll still have teams with nothing to play for at the end, but you're adding in the extra imbalance of teams in the same group playing different opponents to each other. Some teams will inevitably get an easier draw, which will help then finish above a team with a tougher run of fixtures.
Just because one system isn't perfectly fair, doesn't mean it should be replaced with something more imbalanced.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2318 - 26/03/2023 17:37:31    2466794

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Replying To MonaghanBoi:  "3 ulster final appearances including 1 win. For a population of 65,000 people and only 30 odd clubs we see staying in division 1 as an achievement. Anf some of the best footballers in the country. On the other hand, Derry have 1 ulster final win and appearances in 9 years. With a population of 110,000 and 40 clubs. I'd say that's bit of an under achievement."
You also have to remove much of the Derry city population too. Derry will be a king pin of football during the whole 2020's.

PattyONeill (Derry) - Posts: 263 - 26/03/2023 17:38:48    2466795

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Replying To PattyONeill:  "Derry could win the Ulster championship easily enough by the look of it"
And the All Ireland too, no doubt about it. Probably should end the season now and hand out the medals.

PolicemanFox (Monaghan) - Posts: 191 - 26/03/2023 17:55:58    2466810

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Replying To endgame:  "Armagh won't be sending any bouquets to Mayo. Mayo playing a largely second string team played a big part in relegating Armagh. Mayo at full tilt would have beaten Monaghan. There's an unfairness there somewhere."
Mayo's jobs is too look after Mayo's interests. Not their job to help Armagh or anyone else.

PolicemanFox (Monaghan) - Posts: 191 - 26/03/2023 18:00:02    2466811

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Replying To PattyONeill:  "You also have to remove much of the Derry city population too. Derry will be a king pin of football during the whole 2020's."
God between us and all harm, they will have to pay people to go to watch football.

tireoghainabu (Tyrone) - Posts: 390 - 26/03/2023 18:01:38    2466813

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Replying To PattyONeill:  "You also have to remove much of the Derry city population too. Derry will be a king pin of football during the whole 2020's."
Why would I have to remove much of the derry city population?

MonaghanBoi (Monaghan) - Posts: 55 - 26/03/2023 18:15:38    2466822

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Replying To PolicemanFox:  "Mayo's jobs is too look after Mayo's interests. Not their job to help Armagh or anyone else."
Not the point at all which is a scheduling issue as another poster pointed out and Monaghan benefitted today and Armagh lost out. Definitely unfair but them's the breaks I suppose. Monaghan took advantage so the best of luck to them. Armagh have plenty of good footballers and will be back but I think they need a change from Kieran Mcgeeney at the helm.

endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2393 - 26/03/2023 18:27:11    2466833

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Replying To PattyONeill:  "You also have to remove much of the Derry city population too. Derry will be a king pin of football during the whole 2020's."
Where were they in 2021 ??????

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2289 - 26/03/2023 18:27:52    2466834

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Replying To PolicemanFox:  "Mayo's jobs is too look after Mayo's interests. Not their job to help Armagh or anyone else."
Exactly. Mayo have a league final and a Connacht quarter-final the next two weekends. Today was the sensible day for them to utilise their squad.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8773 - 26/03/2023 18:35:13    2466840

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Replying To endgame:  "Armagh won't be sending any bouquets to Mayo. Mayo playing a largely second string team played a big part in relegating Armagh. Mayo at full tilt would have beaten Monaghan. There's an unfairness there somewhere."
Armagh had plenty of other chances to secure safety. And anyway, Mayo had Armagh well beaten in the Athletic Grounds earlier in the league, but the ref seemed determined to make a draw of it and handed Armagh a point that day. It all works out in the end.
Monaghan do it again.

Eddie the Exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 1201 - 26/03/2023 18:49:43    2466849

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Replying To endgame:  "Not the point at all which is a scheduling issue as another poster pointed out and Monaghan benefitted today and Armagh lost out. Definitely unfair but them's the breaks I suppose. Monaghan took advantage so the best of luck to them. Armagh have plenty of good footballers and will be back but I think they need a change from Kieran Mcgeeney at the helm."
All of Armaghs talents and flaws were visible during the league. The seem to have a lot of talent, but when it comes to the crunch they are beatable by all the top teams and can't seem to do anything about it. Today was another example where they had a chance to cement their DIvision 1 status but couldn't get the job done. Donegal apart pretty much all the other div 1 teams will be happy enough so far. Armagh on the other hand are now heading into the championship on down note.

PolicemanFox (Monaghan) - Posts: 191 - 26/03/2023 19:09:49    2466862

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Replying To PattyONeill:  "You also have to remove much of the Derry city population too. Derry will be a king pin of football during the whole 2020's."
As a City man there can be no doubt that soccer is the primary sport. Derry City FC draw 3500 to their matches every other week. But Gaelic football is growing hugely in the City. At the last count in the City there were 5500 kids playing soccer and 4300 playing Gaelic Football. I would imagine the City will start to produce 3-4 top footballers over the next 5-6 years all being well. There has been a huge push in the city to promote our Gaelic games and it is great to see

Jazzyjeff (Derry) - Posts: 212 - 26/03/2023 20:15:09    2466893

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I thought it has been a fantastic league this year in all the divisions. Some great results and exciting promotions etc. On division one Monaghan survive again. Unreal. Surprised and sorry to see Armagh go down. A very talented team and unlucky in a couple of games. Would nt write them off in the championship if they find the right positions for certain players. Rossies a breath of fresh air. Hope Donegal sort out their off field problems. Looking forward to the finals now.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3901 - 26/03/2023 20:16:18    2466894

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "I thought it has been a fantastic league this year in all the divisions. Some great results and exciting promotions etc. On division one Monaghan survive again. Unreal. Surprised and sorry to see Armagh go down. A very talented team and unlucky in a couple of games. Would nt write them off in the championship if they find the right positions for certain players. Rossies a breath of fresh air. Hope Donegal sort out their off field problems. Looking forward to the finals now."
More of the same next year, fixtures out and then plan a weekend in Kerry. Would like to see smaller numbers in league and play home and away.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2289 - 26/03/2023 21:18:50    2466921

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Replying To endgame:  "Armagh won't be sending any bouquets to Mayo. Mayo playing a largely second string team played a big part in relegating Armagh. Mayo at full tilt would have beaten Monaghan. There's an unfairness there somewhere."
It was Tyrone who beat Armagh fair and square and I'd say they owed them one for last years fiasco. Red cards that gave Tyrone a very bad start to the year .

border Gael (Monaghan) - Posts: 909 - 26/03/2023 21:33:05    2466927

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Replying To MonaghanBoi:  "Why would I have to remove much of the derry city population?"
A lot of the city population are Protestant and wouldn't be playing GAA. Fermanagh have only 21 clubs and a sizeable Protestant population too. For them to get promoted to division 2 is some achievement too

leitrim4sam (Leitrim) - Posts: 698 - 26/03/2023 21:46:59    2466933

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This talk of Armagh being unlucky to go down is a load of nonsense tbh, the league table doesn't lie at the end of it all. They'd have stayed up if they deserved to. They were fortunate to get the point from the Mayo game, and even in the game against us they were lucky to get that goal when Beggan lost his head - which proved crucial in the end.

And in terms of us being lucky with having Mayo with nothing to play for on the last day, that's just the luck of the draw. The last couple of years we were playing in games where it was all on the line for both sides. We got the luck of the draw this year, someone else will likely benefit from it next year.

patk (Monaghan) - Posts: 938 - 27/03/2023 09:30:47    2466978

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Well done to Monaghan and hard luck to Armagh . I think Donegal can have no complaints.
In the vagaries of the league , I think that Armagh can feel aggrieved , but I think that no-one can begrudge Monaghan.
It all really highlights how tight the league was. Galway in league final and were extremely lucky to draw with Donegal and beat Armagh by 2 points, and both those teams are relegated.
One other interesting stat. Connacht teams got 20 out of a possible 24 points ( 83%) against non Connacht opposition ( excluding Monaghan).
Connacht teams got 2 out of a possible 6 points ( 33%) against Monaghan.

anotheralias (Galway) - Posts: 981 - 27/03/2023 10:29:26    2466988

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Replying To leitrim4sam:  "A lot of the city population are Protestant and wouldn't be playing GAA. Fermanagh have only 21 clubs and a sizeable Protestant population too. For them to get promoted to division 2 is some achievement too"
Fermanagh have 8 senior 8 intermediate and 4 junior If i am correct - be interesting to see the breakdown of clubs per each county

drumalee11 (USA) - Posts: 351 - 27/03/2023 11:27:51    2467000

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