Meath Forum

Meath v Donegal

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post


Replying To ziggy32001:  "no better than last year? god almighty... the team are fitter for a start than they have been for years."
I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders.

pauk123 (USA) - Posts: 189 - 10/07/2017 14:01:07    2014051

Link

Replying To pauk123:  "I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders."
we just about beat laois last year to stay up. we were falling apart with 20mins to go in a lot of games.the attitude of the players as a whole is better this year. also it is always hard in your first qualifier. at home to sligo all the pressure was on us and we came through that. a game we likely would lose last season. baby steps but hope we keep getting better.

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 10/07/2017 14:15:04    2014080

Link

Replying To pauk123:  "Great effort from the players. It was a test that we ultimately failed, absolutely nothing to do with the refereeing, which admittedly was poor, but it was equal for both sides. I think we lacked a little bit of fitness in the end to cover the spaces we needed to prevent the last score in particular.

I would question why there wasn't a man marking job done on Paddy McB and Murphy particularly at the end they were the main (only) treath. These margins are the difference between winning and loosing. Also why didn't we use the bench sooner?"
Paul , you are probably one of the few people on here that has asked that question ..... We have seen Donegal play for long enough to be able to pick out their core players ....Why then did we give them soooo much space . What tactics were trialled / discussed during the week about closing them out ... I'm sorry but if that's as good as we can do against a team that we have planned against then we need to look at Management . Anyway . Can someone tell me on a factual basis how we have progressed this year . I would like to know . Or are we at a status quo level that we are happy to be at , and fantasize about us seeing progress ... there seems to be a massive level of Prozac been taken here in relation to our Senior team

Meath_True (Meath) - Posts: 285 - 10/07/2017 14:39:16    2014113

Link

Replying To Meath_True:  "Paul , you are probably one of the few people on here that has asked that question ..... We have seen Donegal play for long enough to be able to pick out their core players ....Why then did we give them soooo much space . What tactics were trialled / discussed during the week about closing them out ... I'm sorry but if that's as good as we can do against a team that we have planned against then we need to look at Management . Anyway . Can someone tell me on a factual basis how we have progressed this year . I would like to know . Or are we at a status quo level that we are happy to be at , and fantasize about us seeing progress ... there seems to be a massive level of Prozac been taken here in relation to our Senior team"
we didn't give them that much space,it was hardly akin to the kildare game. at times good teams like donegal are going to make space..

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 10/07/2017 14:55:37    2014138

Link

Replying To Meath_True:  "Paul , you are probably one of the few people on here that has asked that question ..... We have seen Donegal play for long enough to be able to pick out their core players ....Why then did we give them soooo much space . What tactics were trialled / discussed during the week about closing them out ... I'm sorry but if that's as good as we can do against a team that we have planned against then we need to look at Management . Anyway . Can someone tell me on a factual basis how we have progressed this year . I would like to know . Or are we at a status quo level that we are happy to be at , and fantasize about us seeing progress ... there seems to be a massive level of Prozac been taken here in relation to our Senior team"
Also folks , don't forget that Tyrone , tortured Donegal in the Ulster championships . So classing them as a top teams is probably been a bit generous . And more than likely to try to make ourselves feel better about our performance .

Meath_True (Meath) - Posts: 285 - 10/07/2017 15:00:23    2014147

Link

Replying To Meath_True:  "Also folks , don't forget that Tyrone , tortured Donegal in the Ulster championships . So classing them as a top teams is probably been a bit generous . And more than likely to try to make ourselves feel better about our performance ."
In relation to a comparison with last Year, I would say we are at about the same level, certainly I would find it hard to say that we have improved. The performance against Donegal was a battling spirited one but one against a team that has gone backwards in recent times (at least in Championship terms).
I actually do not have too much of an issue with the assumption that we did not man mark Donegals key players, these are players well used to being tightly marked and by probably better defenders than we have available, and there did appear to be a system employed where we defended and looked to counter attack and to a degree it worked. Lets not forget that Donegal were not exactly tight on our forwards either, they conceded 1-14 so they have their own issues to deal with in that regard.

The biggest issue for me was a lack of replacements from the bench. I think our defenders tired which lead to poor tackling and concession of frees. When the game was there for the winning, Donegal brought 4 replacements on and all had an impact. We only made two changes all game plus a black card replacement which was a forced change.

I suppose I could be accused of being harsh on them but in a summary of this season, we failed to get promotion again from Division 2, were well beaten twice by Kildare and despite two favourable home draws in the qualifiers we are out of the championship by early July. So its hard to argue that we have improved.

However if the new management have brought a fresh enthusiasm to the squad and instilled some belief into them and have learned from some very obvious failings then maybe the structures are being put in place behind the scenes to build for the future.

We can only hope.

ROYALOPTIMIST (Meath) - Posts: 179 - 10/07/2017 18:03:07    2014340

Link

Replying To pauk123:  "I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders."
You seem to be a bit confused, I hopefully can help. Firstly we narrowly missed out on promotion this year, last year we scraped over the mighty laoise (now div 4 team) to avoid relegation.
Not once this year did we collapse in second half as we had done so often last 3/years but particulay last year,
Finally we didn't play Westmeath last year it was previous one so your comparison with them and Kildare is inaccurate.
But hey you know what we should do, dump Andy and bring back the maestro that was micko. Ffs

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 10/07/2017 20:10:27    2014440

Link

Replying To pauk123:  "I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders."
And BTW do you not remember bitegate after getting hammered by Dublin?

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 10/07/2017 20:11:45    2014442

Link

Replying To ROYALOPTIMIST:  "In relation to a comparison with last Year, I would say we are at about the same level, certainly I would find it hard to say that we have improved. The performance against Donegal was a battling spirited one but one against a team that has gone backwards in recent times (at least in Championship terms).
I actually do not have too much of an issue with the assumption that we did not man mark Donegals key players, these are players well used to being tightly marked and by probably better defenders than we have available, and there did appear to be a system employed where we defended and looked to counter attack and to a degree it worked. Lets not forget that Donegal were not exactly tight on our forwards either, they conceded 1-14 so they have their own issues to deal with in that regard.

The biggest issue for me was a lack of replacements from the bench. I think our defenders tired which lead to poor tackling and concession of frees. When the game was there for the winning, Donegal brought 4 replacements on and all had an impact. We only made two changes all game plus a black card replacement which was a forced change.

I suppose I could be accused of being harsh on them but in a summary of this season, we failed to get promotion again from Division 2, were well beaten twice by Kildare and despite two favourable home draws in the qualifiers we are out of the championship by early July. So its hard to argue that we have improved.

However if the new management have brought a fresh enthusiasm to the squad and instilled some belief into them and have learned from some very obvious failings then maybe the structures are being put in place behind the scenes to build for the future.

We can only hope."
So you reckon we are in the exact place as we where last year ? When we left Derry humiliated for about the third time that last year ? Where you at that game ?

bobkarlgees (Meath) - Posts: 1263 - 10/07/2017 20:21:58    2014452

Link

I actually used to think royaldunne was a bit paranoid. Had a chip on his shoulder. Was imagining that people were only waiting to see us beaten to have a go at management.
However, to my utter disappointed it appears he is perfectly sane and we capable of judging the motives of a few.

And before anyone has a go at me for standing up for Andy mc, I was one of the very few to support mod, and still firmly believe his intentions were good and there was actually a method to his play.

But Andy is the manager now and he has a big job on his hands. But to be knocking him and slating him after less than a year in the job is ridiculous.

Jinxie (Meath) - Posts: 6342 - 10/07/2017 21:04:24    2014482

Link

Replying To royaldunne:  "
Replying To pauk123:  "I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders."
You seem to be a bit confused, I hopefully can help. Firstly we narrowly missed out on promotion this year, last year we scraped over the mighty laoise (now div 4 team) to avoid relegation.
Not once this year did we collapse in second half as we had done so often last 3/years but particulay last year,
Finally we didn't play Westmeath last year it was previous one so your comparison with them and Kildare is inaccurate.
But hey you know what we should do, dump Andy and bring back the maestro that was micko. Ffs"
Not confused at all RD. I don't see any major progress this year and objectively I think you'd find it difficult to prove otherwise. We stayed in the same division as last year and only got one round further after 2 home draws against average enough opponents. Carlow lasted longer than us! Maybe your definition of progress is different than everyone else's but if that's what progress looks like we are in for a very, very, very long road back.

pauk123 (USA) - Posts: 189 - 10/07/2017 21:24:44    2014503

Link

Replying To bobkarlgees:  "So you reckon we are in the exact place as we where last year ? When we left Derry humiliated for about the third time that last year ? Where you at that game ?"
No I was not at that game nor the previous game against Dublin and yes I do not see much difference between last Year and this, but then to be fair I felt we were possibly better than we looked last Year. Co-incidentally we exited the championship on the exact same date last Year as this and the reality is that we had a home draw against a Donegal team who are in transition, and whilst we gave a good account of ourselves we still were second best.
Lets be clear, I am more than happy to see Andy in charge and I do not think that anybody is really seriously calling for his head or anything like that but at the same time it is perfectly acceptable in my opinion to say that mistakes have been made and must be rectified if we are to progress. I am sure he knows this and I would be confident he will.

Our level would appear to be the third best team in a poor Leinster championship and probably has been the same for the last number of years. We are as far away from making an impact at provincial or All ireland level as we have been and all the talk in the world can not change that.

ROYALOPTIMIST (Meath) - Posts: 179 - 10/07/2017 21:43:42    2014528

Link

Replying To Jinxie:  "I actually used to think royaldunne was a bit paranoid. Had a chip on his shoulder. Was imagining that people were only waiting to see us beaten to have a go at management.
However, to my utter disappointed it appears he is perfectly sane and we capable of judging the motives of a few.

And before anyone has a go at me for standing up for Andy mc, I was one of the very few to support mod, and still firmly believe his intentions were good and there was actually a method to his play.

But Andy is the manager now and he has a big job on his hands. But to be knocking him and slating him after less than a year in the job is ridiculous."
yeah there is clear agenda's from a certain few,and many just want the manager to fail sadly..

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 10/07/2017 22:32:38    2014570

Link

This year in the SFC we defeated a very poor Louth team, were hammered by Kildare twice, struggled past an average Sligo and while we did improve considerably against Donegal we still lost. Also, we failed to gain promotion from Division 2 so therefore I feel we made little or no progress this year.
A big failing which has been highlighted by both Bernard Flynn and Graham Geraghty amongst numerous others was Andy's failure to use his full quota of subs last Saturday when lads were clearly out on their feet. If our previous manager did this he would have been slaughtered.

RoylerKing (Meath) - Posts: 809 - 10/07/2017 23:04:37    2014600

Link

Replying To pauk123:  "
Replying To royaldunne:  "[quote=pauk123:  "I'm not sure how by any objective measure you can say we did better than last year.
We failed to progress in what was a pretty poor division 2, division 2 was a lot stronger last year. We got hammered by Kildare after an easy win over Louth. Replace Kildare with Westmeath and it's similar. The only positive difference is we won a qualifier, against Sligo, in Navan, and struggled doing so. If that's progress we can look forward to a Leinster in 2050!
Also VERY disappointing to see Andy complain about the referee, you at your own failings (there were plenty to go around) before you start blaming outsiders."
You seem to be a bit confused, I hopefully can help. Firstly we narrowly missed out on promotion this year, last year we scraped over the mighty laoise (now div 4 team) to avoid relegation.
Not once this year did we collapse in second half as we had done so often last 3/years but particulay last year,
Finally we didn't play Westmeath last year it was previous one so your comparison with them and Kildare is inaccurate.
But hey you know what we should do, dump Andy and bring back the maestro that was micko. Ffs"
Not confused at all RD. I don't see any major progress this year and objectively I think you'd find it difficult to prove otherwise. We stayed in the same division as last year and only got one round further after 2 home draws against average enough opponents. Carlow lasted longer than us! Maybe your definition of progress is different than everyone else's but if that's what progress looks like we are in for a very, very, very long road back."]Again Carlow have not lasted longer than us, as they just into round we got beat in now.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 10/07/2017 23:09:05    2014603

Link

Replying To Jinxie:  "I actually used to think royaldunne was a bit paranoid. Had a chip on his shoulder. Was imagining that people were only waiting to see us beaten to have a go at management.
However, to my utter disappointed it appears he is perfectly sane and we capable of judging the motives of a few.

And before anyone has a go at me for standing up for Andy mc, I was one of the very few to support mod, and still firmly believe his intentions were good and there was actually a method to his play.

But Andy is the manager now and he has a big job on his hands. But to be knocking him and slating him after less than a year in the job is ridiculous."
Told you I was totally sane :)
Look I had no problem with mod as a man, I met him once in another thing outside football and honestly a more down to earth nicer guy could you meet.
My problem was I don't think he was ever suited to management of Meath seniors, he tried his best and in no way wanted to fail in his endeavors. But it just wasn't for him. And the people I blame for that is not micko but the county board.

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 10/07/2017 23:15:39    2014606

Link

Replying To RoylerKing:  "This year in the SFC we defeated a very poor Louth team, were hammered by Kildare twice, struggled past an average Sligo and while we did improve considerably against Donegal we still lost. Also, we failed to gain promotion from Division 2 so therefore I feel we made little or no progress this year.
A big failing which has been highlighted by both Bernard Flynn and Graham Geraghty amongst numerous others was Andy's failure to use his full quota of subs last Saturday when lads were clearly out on their feet. If our previous manager did this he would have been slaughtered."
lads on their feet? we lost by a point. we didn't falter in the last 15mins at all..

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 11/07/2017 00:13:23    2014637

Link

Andy is the manager and is probably the most passionate, committed and ambitious person willing (and able) to manage the Meath senior team at present. If he has made a few mistakes here and there in his first year, no big deal, so long as he learns from them. It is when you repeat the mistakes of the past, year in year out, then there is an issue. I'd like to see him be a little more adventurous and imaginative next season and to build a squad and bench he can believe in and utilise fully. If there are any issues, getting certain players on board, do everything within his powers to make it happen. I suppose we better support Carlow next weekend!

GlasagusOr (Meath) - Posts: 1348 - 11/07/2017 00:14:29    2014638

Link

Replying To ziggy32001:  "lads on their feet? we lost by a point. we didn't falter in the last 15mins at all.."
We have 40 lads at training the manager picks his sub's uses 2 on hot evening in fairness after putting in a major shift.I would question that too.trust is major thing in sports especially Gaelic games honesty integrity. The other sub's have to b thinking what going on here.reilly in the last day tother etc.6 months training then that b hard sell next year.

Reco (Meath) - Posts: 419 - 11/07/2017 09:37:44    2014733

Link

Replying To GlasagusOr:  "Andy is the manager and is probably the most passionate, committed and ambitious person willing (and able) to manage the Meath senior team at present. If he has made a few mistakes here and there in his first year, no big deal, so long as he learns from them. It is when you repeat the mistakes of the past, year in year out, then there is an issue. I'd like to see him be a little more adventurous and imaginative next season and to build a squad and bench he can believe in and utilise fully. If there are any issues, getting certain players on board, do everything within his powers to make it happen. I suppose we better support Carlow next weekend!"
I'd agree with most of that. I would take it from the 2 subs used against Donegal that McEntee only has 17-18 players that he feels he can rely on when he needs them most. And I have no issue with that. If he did nothing else for the first year than to identify the core of players that he can work with for the next 2-3 years, then he already achieved something. I would have a big issue with it if he was still in the same position next year.
The task for him between now and next year is to add another 4-5 players to those 17/18 so that he has a strong panel to choose from. That can be achieved either by working with the players currently on the panel to improve them further to the point where he feels they can do a job, or to find a few more players not currently on the panel.
In general though, I cant see that there will be huge changes between this years team and next, and again that is how it should be. 1 year should be enough for any manager to identify the panel he can work with, and after that it is just slowly adding and subtracting a few to improve things.

anfearbeag (Meath) - Posts: 1134 - 11/07/2017 09:55:17    2014745

Link