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What your point here? It does seem to grate you that perhaps this may be a new team and era showing some signs of improvement and positive outlook. Why try and argue a point which is clearly inarguable. It is definitely pretty much a new team. I hope it continues to show progression but it will be judged and rightly so on Sam Maguire performances and an ability to contest for div 1 promotion in the next two years.
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 509 - 24/07/2023 18:11:12 2496639 Link 8 |
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Wasting your time with the Westmeath man lad. Looking forward to a good club championship now.
Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1318 - 24/07/2023 18:45:03 2496650 Link 13 |
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Dont know if we are better fitness and strength wise? as against teams in the league we were behind most of them.The Kildare game stands out we were miles off the pace that day,Dublin and Derry also(I know those 2 were in the last 4 so maybe not fair comparing them)We should be fitter and stronger as we were the only division 2 team in the TC.I do think Gray has added something we have missed for a good while so hopefully he can continue to impress against better teams.As you say we will know alot more after the league and championship next year.I think we could see us playing with a bit more freedom next year in the league as we have already got the last 16 ticket so pressure should be off a bit.We have struggled against Ulster teams the last few years but beating Down twice and Antrim maybe we can improve that record but will be playing stronger Ulster teams so would do well to beat them.i think we should go all out for the league next year but will be interesting to see if Colm decides to aim to peak for championship and group stage.If we could get a couple of early wins in the league and keep the momentum going it would stand to us and fill lads with more confidence.I would still be concerned about our defence while it has improved a bit, both Down and Antrim wasted goal chances that division 1/2 sides would take so lots of work to do on that over the break.Lets hope a couple of more lads might put their hand up over the county championship and strengthen us some more.The TC win and the holiday away can only strengthen the bond of the team and hopefully others might commit and want to be part of it.Next year is a big one hopefully we keep taking steps forward.What would be a success next year?Fighting for promotion in the league?a good run in Leinster?a strong showing in group stages?what do people think?
Proudroyal (Meath) - Posts: 256 - 24/07/2023 20:22:28 2496666 Link 3 |
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Judging by these questions I guess you believe we are not. That's fine I suppose. At least Colm can start off next year and if he achieves mid table div 2 and a leinster semi final and a load of valiant defeats in the championship, you will consider this progress given the position you think we are in. I assure you most other Meath supporters wouldn't be happy with that. So where would you see genuine realistic progress next year?
winatallcost (Meath) - Posts: 509 - 24/07/2023 20:26:34 2496667 Link 8 |
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Hard for anyone to argue with this post. To reply to previous poster had spent the last 30 minutes comparing starting team v. Down against reports of last year's 3 championship matches to check who got no championship game time before this year but now see you have beat me to it a much more informative post than I would have. The arguments against saying COR has overhauled the team/ panel are ridiculous. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1353 - 25/07/2023 05:50:41 2496691 Link 9 |
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I agree with most of what you said. I'm coming at it from a different angle in responding to posts where people are spinning things to exaggerate in a negative way where the team is now compared to where we were last year.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1353 - 25/07/2023 05:57:43 2496693 Link 9 |
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In my opinion (I won't pretend my opinion is a fact) our league standing is probably about right of where we lie overall if I was ranking intercounty teams. We're definitely better than Sligo who were in the main competition. Offaly deserved to beat us on the day as we played so bad in first half but had O'Sullivan's scored with his goal chance in the second half we probably would have beat Offaly in my opinion, I'd put us ahead of Offaly. I'd say we're at a similar level to Clare and Louth (we beat Clare by 4 points and lost to Louth by 3 (with 14 men) in the league.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1353 - 25/07/2023 06:16:26 2496694 Link 7 |
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Well Jack Flynn and Dathi McGowan have both been on the Senior panel since 2020 so who knows if the rest of your information is correct
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 870 - 25/07/2023 09:50:20 2496715 Link 1 |
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I'd disagree with that, especially as Jack was still u20 in 2021and wasn't Daithi U20 in 2020 too? Neither made their debuts til last year and I'm almost certain Jack only made sub appearances. Daithi started v Clare in his only game last year from recall. So I would say it's fair to count them as second year guys.
brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 25/07/2023 10:08:30 2496723 Link 11 |
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We'll based on reports on GAA website of last year's championship matches of the team that started against Down 6 of them saw no championship game time last year. Sounds fairly sound post to me.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1353 - 25/07/2023 10:49:04 2496734 Link 7 |
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Thats fine you are entitled to count them whatever way you see fit. Yes they were both u20 But the facts are Dathi McGoawan was on the panel from the start in 2020 and was released to play for the 20s in their championship games and Jack Flynn got brought in after the u20 campaign was over in 2020. Whatever way you interpret how long they have been on the panel is entirely your prerogative. Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 870 - 25/07/2023 10:53:57 2496738 Link 1 |
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Says the lad who doesn't even know what his own club does :). As for Westmeath hahaha what are you 12 ? Can't even think of a decent dig. Pathetic. Ur level though so hard to expect anything else.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/07/2023 14:05:32 2496798 Link 0 |
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Well here is my basis I think you have to look at the year as a whole. With it going in order of championship (all ire) Leinster, league then tailteann cup. I mean Dublin would probably be only 6 if we were to judge on league form alone. I suppose it's whatever way someone wants to judge it. While delighted to get the ticket to the main event next year I don't rate the TC as a competition, great for blooding new players But can you really call them a debut in a secondary competition? Some will and that's their right. I and others won't. We had 2 clear chances to avoid this and we failed in both. We had the easier side of the draw in Leinster (neither Kildare or dubs on our side ) we didn't get past Offaly, and it wasn't just a one off day imo. Look at the Kildare game that was probably worse than the Offaly performance and Kildare without their best players , the disaster against Limerick and louth. And some pathetic excuses thrown out from management and indeed many on here. I'm looking forward to next year with lessons hopefully been learned. No more auld bs talk. Down to business. ProMotion ,Leinster final , and last 8. Now that would be real progress and something we all could get behind . But us back into the top 8. royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/07/2023 14:18:39 2496801 Link 0 |
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I don't think you will get far with that black spot he and his multi alter egos won't use common sense
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/07/2023 14:24:16 2496804 Link 0 |
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Comment's were based on how we finished season. No doubt we lost our way after Clare game, nothing seemed right with team and it took us a few games in TC to start showing some promise. I think both fitness but especially physicality improved in last three games in cup. Jones, Flynn, Costello, Gray are all big mobile men, add in Ryan, Keoghan, McEntee and a fit again Harnan we have a core that should be able to mix it with most teams. A lot of the younger lads have a way to go but template seems to be in place to allow ongoing improvement. Defense has improved, but still below standard required against better teams. On a positive note the sack the manager mob have realised this team and management need some time and the change of tone is welcome. As for sucess next year, I think a steady improvement throughout league should set us up for rest of season, also get injured lads back and the addition of one or two more new faces.
seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2142 - 25/07/2023 14:25:44 2496805 Link 7 |
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S & C definitely can't be judged on TC. To judge it on that would be ridiculous. We looked so far off the pace against Derry and Dublin it was scary. But even allowing for them been so far ahead of us I think the measure that you use of Kildare is very accurate. They ran rings round us. Even Limerick seemed better conditioned than us. Same for louth and against Offaly agin we looked unfit. As for next year ? The only way we improve is playing better teams. I am hoping that Armagh keep mcgeeny as I don't rate him at all and believe he is holding them back, if they change to a half decent manager then they could walk div 2. For me vying for promotion on last day is the only thing that will show we have improved. It's a very average league next year compared to this. Clare I'd rate as better than cavan Limerick on par with Fermanagh and Donegal (who are in implosion mode) and Armagh are not better than dubs in particular or Derry. The rest we know about. Has the qualification for Sam by louth Kildare cork helped them playing teams of a higher level ? and has us not doing so , helped or hindered us ? That question won't be answered until March I'd say. But for me can you imagine the buzz of been in Croke park to pick up a division 2 title and go into all ire with that behind us would bring. I think many others would agree that cup would mean more than the Tc. But maybe that's just me . On the Leinster part it becomes awkward. Cause we lost the seeding. The top 4 in Leinster (Dublin Kildare louth and Offaly) are split and cannot meet until semifinals. So we will have to play two of them at least to reach a final. Ie we could have a rd 1 match against say Westmeath then a quarter final v dubs or Kildare and then say if it was Kildare in quarters, then a semi v Dublin. So rather than put too much emphasis on the Leinster run (people say I'm hard on Colm, I'm giving him an out here) I'd pretty much ignore the need for a Leinster final. Now if draw falls our way then absolutely. I mean we could get a Laois or Wexford rd1 then Offaly then louth. In that scenario absolutely a Leinster final would be demanded. It would be great to get the seeding back. After the league the round robin is so important, again I don't think we should be dependent on the 16th rank to get us into it. That puts us as 4th seeds so all seed ones (provincial winners ) Dublin, Kerry , mayo/Galway and most likely Derry, seed two cork Kildare the looser in Connacht and anyone of 3 in ulster then we go to league positions for seed 3 and 4 plus us as tc winners. So for me I'd like to see us qualify within our own right as div 2 promotion. And at least be avoiding some of the top teams. Now all this is assuming the top teams in provincials avoid each other. But I'd be hoping for a quarter final playoff match anyway so 2nd or 3rd in round robin and maybe just maybe a all ire quarter final. Now that would be progress for next year. royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/07/2023 14:57:50 2496824 Link 0 |
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Anyway I'm on my hold soon. So I will wish everyone well on here. For the time being. Hope to catch a few club games when I return. royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 25/07/2023 18:25:14 2496906 Link 0 |
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Imagine saying brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 26/07/2023 10:22:16 2496981 Link 7 |
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That's fair enough blackspot, accept the points you make. In some cases are lads not brought in to see if they can get up to the standards, then don't see game time because they can't. If a lad is on a panel for for three years but never sees game time in years one and two are they really on the panel? Or are they there to develop and improve to the standards required? I'll put it another way are all the players who are on the development panel on the full Meath panel? The likes of Wyer, Coffey etc came into the full panel after the league but are the other guys part of the full Meath panel? If they're not okay… but if they are then O'Rourke has given a whole lot more guys inter county level training and exposure than any of us are counting? brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 26/07/2023 10:28:29 2496984 Link 6 |
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Fair enough Seadog,no doubt we have looked better in TC but will need to step up again in the league next year.Gray as I've said previously looks good and something we have lacked for a good while so hopefully he keeps improving.Flynn hopefully can bring his TC form into next year,Jones in fairness was was one of our better performers in the league so with Grqy and Flynn with him hopefully they can form a good partnership.Cosstello will be a key player for us and did get in the ball more in the TC but we need to find a way to get him on the ball more in bigger games.The defence does worry me though , would need to tighten up quite a bit for next year.As you said if the injured lads can get back will strengthen us and maybe getting a free flowing magill and lavini back?Not sure if those 2 are interested in committing but I'd say the door is open for anyone if Jack o connor and Sean coffey are anything to go by.Im happy we won the TC as I think it's great experience for the young lads to win in Croker but it also takes a bit of pressure off management.What I mean by that is the national media is more focused on Meath now that o Rourke is in charge.He gave criticism to alot of teams when on the Sunday game so now people are scrutinizing his every move and waiting to launch in when things go wrong.That has to put more pressure on and maybe that's why we haven't adapted quicker.He wants to play more of a quicker long ball game (because that's the way he likes to play)but found it hard against tight defensive systems.We have improved ,adapted better and mixed things up a bit more but against better teams we made silly mistakes and took wrong options.I hope now that all Ireland football secured we will see us play a bit more off the shackles football in league and championship next year.Next year is massive for us we have a platform now,confidence growing,younger players with more experience (TC games)and hopefully a Meath crowd starting to swell again.I think the league is very important for us need to keep winning and keep momentum flowing and I'm looking forward to it .Who knows what may happen and maybe I am getting carried away by the TC win but hopefully the green shoots will keep growing but it will take time but will folk give it? I hope everyone gets behind the team but have a feeling some just cant wait to say I told you so regarding o Rourke.Again all this is just my opinion and everyone is entitled to their own.
Proudroyal (Meath) - Posts: 256 - 26/07/2023 10:38:09 2496988 Link 4 |