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Day Out In An Empty Croke Park

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "Context Jimmy boy.

Last year had meath and Kildare replaced by carlow and Longford. It's no wonder it was lower. Considering meath, Dublin and Kildare were in this years the attendance is truly shocking."
What's truly shocking is your negativity and defeatist attitude .

superbluedub (Dublin) - Posts: 2842 - 10/06/2019 17:30:42    2193089

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Replying To Joxer:  "Just to remind you Dr Gloom that of the 6 AIs won by the Dubs since 11, four of them were won by just one point and arguably Mayo should have won two of those matches. In the late 70s and early 80s Kerry were winning AI finals by 17 points. Now that's real dominance on a run to 5 in a row. Dubs have plenty of years on their legs, 8 starters right now, played in 2011 and 3 on the bench played in 2011. Not much in the pipeline either. The blue tide may well be about to turn. What will you ever post about when that happens?"
This reminds me of leinster.

You often had to fight hard at least once in the championship but eventually got to a stage where you steam rolled every team.

There is a danger this could happen at national level. Teams like Tyrone, Mayo, kerry, donegal or galway might run you close now but what if the gap widens even further and you hammer everyone every year. No matter what format the GAA go with it won't matter because it won't be enjoyable.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 10/06/2019 17:35:32    2193092

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "I've been at a lot of dublin games and that atmosphere was terrible. Never heard the hill so quiet. Are a good chunk of dublin season ticket holders just attending to keep their attendance record up to guarantee an all Ireland final ticket?

This year you will hemmer meath and remind us all that your Kildare/meath rivalries won't be returning. You'll probably do the 5 in a row which is keeping Dublin fans hyped. But what then? The hype will drop drastically next year for the 6 in a row. I predict attendances will drop even further.

We can compare attendances to other provinces but look at the population of dublin compared to the counties involved in the other semi finals. 30k Dubs in Croker for a Kildare semi isn't good."
To be honest, I disagree, if you look at The Sunday Game highlights last night there is a huge contrast between the games. The stadium was empty for the first game, when it was over and during our game you see a full Hill 16 and lower Cusack. The majority of the crowd were Dubs. I was heartened to see so many family's and kids, that s the future, these whines no, no different they will perpetuate success. There is and always will be interest in Dublin.

I thought the atmosphere was great yesterday for our game, given the context of the game, the hill was loud and raucous and familiar tunes banging out. You can go to as many Dublin matches as you like, it still wouldn't be as many as me and comparatively that was an excellent atmosphere for a Leinster semi, in a meaningless game in a dead championship.

I was shocked with the small Meath crowd, I saw far more Kildare and probably Laois truth be told.

The reality I believe is Dublin are fine, maybe Meath and Kildare have waived the white flag at it, that's not our problem really, not to be unsympathetic but it's not. Seems there is zero interest in Meath or Kildare football these days. We contributed the guts of the attendace yesterday, I would say 30k conservatively. As the games grow in importance that will grow and eventually full houses depending on who we play.

Like the facts suggest, people spent a week winging about the attendance, only for it to be the best of the year so far and better then any other province that's "competitive". Largely down to the interest in Dublin. No other county could pull an attendace off like that with essentially dead rubber games.

They are falling right across the provinces, it's a nation wide problem.

Football has a problem though, but it is certainly not Dublin attendances at the heart of it.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4517 - 10/06/2019 17:55:34    2193097

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Replying To GreenandRed:  "Going on a tangent here but are attendances up or down in other provinces? Not like there are other sports talking away from GAA crowds at this time of year. Clearly Dublin's football dominance has crowds down for their games, maybe even a few more Dublin supporters will go and see their hurlers tested rather than the footballer at this stage on the year? We've a load more live TV , plus play backs and highlights, than we did when they opened the backdoor in 2001. I think people in 2019 are a bit less inclined to go to games than 18 years ago, just an opinion. We can and do like to give out about the Dubs dominance but I think there's more to falling attendances than their dominance."
Hard to say in Ulster. I'd say they're comparable with years gone by but would also say that since the introduction of the back door there's a slight drop. Remember a few years either side of the change semis were very well attended and you couldn't get an Ulster final ticket for love nor money. Interesting to see what this year will be like with 2 traditionally well supported counties.
That's a very poor attendance for Leinster with a double header against traditional rivals and considering populations involved. Shockingly poor I'd say. Attendance for the final will tell a tale and historically would have been a sell out with those two involved. I'd imagine there'll be plenty of empty seats for the show piece but it's very hard to justify having the semis in Croker with those numbers. Leinster is in a bad way.

Hardtimes (Cavan) - Posts: 1056 - 10/06/2019 18:13:53    2193107

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There was about 5k from meath there yesterday. Most left after the first match. The hill also wasn't full. The far section of it had plenty of space. Only the middle was full.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 10/06/2019 18:14:18    2193109

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Replying To Jack_Goff:  "This reminds me of leinster.

You often had to fight hard at least once in the championship but eventually got to a stage where you steam rolled every team.

There is a danger this could happen at national level. Teams like Tyrone, Mayo, kerry, donegal or galway might run you close now but what if the gap widens even further and you hammer everyone every year. No matter what format the GAA go with it won't matter because it won't be enjoyable."
Have you seen our league results and looked at the age of our team? Leinster is poor. County board in-fighting over managerial appointments, clubs and ex greats falling out with chairmen and mismanagement has set the once strong counties of Leinster back years. While Tyrone, Mayo, Kerry, Monaghan, Donegal and Galway have all put it up to Dublin in recent years the two main rivals to Dublin in Leinster have been all over the shop. Nothing to do with Dublin but these counties just haven't been up to it. I don't think they would fair well in any province just now to be honest, not even the hurling province of Munster.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4745 - 10/06/2019 18:28:11    2193114

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I think the new Croke Park is oversized by about 20k. It went from circa 62k in the early nineties, which was ideal, to 82k, on the back of what was in hindsight a temporary surge in attendances during the nineties.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1256 - 10/06/2019 18:42:19    2193123

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Replying To TheUsername:  "To be honest, I disagree, if you look at The Sunday Game highlights last night there is a huge contrast between the games. The stadium was empty for the first game, when it was over and during our game you see a full Hill 16 and lower Cusack. The majority of the crowd were Dubs. I was heartened to see so many family's and kids, that s the future, these whines no, no different they will perpetuate success. There is and always will be interest in Dublin.

I thought the atmosphere was great yesterday for our game, given the context of the game, the hill was loud and raucous and familiar tunes banging out. You can go to as many Dublin matches as you like, it still wouldn't be as many as me and comparatively that was an excellent atmosphere for a Leinster semi, in a meaningless game in a dead championship.

I was shocked with the small Meath crowd, I saw far more Kildare and probably Laois truth be told.

The reality I believe is Dublin are fine, maybe Meath and Kildare have waived the white flag at it, that's not our problem really, not to be unsympathetic but it's not. Seems there is zero interest in Meath or Kildare football these days. We contributed the guts of the attendace yesterday, I would say 30k conservatively. As the games grow in importance that will grow and eventually full houses depending on who we play.

Like the facts suggest, people spent a week winging about the attendance, only for it to be the best of the year so far and better then any other province that's "competitive". Largely down to the interest in Dublin. No other county could pull an attendace off like that with essentially dead rubber games.

They are falling right across the provinces, it's a nation wide problem.

Football has a problem though, but it is certainly not Dublin attendances at the heart of it."
You're completely missing the point many posters have made tho. .


It's not that Dublin fans aren't showing up to follow their team - they are.

It's that traditionally great counties like Meath, and a county with a huge population like Kildare can't be bothered to follow their teams because in the end, they're at a hiding to nothing.

It's not Dublin's fault - it's the GAA's fault. And there's nothing on the horizon to suggest that they are willing to do anything to address it.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5253 - 10/06/2019 18:55:50    2193134

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Replying To RealTalk101:  "Just over 30 thousand at Croke Park today to witness the two Semi-finals. Probably less than 10 thousand at the first game between Meath and Laois. 10 thousand seats full, 70 thousand empty. The result is a bleak, gloomy atmostphere which certainly hampers the game and is doing us no favours in promoting the game.
The GAA's relentless persistence of playing these games in venues that are too big are driving many of the casuals fans away. Reading the reaction from people who were at the game online only reiterates the point. This idea of teams having 'a day out in croke park' needs to end in my opinion. Play Dublin and Kildare in a venue like Tullamore for example and you'd get a full house with a decent atmostphere. Play Meath and Laois likewise in a smaller venue and you'd have the same.
We are doing ourselves no favours in the promotik of the game, having masses of empty seats on view. Croke park should be only used for games that will attract a crowd that warrants it, i.e 60 thousand. Even All Ireland Semis should be moved out in my opinion. Look back to 2014 with Kerry and Mayo in the semi final. Kieran donaghy recently said it ws one of his favoirite games to play in due to the packed house and the atmosphere."
The alternative is to squeeze them into venues too small, if you want atmosphere just go to your local pub and watch.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4954 - 10/06/2019 19:02:34    2193139

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Replying To cavanman47:  "How far away does your next door neighbour live? Just curious."
You're wasting your breath. I was at a scouting conference years ago and when the subject of rural units struggling with small numbers came up, a Dublin delegate couldn't understand why they couldn't just hop on a bus and amalgamate units; the fact that the next unit might by 40-60 miles away was beyond the poor lads ken.

But a dub congratulating himself because a game hosted in his home town which happens to have a population of 1.5 million is attended by a slightly larger crowd than a game held in a town of a few thousand is pretty entertaining.

As long as they keep winning AIs, the Dubs on this website seem completely blind to everything else.

festinog (Galway) - Posts: 3150 - 10/06/2019 19:03:03    2193140

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Replying To TheUsername:  "To be honest, I disagree, if you look at The Sunday Game highlights last night there is a huge contrast between the games. The stadium was empty for the first game, when it was over and during our game you see a full Hill 16 and lower Cusack. The majority of the crowd were Dubs. I was heartened to see so many family's and kids, that s the future, these whines no, no different they will perpetuate success. There is and always will be interest in Dublin.

I thought the atmosphere was great yesterday for our game, given the context of the game, the hill was loud and raucous and familiar tunes banging out. You can go to as many Dublin matches as you like, it still wouldn't be as many as me and comparatively that was an excellent atmosphere for a Leinster semi, in a meaningless game in a dead championship.

I was shocked with the small Meath crowd, I saw far more Kildare and probably Laois truth be told.

The reality I believe is Dublin are fine, maybe Meath and Kildare have waived the white flag at it, that's not our problem really, not to be unsympathetic but it's not. Seems there is zero interest in Meath or Kildare football these days. We contributed the guts of the attendace yesterday, I would say 30k conservatively. As the games grow in importance that will grow and eventually full houses depending on who we play.

Like the facts suggest, people spent a week winging about the attendance, only for it to be the best of the year so far and better then any other province that's "competitive". Largely down to the interest in Dublin. No other county could pull an attendace off like that with essentially dead rubber games.

They are falling right across the provinces, it's a nation wide problem.

Football has a problem though, but it is certainly not Dublin attendances at the heart of it."
You're the king of spin and propaganda username.

Leo could use you on his team I'd say.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 10/06/2019 19:13:00    2193144

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Replying To OpenStand:  "Dead right, croke park is lonesome and soulless on days its half full or less. As mentioned earlier Kerry v Mayo in Limerick had the best atmosphere of a football semi final in recent years.
KIldare and Dublin in a full portlaoise be a far better day for all.
Would the GAA be better off having a few more concerts ?"
This is why Super 8 matches should be in provincial grounds. Last year:
Kerry v Galway, Limerick.
Donegal v Dublin, Clones.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8852 - 10/06/2019 19:33:20    2193147

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Replying To KingdomBoy1:  "You're the king of spin and propaganda username.

Leo could use you on his team I'd say."
There is some truth to his post though. Just over 5k at a Munster semi final? A semi final featuring the high & mighty Kerry team. Attendances down everywhere. Not just Leinster.

lilylanger (Kildare) - Posts: 758 - 10/06/2019 19:51:30    2193160

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Plenty of incentive for Dublin fans no doubt. They have a fantastic team who play a brilliant brand of football and there are only a handful of teams who can relatively compete with them.

However, facts don't lie. Poor attendances over recent years speak for themselves. Match-day goers expect to get some kind of value for their money by seeing their team compete. People will always be interested when they know their team has a chance. No one wants to go and see their team humiliated. Fair play to Kildare fans who actually went but I doubt they'll have got any satisfaction out of seeing their team slowly strangled to death.

If you create a non competitive competition, how do you hope to attract spectators? I think its easy to take a punt at rival fans for not being "loyal" to their county team but logically speaking, the average supporter has zero incentive.

RoyalClass (Meath) - Posts: 790 - 10/06/2019 19:55:22    2193162

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Replying To festinog:  "You're wasting your breath. I was at a scouting conference years ago and when the subject of rural units struggling with small numbers came up, a Dublin delegate couldn't understand why they couldn't just hop on a bus and amalgamate units; the fact that the next unit might by 40-60 miles away was beyond the poor lads ken.

But a dub congratulating himself because a game hosted in his home town which happens to have a population of 1.5 million is attended by a slightly larger crowd than a game held in a town of a few thousand is pretty entertaining.

As long as they keep winning AIs, the Dubs on this website seem completely blind to everything else."
But if you look at a die hard Celtic fan (and that's the level of the gulf we're talking about), they're happy out to be winning 8 leagues in a row without breaking a sweat.

Will the GAA remain blissfully ignorant when Dublin win 5, 6 , 7 etc in a row?
Maybe falling attendances is all that will shake things up.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5253 - 10/06/2019 20:01:48    2193164

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I am watching the ireland game on TV here. That's where all dubs are in the aviva. A field and old Trafford. But never mind they will be for the all ireland final. Jim gavin must have double vision if he saw that many on the hill sunday

traleegerry (Kerry) - Posts: 738 - 10/06/2019 20:02:27    2193166

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Replying To festinog:  "You're wasting your breath. I was at a scouting conference years ago and when the subject of rural units struggling with small numbers came up, a Dublin delegate couldn't understand why they couldn't just hop on a bus and amalgamate units; the fact that the next unit might by 40-60 miles away was beyond the poor lads ken.

But a dub congratulating himself because a game hosted in his home town which happens to have a population of 1.5 million is attended by a slightly larger crowd than a game held in a town of a few thousand is pretty entertaining.

As long as they keep winning AIs, the Dubs on this website seem completely blind to everything else."
Well it is always healthy by comparing an entire population to an opinion you didn't agree with a couple of years ago, to make an insulting comment and broad generalization. I take it with that attitude it's still a problem.

I do think we can take pride in our support as it goes, it's a clear winner from creating atmosphere, revenue, it's on every promo for a GAA programme and while you most would never admit it, there's nothing our country cousins love more then a game against the Dubs for the atmosphere. It's incompatible, Mayo give it a good rattle to be fair to them.

Your own county I would have a lot of sympathy for, they are very poorly supported, they deserve better in my opinion and if we are being critical of support basis, Galways football support would rank highly for me. The team was abandoned both in the league final and semi last year. Look at your own comparative semi final against Sligo, I have a lot of time and respect for the Galway football team, infact there could well be an All Ireland in that team, but they are undermined by their own fans.

You will speak about traveling to games etc, before you do, yes I've travelled to Salthill on numerous occasions and with a fair wind (pardon the pun) this summer to, while Mayo and Roscommon put yee to shame. I have a lot of sympathy for the Galway footballers, there like nobody's team. We certainly don't need lessons from you, nor do you have just cause to be taking moral high ground with any set of supporters really.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4517 - 10/06/2019 20:15:27    2193175

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Replying To lilylanger:  "There is some truth to his post though. Just over 5k at a Munster semi final? A semi final featuring the high & mighty Kerry team. Attendances down everywhere. Not just Leinster."
The night of the champions league final might have had a bit to do with that as well .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 10/06/2019 20:48:40    2193200

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Middle of the leaving cert didn't help

Could have been 40k+

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20763 - 10/06/2019 20:50:57    2193202

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Fact is less than 2.5% of dubs bothered to turn up to a stadium the vast majority of them could walk to in 40 mins.
Add in dublin fans are the only fans allowed access to cheap hill tickets and still could only half fill it speaks volumes.
Dublin support (in the Leinster champ) is declining just as fast as any other team in Leinster.
Kildare will be have a decent following again in the back door all going well but there now seems to be a deliberate move away from supporting the team in Leinster as all the ticket sales ends up back in Dublin gaa via Leinster council to fund the Dubs again next year expanding the chasm.

cuttothebone (Kildare) - Posts: 168 - 10/06/2019 21:00:55    2193208

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