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Football Format Changes Discussion

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If the provincial champions were the only teams guarenteed Sam Maguire football from the provincial championships it could strike the right balance.
The 4 provincial champions would go forward as seeds and be joined by the next 8 teams seeded by league position. Im going for 8 as that gives 4 groups of 3 and one game home and away each which is fair imo. It also increases the strength of competition imo. Even if all 4 provinces were won by non division 1 teams the 8 division 1 teams would join them in the round robin.
The top 2 from each group to the quarter finals etc.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 24/04/2026 15:24:18    2668383

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "If the provincial champions were the only teams guarenteed Sam Maguire football from the provincial championships it could strike the right balance.
The 4 provincial champions would go forward as seeds and be joined by the next 8 teams seeded by league position. Im going for 8 as that gives 4 groups of 3 and one game home and away each which is fair imo. It also increases the strength of competition imo. Even if all 4 provinces were won by non division 1 teams the 8 division 1 teams would join them in the round robin.
The top 2 from each group to the quarter finals etc."
Something like that would be decent.

I guess the issue would be that the competition can't move on until the Provincials are fully completed.

There was also the issue of if a Province has a particularly strong team in it, it becomes so much harder for another team to get through via that route.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 24/04/2026 16:51:19    2668409

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This rabbit hole of a discussion is still ongoing! The good old Christy Ring Cup format is in play for the All Ireland championship. Let's give it a chance.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9667 - 24/04/2026 21:20:24    2668439

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Something like that would be decent.

I guess the issue would be that the competition can't move on until the Provincials are fully completed.

There was also the issue of if a Province has a particularly strong team in it, it becomes so much harder for another team to get through via that route."
It doesnt need to move on though. Teams and players need a break too and to regroup before they go again. The season structure could accommodate what I suggest with no tweaks required.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 24/04/2026 22:10:07    2668453

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Replying To legendzxix:  "This rabbit hole of a discussion is still ongoing! The good old Christy Ring Cup format is in play for the All Ireland championship. Let's give it a chance."
Ring Cup is a 6 team Round robin competition!

Seanfan (Roscommon) - Posts: 516 - 24/04/2026 23:30:23    2668462

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The back door system could've been made more fair and a lot more streamlined.

Ulster and Leinster champions to AI Quarter Finals
Ulster and Leinster finalists and Connacht and Munster champions enter at qualifiers round 3.
Ulster and Leinster semifinalists and Connacht and Munster finalists enter at qualifiers round 2.
Other 20 teams start at Qualifiers round 1.

Qualifier round 1 is 20 teams and they should be seeded based on league performance.
Qualifier round 2 is 16 teams, 10 round 1 winners and 6 dropping out of the Provincials. Should be seeded by league.
Qualifier round 3 is 12 teams, 8 round 1 winners plus 4 dropping out of the Provincials.
All Ireland Quarterfinals then, seeded by league performance.

It's a good bit fairer really.

Teams enter by Provincial performance but are then seeded by their league results so both competitions are meaningful.

The championship is streamlined too (8 rounds really) , so maybe the league could be longer somehow. 3 divisions maybe?

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 06:47:47    2668473

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If you had that simpler All Ireland you could have an Inter-county season starting in April with 7 rounds of league and finishing on the 2nd weekend in August with Club championships following but Provincial and All Ireland club not needing to be played until February and March.

That's actually hitting a lot of things that'll improve the season for everyone.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 06:56:42    2668474

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If you had that simpler All Ireland you could have an Inter-county season starting in April with 7 rounds of league and finishing on the 2nd weekend in August with Club championships following but Provincial and All Ireland club not needing to be played until February and March.

That's actually hitting a lot of things that'll improve the season for everyone.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 07:04:01    2668476

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Sorry got the timings wrong but you wouldn't have to start the league until mid February going on right to the end of April and the season could be finished on the current date.

League pushed out a bit and given a bit more time could be great for the game.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 07:52:13    2668479

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Replying To Seanfan:  "Ring Cup is a 6 team Round robin competition!"
Ahem, the good "old" Christy Ring Cup format!!

See Christy Ring Cup 2009 to 2017 on Wikipedia.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9667 - 25/04/2026 09:14:26    2668487

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Replying To Whammo86:  "The back door system could've been made more fair and a lot more streamlined.

Ulster and Leinster champions to AI Quarter Finals
Ulster and Leinster finalists and Connacht and Munster champions enter at qualifiers round 3.
Ulster and Leinster semifinalists and Connacht and Munster finalists enter at qualifiers round 2.
Other 20 teams start at Qualifiers round 1.

Qualifier round 1 is 20 teams and they should be seeded based on league performance.
Qualifier round 2 is 16 teams, 10 round 1 winners and 6 dropping out of the Provincials. Should be seeded by league.
Qualifier round 3 is 12 teams, 8 round 1 winners plus 4 dropping out of the Provincials.
All Ireland Quarterfinals then, seeded by league performance.

It's a good bit fairer really.

Teams enter by Provincial performance but are then seeded by their league results so both competitions are meaningful.

The championship is streamlined too (8 rounds really) , so maybe the league could be longer somehow. 3 divisions maybe?"
You do realise that there are 3 division 1 teams in the Connacht Championship currently?
Any attempt to make one some provincial championships more important than others will be resisted imo.
Other than that, its far too complicated and gets rid of the Tailteann Cup too. That competition has been a success. There is room for a 3rd tier imo but it has been a success.
I dont have a problem with seeding from league performance though. My suggestion of a sam competition of 12 comprising of 4 provincial winners and 8 from league position could be seeded that way.
The next 12 from league position compete in Tailteann Cup and last 8 plus NY and KK in a Tailteann Shield/ Tommy Murphy Cup.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 25/04/2026 10:24:28    2668497

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I don't want to get into format discussions but I do want to say that the qualifiers should come back at the very least:
On Saturday of the Leinster and Ulster football finals if Kildare (Tailteann winners) make Leinster final:
Qualifier Round 1 - 16 lowest non finalists on league ranking.
On the weekend after the Leinster and Ulster football finals if Kildare make Leinster final:
Qualifier 2 - 8 highest non finalists on league ranking against 8 Q1 winners.

Now ideally qualifiers would lead into a group stage. But after adopting the Round 2A and 2B format, I'll hold off suggesting further changes. Just to say that in the event of qualifiers - the Tailteann should be straight knockout.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 9667 - 25/04/2026 11:26:49    2668506

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "You do realise that there are 3 division 1 teams in the Connacht Championship currently?
Any attempt to make one some provincial championships more important than others will be resisted imo.
Other than that, its far too complicated and gets rid of the Tailteann Cup too. That competition has been a success. There is room for a 3rd tier imo but it has been a success.
I dont have a problem with seeding from league performance though. My suggestion of a sam competition of 12 comprising of 4 provincial winners and 8 from league position could be seeded that way.
The next 12 from league position compete in Tailteann Cup and last 8 plus NY and KK in a Tailteann Shield/ Tommy Murphy Cup."
It's no more complicated than the current system. Less complicated than the old back door.

Connacht and Munster champions have to play fewer rounds to get to the same stage as Leinster or Ulster teams.

This evens that out.

The Connacht teams will have easier fixtures in the All Ireland if they are strong.

The Tailteann cup shouldn't be protected for the sake of a better overall championship.

The weaker sides aren't really losing out, they get a 2nd chance in the All Ireland. They also get a league campaign played at a better time of the year and they don't have to sit around and wait to get playing again after losing in their Province.

I know you said that waiting around isn't an issue but it is, the Club game is being held up to facilitate county teams not playing games in April and May, almost the 2 best months for playing games.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 11:29:48    2668507

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Replying To Whammo86:  "It's no more complicated than the current system. Less complicated than the old back door.

Connacht and Munster champions have to play fewer rounds to get to the same stage as Leinster or Ulster teams.

This evens that out.

The Connacht teams will have easier fixtures in the All Ireland if they are strong.

The Tailteann cup shouldn't be protected for the sake of a better overall championship.

The weaker sides aren't really losing out, they get a 2nd chance in the All Ireland. They also get a league campaign played at a better time of the year and they don't have to sit around and wait to get playing again after losing in their Province.

I know you said that waiting around isn't an issue but it is, the Club game is being held up to facilitate county teams not playing games in April and May, almost the 2 best months for playing games."
How is the club game being held up?
No club championship starts before August even though most counties are out before end of June. Thats the reality.
I take it that you would sooner lose big in the Sam Cup that compete to win the Tailteann. Not everyone agrees with you but you are entitled to your opinion.
My opinion is that if you are a weaker county, put a run of form together and win a provincial championship that should count for something in the All Ireland series. You have earned the right to compete in Sam as provincial champions. That should never be taken away or diminished in any changes to the system.
If you dont earn the right to compete in Sam through League or championship performance then you shouldn't be in it. Thats my opinion too.
The gap between the bottom 6 in Division 4 and the rest is too wide imo hence I think we need a third tier.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 25/04/2026 17:12:51    2668561

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "How is the club game being held up?
No club championship starts before August even though most counties are out before end of June. Thats the reality.
I take it that you would sooner lose big in the Sam Cup that compete to win the Tailteann. Not everyone agrees with you but you are entitled to your opinion.
My opinion is that if you are a weaker county, put a run of form together and win a provincial championship that should count for something in the All Ireland series. You have earned the right to compete in Sam as provincial champions. That should never be taken away or diminished in any changes to the system.
If you dont earn the right to compete in Sam through League or championship performance then you shouldn't be in it. Thats my opinion too.
The gap between the bottom 6 in Division 4 and the rest is too wide imo hence I think we need a third tier."
Club county championships are allocated about 13 to 15 weeks in the year split between 2 codes compared to 27 that's allocated to Inter County.

The inter county season greatly impinges on the time that can be given over to the club game.

The time should be used wisely at the very least.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 18:24:19    2668586

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Replying To Whammo86:  "Club county championships are allocated about 13 to 15 weeks in the year split between 2 codes compared to 27 that's allocated to Inter County.

The inter county season greatly impinges on the time that can be given over to the club game.

The time should be used wisely at the very least."
The intercounty game pays the bills and advertises our sports. It is used widely. Hurling has its act in order. Other than a few rule tweaks there is very little to be done with its format and season.
Football has come a long way and the game itself is a far better entertainment spectacle now than it was less than 20 months ago.
There are tweaks to be made to the championship but replacing the importance of the provincial championship with the league isnt it in my opinion. It will be interesting to see how the current all ireland series works and whether its better than last years version. The reality , though, is that geography does matter. The crowds are bigger for local rivalries and they are bigger for Championship matches between those rivals than league games.

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 25/04/2026 18:37:04    2668588

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "The intercounty game pays the bills and advertises our sports. It is used widely. Hurling has its act in order. Other than a few rule tweaks there is very little to be done with its format and season.
Football has come a long way and the game itself is a far better entertainment spectacle now than it was less than 20 months ago.
There are tweaks to be made to the championship but replacing the importance of the provincial championship with the league isnt it in my opinion. It will be interesting to see how the current all ireland series works and whether its better than last years version. The reality , though, is that geography does matter. The crowds are bigger for local rivalries and they are bigger for Championship matches between those rivals than league games."
There'd be more games between local rivals in a league based format.

It's a short sighted view to say that inter county pays the bills.

Club football still develops the players and the club game develops the interest too. Everything has to work in balance and I believe that it doesn't really now.

Even though taking your point around the intercounty game pays the bills, well it doesn't if there's no games going on.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 19:33:36    2668598

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Replying To Tadhg2020:  "The intercounty game pays the bills and advertises our sports. It is used widely. Hurling has its act in order. Other than a few rule tweaks there is very little to be done with its format and season.
Football has come a long way and the game itself is a far better entertainment spectacle now than it was less than 20 months ago.
There are tweaks to be made to the championship but replacing the importance of the provincial championship with the league isnt it in my opinion. It will be interesting to see how the current all ireland series works and whether its better than last years version. The reality , though, is that geography does matter. The crowds are bigger for local rivalries and they are bigger for Championship matches between those rivals than league games."
To be honest I don't even have an issue with the Provincials being linked to the All Ireland but I just don't think the current system does it very well or works as a whole.

To link the Provincials to the All Ireland either involves a very unfair system or more often than not an overly complicated one.

If we were to zoom out a few years and look at some of the issues with the championship how many of those were actually properly resolved.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4639 - 25/04/2026 19:44:28    2668604

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Now the reality sets in
Down have to beat Donegal and Armagh to make an Ulster final

Cork had to beat Limerick and TIpp -

how is this system fail again?

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 1778 - 27/04/2026 10:11:15    2669085

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Replying To tirawleybaron:  "Now the reality sets in
Down have to beat Donegal and Armagh to make an Ulster final

Cork had to beat Limerick and TIpp -

how is this system fail again?"
Down were in the same league division as limerick. Both were there by performance.
You are arguing that the provincial championships should be down graded on the basis of your example above while others are arguing that the Tailteann Cup should be abolished and using plucky Leitrim and their performance against complacent Galway as their example of evidence. Both of the arguments are wrong imo
If plucky Leitrim do ever win Connacht again then the should be rewarded with a place in Sam. If they dont and remain in division 3 or 4 of the NFL they belong in the Tailteann Cup.
Cork would be in Sam anyway whether they win or lose the Munster final. Its on that basis that I think winners of Provincial finals should be seeded in the All Ireland Series.( Both teams in sam anyway)

Tadhg2020 (Limerick) - Posts: 254 - 27/04/2026 11:37:22    2669135

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