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Replying To Vish: "What's wrong with Mayo's strength and conditioning team over the past 4/5 yrs. ?
So many long-term injuries year in , year out , and its preventing management going into a championship with a full playing deck..
Its cost them an All Ireland beause they are simply losing too many players and its gone past a co-incidence at this stage,
and anyone brushing it aside blaming it on bad luck are sun-shiners." You claim we have had many long term injuries. I'm asking who are/were they? Not such a difficult question to answer really.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7343 - 29/03/2022 12:55:26
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Replying To GreenandRed: "You claim we have had many long term injuries. I'm asking who are/were they? Not such a difficult question to answer really." Its is if you read the bottom of page 6, a chara..
Vish (USA) - Posts: 88 - 29/03/2022 13:35:10
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What's the story with Cillian? The injury he got is the worst possible but he should have been coming back around now surely? Lack of game time for last 12 plus months he will do well to get back into the team this year you would imagine if fit
sourmilk93 (Roscommon) - Posts: 1144 - 29/03/2022 13:37:28
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Replying To Vish: "Do you go watch games at all ?
Here's 5 off the top of my head .
(1)
Tom Parsons 2018 v Galway ,
Blew beause of a divot on the bad Pitch at MacHale park, with all his weight suppressing his knee which needed 3 operations to mend.
This i admit was bad luck..
(2)
Cillian o Connor 2020
After coming back from a previous 10 month long-term injury layoff , he was unnecessarily played in "every game in DIv 2", and he eventually snapped his ACL v Clare when the work overload became too much.
Did he really need to be used in every game against lets be honest ..bang average opposition..?
(3)
Jason Doherty v Donegal, August 2019
Has a 2nd breakdown, ACL in both knees which kept him out for 2+ years,
Obviously the rehab programme went south.
(4)
Brendan Harrisson 2020
An innocuous twist of his knee that the medial team have struggled to diagnose and heal, and hes just had a re-occurrence again yesterday after 2 years of trying to get to the bottom of the issue.
(5)
Colm Boyle January 2020
Boyle suffered what was described some weeks later as 'a serious knee injury' by James Horan.
We now understand it to have been a badly damaged cruciate ligament that ended his inter-county season there and then against Dublin on January 28.
Badly missed as their was multiple retirements that year.
Averaging 1 ACL for every year we play going by the numbers , andy b4 that, and have multiple other players in the squad who suffer less damaging injuries but go missing for 2/3 months which is not ideal when the quest is All Ireland and All Ireland only." You specifically said ACL injuries.
Tom Parsons suffered a freak leg break, not ACL. Very unfortunate.
Cillian O'Connor tore his Achilles, not ACL. What 10 month injury lay off was he coming back from at that time? He was flying fit during the 2020 championship and early 2021. No way is that down to burnout.
Fair enough I forgot Boyle's injury, but I don't see any evidence of us being worse off in terms of injuries than other counties.
Galway have been riddled with injuries in recent years, Donegal too. Cork have had multiple players with very serious hamstring tears.
MayoDan (Mayo) - Posts: 420 - 29/03/2022 13:48:11
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Replying To Vish: "Its is if you read the bottom of page 6, a chara.." That's fair enough when I read it there. They might have made a difference in those seasons,we'll never know but we won't be slow to make excuses before and after a season ends and we don't lift Sam including curses. There were other factors for losing All Irelands those seasons but it always seems that an individual or idividuals become scapegoats. Simply saying the 'winners were the better team on the day' fixes nothing. Just postponing the inevitable. We have to find whey they were the better team in the final, why they made the right decisions and did the right things in the last ten minutes, why we didn't in finals, why we don't do and fix it before we can lift the Sam Maguire. But having less injuries is definitely a good starting point.
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7343 - 29/03/2022 14:10:05
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Didn't Andy Moran also do his cruciate, which is what caused him to miss the final in 2012? I know he broke the leg after too.
I recall AOS had a knee injury scare last year and was also tormented for a couple of years by osteitis pubis. Not sure, but is that what's also keeping Mark Moran out?
The number of significant Mayo players with long term issues, rehabs etc, just seems to be unrelenting. Some of it is plain back luck. It's true other counties have had their share too. Kerry only had James O'Donoghue fit for about 2 years of his career and Paul Geaney has struggled. The Gooch had one year taken by a cruciate, ironically 2014. He was never as effective after he came back either (though that was partly down to the role of the FF evolving into something he wasn't). Our neighbours Galway have had a fair run of long term problems too.
The Dubs training locally and playing the bulk of their games on the best pitch in the country may have reduced their tendency to pick up freak injuries.
I think the bigger panel is the only contingency the Mayo management could take to offset the inevitable. Counties need to have the sort of depth to be able to cope and hopefully the league this year with all the chopping and changing of match day panels will enable Mayo to deal with whatever circumstances throw up. There are players who are growing in front of our eyes like Plunkett, Carney, Flynn and Orne (even O'Hora is improving). By the time some of the long termers come back the players they'll be looking to displace might not be so moveable. Time waits for no one.
Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 2521 - 29/03/2022 14:33:48
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Replying To MayoDan: "You specifically said ACL injuries.
Tom Parsons suffered a freak leg break, not ACL. Very unfortunate.
Cillian O'Connor tore his Achilles, not ACL. What 10 month injury lay off was he coming back from at that time? He was flying fit during the 2020 championship and early 2021. No way is that down to burnout.
Fair enough I forgot Boyle's injury, but I don't see any evidence of us being worse off in terms of injuries than other counties.
Galway have been riddled with injuries in recent years, Donegal too. Cork have had multiple players with very serious hamstring tears." OK..
I will "specifically" take out Parsons injury , and replace him with Tommy's ACL injury instead.
Its makes worse reading, that's 4 major breakdowns in 4 years , not taking into account other injuries which are standard procedure in any given season.
O Connor and Conroy's injuries were avoidable, or could have been at least minimized, but Mayo Management , colleges , and clubs all put their selfish interests 1st,,, and the kid broke down trying to appease all of them..
We made a Rod for our own back yet again.. ,and dont really deserve an All-Ireland so long as we continue with so many self-inflicted miscalculations.
Given our resources up-front, it was an area of the pitch that needed a cotton wool approach, but we exposed our most prized asset at the time and got punished for it., learning absolutely nothing from O Connor injury the season before..
Rate of long-term injuries is not sustainable, and we have invested lots of money into that sector to minimise these things from happening.
Criticism around the county sparked our management into re-introducing the kicking game , and we've seen it
come so natural to our squad of many talented footballers, so maybe similar scrutiny towards our S&C and medical staff might see some change too..
The days of
"Ah shur, we were unlucky " dont wash anymore.
Last years final was the straw that broke the camels back for many fans , and in a way it was a good thing , as the days of a select group of Mayo fans shunting down opinions both at home and online , blaming everybody but themselves is long over.
Vish (USA) - Posts: 88 - 29/03/2022 15:08:55
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Replying To Vish: "OK..
I will "specifically" take out Parsons injury , and replace him with Tommy's ACL injury instead.
Its makes worse reading, that's 4 major breakdowns in 4 years , not taking into account other injuries which are standard procedure in any given season.
O Connor and Conroy's injuries were avoidable, or could have been at least minimized, but Mayo Management , colleges , and clubs all put their selfish interests 1st,,, and the kid broke down trying to appease all of them..
We made a Rod for our own back yet again.. ,and dont really deserve an All-Ireland so long as we continue with so many self-inflicted miscalculations.
Given our resources up-front, it was an area of the pitch that needed a cotton wool approach, but we exposed our most prized asset at the time and got punished for it., learning absolutely nothing from O Connor injury the season before..
Rate of long-term injuries is not sustainable, and we have invested lots of money into that sector to minimise these things from happening.
Criticism around the county sparked our management into re-introducing the kicking game , and we've seen it
come so natural to our squad of many talented footballers, so maybe similar scrutiny towards our S&C and medical staff might see some change too..
The days of
"Ah shur, we were unlucky " dont wash anymore.
Last years final was the straw that broke the camels back for many fans , and in a way it was a good thing , as the days of a select group of Mayo fans shunting down opinions both at home and online , blaming everybody but themselves is long over." Can you please explain how Cillian O'Connor's injury was avoidable? It happened in the first half against Clare last year and there was a 2 week break before that game.
MayoDan (Mayo) - Posts: 420 - 29/03/2022 15:35:14
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Replying To MayoDan: "Can you please explain how Cillian O'Connor's injury was avoidable? It happened in the first half against Clare last year and there was a 2 week break before that game." :D
We played him non-stop against "Div 2" opponents after coming back from a previous injury, and he broke down against Clare .
A run of games which was supposed to get him "up to speed.". but he broke down;
Was he really needed in any of these games.......???????????
Cut out the ignorance
Vish (USA) - Posts: 88 - 29/03/2022 15:43:44
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Replying To Pericles: "Didn't Andy Moran also do his cruciate, which is what caused him to miss the final in 2012? I know he broke the leg after too.
I recall AOS had a knee injury scare last year and was also tormented for a couple of years by osteitis pubis. Not sure, but is that what's also keeping Mark Moran out?
The number of significant Mayo players with long term issues, rehabs etc, just seems to be unrelenting. Some of it is plain back luck. It's true other counties have had their share too. Kerry only had James O'Donoghue fit for about 2 years of his career and Paul Geaney has struggled. The Gooch had one year taken by a cruciate, ironically 2014. He was never as effective after he came back either (though that was partly down to the role of the FF evolving into something he wasn't). Our neighbours Galway have had a fair run of long term problems too.
The Dubs training locally and playing the bulk of their games on the best pitch in the country may have reduced their tendency to pick up freak injuries.
I think the bigger panel is the only contingency the Mayo management could take to offset the inevitable. Counties need to have the sort of depth to be able to cope and hopefully the league this year with all the chopping and changing of match day panels will enable Mayo to deal with whatever circumstances throw up. There are players who are growing in front of our eyes like Plunkett, Carney, Flynn and Orne (even O'Hora is improving). By the time some of the long termers come back the players they'll be looking to displace might not be so moveable. Time waits for no one." Obviously if you go back to 2012, there will be other serious injuries. The fact Andy came back from that and won player of the year in his mid thirties shows the physios/s&c people are doing a lot right.
I just don't see any evidence we've been hit worse than other counties down the years. Re Dublin, I heard Paul Flynn say last year that he was dogged with injuries from his late 20s onwards. Cormac Costello is another that probably hasn't lived up to his underage potential due to injuries.
MayoDan (Mayo) - Posts: 420 - 29/03/2022 15:47:04
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Replying To Vish: ":D
We played him non-stop against "Div 2" opponents after coming back from a previous injury, and he broke down against Clare .
A run of games which was supposed to get him "up to speed.". but he broke down;
Was he really needed in any of these games.......???????????
Cut out the ignorance" What previous injury are you talking about?!
He played every game in the 2020 championship, looked in better shape than ever. It was completely reasonable for him to play league games last May.
What games would you have played him in? Just forget about all the division 2 games, maybe the Sligo and Leitrim ones too. Then he would head out cold onto Croke park for the connacht final, 7 months since his last game! Ignorance is right!
MayoDan (Mayo) - Posts: 420 - 29/03/2022 16:08:10
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Replying To MayoDan: "Obviously if you go back to 2012, there will be other serious injuries. The fact Andy came back from that and won player of the year in his mid thirties shows the physios/s&c people are doing a lot right.
I just don't see any evidence we've been hit worse than other counties down the years. Re Dublin, I heard Paul Flynn say last year that he was dogged with injuries from his late 20s onwards. Cormac Costello is another that probably hasn't lived up to his underage potential due to injuries." I just threw Andy in because it was so high profile and at the time it was a costly one because he was at peak form and un-markable.
But it's obvious that Mayo are not standing still waiting for Cillian or anyone else. Even Eoghan McLaughlin, who I'd have regarded as a nailed on starter at the start of 2022, because of his absence due to his injury it has allowed one of the other contenders for that halfback place to put his case and now I'm not sure where you'd accommodate him. I suspect JH had been considering moving him up to the half-forward line and maybe that might be where he could still find a spot? But that's how it should be and there are definitely options for most positions in spite of the long casualty list.
Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 2521 - 29/03/2022 19:28:47
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What's the story with unused subs out doing warmups during the game?
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7343 - 30/03/2022 18:45:02
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Byrne. Ok but missing Robbie's kick outs.
Keegan fine
Coen poor
O'Hora as well as possible
Plunkett good going forward. Less so defending
Brickenden. Ok for a novice
Hession. Same as Plunkett
Flynn. Mixed good with average
Ruane. Like Flynn
Loftus. Poor.
Aido. Worked hard throughout
Carney. Missed chances drained confidence. He'll have better days.
Carr. Did well and worked hard till fading.
J. DOC. Anonymous.
ROD. Needs help. A real warrior.
Subs. K.Mc. Just not the player of old.
Orme. Needs to nail early chance or confidence dissipates.
Conor O shea. Trier but not up to this level.
Cillian. Hoping this cameo means he's ready.
Missing Hennelly.
Harrison. McBrien. Durcan. Mullin. McLaughlin. Diarmuid. McDonagh. Conroy.
Who can we get back for championship?
Maybe. Hennelly. McBrien. Durcan. Mullin. McLaughlin.Diarmuid.
We can only hope. MaigheoAbu.
ponga (Mayo) - Posts: 649 - 03/04/2022 18:53:29
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Glad to see CO'C back. Horrible injury for anyone so fair play to him. That won't stop me roaring at him on the 24th!
Not a great day for either of us. Saying that it was a good run out and no injures I think so apart from a bit of dodgy defending happy enough.
Yeer scoreline was horrible but I'd imagine ye'll be a different animal with Durkan, DO'C, OM and CO'C back.
Roll on 24th. Should be a great day. Hopefully the pitch gets the OK, we get decent weather and both teams are fully loaded with no injuries and go at it hammer and tongs. Obviously ye are proven at a higher level than us but I think we have a great chance of we get a little luck.
Mayonman (Galway) - Posts: 1828 - 03/04/2022 21:53:22
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Today wont be a set back for Mayo, it was a bonus making a final but they were not looking at winning the league, especially with injuries.
They looked a bit leggy, the lads with pace werent going full tilt so maybe they were training hard in prep for championship.
Its good to get a reality check now, and get them focused and fired up, no pressure on them now, everyone thinks they are no good now again.
tommy132 (Mayo) - Posts: 601 - 03/04/2022 21:56:05
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Replying To tommy132: "Today wont be a set back for Mayo, it was a bonus making a final but they were not looking at winning the league, especially with injuries.
They looked a bit leggy, the lads with pace werent going full tilt so maybe they were training hard in prep for championship.
Its good to get a reality check now, and get them focused and fired up, no pressure on them now, everyone thinks they are no good now again." Coen stood out as being very off the pace he looked gassed from the get go
Sportsfanatic90 (Westmeath) - Posts: 213 - 04/04/2022 08:21:26
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Replying To Sportsfanatic90: "Coen stood out as being very off the pace he looked gassed from the get go" Yeah, I dont think hes up to it, he is a weak link in the defence and making him captain for the year was a very odd choice.
tommy132 (Mayo) - Posts: 601 - 04/04/2022 10:31:20
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Replying To tommy132: "Yeah, I dont think hes up to it, he is a weak link in the defence and making him captain for the year was a very odd choice." Thought we was solid for us all last year. One of our better performers in the final. Former all Ireland winning captain at minor and u21 level…is it really that odd he was made captain?
I'll tell you what is odd…Conor O Se coming on.
yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11229 - 04/04/2022 17:39:32
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Replying To yew_tree: "Thought we was solid for us all last year. One of our better performers in the final. Former all Ireland winning captain at minor and u21 level…is it really that odd he was made captain?
I'll tell you what is odd…Conor O Se coming on." He did have solid year last year but that was his first solid year with Mayo senior team. He was maybe one the that you would say could do a job but I dont think he was ever a sure starter. Hes not good on the ball. I know he has captained other teams but thats young lads and he dedicated and a good speaker. Maybe they thought he could take the pressure of being captain but I dont think it has suited him.
yes Conor O Se coming on is odd, being in the panel is odd..not sure how he is in it, very lucky to be there
tommy132 (Mayo) - Posts: 601 - 05/04/2022 10:41:37
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