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What Makes A Great Footballer

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Replying To Whammo86:  "You should have won the first day. I felt Keane's approach to the spare man was on the conservative side for instance.

In the replay Murchan's goal was hard for you to come back from and Dublin controlled the pace of the second half. You squandered a lot of good positions in the first half playing it directly into full forward. From 5-1 down you really owned the rest of the first half. You can put it up to Dublin in a way that no one did in 2018.

You'll only be better next season and Dublin's bench was certainly stronger 2 to 3 years ago than it was this year.

I see 3+ All Ireland's in Kerry in the next 10 years and some mighty battles with the Dubs."
I hope you're right whammo, I just can't see it in the immediate future bud.

Everyone saying that Gavin and a load of dubs would retire if they got the 5 and it doesn't look like that's going to happen, there will probably be more Kerry retirements this year than dubs.

No young dubs going to Oz compared to the rest of the country losing their best and brightest.

People losing interest watching amateurs playing professionals in their own back yard.

Football is in big trouble.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 9857 - 29/09/2019 21:18:47    2240126

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "I hope you're right whammo, I just can't see it in the immediate future bud.

Everyone saying that Gavin and a load of dubs would retire if they got the 5 and it doesn't look like that's going to happen, there will probably be more Kerry retirements this year than dubs.

No young dubs going to Oz compared to the rest of the country losing their best and brightest.

People losing interest watching amateurs playing professionals in their own back yard.

Football is in big trouble."
Jays but you take the biscuit alright. Talk about burying your head in the sand. Utter manure as usual.
Ye have done more damage to the GAA than any other county with you're own scout dragging players to Australia and you on here whinging about how hard ye have it.
Give me a break will you, ye had every advantage in the All Ireland final and bottled it not for the first time either.

catch22 (USA) - Posts: 1037 - 29/09/2019 21:49:28    2240144

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"Great" is such a broad term...I know lads who could have been great (or at least that's my view) but didn't have the dedication or head for it to take it seriously. Who knows what level they could have reached.

I would say attitude and dedication are your base. Being able to read a game (intelligence) and of course ability.

Now some handful of players are just born with skill but you can become very good with hours and hours of practice over years.

Good coaching (like a good teacher) can shape a kids future.

S&C is huge now and of course vital but is too much being placed on physical and endurance aspects instead of actual skills? At club level I feel it's a problem.

I see some lads who are gym addicts and play, a few more who are naturally better footballers but are not interested in the gym or S&C side of things. The club season is finishing up now or will do in the next few weeks for most....then it's back at it just before or after Christmas....is the enjoyment going out of the game?

Sorry just realized I've been rambling....

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 9902 - 30/09/2019 19:13:17    2240437

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Replying To yew_tree:  ""Great" is such a broad term...I know lads who could have been great (or at least that's my view) but didn't have the dedication or head for it to take it seriously. Who knows what level they could have reached.

I would say attitude and dedication are your base. Being able to read a game (intelligence) and of course ability.

Now some handful of players are just born with skill but you can become very good with hours and hours of practice over years.

Good coaching (like a good teacher) can shape a kids future.

S&C is huge now and of course vital but is too much being placed on physical and endurance aspects instead of actual skills? At club level I feel it's a problem.

I see some lads who are gym addicts and play, a few more who are naturally better footballers but are not interested in the gym or S&C side of things. The club season is finishing up now or will do in the next few weeks for most....then it's back at it just before or after Christmas....is the enjoyment going out of the game?

Sorry just realized I've been rambling...."
Agree with most of what you say. The off the cuff forward is a thing of the past. They are programmed nowadays to retain possession and wait for openings.

Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 972 - 01/10/2019 13:00:46    2240610

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Replying To yew_tree:  ""Great" is such a broad term...I know lads who could have been great (or at least that's my view) but didn't have the dedication or head for it to take it seriously. Who knows what level they could have reached.

I would say attitude and dedication are your base. Being able to read a game (intelligence) and of course ability.

Now some handful of players are just born with skill but you can become very good with hours and hours of practice over years.

Good coaching (like a good teacher) can shape a kids future.

S&C is huge now and of course vital but is too much being placed on physical and endurance aspects instead of actual skills? At club level I feel it's a problem.

I see some lads who are gym addicts and play, a few more who are naturally better footballers but are not interested in the gym or S&C side of things. The club season is finishing up now or will do in the next few weeks for most....then it's back at it just before or after Christmas....is the enjoyment going out of the game?

Sorry just realized I've been rambling...."
Agree with most of what you say. The off the cuff forward is a thing of the past. They are programmed nowadays to retain possession and wait for openings.

Inaroundehouse (Cavan) - Posts: 972 - 01/10/2019 13:44:17    2240624

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "I hope you're right whammo, I just can't see it in the immediate future bud.

Everyone saying that Gavin and a load of dubs would retire if they got the 5 and it doesn't look like that's going to happen, there will probably be more Kerry retirements this year than dubs.

No young dubs going to Oz compared to the rest of the country losing their best and brightest.

People losing interest watching amateurs playing professionals in their own back yard.

Football is in big trouble."
James Madden.

The rest of your post is as wrong.

Gavvygavgav (Dublin) - Posts: 319 - 01/10/2019 17:07:00    2240707

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Discipline simple as that, you can have talent but if you're disciplined, focused you can succeed. You don't need skill to show up on time, listen to coaches, try one best, give 100% and be disciplined both on and off the field.

I've often maintained once a player is disciplined, has the adequate coaching and resources and is willing to learn then they can succeed.

Horsebox77 (Kerry) - Posts: 4225 - 02/10/2019 15:01:59    2240956

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80% brain, 20% the rest of the variables. its sad and frustrating watching some games now. lads have been coached so so much that some don't know how to think on their feet or react when the plan falls apart. I'm sick of seeing managers running up and down the line and telling fells where to stand, where to run to etc etc. surely the player should have that spacial awareness themselves. obviously you need a game plan but to me, coaching should be teaching and encouraging lads to think for themselves. bit of a tangent there, apologies for that.......

theweanling (Cavan) - Posts: 381 - 02/10/2019 17:09:15    2240988

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Replying To theweanling:  "80% brain, 20% the rest of the variables. its sad and frustrating watching some games now. lads have been coached so so much that some don't know how to think on their feet or react when the plan falls apart. I'm sick of seeing managers running up and down the line and telling fells where to stand, where to run to etc etc. surely the player should have that spacial awareness themselves. obviously you need a game plan but to me, coaching should be teaching and encouraging lads to think for themselves. bit of a tangent there, apologies for that......."
I think it should be all those things, absolutely.

I think game management as an idea is relatively new to the game.

I think there's a bit of a transition happening where there's less of the cuff stuff working for players and it's taking time for them overall to adjust.

It's a messy game though and it does take guidance from the line to see the overall picture and what's going wrong.

You look to the All Ireland replay, it was a considered tactic of Kerry's to play it directly into their forward line from deep. They stuck with it way too long.

I think in years to come with players more tactically aware they take the responsibility to change the game plan upon themselves.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 2752 - 02/10/2019 17:36:25    2240994

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I think part of the reason for the safety first football that we see at times is that mistakes can be very quickly punished in our game now.

It started with Donegal in 2012 and others have matched it.

Teams transition quickly when they win the ball and break at speed.

You lose the ball in the opposition 45 and aren't ready to defend, you're in trouble in a way that you weren't in the past.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 2752 - 02/10/2019 17:41:29    2240996

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Having a Kerry parent : )

essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 600 - 02/10/2019 19:09:16    2241009

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Replying To essmac:  "Having a Kerry parent : )"
)))

GodInyou (UK) - Posts: 2 - 14/10/2019 15:00:42    2243425

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Honestly this is just such complete rubbish.

Did you see Jack McCaffrey, Sean O'Shea, David Moran or Brian Howard in the first game?

Then there was Murchan, Fenton and Mannion in the replay.

Players take on their man all the time.

These players are pure class.

Murchan is a corner back who roasted a midfielder and slotted the ball into bottom corner with the outside of his foot after a 50 yard run.

Paddy Durcan, Con O'Callaghan, Peter Harte, Cathal McShane, Michael Murphy, Paddy McBrearty, Conor McManus, Eoin McHugh.

I actually pity people who can't appreciate these guys. I don't know what game you're watching if you can't see the skills on show.

They're proper ballers these lads and they're testing each other more than players ever did back in the day.

The decision making is at a level that wasn't even a consideration 20 years ago."
Excellently put. To me Gaelic football has almost the perfect balance of skill, fitness and power. The players name checked are incredible both athletically and skill wise. Even in the era when blanked defenses were ultra prominent we were treated to the speed of thought and movement likes of Gooch, Donnacha O'Connor and Bernard Brogan to create space and unlock them. A challenge infinitely greater than any of the forwards of previous generations faced.

It always did my head in when you had every Tom, Dick and Harry saying there was no skill in gaelic football anymore while lauding a relatively minor skill in that they might see in a rugby game (which I also enjoy). I suppose that's just the nature of it. If the TV pundits say something is awful or amazing often enough the average Joe will take the same line. Some of the older pundits seemed to have a "twas better in my day" agenda

I'd rather the Dubs weren't so dominant but one positive is that they have made the general public sit up and admire not just them but also gaelic football again.

tomhealycork (Cork) - Posts: 62 - 15/10/2019 15:52:41    2243737

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Replying To tomhealycork:  "Excellently put. To me Gaelic football has almost the perfect balance of skill, fitness and power. The players name checked are incredible both athletically and skill wise. Even in the era when blanked defenses were ultra prominent we were treated to the speed of thought and movement likes of Gooch, Donnacha O'Connor and Bernard Brogan to create space and unlock them. A challenge infinitely greater than any of the forwards of previous generations faced.

It always did my head in when you had every Tom, Dick and Harry saying there was no skill in gaelic football anymore while lauding a relatively minor skill in that they might see in a rugby game (which I also enjoy). I suppose that's just the nature of it. If the TV pundits say something is awful or amazing often enough the average Joe will take the same line. Some of the older pundits seemed to have a "twas better in my day" agenda

I'd rather the Dubs weren't so dominant but one positive is that they have made the general public sit up and admire not just them but also gaelic football again."
All these skills are being suffocated by the style of the game today. Once again rules are being changed to open up the game advanced mark sin bin when does it end. Love the game and these players are as talented as any that ever played the game but right now the game has lost its identity it has taken from other sports and quiet frankly is a mess. How many games from the last 2 years will you watch on a cold winters night. A handful at best.

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 27 - 20/10/2019 14:45:41    2244548

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Someone who can kick a ball, accurately to another player and to score. Rare enough in the modern game.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4190 - 20/10/2019 17:33:06    2244578

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This Dublin team are very good but '"the best team and footballers ever". Not a chance. What this Dublin team has is conditioning, fitness, organisation and plenty of back up and resources. They also have a reservoir of players to choose from and want for nothing. However they are no better players than the Kerry sides of the 70's and 80's, Down from the early 90's or Tyrone in the 00's. Spillane, Jacko, John Egan, Mickey Linden, Greg Blaney, James McCartan, Peter Canavan, Stevie O'Neill, Brian McGuigan etc were every bit as talented as anyone on the current Dublin panel.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9203 - 20/10/2019 20:53:52    2244635

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Jim Gavin.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 3018 - 21/10/2019 10:55:04    2244723

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