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Is no lucky all-irelands a myth?

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Off the top of my head in football I can think of 3 lucky all-ireland wins. 1982- Offaly beating Kerry with a late goal 1992- Donegal beating Dublin missed pen changed the course of the game. 2011- Dublin won the all-ireland against the run of play during the match as a whole. Kerry were coasting for about 60 mins. Then they were caught with a goal from nowhere. If cluxtons final point did not go over, there is little doubt Kerry would have won the replay. To me an all Ireland eventually comes down to a knock out phase. It is much easier to get a lucky cup win rather then win a proper league system (like other sports) which takes much more consistency resulting in less shocks as a result. gormdubhgorm (Dublin) - Posts: 990 - 25/07/2016 15:30:12 1889799 Link
No, there is merit in the statement gorm, I mean there's no comparing some teams all-Ireland victories to others e.g. Kerry 2004 vs Tyrone 2005. In that example, you could argue that it's not Kerry's fault nor luck that the opposition they faced that year was relatively poor bar Limerick in the Munster final that year. They beat what was in front of them and the history books won't say any different. But it was lucky that the draw worked out for them the way it did. There are others that I'd put in the same boat though: Cork 2010 - Cork were lucky that Dublin conceded so many free's and a penalty in the semi let alone that Down were arguably one of the weakest teams to appear in an All Ireland final. Yet Down played really well and missed a number of good chances in the final to have pushed the game closer Kerry 2014 - Kerry were let off the hook by Mayo's wasteful shooting and poor defending in the first game in the semi's, there were some very dodgy refereeing decisions in the second game while Durcan's kickout in the final gifted Kerry that All Ireland Meath 1996 - A disallowed Dublin goal in the Leinster final in the last minute would have knocked Meath out before the semi's. The bounce of the ball from Colm Coyle's punt lands over the bar in the last minute to earn the draw. Dublin 1983 - It's not just the fact that they scraped home with 12 men on the pitch in one of the worst games of football we've ever seen but Cork should have beaten Dublin in the semi final that year. In Leinster, Offaly were still reveling from their victory the year before and didn't offer the same contest where they had beaten Dublin 3 years in a row previously. Not to mention the fact that Dublin drew with Meath in the Leinster quarter final that year. Kerry 1981 - You could argue that Kerry were simply that good and that they just blew everyone away that year. In my own opinion that was Kerry at their peak, I don't think a best of the country combined that year would have stopped them. But you could also argue the other way and say that the opposition that year were simply brutal. Offaly barely put up a fight in the final, while Cork and Mayo both put in absolutely pitiful performances that would make Kildare supporters laugh and say "You call that defending!!" Ps I wouldn't class 1992 in there, penalty miss aside, Donegal would have won that game. Dublin thought they only had to show up. Wasn't there a story about one Dublin footballer going to a wedding the night before? keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 25/07/2016 16:29:01 1889858 Link
Another Kerry bashing thread, wonderful! KYTitletown (Kerry) - Posts: 816 - 25/07/2016 17:04:28 1889888 Link
Louth 1910 The only time that an all Ireland was won with a walk/over. The Kerry team refused to travel because the train company at that time would not reduce the train fare for the Kerry supporters. OLLIE (Louth) - Posts: 12224 - 25/07/2016 17:05:15 1889889 Link
Kerry all ireland 2014..lucky in the sense that they avoided dublin in the final..as we would have destroyed them...ha GGdub (Dublin) - Posts: 260 - 25/07/2016 19:12:11 1889961 Link
Replying To KYTitletown: "Another Kerry bashing thread, wonderful!" you're way too sensitive mate.. skillet (Limerick) - Posts: 1056 - 25/07/2016 19:44:45 1889979 Link
Tipperary Clare Cavan Mayo Imo if you only had to play these teams in the 90's to win Sam you have to say it's a lucky all Ireland. clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 25/07/2016 19:49:41 1889981 Link
Replying To OLLIE: "Louth 1910 The only time that an all Ireland was won with a walk/over. The Kerry team refused to travel because the train company at that time would not reduce the train fare for the Kerry supporters." Not entirely true Ollie, they wouldn't reduce the train fare initially for the team and they refused to provide the Kerry players with their own coach, like they had done for the journey up for the 1909 final. They eventually agreed to do both but held firm on not giving discounted tickets to a few officials and family members that wanted to travel with the Kerry players, and that's why Kerry didn't travel. Interestingly after losing out on such a big pay day due to the All Ireland was cancelled, the railway companies had a massive change of heart. From then on, they usually bent over backwards to accommodate traveling teams and supporters with discounted fares and they began to heavily sponsor GAA competitions, hence why the Inter-provincial competition was called the Railway Cup . Another example was the Great Southern and Western Railway Company donated a massive silver cup to the GAA in 1913 which was to be awarded to the All-Ireland football champions, Kerry won it in 1913 and because they won it again in 1914 the county was allowed keep the cup in celebration of that achievement. TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 25/07/2016 20:34:59 1889997 Link
2010 is the only time I've known a team to win an All-Ireland and get little credit for it. I'm not saying if it was right or wrong. All the provincial champions went out in the quarter-finals. That possibly had some part to play in it. If we won the All-Ireland in 2011 it would have been soft. We were never really bothered by opposition too much. We were in transition after losing to Down the year before, retirements from a great team were kicking in and we had neglected our youth. Halfway through the second half of '11 we were like a ship coasting into harbour. Now All-Irelands are not easily won. The capital grabbed the game by the scruff of the neck and seized the day. To the victors goes the spoils. It was a hard fought win for them. Mayo lacked that ability to seize the day in 2013. It still seems like the loss that will haunt that team. Someone's having a laugh about '14. Having neglected our youth, lost the Gooch, being in transition, it was a massive achievement to win another hard fought All-Ireland. legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7822 - 25/07/2016 20:40:13 1889998 Link
Replying To clondalkindub: "Tipperary Clare Cavan Mayo Imo if you only had to play these teams in the 90's to win Sam you have to say it's a lucky all Ireland." So your saying Kerry's All Ireland in 1997 was 'lucky' because all they did was beat the Ulster champions and the Connacht champions who should have probably won the All-Ireland a year earlier?? As opposed to say Dublin in 1995 who beat the Ulster champions Tyrone and the Munster champions Cork, the latter a fading force the former being a flash in the pan?? Ya that makes sense to me lad, be a good man and keep this anti-Kerry crap to yourself. TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 25/07/2016 20:43:57 1890000 Link
The luckiest team to have ever won a Football All-Ireland has to be Tipperary in 1900. Kilkenny beat Tipperary in the 1900 All-Ireland semi final , 1-7 to 0-8. [Yes, we're talking football] The game was refixed following an objection by Tipperary, Kilkenny refused to play, so the match was awarded to Tipperary. Tipperary went on to win the All Ireland final beating Galway 2-20 to 0-1. Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 2447 - 25/07/2016 21:08:41 1890015 Link
Replying To gormdubhgorm: "Off the top of my head in football I can think of 3 lucky all-ireland wins. 1982- Offaly beating Kerry with a late goal 1992- Donegal beating Dublin missed pen changed the course of the game. 2011- Dublin won the all-ireland against the run of play during the match as a whole. Kerry were coasting for about 60 mins. Then they were caught with a goal from nowhere. If cluxtons final point did not go over, there is little doubt Kerry would have won the replay. To me an all Ireland eventually comes down to a knock out phase. It is much easier to get a lucky cup win rather then win a proper league system (like other sports) which takes much more consistency resulting in less shocks as a result." Yep spot on. All Ireland champions should be determined on a league basis not on a cup knock out basis. Any of the provincial champions for example could have a off day/ shafted by a poor decisions and they're gone. Not a fair system at all but going to stay as the provincial councils won't agree to anything else. Does any other sport determine its champions by a cup knock out? county man (Limerick) - Posts: 1102 - 25/07/2016 21:13:15 1890019 Link
Not anti at all I love Kerry football but that's a lucky path to the all Ireland in anyone's eyes. We beat Meath by the way who won Sam the following year and that was a very good Cork team and very good Tyrone team. Id fancy our chances if we'd that route in '97. clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 25/07/2016 21:23:21 1890027 Link
Replying To county man: "Yep spot on. All Ireland champions should be determined on a league basis not on a cup knock out basis. Any of the provincial champions for example could have a off day/ shafted by a poor decisions and they're gone. Not a fair system at all but going to stay as the provincial councils won't agree to anything else. Does any other sport determine its champions by a cup knock out?" If this happened Dublin would win 10 in a row at least with the knock-out system there's a always a chance even if it's slim, if it was a league system it'd be like the French soccer league with PSG running away with it every year. KYTitletown (Kerry) - Posts: 816 - 25/07/2016 21:25:58 1890028 Link
Replying To clondalkindub: "Not anti at all I love Kerry football but that's a lucky path to the all Ireland in anyone's eyes. We beat Meath by the way who won Sam the following year and that was a very good Cork team and very good Tyrone team. Id fancy our chances if we'd that route in '97." Could have fooled me... KYTitletown (Kerry) - Posts: 816 - 25/07/2016 21:27:47 1890029 Link
Replying To Cockney_Cat: "The luckiest team to have ever won a Football All-Ireland has to be Tipperary in 1900. Kilkenny beat Tipperary in the 1900 All-Ireland semi final , 1-7 to 0-8. [Yes, we're talking football The game was refixed following an objection by Tipperary, Kilkenny refused to play, so the match was awarded to Tipperary. Tipperary went on to win the All Ireland final beating Galway 2-20 to 0-1."]Or what about Kerry winning the 1891 hurling, ref blew as a Wexford shot was sailing over the bar. Kerry won in extra-time. commercials1 (Limerick) - Posts: 115 - 25/07/2016 21:34:01 1890033 Link
Replying To gormdubhgorm: "Off the top of my head in football I can think of 3 lucky all-ireland wins. 1982- Offaly beating Kerry with a late goal 1992- Donegal beating Dublin missed pen changed the course of the game. 2011- Dublin won the all-ireland against the run of play during the match as a whole. Kerry were coasting for about 60 mins. Then they were caught with a goal from nowhere. If cluxtons final point did not go over, there is little doubt Kerry would have won the replay. To me an all Ireland eventually comes down to a knock out phase. It is much easier to get a lucky cup win rather then win a proper league system (like other sports) which takes much more consistency resulting in less shocks as a result." Didn't think Donegal were lucky, penalty hardly decided the winner of that game considering how the game panned out. I suppose you could say Offaly were lucky due to the fact the goal should not have stood and that was the game changing moment. TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 7885 - 25/07/2016 21:42:57 1890040 Link
Please, please let us win a lucky All Ireland. Objections, lucky penalties, bad refereeing decisions, train disputes, poor standard of football, dodgy black, yellow and red cards, hop balls going over the bar, teams rebuilding, foot and mouth keeping the northern teams out, hawkeye malfunction, dives, headlocks, hair tousling, back doors, front doors, side doors we'll take them all just to win it once. Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1113 - 25/07/2016 21:43:35 1890041 Link
Replying To KYTitletown: "If this happened Dublin would win 10 in a row at least with the knock-out system there's a always a chance even if it's slim, if it was a league system it'd be like the French soccer league with PSG running away with it every year." Yeah but we're talking about lucky All-Ireland's. It's more unpredictable but cup knock out can lead to a team who is not the best winning an All-Ireland. county man (Limerick) - Posts: 1102 - 25/07/2016 21:54:09 1890045 Link
How am I anti? Cause I said you's were lucky in '14 or cause I said we beat you by ten plus points in the league final? I've stated a million times on here Gooch is the greatest forward I've ever seen , A lot of the time hermit gives us stick so I give it back. No one on here gets more stick than Dublin so we have to give it back. clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 25/07/2016 21:59:14 1890046 Link