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GAA Before The Noughties Was Terrible

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Anyone watching that first half between Galway and Mayo cannot say current football is better. Its passing back and forth across the field, passing backwards, trying to run aimlessly into three or four defenders etc. And that is the way every football game is now. Also it doesn't feel like a championship game. April is for league. On the positive side the pitch looks superb, definitely the best ground in Connacht.

Leitrim_12 (USA) - Posts: 207 - 24/04/2022 16:43:31    2412766

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Replying To kentuckytucky:  "Anyone watching that first half between Galway and Mayo cannot say current football is better. Its passing back and forth across the field, passing backwards, trying to run aimlessly into three or four defenders etc. And that is the way every football game is now. Also it doesn't feel like a championship game. April is for league. On the positive side the pitch looks superb, definitely the best ground in Connacht."
On the plus side, think of the concerts.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2017 - 24/04/2022 17:21:37    2412783

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Replying To kentuckytucky:  "Anyone watching that first half between Galway and Mayo cannot say current football is better. Its passing back and forth across the field, passing backwards, trying to run aimlessly into three or four defenders etc. And that is the way every football game is now. Also it doesn't feel like a championship game. April is for league. On the positive side the pitch looks superb, definitely the best ground in Connacht."
Definitely better than games from the 80s

jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 24/04/2022 17:45:15    2412798

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Replying To kentuckytucky:  "Anyone watching that first half between Galway and Mayo cannot say current football is better. Its passing back and forth across the field, passing backwards, trying to run aimlessly into three or four defenders etc. And that is the way every football game is now. Also it doesn't feel like a championship game. April is for league. On the positive side the pitch looks superb, definitely the best ground in Connacht."
Definitely better than games from the 80s

jonjon (Mayo) - Posts: 99 - 24/04/2022 18:07:59    2412812

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Replying To kentuckytucky:  "Anyone watching that first half between Galway and Mayo cannot say current football is better. Its passing back and forth across the field, passing backwards, trying to run aimlessly into three or four defenders etc. And that is the way every football game is now. Also it doesn't feel like a championship game. April is for league. On the positive side the pitch looks superb, definitely the best ground in Connacht."
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I enjoyed that game today.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 24/04/2022 19:15:45    2412840

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Wrong on all counts."
Do explain. Especially in lieu of your post on page 3.

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1737 - 25/04/2022 09:09:49    2412936

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "Do explain. Especially in lieu of your post on page 3."
Your post was entirely ignorant of what actually happened in both football and hurling prior to the noughties.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 25/04/2022 16:20:38    2413159

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I enjoyed that game today."
Me too. I attended plenty of Connacht championship games in the 80s and early 90s - many of them were dire stuff altogether and that was the general impression at the time. To all the people who constantly pine for the "catch-and-kick" era - do you actually watch any of the games nowadays? Because if you did, you would see plenty of outstanding fielding and many brilliant long-range points being kicked by a variety of players. In the old days, long-range points from open play were few and far between and there was a lot of aimless kicking that resulted in the ball going out of play or straight into the hands of an opponent.

Gaillimh_Abu (Galway) - Posts: 996 - 25/04/2022 17:30:47    2413187

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
Incredible post looking down on past days in the gaa. First off players hurlers back in the day were every bit of skillful than nowadays, as one previous post said the hurls were different, smaller bas and the sliotars wayy heavier. I'd like to see some of today's players shoot points from over 100 yards as they do now with the old style hurls and sliotars.
Games were more entertaining off the cuff and the crowd got involved more with the overhead clash of the Ash and the effort involved. Team play is too controlled now and in the past few years as a spectacle to me is suffering.
There was bigger crowds going to matches and in the 90s it reached its peak, alot of the munster shc games in the 90s were 40000 attendance plus, there was 17000 at tipp v Clare yesterday, if that was in the 90s there would be 50000 there, simple as that.

preddan (Kildare) - Posts: 739 - 25/04/2022 17:35:57    2413190

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It's all about perspective and context.

I love watching football matches from the early 2000s because it carried an intensity and novelty about it in the early years of the Harte and Kernan era. That means something to me. Tactics weren't simpler then, they just hadn't been figured out yet.

2021 saw a few changes to the game which will change fundamental tactics over the next 5 years. The room for innovation is itself exciting to me, just like watching what Gilroy and McGuinness developed in the early 10s. Donegal v Dublin 2011 is viewed by some as a classic, and some as dross. As the years go by, it will be remembered for being "*****" football, but it was the foundations of the greatest football team of all-time.

Just because I struggle to enjoy watching football on TG4 Gold from the 1970s doesn't mean I think the quality of football is poor. I just can't give it the same value as the football that I have experienced in my lifetime.

SurelyToGod (Donegal) - Posts: 384 - 25/04/2022 18:48:45    2413207

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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma:  "Here's a question. If, for example, Pat Spillane were born 40 years later and were the same age now as he was in 1982, would he be playing now to a high degree as judged by 2020 standards? (If that makes sense)"
I recently watched an interview on U-Tube regarding great soccer players. The question was asked of Alex Ferguson if players like Pele, Best, Charlton, would be competitive in the modern age with the likes of Messi etc. His answer was that great players of any aers would be great at any era.
I would agree. I watched Joe Keohane, Paddy Bawn, Sean Murphy (probably the best ever half-back), Purcell, Stockwell, Nace O'Dowd, Packy, Paddy Casey, Peter Nolan, and others from the 60's on who some of saw play. They were great then and would be great now.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 749 - 25/04/2022 19:46:42    2413219

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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma:  "Here's a question. If, for example, Pat Spillane were born 40 years later and were the same age now as he was in 1982, would he be playing now to a high degree as judged by 2020 standards? (If that makes sense)"
I recently watched an interview on U-Tube regarding great soccer players. The question was asked of Alex Ferguson if players like Pele, Best, Charlton, would be competitive in the modern age with the likes of Messi etc. His answer was that great players of any years would be great at any era.
I would agree. I watched Joe Keohane, Paddy Bawn, Sean Murphy (probably the best ever half-back), Purcell, Stockwell, Nace O'Dowd, Packy, Paddy Casey, Peter Nolan, McGuigan, Matt Connor, McGinty,and others from the 60's on who some of you saw play. They were great then and would be great now.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 749 - 25/04/2022 21:40:47    2413230

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In my opinion hurling is definitely a better game to watch nowadays than in the 1980's. Personally I think hurling, in terms of watching inter county matches was at its best back 10 years ago, some of the Kilkenny Tipperary matches were amazing.

I couldn't agree football is better now than in the 1980's. Yes the level of preparation and physical fitness of the players is at a much higher level. I haven't seen statistics but it also seems obvious that there is a higher scoring rate (from play and overall). But the problem is that the huge improvements in fitness has led to the general way the game is now played is much more boring than what it used to be. In most matches the players spend most of the match handpassing over and back in front of a mass of opposition players in front of them, this is not good to watch (at matches now you often hear the crowd groaning in boredom watching these tactics play out, spectators generally are quiter at games than years ago as for most of the match they are just not as engaged as years ago). I haven't played in years but I'm guessing it is quiet boring to play.
The GAA years ago should have changed the rule book to tackle the way the game is played but sat on their hands. Had they made teams line up in their positions for kickouts (as happens for the throw ins) the handpassing tactics would have been way less effective way to play the game. Had they did that we now would have a better game and team preparation would focus much more on accurate kicking.
Every game has its own characteristics, kicking, battle for possession and man on man match ups was what Gaelic football was about. It's amazing to me how the GAA have let this die out to a large extent.
In 2017 rugby faced a similar situation. A team used tactics to completely change the way the game was played (Italy against England refused to commit any players after a tackle had been made, thereby preventing any rucks from forming meaning the offside rule was not in play). Rugby immediately realised this completely went against the way rugby was played and almost immediately brought in rules to stop it. It's a pity the GAA didn't act in a similar manner when modern tactics went against the character of our game.

bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1358 - 26/04/2022 11:08:01    2413278

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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma:  "Here's a question. If, for example, Pat Spillane were born 40 years later and were the same age now as he was in 1982, would he be playing now to a high degree as judged by 2020 standards? (If that makes sense)"
Well, in 1982 Spillane was hindered by his knee injury; came on as a sub.

However, given his overall career and style of play, I'd say that no player from the past would be more suited to the work-rate modern game than Spillane. And I'd be reluctant to admit it, as there is much about the man that I find quite disagreeable.

Of those Kerry greats, I'd say himself, John O'Keefe, Paidi, Power, Ogie and obviously JackO are the players that spring to mind who'd have the work ethics, skill sets and attitude that they would still be great today. Basically, they'd have the engines and the application.

But I'd have to ask, and no disrespect intended, would Mikey Sheehy, Seanie Walsh, Jimmy Denihan, Tim Kennelly or even John Egan? It's a question, not an answer, and only my own suspicion.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 1926 - 26/04/2022 12:02:21    2413295

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Apart from Clifford there are no forwards in todays game like Wee James Mc cartin, Mickey Linden Trevor Giles, to name but a few who could win ball, beat a man at pace, take a score and actually deliver a quick foot pass at speed.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 26/04/2022 12:35:34    2413309

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Replying To StoreysTash:  "This is going to offend people of a certain age.
Tallowman GAA on YouTube and TG4/Eir during Covid showing old matches have shone a light on many of the legendary hurling and football matches.
So many of these legendary games from the 80's and 90's were absolutely awful. Yes they were exciting finishes and in terms of heart and passion the players could not be faulted, but they were awful in terms of quality. Player intelligence and skill were scarce commodities, there was about 2-3 top class hurlers on every team and beyond that there was honest endeavour but an attitude of pull, wind and swing and ask questions later.
The real start of intelligent hurling came with the Cork team of the mid noughties, and in football with the Tyrone and Armagh teams. Before these teams came along, it was crash bang wallop.
This is by no means to insult those who won provincial or All-Ireland medals back then, but in my view GAA now is in a far better place than it was back then and while there were pulsating finishes to matches back then (and Ciaran Carey's point v Clare is still the best hurling point ever scored), these great moments of class very much paper over otherwise mundane games."
Absolute horse manure. The games have developed since those days as everything in life has and lads that used to do a hard days labour on building sites, farms and other trades went out for a game and took out the frustrations of their day on another man and then had a pint and fag with said man. Those men all had natural strength from their every day lifes and didn't need gym programmes, S&C sessions and everything modern players has as they did it in their everyday life.

The GAA also has to admit that they've watered down their games to such an extent from those days that of course as a spectacle the game seems much "better" because they've taken all the physicality out of the game. A big shoulder now a days gets people off their seat and you'll have people looking for cards for it. Those were a matter of course in the times you referred too and not even free's in most cases.

Now admittedly some of the changes were for the better and hopefully we won't see as many players having knee, hip and other replacements in later life and they'll not be absolutely hobbled and crippled with injuries.

You say that teams only had 2-3 top class players back then and everyone else pulled and dragged, again BS. Those teams all had top class players but the game was so different in those times that pulling and dragging was part of the game. Transport those players into modern times, give them the same access to gym, S&C , Nutrition, skills training, analytics and data and i guarantee in my opinion they'd be as good as if not better than any current team. If you flipped the script and put the teams of now back in those days without all the support structures they have around them they'd struggle massively. Saying player intelligence and skill were a rare commodity, would you ever go and take a running jump. Some of the best players of all times played in the 70's, 80's and 90's. I'd put many of them so far ahead of current players i wouldn't be funny.

But ultimately they're not playing the same thing anyways. Theirs 15 players a ball and the same objective, but everything else has changed and the rules now a days are all about the spectacle and high scoring games to get people watching.

The plain truth is the games are totally different, some of the changes good (hopefully reduced long term injuries) but for the most part the watering down of the games has made the game a battle of who has the biggest and best access to support around them.

There's absolutely no point trying to compare the games as they're not even close to the same thing. Enjoy both for what they are and if you don't like the old product no one is forcing you to watch it.

brian (Meath) - Posts: 1954 - 26/04/2022 13:13:54    2413320

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "Apart from Clifford there are no forwards in todays game like Wee James Mc cartin, Mickey Linden Trevor Giles, to name but a few who could win ball, beat a man at pace, take a score and actually deliver a quick foot pass at speed."
Not many, but you've still a few: McCarron & McManus in Monaghan, CON in Dublin, Murphy still in Donegal, and Sam Mulroy in Louth.

Can't actually think of too many more, tbh.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 1926 - 26/04/2022 13:25:36    2413325

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "Apart from Clifford there are no forwards in todays game like Wee James Mc cartin, Mickey Linden Trevor Giles, to name but a few who could win ball, beat a man at pace, take a score and actually deliver a quick foot pass at speed."
Now as a days as a forward in some ways it's harder to stand out (despite the fact that pulling and dragging is punished more than what it was back then). The game now a days often is to keep hand passing in front of the opposition until you find a free man in an uncontested position in scoring area of the pitch. It would be harder for a forward like James McCartin or Bernard Flynn, who used their pace to get to the ball before their man not just because their is less space due to tactics but the mindset is so different even if that type of ball is on most modern players wouldn't think of kicking the ball into space in front of them to begin with.

bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1358 - 26/04/2022 14:33:10    2413356

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "Well, in 1982 Spillane was hindered by his knee injury; came on as a sub.

However, given his overall career and style of play, I'd say that no player from the past would be more suited to the work-rate modern game than Spillane. And I'd be reluctant to admit it, as there is much about the man that I find quite disagreeable.

Of those Kerry greats, I'd say himself, John O'Keefe, Paidi, Power, Ogie and obviously JackO are the players that spring to mind who'd have the work ethics, skill sets and attitude that they would still be great today. Basically, they'd have the engines and the application.

But I'd have to ask, and no disrespect intended, would Mikey Sheehy, Seanie Walsh, Jimmy Denihan, Tim Kennelly or even John Egan? It's a question, not an answer, and only my own suspicion."
The answer to your question is yes.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 26/04/2022 15:03:37    2413365

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "Apart from Clifford there are no forwards in todays game like Wee James Mc cartin, Mickey Linden Trevor Giles, to name but a few who could win ball, beat a man at pace, take a score and actually deliver a quick foot pass at speed."
Those lads, legends though they are, weren't operating at the same pace as modern football. There are corner backs in todays game with a greater skillset than a lot of, pre 1990 say, forwards. There's no comparison and it's pointless making them

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12122 - 26/04/2022 15:39:07    2413377

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