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Kerry GAA Thread

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "The success of the county team is irrelevant.The facts are because Kerry have only 8 senior clubs it means teams ranked 9 to 16 are intermediate.Kerry s intermediate teams would beat many senior club teams from alot of counties.Kerins O Rahillys contested an All ireland senior semi and were unlucky and following year are intermediate.Its no coincidence Kerry have thrived in the intermediate club scene.We should have at least 12 senior clubs.Smaller counties have more senior clubs than us."
I'd agree with you Mick. Nobody expects all senior clubs to be full of intercounty standard players. That's not the case in any county. Some senior clubs might have nobody on the county panel. As you said, all reasonably sized football counties have 12 to 16 senior clubs.
12 would still be fewer than counties like Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Tyrone, Galway and Dublin, but would bring a better balance to the overall structure.
It would give club teams a fairer shot at a county championship, by reducing the pool of the divisional teams.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1997 - 29/02/2024 19:15:39    2528975

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd agree with you Mick. Nobody expects all senior clubs to be full of intercounty standard players. That's not the case in any county. Some senior clubs might have nobody on the county panel. As you said, all reasonably sized football counties have 12 to 16 senior clubs.
12 would still be fewer than counties like Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Tyrone, Galway and Dublin, but would bring a better balance to the overall structure.
It would give club teams a fairer shot at a county championship, by reducing the pool of the divisional teams."
Yes indeed WanpintWin

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3618 - 29/02/2024 20:28:07    2528978

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I think the one thing people are forgetting here is population, the amount of Kerry clubs who's second teams have all but gone extinct, first teams struggling, you had urban league for every clubs second string every Friday night from April /May to August then junior champs (for clubs second string).

You could promote 2 or 4 clubs up to senior go to 12 but they won't have big squads, what's more important having Numbers the same as everyone else and a watered down championship or a competition that every side in actually has a chance of if winning.

If you go to 12 you'll be back to yoyo clubs swapping senior for interm every 2/3 years like before.

Then those weaker club teams draw East Kerry and get a 20 plus point hammering, nobody should be getting beaten by more than 4/5 points, all teams should be of equal standard and I think of that's the way the county board want to run it then so be it, at the end of the day, Sam is the only currency and strong divisional sides allow management to see players at another level again from their club (Junior/Intermediate).

I keep hearing East Kerry have a crazy pick, it's cyclical give it a few years and they'll be back to where 6 plus years ago.

People bemoaning the fact that Stacks & Rahillys went down, they simply were not good enough, haven't paid attention to their underage, we've always been senior we'll be fine, Mitchels was starring them in the face and they couldn't see it, Na Gaeil's success is absolutely killing them, fact is their population are moving out of the catchment areas and paying the price for it now, low and behold county board now putting parish rule and first registration back in the agenda when it suits the big boys while ignoring the plight of smaller clubs or contentious areas for years when they wanted something similar where parents could take the kids back to home club.

Nobody mentions the amount of Tyrone teams that make Intermediate & Junior finals, fact of the matter is, they have strong club scene, junior was always tough to win in Kerry it's harder now, but if you promote 4 up you'll still have the junior clubs getting to AI finals cause what people don't talk about is that the teams winning the club championships (intermediate & junior) are usually playing in Division 1 or 2 and playing higher caliber teams than they face in championship so that will always happen, some counties have league linked to championship.which is ludicrous, it doesn't foster a healthy will to want to win as you only move out of it if you win the championship, so the first actual test you could get is when you play provencial game.

Galway good example was 20 plus at one stage, reduced now and could go further again, I lived there played there, teams basically going out to stay senior, doing absolutely nothing for football but they are senior, and the county have big number of teams in senior championship.

Let's have a look and see how many of these would actually contribute to a senior championship if you could bring it down to 12.

Tuam, always senior, barren spell but coming good again, can always put a run together.
Milltown, fallen off the radar but can produce the odd display.
Annaghdown, meh, can talk a good game,
Caherlistrane, if ever a team needed to go down to get things going again, they still go around like they are kings, only thing they are good at the moment is probably bettering a junior Headford side.
Dunmore, finally got back up and actually made an impression under ex Corofin man Gary Delaney, one to watch I think.
Claregalway, these are going to explode and if they don't it'll be their own fault, massive population, big secondary school, facilities, it's all their for them.
Salthill knocknacarra, always there or there abouts.
MB-Moylough, the loudmouths of Galway football, always have something to say, strong club big area but pulling from a small playing pool,
Corofin, nothing to add here, their intermediate team if senior squad members actually played with them instead of warming the timber seats in Tuam Stadium for the senior squad would probably beat an awful lot of senior clubs.
Maigh Cuillin, massive population got it right, should keep it going
St. James, city club, flatter to deceive an awful lot of the time.
Oughterard, noisey, can't see them pushing for Q/F's.
St. Michaels, haven't done a things since making final 10 years ago, got relegated.
An Spideal, young side, won't make inroads in the championship.
Leitir mor, hanging on and just about last ten years, if nothing else it's impressive.
Bearna, another big population, flirting with playoffs & Q/F's haven't done an ounce in 10 years or so since they made a semi,
Killanin, like Bearna, always around but not really doing anything, the odd year there's a push, need to up it can you consider them senior, would they even have made an impression in intermediate along with 4 or 5 others, I doubt it.

For an 8 team championship Keep Corofin, MB-MM, Tuam, Maigh Cuillin, Salthill, then pick 3 from Bearna, Claregalway, Annaghdown, St. James, Dunmore, Monivea, Milltown or that's your 12 and you couldn't say any of the others would run away with the Intermediate if they went down.

So out of the above list, parachute them into Kerry how many bar the usual 4/5 strong clubs you have in most counties improves the value of the championship, zero is my answer, people can shout about 9th best team etc etc but Cork have 3 times as many clubs and have made a hames of their championship,

Teams that went down to massive fanfare at the time
Micheal Breathnach, aim was stay senior,
Carna Caisil, see above
An Ceathru Rua, went down after a few poor showings, will be hard to get back up, nearly went junior, population and rugby going to be an issue there.
Oranmore, insane population seem to have got the act together, need to get back up senior after what 20 plus years.
Killererin, less said about that shiteshow the better,
Caltra, massive decrease in population but coming again,
Cartoon, too good to go down was the cry, lost (threw away) semis and finals since.
Monivea Abbey, back up, will be decent but no more than that.


We can talk about low numbers etc. but the fact of the matter is and we could probably do it with loads of counties, numbers doesn't mean quality.
I've no interest getting into a I said you said debate here but I used Galway as I've a great gra for the county, the championship is good but could be on another kevel of the county board took thr difficult decision and relegated clubs ( lets not even get into the hurling champ. That's another level of crazy)

Roscommon championship of 12 with the introduction of 2 possibly 4 divisional sides is actually fairly competitive, Brigids, Boyle, Pearses out in front followed by Clann, Ros Gaels, Oran, Dominic's, etc.
Divisional sides hard to get off the ground in a county with only 27 clubs, where clubs second teams are winning the Junior championship for fun and going deep in the Intermediate championship, three championships of 12 teams and some want the Junior for 6 first teams only so that they can win something, I think that's more insane than the Cork set up. Fact is Kerry is in a healthy place, could be better but has the eyes of the country on it so will always get questioned.

Jesus I really segwayed from my initial post about population having an effect in Kerry.

TheDude23 (Roscommon) - Posts: 10 - 02/03/2024 01:13:08    2529158

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd agree with you Mick. Nobody expects all senior clubs to be full of intercounty standard players. That's not the case in any county. Some senior clubs might have nobody on the county panel. As you said, all reasonably sized football counties have 12 to 16 senior clubs.
12 would still be fewer than counties like Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Tyrone, Galway and Dublin, but would bring a better balance to the overall structure.
It would give club teams a fairer shot at a county championship, by reducing the pool of the divisional teams."
Mick please name the four club teams you would promote to the senior ranks.
No beating around the bush on this, just four and no maybes.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 744 - 02/03/2024 16:54:03    2529246

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Replying To Gaa Fan:  "Mick please name the four club teams you would promote to the senior ranks.
No beating around the bush on this, just four and no maybes."
The top 4 intermediate teams obviously.The likes of O Rahillys and Stacks in they in top 4 of intermediate section.Anyway it does nt matter what I say as you dont agree anyway with 12 senior teams

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3618 - 03/03/2024 11:01:14    2529388

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "The top 4 intermediate teams obviously.The likes of O Rahillys and Stacks in they in top 4 of intermediate section.Anyway it does nt matter what I say as you dont agree anyway with 12 senior teams"
I have not problem with twelve clubs having teams in the county championship provided all teams are of senior calibre.
Stacks and Stand Road have regressed just as Mitchells did. Neither have a good under-age structure in place in spite of the fact that there are approx. 1,200 under-age in Trealee.
Stacks part of an amalgamated division team made no impact this year.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 744 - 03/03/2024 13:15:42    2529413

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Yes indeed WanpintWin"
I think that the divisional teams work well in Cork and Kerry. Would David Clifford for example, ever play top level club football otherwise? It exposes good talent to higher quality stuff and this in turn helps the county teams.

However, it does seem a tad lopsided when players from the likes of Austin Stacks can be part of a divisional team. These big clubs who can yo-yo their way between senior and intermediate from year to year, could they be banned from forwarding players to a divisional side? For example, a relegated senior club must be in the inter grade for at least 2-3 seasons before its players can join a divisional side!

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 1866 - 03/03/2024 14:02:29    2529418

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Replying To Gaa Fan:  "I have not problem with twelve clubs having teams in the county championship provided all teams are of senior calibre.
Stacks and Stand Road have regressed just as Mitchells did. Neither have a good under-age structure in place in spite of the fact that there are approx. 1,200 under-age in Trealee.
Stacks part of an amalgamated division team made no impact this year."
By your logic if a couple of the current Kerry senior clubs lose their way and fail to reach what you call "senior calibre" then maybe Kerry should reduce to 6 senior clubs. There are many weaker counties whose senior club champions would not win the Kerry intermediate championship. If a county has no club of your "senior calibre" maybe they should have no senior club championship at all.

sligo joe (Dublin) - Posts: 653 - 03/03/2024 14:27:47    2529423

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "The top 4 intermediate teams obviously.The likes of O Rahillys and Stacks in they in top 4 of intermediate section.Anyway it does nt matter what I say as you dont agree anyway with 12 senior teams"
Why are Strand Road in the top 4 Intermediate sides? What are you basing that on?

As for Stacks. If they're "top good" for Intermediate why didn't they win it last year?

oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1361 - 03/03/2024 14:43:38    2529424

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "I think that the divisional teams work well in Cork and Kerry. Would David Clifford for example, ever play top level club football otherwise? It exposes good talent to higher quality stuff and this in turn helps the county teams.

However, it does seem a tad lopsided when players from the likes of Austin Stacks can be part of a divisional team. These big clubs who can yo-yo their way between senior and intermediate from year to year, could they be banned from forwarding players to a divisional side? For example, a relegated senior club must be in the inter grade for at least 2-3 seasons before its players can join a divisional side!"
You are penalising players for being relegated there, you want to expose as many good players to senior as you can. Stacks are a big club but are where they are because they were not good enough to stay up and didn't get back up either, there's a difference between big club & good team.

TheDude23 (Roscommon) - Posts: 10 - 03/03/2024 16:27:46    2529452

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Replying To oneoff:  "Why are Strand Road in the top 4 Intermediate sides? What are you basing that on?

As for Stacks. If they're "top good" for Intermediate why didn't they win it last year?"
By having teams in the senior county championship who do not qualify by their standing in the county league creates two problems.
1. You now have eight teams who qualified by their finish in the league and four who failed the litmus test. Now you have diluted the standard of the county championship and subjected patrons to sub-standard senior quality games.
2. You have reduced the standard of the divisional teams who will still comprise four of the teams.
Shannon Rangers and Feale Rangers will probably have to stay and who else? East Kerry and Mid Kerry.
Now you have eliminated four divisional teams and where will the high quality players (county players) go?
Having twelve teams in Kerry for the sake of having twelve teams does not seem productive.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 744 - 03/03/2024 21:33:25    2529580

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Replying To oneoff:  "Why are Strand Road in the top 4 Intermediate sides? What are you basing that on?

As for Stacks. If they're "top good" for Intermediate why didn't they win it last year?"
Im just giving an example.Im not saying Rahillys should be senior but if are in the top 12 then yes.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3618 - 04/03/2024 15:58:27    2529761

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