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Female Coaches within the Intercounty Scene.

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Positive discrimination in GAA or in any aspect of life should not be the way to go. The best person for the job whether male or female should get it. It's simply another weapon in the armoury of the inne PC brigade. How on earth does positive discrimination lead to better standards? In fact the oppposite is true. Can you imagine if the GAA were stupid enough to adopt it. Imagine a county board saying to a potential county manager, Yes we know that you are the best person to manage the team but we have to reach our positive discrimination targets therefore we are giving the job to this less qualified person. How do you think players would react to that?

lilywhite1 (Kildare) - Posts: 3028 - 30/10/2017 19:14:11    2059154

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Replying To lilywhite1:  "Positive discrimination in GAA or in any aspect of life should not be the way to go. The best person for the job whether male or female should get it. It's simply another weapon in the armoury of the inne PC brigade. How on earth does positive discrimination lead to better standards? In fact the oppposite is true. Can you imagine if the GAA were stupid enough to adopt it. Imagine a county board saying to a potential county manager, Yes we know that you are the best person to manage the team but we have to reach our positive discrimination targets therefore we are giving the job to this less qualified person. How do you think players would react to that?"
I'm talking more generally in the world regarding positive discrimination.

One of the best predictors of a persons salary is their parents salary.

Privilege exists in the world and people are more likely to get ahead if they're born into a wealthy family.

The real world isn't as merit based as any of you people think.

The best people don't get the jobs because those doing the choosing don't choose them. They choose the sons and daughters of their school buddies or golfing partners, or whoever else.

It's not a fair game and those from underprivileged backgrounds need a helping hand not because they're not better than others but because the way of the world is that if they're not given a helping hand or an opportunity they will not get what they deserve the natural way.

It's not about getting people in who aren't as good, it's about giving everyone the shot they deserve.

You can't force a GAA team to take on a woman but you can make them have to be open to interviewing women and then they've got the chance to impress. The NFL instituted this with black coaches and now we're getting to the point where the average black coach is of the same standard as the average white coach.

Positive discrimination isn't about one individual job to fit a quota. It's about making sure that on average that organizations are hiring from a broad spectrum, if they are not doing that then it's quite likely that they are just discriminating. It's about keeping people honest.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4526 - 30/10/2017 19:44:16    2059161

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Sexism and sport go hand in hand. Good enough to make the tea or maybe wash the Jerseys. I coach under 12s this past year I did 12s and 10s with my main focus with the 12s so around this time last year I started putting together a team of people to help out, one happened to be a woman who I thought would be a great addition as she was working with children on a day to day basis and could add some team building skills to our team as I felt that might be an area I was not as experienced in. From day one on the field it was a disaster, I delegated her and a man with 50years experience coaching to the under 10s as I felt both would learn from the other and as far as I could see it did, I set the training plan for them and then let them use their own individual skills how they saw fit. Parents started complaining well two in particular one a woman BTW about how they wanted a proper man over the team not a woman and a pensioner. In the end she walked away as some of the things said about her were pretty personal. It was definitely an eye opener to me as I thought we had moved on a bit, reading some of the comments on this thread would condratict that

Barrowsider (Carlow) - Posts: 1710 - 02/11/2017 13:26:05    2059762

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Replying To Barrowsider:  "Sexism and sport go hand in hand. Good enough to make the tea or maybe wash the Jerseys. I coach under 12s this past year I did 12s and 10s with my main focus with the 12s so around this time last year I started putting together a team of people to help out, one happened to be a woman who I thought would be a great addition as she was working with children on a day to day basis and could add some team building skills to our team as I felt that might be an area I was not as experienced in. From day one on the field it was a disaster, I delegated her and a man with 50years experience coaching to the under 10s as I felt both would learn from the other and as far as I could see it did, I set the training plan for them and then let them use their own individual skills how they saw fit. Parents started complaining well two in particular one a woman BTW about how they wanted a proper man over the team not a woman and a pensioner. In the end she walked away as some of the things said about her were pretty personal. It was definitely an eye opener to me as I thought we had moved on a bit, reading some of the comments on this thread would condratict that"
I bet those complaining about this woman coaching weren't willing to give up their time and effort to coach an underage team?

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7991 - 02/11/2017 14:05:36    2059776

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There's a guy sleeps rough in Ballsbridge mainly around the train station , he actually sleeps on the footpath , most mornings he's there asleep in a sleeping bag freezing , if I have spare coins I try to drop what I can into his cup , what has this got to do with anything you ask ??? The chap is stepped over ignored by hundreds every day , the same people given a voice on social media will post daily about the shame of the homeless and how more needs to be done.
I suggest there are many on HS who like the idea of a female coach as long as its for the opposition. Its the easiest thing in the world to profess yourself as new thinking and enlightened the reality I believe is different.

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 02/11/2017 14:17:25    2059780

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Replying To Damothedub:  "There's a guy sleeps rough in Ballsbridge mainly around the train station , he actually sleeps on the footpath , most mornings he's there asleep in a sleeping bag freezing , if I have spare coins I try to drop what I can into his cup , what has this got to do with anything you ask ??? The chap is stepped over ignored by hundreds every day , the same people given a voice on social media will post daily about the shame of the homeless and how more needs to be done.
I suggest there are many on HS who like the idea of a female coach as long as its for the opposition. Its the easiest thing in the world to profess yourself as new thinking and enlightened the reality I believe is different."
I absolutely would not want to go up against a woman as a coach.

If she's been able to get a role as a coach she must be pretty good.

I used to play poker in the past. I am absolutely used to women being underrated by men, the female players were always dangerous.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4526 - 02/11/2017 16:42:48    2059812

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Replying To Horsebox77:  "Can I throw this out there: ok look I'm not being sexist but the majority of posters here are male… also not being sexist but the Gaa as an organisation is primarily a Male driven organisation. However team wise both at club level and intercounty we have teams that are male/female. From what I have seen in Kerry the ladies teams are again mainly trained by males…. Can I ask in any county is there any senior male football team at club level currently coached or in the past coached by a female or will we ever see the day when an Inter County team will be coached by a female.

Ok I know that the ladies have their own Gaa Organisation and yes this is successfully run but I'm talking about the (male) Inter County Scene?

I am just thinking here from a Kerry perspective our ladies won was it 9 All Irelands in a row in the late 80's - this was an exceptional bunch of Gaa blinkered women, but still none made the move to the other side of the white lines…. Surely of that 9 years of success there was a fair few who had the football brain and capabilities.. or it is just not considered…. Are we that sexist in the Gaa?

The topic just came up in conversation over the weekend and I'd no answer for it…"
Over the five continents women have or do hold the most important and responsible positions in the world, that of finance, politics, CEO's of multi nationals etc, etc. Back home we have had two women presidants of Ireland that ran two terms, we have, and had senior female politicians at the highest level in government, women who run their own business successfully, women who hold senior positions with multi nationals, also in finance, in particular with the Bank Of Ireland, all of which are very professional positions, we also have a woman who is in charge of the National Ploughing Championship in conjunction with the department of agriculture, which is by the way predominately male dominated.
So back to the question of, Female coaches within the Inter county scene, in my opinion, No, because I couldn't see the likes of Jim Gavin, Stephen Rochford, Eamon Fitzmaurice etc, etc, etc, all the way down to div.3 being asked to step down to facilitate any woman, the only vacancy that may arise would be in div.4, I'm not sure today's woman are prepared to start at the bottom.

supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 3179 - 06/11/2017 23:49:25    2060904

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Replying To supersub15:  "Over the five continents women have or do hold the most important and responsible positions in the world, that of finance, politics, CEO's of multi nationals etc, etc. Back home we have had two women presidants of Ireland that ran two terms, we have, and had senior female politicians at the highest level in government, women who run their own business successfully, women who hold senior positions with multi nationals, also in finance, in particular with the Bank Of Ireland, all of which are very professional positions, we also have a woman who is in charge of the National Ploughing Championship in conjunction with the department of agriculture, which is by the way predominately male dominated.
So back to the question of, Female coaches within the Inter county scene, in my opinion, No, because I couldn't see the likes of Jim Gavin, Stephen Rochford, Eamon Fitzmaurice etc, etc, etc, all the way down to div.3 being asked to step down to facilitate any woman, the only vacancy that may arise would be in div.4, I'm not sure today's woman are prepared to start at the bottom."
I agree with the first 80% of your post.

I disagree with your conclusion though.

No one starts at the top. In practically every walk of life one has to earn their dues.

The likes of Rochford was in the club game before getting the Mayo gig. Other managers work with minors and under 21s before moving up.

It's the way it has to be. If a woman is to get to intercounty management she'll need to start at the bottom as is only fair and sensible.

All the women you mentioned at the start didn't just get their roles handed to them. They worked their way up.

I see no reason why an ambitious driven female manager wouldn't attempt the same.

It'll be interesting to see if there is a female intercounty manager within the next 20 years. I think there could be and it's not far off evens. A lot of progress can be made in 20 years.

Young men now are well used to women in positions of power. I don't see why they would reject a female coach/manager particularly if they were a distinguished player.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4526 - 07/11/2017 15:11:20    2061009

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