Ondaforty,

What makes Val Andrews a top class manager ? Please list his successes at county level especially those since he was last with us ? Simple questions !!

I have no problems with him personally but if he was not good enough when last with us, why is he good enough now ?

Was Pete McGrath even approached ?
Will we be back on here again in two years debating these same issues yet again as we were after Donal and Tommy ?
I am not running down anyone who is questioning the C.B. decisions, just the decisions themselves. Nor am i criticising anyone who backs these decisions, just wanting to know why posters and C.B. think that the decisions to appoint Val and Terry are the right ones in view of the amount of winning managers who are available and asking if they were even approached !! Someone obviously believes that these men are the right choices and i would like to know, in a nice way, why ?

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 26/08/2010 10:28:39    756650

THE.FOX
County: Cavan
Posts: 6

756588
Time for us all to get behind them if they get in and quit the usual negativity on this website
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If they can make some progress nobody will be complaining. You cannot blame posters for questioning this decision. Its got question marks all over it for obvious reasons.

Con Cavan (Cavan) - Posts: 894 - 26/08/2010 11:14:32    756692

Maybe there are Con but come on how many managers since McHugh have tried and failed? How come so many managers have got it wrong? Maybe we dont have the players, Maybe as a county we have to much expectations of our county teams, Maybe the players just dont have the commitment or the attitude to succeed. Hopefully as you say they can make some progress and get the support of all the county behind them.

THE.FOX (Cavan) - Posts: 48 - 26/08/2010 11:27:49    756712

THE.FOX
County: Cavan
Posts: 7

756712
Maybe there are Con but come on how many managers since McHugh have tried and failed? How come so many managers have got it wrong? Maybe we dont have the players, Maybe as a county we have to much expectations of our county teams, Maybe the players just dont have the commitment or the attitude to succeed.
________________________________
Are these excuses I am hearing, already?

Con Cavan (Cavan) - Posts: 894 - 26/08/2010 11:37:31    756730

We took a chance on McHugh in 95 and it worked.It worked because McHugh got respect from both players and clubs. He got respect because 3 years earlier he was an all ireland winner who had played under a great manager.PPL only had to listen to him speak to realise he knew what he was talking about..He saw there was players in Cavan who he had played against who just needed a bit of fine tuning..
Since McHugh all we have had is 2nd rate managers with no track record as either players or Managers..So respect from players went. Players nowadays want to be able to look up to a manager, believe in him, trust what he says..example kevin walsh of sligo..Those Sligo players would die for him.
There nothing Val Andrews has done at County level to suggest that will happen..He was here before ,we ran him,now we want him back.
What he do since he left Cavan?? ....NOTHING....SO WHY WE WANT HIM BACK??

richiej (UK) - Posts: 1430 - 26/08/2010 11:56:16    756752

Is this negativity im hearing again?

THE.FOX (Cavan) - Posts: 48 - 26/08/2010 12:05:01    756758

richiej said
"Are the CB officials who were in office in Andrews time in 2001 going to resign? Well they have to if Andrews comes back havent they??."

richiej !! Can you answer a few questions
It was widely reported in 2001 that all the County Board ie Top Table voted for Val Andrews in 2001 and the 24 votes against came from the clubs some of whom were not mandated to vote so why should the County Board officials resign?
2001 Chairman George Cartwright, Secretary Gerry Soden, Treasurer Tom Boylan

In 2001 Cavan beat Down and Monaghan and Tyrone beat them by 2 points in the Ulster Final this was a new Cavan team and an emerging Tyrone team what better have we achieved since?

Who do you want as you clearly have no time for Andrews or are you just a knocker

Stop your negativity and move on with the best interests of Cavan football at heart (or have you)
Give the new team time

Breffnisbest (Cavan) - Posts: 475 - 26/08/2010 12:25:14    756786

Well said breffnisbest!

THE.FOX (Cavan) - Posts: 48 - 26/08/2010 13:58:08    756883

In a nice way why you ask is Val Andrews the man. I have seen managers come and I have seen them go over the last 38 years so I would say I can give a genuine reason as to why I think that Val Andrews is the man to bring us forward. When he came on board after a certain manager with All Ireland medals in his back pocket was shafted by player power. He had to try and gain the confidence of the players all he Val Andrews had was that he brought Tralee to 3 in row sigerson cups that's all.
He came and a lot of those players that did what they did never again played for Cavan why you ask well they were at the end of their time and could give the county no more.
I as always watch and take on board what was going on and Val Andrews had great communications with the players he had in his squad and was getting good results with them.
He did get us to an Ulster Final did he not and as said in a previous post if Jason had slammed the ball in the back of the net he would be a great manager in every Cavan GAA supporter's eyes like Marin McHugh is. We had a person R.I.P who had won an All Ireland both as a player and manager and unfortunately he was unable to get anything from what he had on the panel. It's not all down to having medals in your pocket it's down to being clever and being cute.
The negativity is stifling me to tell you all the truth and maybe it's time that you people relaxed and gave Val Andrews his head and see what happens.
For me personally I feel that under the circumstances? We have got a very well educated and very knowledgeable person to bring this County out of the slumber it is in.
If I am wrong I will hold my hand up and say so.
On this forum many have asked where is the talent well I am very confident that Val Andrews will bring them in if they want to play Inter County Football no matter what club they come from.
Is mise SeanO'Rinn
Slain go Foill

The Quiet Man (Cavan) - Posts: 4602 - 26/08/2010 14:09:42    756910

well said richie

Alonso (Cavan) - Posts: 41 - 26/08/2010 14:15:21    756917

Breffnisbest....In you defence of Andrews you fail for some reason to mention the hammerings we recieved by Derry in 1999 and 2000 in the 1st round of the Ulster Championship.You also fail to mention that in those 2 years we won 6/14 nation league games. So its not very inspiring stuff from Mr Andrews. Even in 2004 and 2005 he failed to get Louth past the first round of the Leinster Championship.
Two of the officers you mention still represent Cavan at Ulster and Central Council Level.

Lets call a spade a spade here .. Why did the CB not offer Val Andrews the job alone??......Because the clubs would not ratify it.
Why did the CB not offer Terry Hyland the job alone?..Because of his inexperience at Senior level and the fact that they got it wrong with Tommy Carr 2 year ago rhey couldnt get it wrong again.
So they use Terry Hylands success at under21 and junior level to push THEIR man ANDREWS through..
The CB know that they wouldnt get Andrews through alone so they use Terry as bait.
They know the clubs will ratify the appointment once Terry is on board......So they using Terry to get Andrews in.

Why did they not interview McGrath?? Because he was part of the sports agency that recomended Carr.
Look at the 3 available All Ireland winning Managers that are available in Ulster...McGrath,McEniff,Kernan.
Why not one of them..Bring Terry Hyland in as selector with one of them for 3 years to learn the tricks of the trade then give Terry the job in 3 Years when he has learned his trade.
McHugh learned from McNiff,,McGeeney learned from Kernan,,McCartan learned from McGrath..Thats the way forward..
We never had a Top Class Manager for anyone to learn from
Instead we are going backways....bringing in a manager that was there before for some sort of unfinished buisness.
Name one County that has brought back an outside manager to manage them again?
Move on. New era, New blood, New manager....Forget the past......BUT WE NEVER COULD IN CAVAN..WE STILL CROWING ABOUT 1947

richiej (UK) - Posts: 1430 - 26/08/2010 14:33:06    756930

seannorinn....in answer to your last post....30 Potential players standing in Breffni Park listinging to someone like McGrath,McHugh, McGeany,Kiernan,McCartan,explaining football or tactics....These 30 players will take on board everything those men tell them because they have been ther, done that,
30 players standing listening to Andrews,Keoghan,Carr...its gona cross those players minds well how can you tactics work here they never worked anywhere else.
See its about respect..Success breeds respect

richiej (UK) - Posts: 1430 - 26/08/2010 14:49:34    756943

Ah C'mon Richie your bordering on conspiracy theory stuff here. You say that the CB want THEIR man Andrews in. What do you mean by this?? Of course the Manager should be the CBs man, it should be a united effort not an Us vs Them situation. Hyland is there because he is the most successful manager we have within the county and has a great knowledge of Cavan football and managed the under 21 team which will hopefully provide us with options. He is there on merit.

The year before he left Andrews had us in an Ulster final and we could have beaten that great Tyrone team. And we were holding our own in Divison 1 with a respectable mid table finish. He has to be judged on how far he brought the team not what happened in his first year so the hammering by Derry (in a replay might I add) in 1999 isn't here nor there.

If the mighty Joe Kernan couldn't cut it with Galway what makes you think he would succeed with Cavan? And as was said above, Cavan are currently at the bottom of the barrel, anyone who thinks All Ireland winning managers will be lining up for the Manager's job need a reality check.

At the end of the day the decision lies with the clubs. The choice is there not to ratify him as manger and if they do the CB can not be blamed for his appointment if things go wrong.

Inactive x5 (Cavan) - Posts: 1452 - 26/08/2010 15:02:41    756958

richiej
County: UK
Posts: 475

30 players standing listening to Andrews,Keoghan,Carr...its gona cross those players minds well how can you tactics work here they never worked anywhere else.
See its about respect..Success breeds respect

I think richiej you need to sit back and relax, the names you mentioned how do you or I know if in fact our chairman spoke with them or not and they turned it down. We don't have the money to take on the people you have mentioned despite the fact it's said McGrath would do it for free not sure about that.
I have underlined a few of your words so maybe time to take them on board.
See its about respect..Success breeds respect
I hope that Val Andrews will bring in the young talent that we have out there and they will I have no doubt be very willing to listen to Val Andrews and bring a bit of pride back to our game in Cavan. I also hope he gets rid of the disruptive disrespectful ill disciplined players that we have at the moment and bring back what we need once again pride and passion in the County and not all about ME Me Me

See its about respect..Success breeds respect

Is mise Sean O'Rinn

The Quiet Man (Cavan) - Posts: 4602 - 26/08/2010 15:06:57    756967

I cannot help but feel that we have been here before, right in this same position with the appointments of Donal and Tommy !! Why are many lads so easily pleased or taken in ? Were any of the managers mentioned by Richiej even asked or approached by the county board ? Why do they not come out and say that we approached so and so and they refused to take the job, or they were too expensive ? We get no answers at all so it is fair for posters to assume that once again this is just a quick fix Cavan way of doing the job and to hell with results or success. Hoping against hope that we succeed. Some posters say that we are only Cavan with poor players etc and what would we want or expect with a good successful manager ? That is precisely why we are where we are !! If you expect mediocrity then that is what you get !!
What success has Andrews had at county level ? I am still waiting for the answer and the fact that he got us to an Ulster final is neither here nor there as that is not success in my book !!

Cavan_Slasher (Cavan) - Posts: 10253 - 26/08/2010 15:28:34    756985

JonSmith...The only way that the clubs will ratify Andrews is to bring Hyland in with him. Otherwise Andrews would be the sole manager with Hyland as Selector. But the CB know they cant get Andrews in on his own

richiej (UK) - Posts: 1430 - 26/08/2010 15:32:43    756991

Slasher he has no sucess at County level..One Ulster final appearence in 2001. Gabriel Kelly brought us to Ulster Final. So should we have him back too??
Andrews couldnt get Louth past the first round in 2004 0r 2005..
4 Games this year with Dublin Minors and they couldnt get to a lenister semi despitebeing reigning champions.
So its not inspiring stuff from Mr Andrews..Seems its just more of what we had..This scientific football that Andrews preaches doesnt put the ball over the bar as Dublin Minors found out this year

richiej (UK) - Posts: 1430 - 26/08/2010 15:42:36    757000

What success has Andrews had at county level ? I am still waiting for the answer and the fact that he got us to an Ulster final is neither here nor there as that is not success in my book !!
Cavan_Slasher , 26/08/2010 at 15:28

of the few posters that I have respect for on this forum I am really surprised by your last few posts to tell you the truth.
As I have stated before I know Val Andrews will supply for I have seen him in action.

Would it be fair to say to Val look we have asked McGrath, Kernan and so on but they don't want it will you take it ? NOW come on lets be real here diplomacy has to come into play.
Why this appontment is being knocked baffles me for you have to admit we were heading in the right direction with him when we had him as manager and it took one person on the night to deprive us of maybe an Ulster win the following year with the same negativity that is now been shown here.
Give him a chance and I am sure come next January February we will get a chance to see where we are heading.

I will say this however if its as you were player wise well then you will all have got it right and I got it wrong but I say Val Andrews will do it right and please give him a chance, is that too much to ask for.
Sean

The Quiet Man (Cavan) - Posts: 4602 - 26/08/2010 15:43:18    757001

Richie, I could'nt agree more with all the messages that you have posted.

We are moving in the wrong direction here, I heard Canavans name being mentioned some time ago about as a possible Manager, why not approach the likes of him and see if he would be interested. there is a decent batch of minors/u21s coming through and its true what your saying about a man who has actually been there and done that talking to these lads, thats what happened when mchugh took over, he turned cavan players into believers and winners

We live in a crazy county, no offence to anyone on this message board but we are so content with getting to provincial finals thats how low we have gone. Most people seem happy to get to finals but you know what they say about coming second!!

Alonso (Cavan) - Posts: 41 - 26/08/2010 15:45:27    757005

I'm failing to see your point here Richie, what do you think is so special about Hyland that the clubs will appoint Andrews just because Hyland is with him? You're making out as if the CB are forcing the clubs hands by including Hyland in the deal which is simply not the case. The option is there for the clubs to vote no regardless of who the nomination is.

Inactive x5 (Cavan) - Posts: 1452 - 26/08/2010 15:54:10    757016