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Kerry GAA Thread

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "Was at a few Dingle matches last year. They are great club but no doubt both the amount of games they have had to play coming from club to county and the quality of the divisional teams has hit them. Came very close to beating East Kerry last year.

I fancy them to go close in AI series with the bit of a rest. Much better team than O'Rahilly's last year and they gave Crokes a rattle."
Agree Barney but they have not a huge pick so they need to be injury free.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3617 - 03/11/2023 21:57:30    2511472

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "The Kerry county championship is great in the fact it gives every footballer a chance even junior b a chance to play in the senior county championship.However it used have loads of senior clubs and then maybe 9 or 10 divisional teams (made up of intermediate and junior clubs in close proximity to eachother).It was a great system.However Croke park then made a rule there can only 16 teams allowed in the championship so Kerry changed the structure to 8 senior clubs and 8 divisional teams.This though means clubs number 9 to 16 are now in with divisional teams making some teams too strong and making it harder for clubs to retain senior status.This also affect other counties as it makes Kerry clubs very strong in the all ireland intermediate championship and its no coincidence clubs from Kerry are winning regularly.Ideally there should be at least 12 senior clubs in Kerry for the championship ."
I'd agree with pretty much all of that Mick. The issue isn't with the divisional teams as such, but the very small number of actual senior clubs in the championship. It means the divisional teams have the pick of number of very strong teams. Croke Park's 16 team limit might make sense when purely based on clubs, but it's not very suitable for Kerry's senior championship.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1997 - 04/11/2023 19:26:10    2511504

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd agree with pretty much all of that Mick. The issue isn't with the divisional teams as such, but the very small number of actual senior clubs in the championship. It means the divisional teams have the pick of number of very strong teams. Croke Park's 16 team limit might make sense when purely based on clubs, but it's not very suitable for Kerry's senior championship."
Why don't ye let the Divisional teams play in their own groups for say 1 semi final spot and the Senior Clubs (12 needed) to play for the other ther 3 Semi final places?

Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1280 - 05/11/2023 12:23:07    2511560

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd agree with pretty much all of that Mick. The issue isn't with the divisional teams as such, but the very small number of actual senior clubs in the championship. It means the divisional teams have the pick of number of very strong teams. Croke Park's 16 team limit might make sense when purely based on clubs, but it's not very suitable for Kerry's senior championship."
Spot on Wantpint

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3617 - 05/11/2023 15:27:04    2511581

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Replying To Seanfanbocht:  "Why don't ye let the Divisional teams play in their own groups for say 1 semi final spot and the Senior Clubs (12 needed) to play for the other ther 3 Semi final places?"
Not a bad idea all Sean or let the divisional teams have a qualifying competition with 4 to qualify with 12 senior teams.One thing for certain though is change is coming very soon.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3617 - 05/11/2023 20:10:41    2511628

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Not a bad idea all Sean or let the divisional teams have a qualifying competition with 4 to qualify with 12 senior teams.One thing for certain though is change is coming very soon."
East Kerry team this year had only seven of last year's winning team. Remove the two Cliffords and Daragh Roche and they are at the very best an Intermediate caliber team.
Fossa are an intermediate team depending entirely on the two Cliffords.
The quality of club football in Kerry has deteriorated noticeably in the recent years with two to three exceptional players carrying the rest on each team.
The backbone of Kerry county teams were Strand Road, Stacks and Mitchells. None are senior level or caliber nowadays.
How many make the county team or even panel. Crokes have also faded and still rely on players in their mid thirties to compete.
Watched all the championship games and it was at times like watching junior football. I wondered at times how they were able to come up with twenty or twenty two county caliber players.
Kerry junior and intermediate teams do well in the club championships on the shoulders of two or three players on otherwise very average players.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 743 - 24/11/2023 18:06:10    2514509

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Kerry and Cork are submitting a motion to Congress to allow counties with divisional clubs more than 16 teams in the County Championship. Kerry should have at least 12 senior clubs. These 12 should compete in 2 groups of 6, with the top 2 from each group into the Senior Club Championship semi-finals.
The 8 divisional clubs should play a playoff round after the lower tier Intermediate, Junior Premier and Junior championships have completed. The 4 winners should join the Final 16 in the County Championship.
The 5th and 6th placed senior clubs (4 teams) should start in a County Championship Preliminary Round. The 2 winners advancing to the Final 16. The 2 losers should be the relegation final.
The 4 divisional club playoff losers should also enter a County Championship Preliminary Round. The 2 winners also advancing to Final 16.
The Final 16 in the County Championship should consist of: 10 senior clubs and 6 divisional clubs. 10 senior clubs consisting of the top 4 from each Senior Club Championship group (8 teams) and 2 preliminary round winners. The 6 divisional clubs consisting of the 4 divisional playoff winners and 2 preliminary round winners.
The reason for a divisional playoff round is so that divisional clubs get at least two games. It'll be harsh for divisional clubs to go straight knockout. Senior clubs will have been road tested from 5 group games.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7716 - 25/11/2023 14:08:59    2514563

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Not a bad idea all Sean or let the divisional teams have a qualifying competition with 4 to qualify with 12 senior teams.One thing for certain though is change is coming very soon."
In Cork our Divisions & Colleges play off 1st, with one team emerging to play in the Premier Senior Championship proper.

Each county is different so it's not a one size fits all approach & I'm sure Kerry will address this issue to meet the needs of all it's stakeholders.

St.Mologga (Cork) - Posts: 88 - 25/11/2023 14:54:04    2514565

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Replying To St.Mologga:  "In Cork our Divisions & Colleges play off 1st, with one team emerging to play in the Premier Senior Championship proper.

Each county is different so it's not a one size fits all approach & I'm sure Kerry will address this issue to meet the needs of all it's stakeholders."
Leave as is. Teams who were relegated to Intermediate are just not good enough. There are no twelve senior football calibre teams in the County. North Kerry's divisional sides, Shannon Rangers and Feale Rangers, have one county player between them.
Name the twelve teams you would have in the senior group.
Miltown the Kerry intermediate rep well beaten by Cill na Martra, no Kerry superiority.
Dingle, in the senior div. very lucky to win over Commercials.
Listowel Club showing a lot of improvement.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 743 - 29/11/2023 18:55:32    2515022

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Replying To Gaa Fan:  "Leave as is. Teams who were relegated to Intermediate are just not good enough. There are no twelve senior football calibre teams in the County. North Kerry's divisional sides, Shannon Rangers and Feale Rangers, have one county player between them.
Name the twelve teams you would have in the senior group.
Miltown the Kerry intermediate rep well beaten by Cill na Martra, no Kerry superiority.
Dingle, in the senior div. very lucky to win over Commercials.
Listowel Club showing a lot of improvement."
Each county will have different needs & issues to address, & up to this point as an outsider looking in the club football scene in Kerry has been very good for the Kingdom at inter county level, where down through the decades success was never far away.

St.Mologga (Cork) - Posts: 88 - 30/11/2023 09:05:10    2515040

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I think the Kerry County Championship will go straight knockout. 8 divisional clubs playing off to join 12 senior clubs. All players have 3 games in the club championships; Senior, Intermediate and Junior. The group stage in the County Championship has been excessive.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7716 - 04/12/2023 12:24:43    2515453

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Replying To legendzxix:  "I think the Kerry County Championship will go straight knockout. 8 divisional clubs playing off to join 12 senior clubs. All players have 3 games in the club championships; Senior, Intermediate and Junior. The group stage in the County Championship has been excessive."
Please name the twelve teams you would put in the senior championship.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 743 - 05/12/2023 06:35:36    2515546

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Replying To Gaa Fan:  "Please name the twelve teams you would put in the senior championship."
One for the county board to decide.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7716 - 05/12/2023 18:54:52    2515646

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Replying To Gaa Fan:  "Please name the twelve teams you would put in the senior championship."
I'd assume the current 8 for 2024, plus Stacks, O'Rahilly's, Fossa as beaten intermediate finalists and maybe Legion.
A strong football county like Kerry can easily have at least 12 senior clubs, when you consider that the likes of Donegal, Tyrone, Galway, Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Dublin etc, all have at least 16.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1997 - 06/12/2023 08:00:49    2515690

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd assume the current 8 for 2024, plus Stacks, O'Rahilly's, Fossa as beaten intermediate finalists and maybe Legion.
A strong football county like Kerry can easily have at least 12 senior clubs, when you consider that the likes of Donegal, Tyrone, Galway, Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Dublin etc, all have at least 16."
Despite what people might think but Fossa would have no business being a senior club. Without the Cliffords they have very little else. Milltown will likely also struggle next year. Legion have been Intermediate for a few years. If they were good enough to be a senior team they'd have won the Intermediate and gone back up again.

This thing people have in their heads about teams being too strong for a grade don't stack up. People are know claiming Ballymc and Ardfert are too strong for Junior. This despite the fact Listowel won the Junior by beating Ballymc in the final.

Strand Road better Club and Country championship this year won one game out of I think seven. How can anyone argue with that record not being good enough? Just because they've always been senior doesn't mean they've a right to always be there. Maybe 20 years ago or so Mitchels pulled a similar stunt and refused to be relegated when they lost in a relegation play off.

oneoff (UK) - Posts: 1361 - 06/12/2023 09:43:27    2515700

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Replying To oneoff:  "Despite what people might think but Fossa would have no business being a senior club. Without the Cliffords they have very little else. Milltown will likely also struggle next year. Legion have been Intermediate for a few years. If they were good enough to be a senior team they'd have won the Intermediate and gone back up again.

This thing people have in their heads about teams being too strong for a grade don't stack up. People are know claiming Ballymc and Ardfert are too strong for Junior. This despite the fact Listowel won the Junior by beating Ballymc in the final.

Strand Road better Club and Country championship this year won one game out of I think seven. How can anyone argue with that record not being good enough? Just because they've always been senior doesn't mean they've a right to always be there. Maybe 20 years ago or so Mitchels pulled a similar stunt and refused to be relegated when they lost in a relegation play off."
Obviously Fossa are extremely reliant on the Cliffords, but they were a whisker away from reaching the top 8 in Kerry. They've been on some journey. In their current form, they're knocking in the door.
We can pick holes in every club, I can do the same in Galway. The basic issue is that having only 8 senior clubs in a strong footballing county, seems disproportionately low. I believe Kerry has around 70 football clubs, which is more than Galway or Mayo. Having only 8 of these in senior is quite lopsided.
I've made the point before that it leads to a few of the divisional teams becoming extremely strong, as they have the pick of teams ranked 9th and below.
This makes it very difficult for actual clubs like Dingle at the moment to win a county championship.
Having at least 12 senior clubs will reduce the advantage of a few divisional teams and give the clubs a fairer chance.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 1997 - 06/12/2023 15:53:52    2515763

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "I'd assume the current 8 for 2024, plus Stacks, O'Rahilly's, Fossa as beaten intermediate finalists and maybe Legion.
A strong football county like Kerry can easily have at least 12 senior clubs, when you consider that the likes of Donegal, Tyrone, Galway, Mayo, Kildare, Meath, Dublin etc, all have at least 16."
In my opinion there are no twelve stand alone teams of county calibre in Kerry.
Milltown/Castlemaine defeated Fossa in the Inter final and Cill na Martra won handily.
Most Intermediate teams are depending on three or four players.
Milltown/Castlemaine were depending a lot on Eanna O'Connor and he was held to two points from frees.
Kerry county senior championship football is poor enough now without adding three teams who could not win the intermediate.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 743 - 06/12/2023 18:28:00    2515781

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Replying To WanPintWin:  "Obviously Fossa are extremely reliant on the Cliffords, but they were a whisker away from reaching the top 8 in Kerry. They've been on some journey. In their current form, they're knocking in the door.
We can pick holes in every club, I can do the same in Galway. The basic issue is that having only 8 senior clubs in a strong footballing county, seems disproportionately low. I believe Kerry has around 70 football clubs, which is more than Galway or Mayo. Having only 8 of these in senior is quite lopsided.
I've made the point before that it leads to a few of the divisional teams becoming extremely strong, as they have the pick of teams ranked 9th and below.
This makes it very difficult for actual clubs like Dingle at the moment to win a county championship.
Having at least 12 senior clubs will reduce the advantage of a few divisional teams and give the clubs a fairer chance."
Yes indeed Wanpint I agree with you.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3617 - 06/12/2023 19:40:37    2515791

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "Yes indeed Wanpint I agree with you."
East Kerry are strong because of the Cliffords and Roche. No other county players on there. Mid Kerry have Breen and nobody else of county calibre. Templenoe have more county players on their team as does Dingle, but not the Cliffords.
Seem to be making a case to lessen the competition to allow club teams to win. Noone complained when Crokes, Stacks and Strand Road ruled the roost.

Gaa Fan (USA) - Posts: 743 - 06/12/2023 21:59:47    2515799

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Replying To oneoff:  "Despite what people might think but Fossa would have no business being a senior club. Without the Cliffords they have very little else. Milltown will likely also struggle next year. Legion have been Intermediate for a few years. If they were good enough to be a senior team they'd have won the Intermediate and gone back up again.

This thing people have in their heads about teams being too strong for a grade don't stack up. People are know claiming Ballymc and Ardfert are too strong for Junior. This despite the fact Listowel won the Junior by beating Ballymc in the final.

Strand Road better Club and Country championship this year won one game out of I think seven. How can anyone argue with that record not being good enough? Just because they've always been senior doesn't mean they've a right to always be there. Maybe 20 years ago or so Mitchels pulled a similar stunt and refused to be relegated when they lost in a relegation play off."
What level do Mitchells play at now actually? They're a club that I haven't heard anything about in a while. I used to drink in Eugene Creigh's pub in Boherbue well over 30 years ago. I used to hear of the halyicon days of The Mitchells back then.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 1865 - 06/12/2023 22:15:26    2515801

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