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Replying To Ned_Stormcrow: "Whilst I think changing the manager would be a largely pointless endeavour, I personally think if we could get Mickey Harte then it would be worth it. He's probably the only candidate you would make the change for. Would he coach a team against his own county though?" He is with Louth and seems to enjoy his role there.
A lot of forwards left the Tyrone panel in Mickey Hartes later years with Tyrone. Darren McCurry played his best football under the new management, as they were kicking the ball in.
FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 15/07/2022 13:53:48
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Replying To breffnibluewhite: "i agree with most of what you said and yes mickey and his management got more wrong this year than right but if he goes i can see Galligan Faulkner Moynagh Killian Clarke and Mckiernan retiring of the starting team against westmeath with possibly a few others. This is the main reason why i think he should stay on after next year i will not matter if God himself is in charge." Great point, and I know if it comes out in a few weeks that Mickey does decide to stay on for another year I wont be too disappointed and I will back him all day long. The man obviously has something special about him. I hear Corey has left too so its a chance for him to turn that background team on its head too.
As I have mentioned, he has giving us some great times and great moments over the last 4 years but I just had a gut feeling this week that this was the end.
I think your Mickey Grahams and Terry Hylands might get you to Croke Park for a day out. I think a Mickey Harte or Mickey Moran will teach us how to win in Croke Park once and for all.
blueskies (Cavan) - Posts: 194 - 15/07/2022 14:08:28
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Replying To breffnibluewhite: "i agree with most of what you said and yes mickey and his management got more wrong this year than right but if he goes i can see Galligan Faulkner Moynagh Killian Clarke and Mckiernan retiring of the starting team against westmeath with possibly a few others. This is the main reason why i think he should stay on after next year i will not matter if God himself is in charge." Talk about been negative……. That takes the biscuit
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 15/07/2022 14:13:20
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Replying To ForeverBlue2: "Wouldn't take a genius to know we are not really competitive in Ulster any more… Pundits just said we played as well or better than Donegal in the first half but most people know a game is played over 70+ minutes and not 35….. no good been at it for the 1st half and then making schoolboy errors in the half that matters…. This is what separates the top teams from the no hopers…." school boy errors are made by players on the pitch, not management.
Is Dessie Farrell a poor manager because his defender gave away a needless free kick last Sunday? no he's not.
Mickey Graham isn't a poor manager because two of our more experienced players made silly errors. The man took us to two Ulster Senior finals in a row, winning one of them. When was the last time Cavan got to two Ulster Senior Finals in a row?
I guess, you are one of the glass half empty brigade and no doubt you'll spend the weekend whining that the weather is too hot!
cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 15/07/2022 14:37:46
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Replying To cavanblueman: "school boy errors are made by players on the pitch, not management.
Is Dessie Farrell a poor manager because his defender gave away a needless free kick last Sunday? no he's not.
Mickey Graham isn't a poor manager because two of our more experienced players made silly errors. The man took us to two Ulster Senior finals in a row, winning one of them. When was the last time Cavan got to two Ulster Senior Finals in a row?
I guess, you are one of the glass half empty brigade and no doubt you'll spend the weekend whining that the weather is too hot!" They made errors that they would get away with in Division 3/4…. When you play at that level you are found out against the big teams… Graham and his management team brought Cavan to this level and therefore must take the blame….. Getting the handy side of the draw 2 years running doesn't make you a good manager it makes you a lucky manager… taking a team from Division 1 to Division 4 certainly doesn't mean you are a good manager… it means you are a very poor manager and Cavan's performance's in the last couple of years proves he is a poor manager… you can't always depend on luck….. He has had his time and Cavan are on the slide since 2019/20…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 15/07/2022 14:55:32
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Tactical mistakes prove costly for Cavan in final flop - Mark McGowan
Bitter disappointment will be the prevailing emotion as Cavan's footballers' season ended with defeat to Westmeath in Croke Park. Despite taking an early lead and holding a two-point advantage with 12 minutes of normal time remaining, few Cavan fans could argue that Westmeath weren't the better side on the day and deserved inaugural Tailteann Cup champions.
Westmeath named an unchanged line-up from the side that comfortably defeated Offaly in the semi-final three weeks previous, where the Faithful county were no match for their neighbours' pacey and powerful running game.
As expected, Killian Brady took up marking duties on John Heslin, Padraig Faulkner picked up Luke Loughlin and Carolan completed the last line of defence by taking up station on Lorcan Dolan. Since Westmeath typically leave three attacking players high up the field, it was hard to argue with these defensive match-ups for Cavan with Carolan on the quickest, Brady on the classiest, and Faulkner on the biggest threat aerially, and though each of Cavan's full-back line made glaring errors at various stages, each of them will fell that they had their opponent in their pocket for long sections of the game.
The thing about defending though, is that any lapse in concentration can be fatal and so it proved as both Faulkner and Carolan were caught ball-watching for the opening goal. The Kingscourt man allowed Loughlin to peel off him in the square where he was found by Ronan O'Toole's delightful cross-field pass, while the Cúchulainns youngster was caught napping as Dolan raced by him to finish after Loughlin had teed him up.
In last week's preview, I highlighted centre-forward O'Toole as the main attacking threat and the man to watch, expecting Jason McLoughlin to be given a man-marking job on the elusive St. Loman's man. However, Cavan management instead opted to assign this task to Conor Brady.
Brady has had a superb year in Cavan blue and nothing can take that away, but tackling large opponents has been his bread and butter and the diminutive O'Toole was far too clever and elusive for the powerful Gowna man. By the time McLoughlin was switched onto O'Toole just after the 20-minute mark with Brady now watching Sam McCartan, O'Toole had four points from play to his name and had almost single-handedly kept Westmeath in touch.
At the other end of the field, Westmeath manager Jack Cooney identified James Smith as Cavan's most dangerous weapon and placed his trust in captain Kevin Maguire to man-mark him. I'd expected Maguire to get to grips with Paddy Lynch and Smith to emerge as the ace in the pack, but this was an inspired move by Cooney as Smith's physical presence was conspicuous by its absence in any meaningful way close to goal.
With Maguire on Smith, Lynch was picked up by Jack Smith in what ought to have been a mismatch height-wise, had aerial deliveries been forthcoming. They weren't, and this was surprising given Cavan's success with early, direct ball in the earlier stages of the championship and the frequency with which the kick-pass option was selected in the ensuing encounters.
On the 40, Gearoid McKiernan found himself being marked by David Lynch which gave Ronan Wallace more freedom to do what he does best - make repetitive driving runs right through the heart of Cavan's defence. Quite who (if anybody) was supposed to be tracking Wallace when Westmeath were in possession wasn't clear, but if that was the case then it was a terrible oversight given Wallace's threat for goals as he bombs forward.
Of course, tactics are never a one-way street and there are counters to every measure, but in more ways than one, this was an extremely tame performance by the Breffni men. To think of Thomas Galligan's direct running against Donegal - prompting some members of the crowd to release their inner "Hulk" in tribute - or the incisive and unstoppable run from the throw-in against Fermanagh, and it's difficult to fathom how unadventurous 2020's Ulster Player of the Year was in possession and how unwilling he seemed to take the ball into contact.
In fact, the same can be said of most of the Cavan team, but you'd expect Galligan to be the most prominent given how difficult he is to stop. There was an element of risk-averse football about Cavan's play and you'd have to suspect that their openness at the back against Sligo played its part in no small measure.
Bringing Conor Moynagh back into the team was no doubt designed to make Cavan more structurally sound at the back - something I'd personally advocated for - but it ultimately failed to have the desired impact as Westmeath still found too many holes in the Cavan defence and rendered Graham's men rather listless as they brought the ball out of defence, often barely above walking pace.
This was not a game where kick-out strategies had a major bearing, and for that I'd tend to be a little critical of Cavan. Raymond Galligan's first kicking option all year has been to go long, to find a man in space between 45 and 65, or to kick long to a contest in which invariably the odds are in Breffni's favour. This has given Cavan a great platform from which to launch swift attacks, but at the weekend Galligan opted to go short on most occasions and Westmeath were able to comfortably hoover up most of the breaking balls whenever the Lacken shot-stopper kicked to a contest.
His opposite number Jason Daly must've expected to be faced with an aggressive press given the size of his blue-shirted opponents, so will have been very happy to realise that the short option was available more often than not. Again, the risk of being caught on a quick counter no doubt influenced Cavan's tactics, but this was uncharacteristically negative from a side that have played on the front foot all season.
The impact from the bench was one of the defining characteristics of Cavan's Ulster Championship triumph in 2020, with Thomas Galligan's introduction turning the game on its head against Monaghan - and to a lesser extent, against Antrim - and Conor Madden doing the same against Down, but there has been very little to write home about from the substitutes this year. Stephen Smith came in for Cian Madden at half-time, and though Smith did reasonably well, it was a like-for-like replacement.
Though Conor Brady had struggled to deal with Ronan O'Toole in the early stages, he was one of the better players after swapping with McLoughlin, and one of the few in a blue shirt who drove forward with intent, so I was a little surprised to see him replaced by Martin Reilly after 50 minutes. The Killygarry veteran may well have played his last game in a Cavan shirt and it will be one to forget having given away possession in the lead-up to Westmeath's second goal, though there are roughly a half-dozen Breffni men who ought to have done much better as Kieran Martin careened through the defence like a velvet-quilted sledgehammer.
It is much too simplistic to say that Thomas Galligan's red card - which he can have few complaints over - was the turning point - even if Westmeath went on to outscore Cavan by 1-04 to no score - because the Lake County men looked much the fresher side, but I guess we'll never know for sure.
Is this the end of the road for Mickey Graham? I suspect the people of Cavan would love to see him stay but that is a decision that he'll ultimately make himself. Tactical reviews always have the benefit of hindsight, and on occasion, even the best laid tactical plans come a cropper due to unforeseen circumstances, human error, or just plain old bad luck.
Graham has gotten much more right than he's gotten wrong, and in a game of such fine margins, you can't ask for much more than that.
ExiledCuCu (Cavan) - Posts: 226 - 15/07/2022 15:14:01
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Replying To Ned_Stormcrow: "Whilst I think changing the manager would be a largely pointless endeavour, I personally think if we could get Mickey Harte then it would be worth it. He's probably the only candidate you would make the change for. Would he coach a team against his own county though?" i think he set up louth very defensively against a poor cork team in this years championship and by all account it was one of the poorest spectacles in the championship made the Donegal Derry game look good.
breffnibluewhite (Cavan) - Posts: 452 - 15/07/2022 17:52:09
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Replying To breffnibluewhite: "i think he set up louth very defensively against a poor cork team in this years championship and by all account it was one of the poorest spectacles in the championship made the Donegal Derry game look good." That would not be a good way to go so … I think if Mickey Graham goes the CB will give the job to Ricey Mc Mennimen…. I think one of the selectors Corey from Monaghan has already jumped ship….
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 16/07/2022 11:09:32
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Be more then Corey jumping ship if Mcmenaminn is manager
FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 16/07/2022 14:04:31
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Replying To FoolsGold: "Be more then Corey jumping ship if Mcmenaminn is manager" I think you're right but he will be odds on to get the job…. That's why he was brought in there in the first place… he certainly didn't improve our defensive system…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 16/07/2022 14:16:58
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Replying To ForeverBlue2: "I think you're right but he will be odds on to get the job…. That's why he was brought in there in the first place… he certainly didn't improve our defensive system…" I think you're right but he will be odds on to get the job…. That's why he was brought in there in the first place… he certainly didn't improve our defensive system…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 890 - 16/07/2022 14:16:58 2432346
Odds on where u getting that from ?
RHF (Cavan) - Posts: 845 - 17/07/2022 21:30:38
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If MG stays I think he needs a clean sweep with his back room team. Seanie and Ricey clearly not up to the task. And I've never seen what Corey brought either.
Back room team for us has been a problem for years Not experienced enough.
If you look at the Teams doing well this year they had really strong back room Teams( ex managers in some cases).
I think that's our main problem more so than a change of manager.
Johnston being a good footballer has little experience coaching county teams. He would be far better off coaching minors to start off with.
Ricey walking away would save the CB loads in travel expenses.
McHugh/ Mickey Moran would be excellent choices as Number 2. Lots of experience to pass on without the pressure of fulltime management.
Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 18/07/2022 10:53:11
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He was brought in to replace Dermot McCabe. Never anything about him becoming manager.
FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2763 - 18/07/2022 11:09:26
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We will just have to wait and see…. The best move would be to clear out the lot…
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 18/07/2022 13:14:33
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Not a word from Loughduff Lad since the Final….! Maybe he now admits this current set up with Cavan is just not working… penny has dropped
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 19/07/2022 15:26:32
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Not a word from Loughduff Lad since the Final….! Maybe he now admits this current set up with Cavan is just not working… penny has dropped
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 19/07/2022 15:32:25
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Replying To ForeverBlue2: "Not a word from Loughduff Lad since the Final….! Maybe he now admits this current set up with Cavan is just not working… penny has dropped" If people listened to you, then Padraig Joyce wouldn't be leading Galway into an All-Ireland Final this weekend.
Look at his record before this year, the like's of you would have been calling for his head.
As Joyce said, lose one match and people will be looking for you to go.
Supporters like you think we have the same calibre of players as they do in Dublin and Kerry. The fact is we dont, we have good players but they are not top class players, yet Mickey has made them more competitive than any manager has done in Cavan in 30 years. Reaching two Ulster Final in a 5 year tenure is nothing short of remarkable given what went before him.
People talk about Terry and Matty in Division One, the reason we reached Division One was because the majority of teams in those Division's were breaking in new blood whilst Cavan were fielding first team players in every match. Matty or Terry could barely win an opening championship match. Yes, we got demoted under Graham, but he didnt mind, he used the league to blood new players and you can see the improvement in those players.
We could get Mickey Moran, Mickey Harte or Jim Gavin into manage Cavan but the fact is, the calibre of player isnt there, and no doubt after a few losses, you'll be calling for their heads too!
cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 20/07/2022 13:36:01
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Replying To cavanblueman: "If people listened to you, then Padraig Joyce wouldn't be leading Galway into an All-Ireland Final this weekend.
Look at his record before this year, the like's of you would have been calling for his head.
As Joyce said, lose one match and people will be looking for you to go.
Supporters like you think we have the same calibre of players as they do in Dublin and Kerry. The fact is we dont, we have good players but they are not top class players, yet Mickey has made them more competitive than any manager has done in Cavan in 30 years. Reaching two Ulster Final in a 5 year tenure is nothing short of remarkable given what went before him.
People talk about Terry and Matty in Division One, the reason we reached Division One was because the majority of teams in those Division's were breaking in new blood whilst Cavan were fielding first team players in every match. Matty or Terry could barely win an opening championship match. Yes, we got demoted under Graham, but he didnt mind, he used the league to blood new players and you can see the improvement in those players.
We could get Mickey Moran, Mickey Harte or Jim Gavin into manage Cavan but the fact is, the calibre of player isnt there, and no doubt after a few losses, you'll be calling for their heads too!" You are deluded…. the performance and the way the team were set up was pathetic… not contesting 24 kick outs was madness.. The way Cavan are set up they would keep Kilkenny in a match if they bothered to field a team… I agree we have some seriously average players but this gomeless management team are setting them up as if they were a Kerry or Dublin… No point in conceding the kick outs if you are not able to defend… The fact Mickey Graham can't see this proves he is clueless… Granted he won a covid ravaged Ulster Championship but what has happened since proves without doubt it was a flash in the pan… How on earth can a back room team of 22 stand over an embarrassing performance like what we seen v Westmeath…… just think a back room team of 22…. Real Madrid wouldn't have that many..
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 20/07/2022 16:13:10
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Replying To cavanblueman: "If people listened to you, then Padraig Joyce wouldn't be leading Galway into an All-Ireland Final this weekend.
Look at his record before this year, the like's of you would have been calling for his head.
As Joyce said, lose one match and people will be looking for you to go.
Supporters like you think we have the same calibre of players as they do in Dublin and Kerry. The fact is we dont, we have good players but they are not top class players, yet Mickey has made them more competitive than any manager has done in Cavan in 30 years. Reaching two Ulster Final in a 5 year tenure is nothing short of remarkable given what went before him.
People talk about Terry and Matty in Division One, the reason we reached Division One was because the majority of teams in those Division's were breaking in new blood whilst Cavan were fielding first team players in every match. Matty or Terry could barely win an opening championship match. Yes, we got demoted under Graham, but he didnt mind, he used the league to blood new players and you can see the improvement in those players.
We could get Mickey Moran, Mickey Harte or Jim Gavin into manage Cavan but the fact is, the calibre of player isnt there, and no doubt after a few losses, you'll be calling for their heads too!" Probably the best reason nobody would be calling for his head is that he didn't take Galway from Division 1 to Division 4…. If that had been achieved I doubt he would still be in the job or Galway anywhere near an All Ireland football Final…. It's simple but probably hard for you to comprehend…!!
ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 1901 - 20/07/2022 18:25:09
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Replying To ForeverBlue2: "Probably the best reason nobody would be calling for his head is that he didn't take Galway from Division 1 to Division 4…. If that had been achieved I doubt he would still be in the job or Galway anywhere near an All Ireland football Final…. It's simple but probably hard for you to comprehend…!!" maybe have a look at the Celt this week.....celebrating the 1997 Ulster Final win....to put that in perspective, Cavan didnt win another Ulster Final until 2020, under Mickey Graham.
Joyce took over Galway in 2019, yet was beaten in two Connaught Finals in 2020 and 2021 - they were also mauled by Kerry by 22 points in the league in May 2021 and relegated to Division 2. Should he have been sacked then? 3 years in charge, lost 2 provincial finals and relegated to Division 2.
So if Galway dont beat Kerry on Sunday, does that make Joyce a failure once again....I suppose in your eyes, it will.....
cavanblueman (Cavan) - Posts: 636 - 21/07/2022 10:09:50
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