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There was of course a need for money to be invested in order to promote and bring the status of the game forward in Dublin. We have the resources, we always have had ,we just weren't able to organise our house properly. Essentially, for many years before 1970 , Dublin had fallen well back in terms of being able to generate interest and promote the game in the county. We were contesting very few All Ireland's and it took the brilliance of Kevin Heffernan to turn that ship around. The spell between 1995 and 2011 was a barren spell and undoubtedly finance was needed as the game was in danger of falling back to where it was prior to Heffernan's intervention. We've always produced good players but the crop over the last decade have been exceptional and this combined with the personnel and finance has meant that we are experiencing a period where our true potential is being realised. As I mentioned to another poster , I do think other counties in Leinster need finance to improve but they will have to have the right people there to use that money wisely. Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 31/01/2021 17:03:24 2329849 Link 0 |
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95 to 2011 was barren as far as ye didn't get to any finals dubhlinn but dublin were still getting to quarter and semifinals it was hardly a crisis in the grand scheme of things. Plenty of other counties had it worse than dublin in that time but they got no help from the gaa . KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 31/01/2021 17:34:06 2329858 Link 1 |
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Yes, but only quarter and semi's for that long period would definitely demonstrate that something was not right. When you consider that Dublin contested or won finals in the previous decades it would suggest an anomaly. There is little doubt that finance was necessary but as I've mentioned to other posters we have made the most of it and perhaps other Leinster counties have not been entirely free of blame for their own decline. I'm not suggesting the finance hasn't contributed but again no county that has been successful has done so without money and the right personnel on board both at management and grass roots level. Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 31/01/2021 18:03:16 2329870 Link 0 |
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Oh listen I agree with all of that, I think we completely took the eye off the ball in the 90s and 00s, in fact not only that but we actively took decisions which harmed Meath Gaa (ie persisted with out-dated underage development and made a complete mess of our county championship). We created our own problems and that certainly isn't Dublin's fault, my main worry is though, that it will be very difficult to bridge the gap now even if do get everything in order. Dublin have gone so far ahead that even the top teams outside of Leinster can't beat them. Now I don't think the situation is completely hopeless but it will take a lot of time to correct and we need to stand up and counted. I know there's a lot of good people in Meath Gaa who give hours and hours of their time for nothing and we couldn't survive without them but also need some expertise. Money in the wrong hands will be wasted and our record is not great as it is, we can't even erect fcukin floodlights! Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 31/01/2021 18:58:56 2329884 Link 7 |
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I would agree with that Dubh_linn, the money will have to be disrtibuted elsewhere to make the rest of us competitive again but it is crucial that we have experienced people in place to oversee expenditure. We need a John Costello, now he's a brilliant organiser and by all accounts a very talented business man and the likes of him don't just grow on trees but I think we need to do more in trying to attract someone like that and ask them would they be willing to help out. Meath is a big county, with plenty of potential and a rising tide lifts all boats as they say. As for Meath's shortcoming, I have no problem holding my hand up, infact I've been very critical of our county boards down through the years, some of them have been nothing short of awful. And just when I thought things were improving, in 2019 our then chairman had to resign after messages he sent to a referee about a club he wasn't too fond of (best not say too much on that) a couple of months before he was elected chairman. That's the sort of embarrassing/infuriating rubbish we're dealing with and further highlights the need for someone with level headed business experience. So no, we have no right to lay the blame for our mess squarely at Dublin's door step. But it's also important to acknowledge that there are plenty of dedicated, genuine Gaa people in Meath as well and if we got the extra help then their efforts might be better rewarded at intercounty level. Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 31/01/2021 19:19:43 2329886 Link 6 |
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Connellan's letter gained a lot of traction which is good because it highlights issues which the Gaa doesn't even want to acknowledge much less address. I have very little time for the Leinster council, they know which side their bread is buttered and they couldn't give a monkeys about the rest of us! Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 31/01/2021 19:24:27 2329887 Link 8 |
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Absolutely, it would be easy to suggest that we have always made the best of the resources we have but I don't think that is true of any county.There is no doubt that Meath have the ability and personnel to be a force again and just need to get the right hands in charge. Financing will be needed but I think we are in agreement that perhaps some of the old habits will need to be eradicated. I look forward to the day when we can face off again without it being somewhat of a foregone conclusion. Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 31/01/2021 19:50:17 2329891 Link 0 |
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Ya fair play to Connellan he's a barrister so people will listen to him I'm surprised the other barrister Mr brolly isn't high lightning this issue the man pretends to be a socialist but of xourse Joe will with the hare and hunt with the hound. As for the leinster Council well the Munster council isn't much better a bunch of yes men and women only interested in climbing the ladder. KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 31/01/2021 20:49:34 2329904 Link 0 |
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Yeah getting that vibe from some posters that what's the point in giving them money they haven't got the dedicated people we have. That is pure and utter rubbish there is hundreds of dedicated hard working people in Meath gaa, who give all they can without any reward, if the money was there there people would be able to give more of their time and effort with the financial help if we received it.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 31/01/2021 21:32:02 2329914 Link 0 |
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Just an interesting one if you say something was wrong because dublin were not contesting all Ireland finals, Dublin were still wining Leinster titles for fun in that period though. Other counties in Leinster in that period or you could argue for the previous 50 years were not winning anything so the GAA could have concluded that they need help/ finances, but alas they did not get it. IMO the GAA called it wrong and the gap is too big now. BTW that's not Dublins fault. I have lived in Dublin for the last 35yrs while commuting for 20 yrs to play at home, my kids play here & they dont get the moaning from country folk on Dublins prominence. I have a real concern for the other counties and how the GAA are going to address the enormous gap
bottletopbill (Wexford) - Posts: 71 - 31/01/2021 21:35:44 2329916 Link 1 |
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Your 100% right lad, it only a matter of time before Dublin are knocked off their perch , and teams like Mayo, Kerry have got very close. Meath and Kildare are getting closer, just need to stop a percentage of people fawning all over the dubs as if it's a get out of jail free card for Meath/Kildare for being sh1te
jackmeyhoffer (USA) - Posts: 148 - 31/01/2021 21:36:10 2329917 Link 0 |
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I think you will be waiting a very long time for that to happen Dubh_linn. Leinster is dead and it will not be revived anytime soon. None of this is Dublin's fault. Dublin were singled out by the hierarchy of The GAA. Seán Kelly and his fellow administrators wanted to "strengthsn Dublin GAA." Nobody could have any qualms with the hierarchy providing advice and guidance with regards to a county improving their structures and consequently their performances on the field. The hierarchy however went way beyond that. They have provided huge financial assistance every year since at least 2007 to Dublin. That assistance has been significantly disproportionate to what every other county receives. John Costello and the Dublin county board have utilised that money brilliantly. The effectiveness of the utilisation of the money is not the issue. The issue is the fact that the hierarchy of The GAA who are entrusted with administering the association for the benefit of everyone have for the last 18 years singled out one county for preferential treatment. That preferential treatment is still ongoing. It is indefinite. None of this is Dublin's fault. What it has done is create a massive gap that no county in Leinster can possibly hope to bridge. Most certainly some counties have been less than effective when it comes to administering the games. However the point has been made that if Dublin in 2002 had been told that they would have to "get their act together" where would they be now? Dublin have been and are brilliant on and off the field. The hierarchy of The GAA have been in dereliction of their responsibilities to administer the association in a manner that will benefit everyone for nigh on twenty years. Consequently we are now facing an extremely serious situation. The Leinster championship is dead. Talk of competitiveness being restored to the Leinster championship any time soon is nothing more than a pipe dream. What is even worse is that the All Ireland itself is now on it's knees. The situation is that serious.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6030 - 31/01/2021 22:05:43 2329922 Link 2 |
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An interesting discussion about these issues in The Irish Times today. Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 01/02/2021 09:56:01 2329949 Link 2 |
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Decent debate. Connellan way out of his depth even though I'm sure he means well.
lilylanger (Kildare) - Posts: 758 - 01/02/2021 11:22:49 2329961 Link 3 |
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The current provincial format needs to be replaced, end of story CleanShoulder (Westmeath) - Posts: 268 - 01/02/2021 12:20:17 2329975 Link 0 |
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In truth the reason the likes of Meath and Kildare don't get to play Dublin at home is the GAA has never put investment into our grounds like say they have in counties in Munster (Semple, the Pairc, Limerick etc.) because we are located close to the national stadium. Maybe, looking back, the GAA should not have developed Croke Park up to the extent they did, had they say spent less and developed Croke Park into say a 55k modern stadium they could have developed maybe 2 other stadiums in Leinster up to say Semple stadium standard. Then more games drawing a big crowd in the Leinster championship could be played outside Croke Park.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1332 - 01/02/2021 12:47:29 2329980 Link 2 |
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Being honest I think any team playing Dublin would have a better chance outside Croke Park simply down to the fact that the Croke Park playing pitch is so big and a team like Dublin who are supremely fit can over run you.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1332 - 01/02/2021 12:50:05 2329981 Link 3 |
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https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/population-funding-and-major-structural-defects-how-to-stop-the-gaa-collapsing-in-on-itself-40031253.html It is a good read. People who say O'Rourke is out to down Dublin, if they read this they will see where he is coming from. He was part of the GAAs football Strategic review committee back in 2002. I had forgot that in 2002 it was this committee who first suggested splitting Dublin (as part of an overall strategy to grow the game in Dublin). I did not know that this committee also recommend putting more central GAA money into growing the game in Dublin (splitting Dublin was seen as logical as part of giving the extra funding to grow the game) before Dublin's current funding model was commenced. It was this report that put extra funding for Dublin on the table. They also wanted to insist that as part of the extra funding more clubs would be formed in Dublin so no clubs would be allowed to have the huge catchment areas that they have. From memory (although not mentioned in this article) this committee also suggested a much more logical competition structure based on a tiered system and a pool stage. Had this committee being listened to a lot of the current problems of the game would not have arisen. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1332 - 01/02/2021 13:31:25 2329991 Link 2 |
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That's very true bdbuddah. I never agreed with the idea of splitting Dublin and I still don't. I would have absolutely no problem with The GAA advising any county on how to improve their structures with a view to improving their performances on the field of play. What happened after 2002 went way beyond that. Disproportionate amounts of money were poured in to Dublin. That's not Dublin's fault. They have used the extra money brilliantly. The hierarchy of The GAA were in gross dereliction and remain in gross dereliction of their responsibilities to the general membership of The GAA. They are obliged to act in the best interests of everyone involved in the association. They are not doing that. The question remains why was Dublin singled out for special treatment. That is contrary to the ethos of the association. It remains so footbal competitions suffer. This is not an anti Dublin tirade. Leinster is dead. The All Ireland is going the same way and the likes of the chairman of the Leinster Council Pat Teehan doesn't see anything wrong.
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6030 - 01/02/2021 19:05:49 2330034 Link 1 |
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I don't think Dublin have been necessarily underfunded historically. I believe (maybe I'm wrong?, I'm no expert) that the growth of the GAA for most of its history been organic in different areas depending on the interest of people in the area and, historically the interest wasn't there in Dublin like it was in rural areas (that's why most Dublin teams up to the 50's were manned by country people working in Dublin). From looking at bits of local history around here the GAA started out as part of the nationalist revival movement in the latter part of the 19'th century (generally at this time loads of Gaelic league and GAA clubs formed, GAA clubs took deep root, Gaelic league withered). In certain places individuals were a huge driving force in establishing a football or hurling tradition (such as teachers/ priests etc.) and the tradition continued organically there after, passed down the generations. I think the idea of hiring paid staff to to go into areas to promote the games, as commenced in Dublin in the noughties is a relatively new idea so games development funding was not really important before this. Before this whatever funding was handed out by the GAA was largely doled based on where there was people playing GAA. bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1332 - 02/02/2021 16:46:23 2330136 Link 3 |