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Munster Hurling Relegation Play-Off: Kerry V Tipperary (25Th Of June 2022)

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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma:  "Regarding Kerry playing in Munster, should another county have to be relegated because to accommodate it? A six-team round robin championship would still use up the same number of weekends. Also, going the complete opposite way, if Kerry should win the Joe McDonagh Cup, maybe they should just ascend to the Leinster Championship instead, rather than be made play for their place in a championship that doesn't want them?"
That would not work nor has anyone from Kerry suggested it as far as I know?

Counties like Westmeath were not one bit happy about Antrim coming in and I very much doubt they'd be in favour of this. It set them back a bit at a time not long after they'd won Division II and being refused promotion if memory serves me right! And a year or two after they'd beaten Dublin in the Leinster quarter final.

Then when they applied logically to be allowed play in Ulster championship they were not even given a hearing. I'd be sympathetic to Kerry but other Leinster counties trying to make the break through ought to have first dibs on a promotion spot.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2557 - 27/04/2022 21:37:39    2413747

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Some people are questioning Kerry's continued participation in the Munster Minor hurling championship. Sure there have been some harsh lessons, but surely there is also a benefit in coming up against top quality opponents.
Leinster minor tiers 1, 2 and 3 explained.
A fair solution would be to allow Kerry into the Peadar O Liathain Cup after the Munster Championship."
Kerry had a particularly poor minor team this year. Last year they actually put it up to Tipperary for 3/4 of the game and that was without 7 starters from the previous year who were unavailable due to being on the football panel! I would have been very interested to see how they would have got on if they were full strength, I actually think they could have beaten Tipp and maybe another county or 2 in Munster. A lot of those who were unavailable started on the u20 team this year despite being first year u20s.

Kerry15 (Kerry) - Posts: 958 - 28/04/2022 08:35:31    2413754

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There is a lot of snobbery towards so called weaker sides. I've always enjoyed seeing Limerick play Laois/Kerry/Antrim/Carlow/Westmeath. Each have brought something different and colourful compared to other MacCarthy cup sides.

If Kerry want to play in the Munster Championship it should be their choice. Relegating another Munster side to get Kerry into Munster is nonsensical. When one of the big 9 counties get a hiding off another nobody bats an eyelid. Example - 2009 semi, we lost by 24 points. When one of the 5 mentioned above get beaten RTE go into overdrive looking for them to drop down a level. It is taken for granted that a big county will do better next year. Laois and Westmeath lose heavily in one season and trapdoor time.

Give them the chance and help them to develop with a long term plan. Look to expand the MacCarthy cup to 16 teams. No closed shop!

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6480 - 28/04/2022 08:51:27    2413756

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "That would not work nor has anyone from Kerry suggested it as far as I know?

Counties like Westmeath were not one bit happy about Antrim coming in and I very much doubt they'd be in favour of this. It set them back a bit at a time not long after they'd won Division II and being refused promotion if memory serves me right! And a year or two after they'd beaten Dublin in the Leinster quarter final.

Then when they applied logically to be allowed play in Ulster championship they were not even given a hearing. I'd be sympathetic to Kerry but other Leinster counties trying to make the break through ought to have first dibs on a promotion spot."
When Antrim were left into Leinster it set a precedent imo. Galway joining was to totally different issue from it.

Everything has been done over the years to keep Antrim at as high a level as possible. Going back to when they wouldn't play in a relegation final. Would Kerry, Westmeath etc be left get away with it? To them being put into the Joe McDonagh without having won the Christy Ring. On top of them being left play in both Ulster and Leinster championships.

oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1380 - 28/04/2022 09:34:06    2413767

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Replying To slayer:  "There is a lot of snobbery towards so called weaker sides. I've always enjoyed seeing Limerick play Laois/Kerry/Antrim/Carlow/Westmeath. Each have brought something different and colourful compared to other MacCarthy cup sides.

If Kerry want to play in the Munster Championship it should be their choice. Relegating another Munster side to get Kerry into Munster is nonsensical. When one of the big 9 counties get a hiding off another nobody bats an eyelid. Example - 2009 semi, we lost by 24 points. When one of the 5 mentioned above get beaten RTE go into overdrive looking for them to drop down a level. It is taken for granted that a big county will do better next year. Laois and Westmeath lose heavily in one season and trapdoor time.

Give them the chance and help them to develop with a long term plan. Look to expand the MacCarthy cup to 16 teams. No closed shop!"
As I said in my previous post re Antrim. Both them and Offaly were getting heavy beatings for a long time but there was never a suggestion of them being relegated, before they actually were. I recall at one point after Laois had got a particularly bad beating from Cork, I think they consided 10 goals, the GAA suggested they drop down to the Christy Ring. Something never ever considered for the likes of Antrim or Offaly.

oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1380 - 28/04/2022 09:39:56    2413771

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Replying To slayer:  "There is a lot of snobbery towards so called weaker sides. I've always enjoyed seeing Limerick play Laois/Kerry/Antrim/Carlow/Westmeath. Each have brought something different and colourful compared to other MacCarthy cup sides.

If Kerry want to play in the Munster Championship it should be their choice. Relegating another Munster side to get Kerry into Munster is nonsensical. When one of the big 9 counties get a hiding off another nobody bats an eyelid. Example - 2009 semi, we lost by 24 points. When one of the 5 mentioned above get beaten RTE go into overdrive looking for them to drop down a level. It is taken for granted that a big county will do better next year. Laois and Westmeath lose heavily in one season and trapdoor time.

Give them the chance and help them to develop with a long term plan. Look to expand the MacCarthy cup to 16 teams. No closed shop!"
The Liam MacCarthy Cup is a 17 team competition. 5 in Munster, 6 in Leinster and 6 in the McDonagh group.
If the the McDonagh winner is always promoted to their province and the 6th placed team in the 6 team provincial championship is always relegated, everyone is treated equally.
Example 2022: Kerry promoted from McDonagh to Munster and Westmeath relegated from Leinster to McDonagh.
Example 2023: Antrim promoted from McDonagh to Leinster and Kerry relegated from Munster to McDonagh.
Example 2024: Westmeath promoted from McDonagh to Leinster and Antrim relegated from Leinster to McDonagh.
In these examples, the McDonagh winner is always promoted to be the 6th team in their provincial championship. The 6th placed team in the 6 team championship is always relegated.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 28/04/2022 20:19:54    2413966

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Saturday 21 May
Leinster SHC round 5
Laois v Westmeath, MW Hire O'Moore Park, 6pm
This is a relegation final, as long as Kerry do not win the McDonagh Cup.

Sunday 22 May
Munster SHC round 5
Tipperary v Cork, FBD Semple Stadium
If Kerry win the McDonagh Cup, Tipperary v Cork could be the relegation final, with the loser playing Kerry in the Relegation Play-Off.

Lots of twists and turns to go yet of course. Cork and Tipperary on current form need Antrim or Offaly, with their Division 1 experience, to save them from being drawn into an historic Relegation Play-Off. Cork and Tipperary of course will be raging hot favourites should a Relegation Play-Off come about. They just won't want the headache of it after a Munster hangover.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 01/05/2022 15:46:51    2414375

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Sunday 8 May
Munster SHC round 4
At TUS Gaelic Grounds
Limerick 3-21
Tipperary 0-23

Is Tipperary's season over or will they have something to play for yet? The McDonagh counties will decide!

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 08/05/2022 15:46:10    2415586

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Sunday 8 May
Munster SHC round 4
At TUS Gaelic Grounds
Limerick 3-21
Tipperary 0-23

Is Tipperary's season over or will they have something to play for yet? The McDonagh counties will decide!"
Looks like whoever loses between Cork and Tipperary....I'll call it Wooden Spoon Decider.

katser (Galway) - Posts: 2194 - 08/05/2022 15:55:35    2415592

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Replying To slayer:  "There is a lot of snobbery towards so called weaker sides. I've always enjoyed seeing Limerick play Laois/Kerry/Antrim/Carlow/Westmeath. Each have brought something different and colourful compared to other MacCarthy cup sides.

If Kerry want to play in the Munster Championship it should be their choice. Relegating another Munster side to get Kerry into Munster is nonsensical. When one of the big 9 counties get a hiding off another nobody bats an eyelid. Example - 2009 semi, we lost by 24 points. When one of the 5 mentioned above get beaten RTE go into overdrive looking for them to drop down a level. It is taken for granted that a big county will do better next year. Laois and Westmeath lose heavily in one season and trapdoor time.

Give them the chance and help them to develop with a long term plan. Look to expand the MacCarthy cup to 16 teams. No closed shop!"
You are right there Slayer.
There was any amount of snobbery in Wexford over losing to Laois until they beat Kilkenny.
I really hope these counties keep up the effort because Leinster hurling needs Offaly and Laois.
I wonder if there is a better format where the provincial championships played as a knock-out and then there is a round robin with 2 x groups of 6 or that.

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1732 - 12/05/2022 14:09:28    2416689

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25.06.2022 (Sat)
Relegation Play-Off (If required*)
Joe McDonagh Cup Winner v 5th Placed Team Munster group
*If Ciarraí win the Joe McDonagh Cup, they shall playoff against the bottom team in the
Munster Championship 'round-robin' at a neutral Munster venue determined by the CCCC.
Joe McDonagh 2022 Final: Antrim v Kerry
Antrim are rightly the raging hot favourites. Antrim had already qualified for the final when Kerry beat them today, May 21st.
If Kerry somehow pull off the shock of the decade, Kerry will take on 5th in Munster in a Relegation Play-Off!
Also please note:
Saturday 11/Sunday 12 June
All-Ireland SHC preliminary quarter-finals
Joe McDonagh Cup winner v 3rd placed Munster group
Joe McDonagh Cup runner-up v 3rd placed Leinster group

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 21/05/2022 14:50:34    2419182

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Replying To legendzxix:  "25.06.2022 (Sat)
Relegation Play-Off (If required*)
Joe McDonagh Cup Winner v 5th Placed Team Munster group
*If Ciarraí win the Joe McDonagh Cup, they shall playoff against the bottom team in the
Munster Championship 'round-robin' at a neutral Munster venue determined by the CCCC.
Joe McDonagh 2022 Final: Antrim v Kerry
Antrim are rightly the raging hot favourites. Antrim had already qualified for the final when Kerry beat them today, May 21st.
If Kerry somehow pull off the shock of the decade, Kerry will take on 5th in Munster in a Relegation Play-Off!
Also please note:
Saturday 11/Sunday 12 June
All-Ireland SHC preliminary quarter-finals
Joe McDonagh Cup winner v 3rd placed Munster group
Joe McDonagh Cup runner-up v 3rd placed Leinster group"
If Kerry win they should just put 6 teams in Munster. It's not any extra weekends. And I don't think that there is any point in relegating one of the other teams.

skirge7 (UK) - Posts: 248 - 21/05/2022 15:33:11    2419192

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Replying To skirge7:  "
Replying To legendzxix:  "25.06.2022 (Sat)
Relegation Play-Off (If required*)
Joe McDonagh Cup Winner v 5th Placed Team Munster group
*If Ciarraí win the Joe McDonagh Cup, they shall playoff against the bottom team in the
Munster Championship 'round-robin' at a neutral Munster venue determined by the CCCC.
Joe McDonagh 2022 Final: Antrim v Kerry
Antrim are rightly the raging hot favourites. Antrim had already qualified for the final when Kerry beat them today, May 21st.
If Kerry somehow pull off the shock of the decade, Kerry will take on 5th in Munster in a Relegation Play-Off!
Also please note:
Saturday 11/Sunday 12 June
All-Ireland SHC preliminary quarter-finals
Joe McDonagh Cup winner v 3rd placed Munster group
Joe McDonagh Cup runner-up v 3rd placed Leinster group"
If Kerry win they should just put 6 teams in Munster. It's not any extra weekends. And I don't think that there is any point in relegating one of the other teams."
In my humble opinion, the 6th team in Leinster should be relegated. The Munster Championship can have 6 teams next year instead.
Antrim are the raging hot favourites however and rightly so. Antrim are confident of getting above Laois and Westmeath in the pecking order.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 21/05/2022 16:09:21    2419200

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A Dublin/Kerry hurling championship match looks quite possible now! That would be interesting.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2557 - 21/05/2022 17:10:31    2419215

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "A Dublin/Kerry hurling championship match looks quite possible now! That would be interesting."
It's on the cards alright. Kerry deserve this opportunity to host a Preliminary Quarter-final. They were denied twice due to the pandemic scheduling.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 21/05/2022 17:29:42    2419224

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Replying To skirge7:  "
Replying To legendzxix:  "25.06.2022 (Sat)
Relegation Play-Off (If required*)
Joe McDonagh Cup Winner v 5th Placed Team Munster group
*If Ciarraí win the Joe McDonagh Cup, they shall playoff against the bottom team in the
Munster Championship 'round-robin' at a neutral Munster venue determined by the CCCC.
Joe McDonagh 2022 Final: Antrim v Kerry
Antrim are rightly the raging hot favourites. Antrim had already qualified for the final when Kerry beat them today, May 21st.
If Kerry somehow pull off the shock of the decade, Kerry will take on 5th in Munster in a Relegation Play-Off!
Also please note:
Saturday 11/Sunday 12 June
All-Ireland SHC preliminary quarter-finals
Joe McDonagh Cup winner v 3rd placed Munster group
Joe McDonagh Cup runner-up v 3rd placed Leinster group"
If Kerry win they should just put 6 teams in Munster. It's not any extra weekends. And I don't think that there is any point in relegating one of the other teams."
And give them all 5 games at home to promote the game.

updwell (Limerick) - Posts: 817 - 21/05/2022 17:56:59    2419231

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I guess Cork are favourites tomorrow, Sunday May 22nd?

Predicted All-Ireland Preliminary Quarter-finals:
Antrim v Cork
Kerry v Wexford

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 21/05/2022 19:57:38    2419254

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Replying To legendzxix:  "I guess Cork are favourites tomorrow, Sunday May 22nd?

Predicted All-Ireland Preliminary Quarter-finals:
Antrim v Cork
Kerry v Wexford"
If you beat Antrim wouldn't that make you the Joe Mac winner?

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 11848 - 21/05/2022 20:49:40    2419281

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Replying To Viking66:  "If you beat Antrim wouldn't that make you the Joe Mac winner?"
If Kerry win the McDonagh, we'll play 3rd in Munster. We'll also get to play 5th in Munster in a relegation play-off..
Antrim are raging hot favourites however. Antrim were very competitive in Division 1. We have to be realistic about the tough challenge that lies ahead.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7843 - 21/05/2022 21:57:22    2419304

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Replying To legendzxix:  "
Replying To skirge7:  "[quote=legendzxix:  "25.06.2022 (Sat)
Relegation Play-Off (If required*)
Joe McDonagh Cup Winner v 5th Placed Team Munster group
*If Ciarraí win the Joe McDonagh Cup, they shall playoff against the bottom team in the
Munster Championship 'round-robin' at a neutral Munster venue determined by the CCCC.
Joe McDonagh 2022 Final: Antrim v Kerry
Antrim are rightly the raging hot favourites. Antrim had already qualified for the final when Kerry beat them today, May 21st.
If Kerry somehow pull off the shock of the decade, Kerry will take on 5th in Munster in a Relegation Play-Off!
Also please note:
Saturday 11/Sunday 12 June
All-Ireland SHC preliminary quarter-finals
Joe McDonagh Cup winner v 3rd placed Munster group
Joe McDonagh Cup runner-up v 3rd placed Leinster group"
If Kerry win they should just put 6 teams in Munster. It's not any extra weekends. And I don't think that there is any point in relegating one of the other teams."
In my humble opinion, the 6th team in Leinster should be relegated. The Munster Championship can have 6 teams next year instead.
Antrim are the raging hot favourites however and rightly so. Antrim are confident of getting above Laois and Westmeath in the pecking order."]I think you're right there. But what if Kerry were promoted to Munster with 6 teams and won a game. You might potentially relegate Waterford or Cork or Tipperary. We can't have that. The Munster championship must not allow for any chance of relegation.

brianb (Kildare) - Posts: 279 - 22/05/2022 10:15:36    2419327

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