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Replying To TerribleFootwork: "I think that's a bit harsh on Dunne, his 1st 3 years 2012-14 we made alot of progress year on year but his last 2 years were very disappointing alright bar a surprise win over Cork in the qualifiers, Davy 5 years were similar in that we made alot of progress in the 1st 3 years in terms of being competitive like you said and obviously winning Leinster, listening to a few of recently retired players they reckon they were running on fumes in that winter championship in 2020 after playing club championships in both codes prior and by all accounts the fitness markers the players reached during lockdowns etc. were insane we got that year badly wrong, 2021 I'd see as the biggest missed opportunity of a Leinster title we've had in the last 20 years, our game against Kilkenny that year was arguably the highest standard of match we've been involved in over the last decade." And we played very well against Clare after 1 of the poorest starts I ever saw.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 21/07/2023 10:45:51
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Replying To TerribleFootwork: "I think that's a bit harsh on Dunne, his 1st 3 years 2012-14 we made alot of progress year on year but his last 2 years were very disappointing alright bar a surprise win over Cork in the qualifiers, Davy 5 years were similar in that we made alot of progress in the 1st 3 years in terms of being competitive like you said and obviously winning Leinster, listening to a few of recently retired players they reckon they were running on fumes in that winter championship in 2020 after playing club championships in both codes prior and by all accounts the fitness markers the players reached during lockdowns etc. were insane we got that year badly wrong, 2021 I'd see as the biggest missed opportunity of a Leinster title we've had in the last 20 years, our game against Kilkenny that year was arguably the highest standard of match we've been involved in over the last decade." I think Dunne arrested our decline, put some discipline in place, got fitness levels back towards where was needed and got a few notable results (Clare) BUT had limitations as a man manager that probably impacted his ability to maximise the return from the group he had.
wexford2012 (Wexford) - Posts: 106 - 21/07/2023 10:50:50
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Replying To wexford2012: "I think Dunne arrested our decline, put some discipline in place, got fitness levels back towards where was needed and got a few notable results (Clare) BUT had limitations as a man manager that probably impacted his ability to maximise the return from the group he had." I think that's a fair summary, he got things back on track after the low of 2009-2012 but I don't we would have ever won a Leinster under his stewardship.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 21/07/2023 11:24:59
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Replying To Viking66: "And we played very well against Clare after 1 of the poorest starts I ever saw." Fanning let in a very soft goal that killed our comeback that day. Seemed to remember the likes of Chin going for goals far too early that day when handy points were on offer. Those performances against KK and Clare were still miles above anything produced this year.
Timbertony (Wexford) - Posts: 424 - 21/07/2023 15:35:21
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Replying To Timbertony: "Fanning let in a very soft goal that killed our comeback that day. Seemed to remember the likes of Chin going for goals far too early that day when handy points were on offer. Those performances against KK and Clare were still miles above anything produced this year." Cathal Dunbar had his best game for Wexford that day too. Tbh if you read back my posts from then I thought Davy deserved another year after that.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 21/07/2023 21:36:56
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Replying To Viking66: "Cathal Dunbar had his best game for Wexford that day too. Tbh if you read back my posts from then I thought Davy deserved another year after that." You're probably right about Dunbar having his best game that day but he's a classic example of Wexford's lack of quality due to the amount of times he's been selected and mostly been mediocre.
GaeilgeDubh (Wexford) - Posts: 16 - 22/07/2023 00:08:19
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Replying To GaeilgeDubh: "You're probably right about Dunbar having his best game that day but he's a classic example of Wexford's lack of quality due to the amount of times he's been selected and mostly been mediocre." Not just Cathal Dunbar. Inconsistent is the word to describe all our hurling over the last 25 years. This year he was one of our better performers in many games but could fade in and out of them also.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 22/07/2023 10:11:28
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Replying To Viking66: "Not just Cathal Dunbar. Inconsistent is the word to describe all our hurling over the last 25 years. This year he was one of our better performers in many games but could fade in and out of them also." Nail on the head. Inconsistency! Dunbar definitely looked better further out the field this year. He doesn't score near enough when in the full forward line.
GaeilgeDubh (Wexford) - Posts: 16 - 22/07/2023 12:35:41
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Just an update on the u16 A team. They beat Waterford this weekend, having beaten Clare and Limerick this year also.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 22/07/2023 23:12:47
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Lads think I'm mad when I go on about the Heather blazing stuff and today cian lynch gives a speech about spirituality leadership.
We need a Wexford man in charge and the best psychologist we can find.
We have to get this selection right.
Next year we'll still have jippo, recks, Donoghue, roc, chin, mac, jacko
We need to get e Ryan, shockman, Doyle, Molloy, Redmond, carley involved.
What limerick are doing is not rocket science.
They're incredibly fit, exceptionally well drilled, and supremely confident in their ability and plan.
This can be copied.
I cannot wait for January.
Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 3704 - 23/07/2023 17:20:33
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Replying To Doylerwex: "Lads think I'm mad when I go on about the Heather blazing stuff and today cian lynch gives a speech about spirituality leadership.
We need a Wexford man in charge and the best psychologist we can find.
We have to get this selection right.
Next year we'll still have jippo, recks, Donoghue, roc, chin, mac, jacko
We need to get e Ryan, shockman, Doyle, Molloy, Redmond, carley involved.
What limerick are doing is not rocket science.
They're incredibly fit, exceptionally well drilled, and supremely confident in their ability and plan.
This can be copied.
I cannot wait for January." I agree but unfortunately the likes of Molloy and Jack Cullen aren't interested in playing for Wexford. And yes we definitely need a top psychologist. Caroline Currid is a major factor for Limerick. And Kinnerk too.
Purpleandgold72 (Wexford) - Posts: 272 - 23/07/2023 17:51:34
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Replying To Doylerwex: "Lads think I'm mad when I go on about the Heather blazing stuff and today cian lynch gives a speech about spirituality leadership.
We need a Wexford man in charge and the best psychologist we can find.
We have to get this selection right.
Next year we'll still have jippo, recks, Donoghue, roc, chin, mac, jacko
We need to get e Ryan, shockman, Doyle, Molloy, Redmond, carley involved.
What limerick are doing is not rocket science.
They're incredibly fit, exceptionally well drilled, and supremely confident in their ability and plan.
This can be copied.
I cannot wait for January." Shokman needs to sharpen up speed and hurling wise to play senior intercounty. Molloy and Redmond don't seem to want to play intercounty. Jack Redmond has gone back for club and county this year also. A new manager to try convince these lads to give Senior Intercounty a real good shot would be great!
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 23/07/2023 18:20:18
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Replying To Viking66: "Shokman needs to sharpen up speed and hurling wise to play senior intercounty. Molloy and Redmond don't seem to want to play intercounty. Jack Redmond has gone back for club and county this year also. A new manager to try convince these lads to give Senior Intercounty a real good shot would be great!" Shokman is too slow for senior inter county at the moment anyhow.
Purpleandgold72 (Wexford) - Posts: 272 - 23/07/2023 21:03:11
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Replying To Doylerwex: "Lads think I'm mad when I go on about the Heather blazing stuff and today cian lynch gives a speech about spirituality leadership.
We need a Wexford man in charge and the best psychologist we can find.
We have to get this selection right.
Next year we'll still have jippo, recks, Donoghue, roc, chin, mac, jacko
We need to get e Ryan, shockman, Doyle, Molloy, Redmond, carley involved.
What limerick are doing is not rocket science.
They're incredibly fit, exceptionally well drilled, and supremely confident in their ability and plan.
This can be copied.
I cannot wait for January." Lots of Limerick's best players now were no world beaters underage. Flanagan, Dan Morrissey etc, maybe even Gillane. Winning breeds confidence. They are an exceptionally well coached and managed team. We have to target a Leinster final next year. Both KK and Galway were badly exposed by Limerick, maybe both teams going to rebuild over winter.
Timbertony (Wexford) - Posts: 424 - 24/07/2023 00:05:23
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Never mind psychologists, etc.
Wexford need to focus on underage. As do Dublin, and many other counties.
In fact, in my opinion the whole province of Leinster needs to up its game significantly. Leinster hurling needs to become the bear pit that the Munster championship is if the counties who come out of it are to do anything in an All-Ireland series.
For me, Wexford's biggest problem is the last U21 Leinster title was, what 7-8 years ago and only a few players have come through since? I don't feel like Dublin have built on our 2016 or 2020 victories either by the way, even if what can you read in to a victory in anything during covid yet Cork only won by 4 points.
But you have to go back to 08 for an All-Ireland from a Leinster team up until 2022 when Kilkenny won it. 14 years.
I know you can make arguments that Kilkenny only beat Wexford by a point but to me a Leinster final is a lesser occasion than an All-Ireland final and Kilkenny seem to rise to the occasion all the time (Yesterday they were just beaten by a better team).
You only get a few players off any underage team, but Wexford haven't really had a conveyor belt with the odd exception of Rory, Conor Foley, Charlie Mc, and so on.
That Limerick team is built on the lucky combination of a group of phenomenal players together at the same time, outstanding coaching and successful schools teams. Ard Scoil Ris won about 5 Harty Cups in the 10's and Wexford schools have half of them playing B and C level Leinster hurling? Hurling and beating top teams in schools breeds confidence that you can hurl at the top level.
The combined schools effort needs to be re-ignited and a way found to get it to work. Its not going to help a young chap go out to hurl against Kilkenny and Galway in minor or u20 if the best he has played against is second and third rate schools.
Can anyone tell me how many schools in Wexford have a designated hurling wall or any form of hurling facility? Even the hurling 365 initiative, while admirable, schools are gone for half the year and it is the effort of parents that keeps this initiative going.
What I am saying is you have to coach them to be good enough at underage, and give them every chance to hurl, and make hurling a fundamental part of their schooling life.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1368 - 24/07/2023 11:46:17
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Replying To Purpleandgold72: "I agree but unfortunately the likes of Molloy and Jack Cullen aren't interested in playing for Wexford. And yes we definitely need a top psychologist. Caroline Currid is a major factor for Limerick. And Kinnerk too." I took a few things from yesterday's All Ireland Final.
Firstly, the focus on the manager as an individual is missing the importance of the backroom team. The modern game is too complex for one person to carry it all. The 'manager' is the conductor, the chairperson their success of failure will be dictated in the main by their ability to find and attract the right people around them and in Limerick's case this included Currid and Kinnerk - neither of them hurling people by background (which means you do no need to restrict yourself to this small pool of talent for these skills).
I would be looking at someone from say the Dublin football squad to join the backroom team.
I don't think we can appoint a 'greenhorn' manager, given what I've said about complexity, a green manager won't get the space, time, leeway to learn, make mistakes and grow (ask Darragh Egan!!) so if we need experience does this push us towards another external candidate? I don't think Joe Fortune's experience would be sufficient, Skippy Ruth hasn't done it at intercounty either - both are Wexford men though and bright lads who could learn but is the curve too steep and Wexford post Egan going to be too unforgiving?
Another point from yesterday, the above costs money, distasteful or otherwise as it may be, a billionaire tax exile is the driving force behind Limerick's resurgence. I have concerns about what this is doing to the ametuer ethos BUT its a reality that to succeed you need deep pockets and a commercial machine to match your ambitions is necessary - I'm not mad about some of the behaviours this drives as it means all people are not equal, those who have money to spend have to be pandered too and I have concerns that this is a corrosive development, but unless we get a sugar daddy we will need this machine.
wexford2012 (Wexford) - Posts: 106 - 24/07/2023 11:46:47
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I think the penny is finally starting to drop.
You do nothing without money, and lots of it. At any level.
It becomes easy once you have the sort of backing Limerick, Dublin footballers, etc have. But secondly, you have to spend it well on top people and I feel, knowing a few Limerick people from college this was where they nailed it.
I know Wexford has no billionaire but the complaints about promotion of the floodlight turning on, was idle talk. I even heard about it in Melbourne.
The question is, where was this promotion for the u20 final? Wexford seem to be way behind the curve on promotion, no point the co. chairman going on SE Radio to appeal to people to go to the Kilkenny match - I had an embarrassing slightly tipsy post here to try to urge people to go but where was the social media promotion about how important that game was?
A simple "buy your tickets on ....." tweet or Facebook post is about as useful as a man singing Dancing at the Crossroads in the Bull Ring telling people to buy tickets. There should be promotional videos, player interviews, generate hype about the game.
On that point - Dancing at the crossroads needs to be buried from the psyche of Wexford hurling. I heard it on the radio after beating Kilkenny, and winced. Is that where ambition in the county is? Celebrating a terrible year with a last day heroic performance? After losing to Westmeath, Dublin and Galway? The intercom should have been silent after that match other than to thank the crowd for their support. The year was a total failure and almost meant Wexford hurled Joe McDonagh next year?
Its good to hear the u16's are good but now they need to drive on and win a Leinster minor and give an All-Ireland.
ExiledWex has hit the nail, we need more players playing at the top level all the way up and especially in schools hurling. I was part of development squads all the way up and they are good, but playing against top counties and schools and Fitzgibbon hurling is where you learn most.
Like, why isn't Enniscorthy CBS doing better in hurling given there must be 15 hurling clubs supplying players? Gorey has a big population yet gave a walk over in u20 hurling last week? How is that, in a town the size of Gorey? Liam Griffin goes on about hurling nationwide yet Rosslare had no U16 team? Why didn't they have the foresight to join with somebody, instead of denying players who do want to play hurling?
These are questions that need to be answered in my opinion, not just ignored. I know there may be reasons.
StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1857 - 24/07/2023 12:43:58
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Replying To StoreysTash: "I think the penny is finally starting to drop.
You do nothing without money, and lots of it. At any level.
It becomes easy once you have the sort of backing Limerick, Dublin footballers, etc have. But secondly, you have to spend it well on top people and I feel, knowing a few Limerick people from college this was where they nailed it.
I know Wexford has no billionaire but the complaints about promotion of the floodlight turning on, was idle talk. I even heard about it in Melbourne.
The question is, where was this promotion for the u20 final? Wexford seem to be way behind the curve on promotion, no point the co. chairman going on SE Radio to appeal to people to go to the Kilkenny match - I had an embarrassing slightly tipsy post here to try to urge people to go but where was the social media promotion about how important that game was?
A simple "buy your tickets on ....." tweet or Facebook post is about as useful as a man singing Dancing at the Crossroads in the Bull Ring telling people to buy tickets. There should be promotional videos, player interviews, generate hype about the game.
On that point - Dancing at the crossroads needs to be buried from the psyche of Wexford hurling. I heard it on the radio after beating Kilkenny, and winced. Is that where ambition in the county is? Celebrating a terrible year with a last day heroic performance? After losing to Westmeath, Dublin and Galway? The intercom should have been silent after that match other than to thank the crowd for their support. The year was a total failure and almost meant Wexford hurled Joe McDonagh next year?
Its good to hear the u16's are good but now they need to drive on and win a Leinster minor and give an All-Ireland.
ExiledWex has hit the nail, we need more players playing at the top level all the way up and especially in schools hurling. I was part of development squads all the way up and they are good, but playing against top counties and schools and Fitzgibbon hurling is where you learn most.
Like, why isn't Enniscorthy CBS doing better in hurling given there must be 15 hurling clubs supplying players? Gorey has a big population yet gave a walk over in u20 hurling last week? How is that, in a town the size of Gorey? Liam Griffin goes on about hurling nationwide yet Rosslare had no U16 team? Why didn't they have the foresight to join with somebody, instead of denying players who do want to play hurling?
These are questions that need to be answered in my opinion, not just ignored. I know there may be reasons." I didn't say the u16 A team are outstanding. Think they lost to Kilkenny. But the point was that they aren't terrible as some posters alleged on this forum back in spring. The u16 B team have lost every game, the last one last weekend by around 20 odd points. So as a group overall there's plenty of work to be done.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16163 - 24/07/2023 13:24:26
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Replying To Viking66: "I didn't say the u16 A team are outstanding. Think they lost to Kilkenny. But the point was that they aren't terrible as some posters alleged on this forum back in spring. The u16 B team have lost every game, the last one last weekend by around 20 odd points. So as a group overall there's plenty of work to be done." I think 4 or 5 of the starters on the u17 team this year are still u16 but open to correction.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 24/07/2023 16:30:55
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Just to point out to a few posters, their is no under 20 in Wexford, it's under 21, I'm shocked at posters lack of knowledge
Lockerroomboy (Wexford) - Posts: 481 - 24/07/2023 18:08:33
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