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Replying To gahfan: "I'd be a bit uncomfortable with all the complaining afterwards about the ref in the media." total ready made excuse, need to be discussing our game plan and wides
castletownman (Wexford) - Posts: 262 - 12/06/2018 07:34:37
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Replying To wexico15: "Tough tough pill to take Saturday, a draw was the least we deserved but unfortunately life isn't always that fair. Alot of nonsense was posted here in the wake of Galway game saying we haven't made progress in recent years and we're not good enough to compete but I felt our team showed there character Saturday and went down with there boots on.
I wouldn't feel its disingenuous to say that 4 games in 21 days was the key factor in the result, we simply were running on empty in the 25 or 30 mins but still showed the resolve to be hanging in there right to the death. the point they showed on the sunday game where leahy dispossessed o'keeffe under the main stand was the definition of players mentally and physically fatigued. was makes it worse is the 4 teams between the 2 provinces in have 4 games in 21 days ended up facing a team coming off a week off in there last game.
Don't think the referee comments are a cop out, in games of such tight margins referees can actually be a major factor in the result, and I 100% feel the ref was a factor Saturday night. Just thinking of some instances during the 2nd half, rory o'connor was blatantly wrestled to the ground 45m out straight in front of the posts, no free given, richie leahy soloed under the main stand was met up by damien reck and grabbed recks arm/hurl should have been a free to us was given as a free to kk which TJ converted, in another instance TJ had the ball 30m out from goal took about 12 steps recycled the ball which to another free which kk converted. the amount of times TJ and leahy got away with overcarrying was scandalous, TJ has been doing that for about 10 years, also the cynical fouls and constant constant moaning to the referee and 2 other aspects to his game, a brillant hurler he is, a role model he isn't.
Small margins can make to a big difference at this level, when you consider facing a fatigued team saturday night and getting away with blanchfield's foul in the lead up to the goal against dublin you could argue there kk have had there fair share of luck, they weren't off been not making the all ireland series let alone the leinster final.
Once we can beat the joe mcdonagh finalist I think the quarter final will define our season it would be our 4th quarter final in 5 years and we've lost the previous 3, a win would be a measure of progress. I would hold not fear of Clare, I think Cork have lethal forwards but are beatable and I think limerick look like a series team so hope to avoid team. hopefully we can come back refreshed now after the 4 week break and give this an almighty rattle" Agree 100%. We ve definitely made progress this year. I think Galway would be the only team that you could say would surely win more than 5 if we played them 10 times. Its a long long time ago since you could even think that there was only 1 better team in Ireland than ours, let alone discuss it on a forum. At a neutral venue for a quarterfinal wed have every chance. Even against Limerick. In recent years gone by wed of probably struggled to beat Offaly. And against KK if we blew a 9 point lead wed of probably ended up losing by 9. Tbh even last year when we beat them they werent as good as they are now and we both were as rested as each other, and at no stage did we dominate them like we did the first 37 mins in Nowlan Park. If we are competitive up til the last puck of the QF if we get there (still couldnt be sure to be sure being a Wexford supporter!!!) that in itself would be progress, as in the last 3 QFs we werent going to win from a long way out. Obviously itd be nice to be All Ireland winners come the end of August, which strange as it might sound, is the first time since 1998 Ive genuinely felt we could be. Progress for sure!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 08:03:31
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Replying To castletownman: "total ready made excuse, need to be discussing our game plan and wides" agree.the referee and blaming him,is an excuse.we had our chances,we didnt take them,focus on what we can do better on (shooting #1) instead of blaming the referee.
kilkenny are great at winning frees,we need to be cuter.
perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 12/06/2018 09:11:13
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The team that beat us in the last 2 seasons (Waterford) are out, as are the only team we failed to beat in the last 2 years (Tipperary), so there is nothing to fear from the remaining sides. We have beaten them all in the last 18 months and know we can beat them all again. Let's learn from the round robin series and push on.
It will be interesting to see if Wexford beat Carlow or Westmeath where the all-Ireland quarter final will be fixed for. Will we have to go all the way to Cork to pay for the stadium like last year or will we end up in Thurles against the Munster teams. It will be 2 separate quarter finals anyway like last year, probably one on Saturday and the other on Sunday as the GAA will want to generate as much revenue. I hope the County Board are already preparing themselves for such a scenario as a lot of Wexford fans won't travel to Cork this year.
Sliotharyslope (Wexford) - Posts: 138 - 12/06/2018 09:23:39
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I dont dont believe for one minute that playing 4 game in four weeks has anything to do with result on saturday!! As far as i know wexford trained once aweek on a wednesday so how could u be fatigued,all hurlers want is more games!! The ref had notting to do with it either!! In my opinion having watched the game twice since,is that kilkenny in the first half were not able to cope with the runners or movement of our forward and could not deal with the space or short puckouts and the overlap with our sweeper in defence simple as!! Having said that kilkenny still created loads of scoring chances easy ones 2 all coming from their own puckout landing on our half back line in a 1v1 situation and we were cleaned out in my eyes!! Walter welsh i thought was cleaning foyle and tj was wininng his own ball on matt in the first half and if they had of converted we cetainly wouldnt have been so far clear!!in the second half i felt kikenney squeezed up and we were forced to hit long puckout and we got cleaned out,with kilkenny able to win there own ball they created overlaps and runners which along with the class of tj reid who pulled all the strings killed us!!it simple in my mind when we have to hurl our own patch win our own ball we struggle big time!! Kilkenny are kings at this and if u cant do it u wont be hurling or if ur not doin it in games u be sittin in the stand!!wexford need to man up and go man for man and try and hurl there own patch win there own ball and things might happen for us!! Thats whats goin to win us games!! Our squad looks weak also!! Big players need to stand up take control make things happen like tj reid did,our big guns havnt done that!! All this talk about steps,i say fair play to them and if u look at the game u can pick out aload of instances of our lad takin 8-10 steps on the ball!!my man of the match was paddy deegan i thought he was outstanding!!
theboys (Wexford) - Posts: 285 - 12/06/2018 09:47:34
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Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot.
Punter72007 (Wexford) - Posts: 319 - 12/06/2018 11:03:22
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Replying To Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." Tipp and Waterford and Offaly all lost their first games were they too tired then?
hurlorhurley (Wexford) - Posts: 1660 - 12/06/2018 11:17:41
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Replying To cragask: "Fairly obvious what went on Saturday night lads. We hurled brilliantly to get ourselves in front,they stayed in the game using there unmatched ability to manufacture frees, we missed oppertunities to bury them,there fresh legs brought the mimpetus and then there ability to score there frees and our inability to consistenly nail ours killed us. Also I will say this game was lost on the line. How or why Dee O Keeffe stayed on the pitch was beyond me. It was obvious 5 minutes into the second half that he hadn't the energy to track Ritchie Leahy when he was dropping back for puck outs, leahy went on to score 2/3 points which won them the game. Why was eoin moore or deveaurax brought onto him? Happened right in front of our line yet we waited til the damage was done before changing it!!
We should of brought on fresh legs when we went 7/8 up early in the second half to kill the game then when we did make changes we brought off our most lively and energitc forward in david dunne and left on kevin foley and nolan who both looked dead on there feet. Why wasn't Dunbar brought on? His pace would of caused havoc in the conditions.
Yes i agree about the referrering. KK are the most cynical team in the country and its an obvious fact that teams are simply not allowed tackle TJ Reid without the kk fans throwing a tantrum. There ability to manufacture frees,convert them and get away with systematic fouling whilst uintimaditing referrees is unrivalled in irish sport. Our naievity and wastefullness is our biggest flaw.
Things we learned again sat night;
1) we have to stay short with puck outs. We dont have any forwards capable of winning clean possession consistently. Chin was superb ball winner one time but seems to have forgotten how to,mcdonald is the most fouled forward in ireland but gets no protection. This wex team is crying out for afully fit jack guiney,say what you like about the chap but id of sent him an sos on sat night.
2) O keffee struggled defensively again.
3) Chin needs to play centrally im sick to death saying it.
4) our forward line needs either more pace/movement or a forward like jack guiney who can play at 11, win and distubute possession.
5) i Thought we defended well overally. Firman done well until donnellys fresh legs caused him bother. Despite others having a go ,o hanlon limited Tj reid quite well. Reid won rucks and stuff but didn't exatcly run riot as others appear to think.
6) I know we went 8 up using our sweeper but I am 100% if we were 15 v 15 against kk we would beat them. We again showed them too much respect. We have better hurlers than them full stop. By playing a sweeper were allowing them nulify our best forward and tighten up there weakesrt position at 3.Conor Mc 1 v 1 with Padraig Walsh would have resulted in the umpire having a sore arm. WE should of gone in for the kill saturday night and I dont care what anybody thinks.
We are very close to being a seriously hard team to beat. Few adustments, a week/10 days off training and we go at it again. Get everybody back and push on.Were 3 games from an all ireland final,theres's not a team out there that I think is any better than us bar Galway who are a step ahead of everyone. I believe limerick have peaked and although hurling brilliantly may well blow themselves out by the time august comes and we've proven we can beat clare and cork... Our season starts now in my eyes." I completely agree about O Keefe. In no mans land for puck outs, either go all the way with leahy or hold the 40. He did neither.
Couple of issues with what your saying though.
1. What evidence is there that Jack Guiney would improve our team??
2. Conor Mac is not our best forward by a long shot, if he learned to pass he could be.
3. MOH got a run around. I watched the game back, Tj Reid set up 5 points in the 2nd half!! He got on an amount of ball and simply ran the show.
4. Firman got skinned by Blanchfield. Got moved off him and then conceded 2 points off Donnelly. If that was Donahoe we would want him dropped. Firman is young and a good player so id stick with him but he didnt do well in the second half!
5. We didnt show them too much respect, we showed them too little by not killing the game. Its as if we didnt expect them to come back at us. We dropped our intensity, made poor decisions and what really bugged me is nobody stepped up in the 2nd half.
The biggest thing learned over the past few weeks is that we have a thin squad. Davy clearly has no faith in a lot of our bench as he hasnt put them in at all even when we were hanging on sat evening.
hurler101 (Wexford) - Posts: 471 - 12/06/2018 11:21:54
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Replying To hurlorhurley: " Replying To Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." Tipp and Waterford and Offaly all lost their first games were they too tired then?"
It's the cumulative effect of playing 4 high end championship games in 21/22 days. By week 4, sometimes the legs go, sometimes it's concentration, sometimes it's skills execution etc etc.
Punter72007 (Wexford) - Posts: 319 - 12/06/2018 12:30:45
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Replying To Punter72007: " Replying To hurlorhurley: "[quote=Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." Tipp and Waterford and Offaly all lost their first games were they too tired then?"
It's the cumulative effect of playing 4 high end championship games in 21/22 days. By week 4, sometimes the legs go, sometimes it's concentration, sometimes it's skills execution etc etc."]Wexford trained 28 times in January and yet they cant play four matches in four weeks in the summer.
Ciaran Deely hit the nail on the head, if teams cant perform four weeks on the trot then the training methods being used are not correct.
Four weeks on the trot is not the reason Wexford, Tipperary or Waterford are out and leave Offaly out of this because if they had six week between each game they would still have lost every game heavily.
hurlorhurley (Wexford) - Posts: 1660 - 12/06/2018 13:04:39
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Replying To Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." The championship draw and fixtures were made several months ago, it wasn't just sprung on people overnight.
Should the management not have taken the fixture schedule into account and used the squad ?
There are players sitting on the bench who never get the chance to stake their claim because they get no game time. There's no point in Davy, or anyone else, blaming the fixture schedule when they wont use all the players at their disposal.
The upside is that we're still in the championship and who knows what a break might do for these lads. Hopefully they'll come back fresh and re-charged in a few weeks.
yelowbelly (Wexford) - Posts: 409 - 12/06/2018 13:09:05
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Replying To Sliotharyslope: "The team that beat us in the last 2 seasons (Waterford) are out, as are the only team we failed to beat in the last 2 years (Tipperary), so there is nothing to fear from the remaining sides. We have beaten them all in the last 18 months and know we can beat them all again. Let's learn from the round robin series and push on.
It will be interesting to see if Wexford beat Carlow or Westmeath where the all-Ireland quarter final will be fixed for. Will we have to go all the way to Cork to pay for the stadium like last year or will we end up in Thurles against the Munster teams. It will be 2 separate quarter finals anyway like last year, probably one on Saturday and the other on Sunday as the GAA will want to generate as much revenue. I hope the County Board are already preparing themselves for such a scenario as a lot of Wexford fans won't travel to Cork this year." Hopefully it will be in Nowlan Park.....
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 14:09:59
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Replying To theboys: "I dont dont believe for one minute that playing 4 game in four weeks has anything to do with result on saturday!! As far as i know wexford trained once aweek on a wednesday so how could u be fatigued,all hurlers want is more games!! The ref had notting to do with it either!! In my opinion having watched the game twice since,is that kilkenny in the first half were not able to cope with the runners or movement of our forward and could not deal with the space or short puckouts and the overlap with our sweeper in defence simple as!! Having said that kilkenny still created loads of scoring chances easy ones 2 all coming from their own puckout landing on our half back line in a 1v1 situation and we were cleaned out in my eyes!! Walter welsh i thought was cleaning foyle and tj was wininng his own ball on matt in the first half and if they had of converted we cetainly wouldnt have been so far clear!!in the second half i felt kikenney squeezed up and we were forced to hit long puckout and we got cleaned out,with kilkenny able to win there own ball they created overlaps and runners which along with the class of tj reid who pulled all the strings killed us!!it simple in my mind when we have to hurl our own patch win our own ball we struggle big time!! Kilkenny are kings at this and if u cant do it u wont be hurling or if ur not doin it in games u be sittin in the stand!!wexford need to man up and go man for man and try and hurl there own patch win there own ball and things might happen for us!! Thats whats goin to win us games!! Our squad looks weak also!! Big players need to stand up take control make things happen like tj reid did,our big guns havnt done that!! All this talk about steps,i say fair play to them and if u look at the game u can pick out aload of instances of our lad takin 8-10 steps on the ball!!my man of the match was paddy deegan i thought he was outstanding!!" If the 4 games in a row doesnt make a difference why are we the only team left out of the 4 that had to do it?
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 14:13:50
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Replying To hurlorhurley: " Replying To Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." Tipp and Waterford and Offaly all lost their first games were they too tired then?"
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 14:21:02
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Replying To hurlorhurley: " Replying To Punter72007: "[quote=hurlorhurley: "[quote=Punter72007: "Makes you think that we have done well to get through this new format.
Four teams between Leinster and Munster have had to play 4 weeks in a row with the following results:
Offaly - Relegated
Waterford (2017 All Ireland Finalists) - Out of Championship
Tipperary (2016 All Ireland Winners) - Out of Championship
Wexford - Still alive
As an extra minor point, it also doesn't help either (as posted earlier by somebody else) that Dublin and Kilkenny had rest weeks before they played Offaly and Wexford on their 4th week on the trot." Tipp and Waterford and Offaly all lost their first games were they too tired then?"
It's the cumulative effect of playing 4 high end championship games in 21/22 days. By week 4, sometimes the legs go, sometimes it's concentration, sometimes it's skills execution etc etc."]Wexford trained 28 times in January and yet they cant play four matches in four weeks in the summer.
Ciaran Deely hit the nail on the head, if teams cant perform four weeks on the trot then the training methods being used are not correct.
Four weeks on the trot is not the reason Wexford, Tipperary or Waterford are out and leave Offaly out of this because if they had six week between each game they would still have lost every game heavily."]Playing high intensity championship matches drains a player mentally as much as physically. Its not like league matches. And certainly not like training- whether you train 28 days or 250 days you are not going to replicate championship intensity. Professional sports people are conditioned from a young age to deal with mental recovery. Our lads in the main have to work during the week. I do think mental tiredness was a factor. This leads to poor concentration and execution. Missed frees in the 1st half was probably more down to nerves. Not passing to a player in a better position late on was bad decision making. Agree MOH was poor on Reid. Hes not got the speed to do a manmarking job. Probably not dirty enough either. Young Firman probably nervous. Reck Ryan and Foley did well tho. Thought Murphy wasnt bad either. Dee o looked tired by the 45 minute mark.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 14:31:53
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the usual "knifers" are back......
perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 12/06/2018 14:36:51
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But up to that was playing his best game this year. And if you look at the 3rd game played by the 3 in a row teams Cork only drew at home to Limerick, Galway barely got over a weakened Dublin team and KK played the worst game i ever saw them play. Up to the consolation goal Walsh scored they only managed 2 points from play in 70 mins. And its a red herring to go on about squad sizes. Like every1 else weve 7 or 8 lads who are central to our team. Fanning, Ryan, MOH, DEE O, Foley, chin, Mac and Rory O
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 15:52:06
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But up to that was playing his best game this year. And if you look at the 3rd game played by the 3 in a row teams Cork only drew at home to Limerick, Galway barely got over a weakened Dublin team and KK played the worst game i ever saw them play. Up to the consolation goal Walsh scored they only managed 2 points from play in 70 mins. And its a red herring to go on about squad sizes. Like every1 else weve 7 or 8 lads who are central to our team. Fanning, Ryan, MOH, DEE O, Foley, chin, Mac and Rory O are the spine of our team. And Nolan too. If some of them play badly /tire, it affects the whole team. And you cant replace them. And no team even Galway are any different. Before they settled on Daithi Burke and Mcinerny at 3 and 6 David Burke midfield canning at 11 cooney at 14 they were only another good team . Now they look a little ahead of the rest. But where would they be if 3 or 4 of those played badly or got injured? And theyve probably the best squad in the country.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 15:57:20
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Replying To perfect10: "the usual "knifers" are back......" Dont worry bout them perfect 10 we ll win all the rest of our games in 2018 and we wont hear from them til next year!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16772 - 12/06/2018 15:59:20
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Replying To perfect10: "the usual "knifers" are back......" Probably seeing phantom posts again... mother hen syndrome at its best
wexcore (Wexford) - Posts: 740 - 12/06/2018 17:21:48
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